dwight in philly Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 I can offer an opinion on how one should go about performing brain surgery. However, I would think that the stronger argument would come from those that have spent years studying it. It seems like Benjamin is the most qualified person on this thread to comment on this subject. if you say so.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section122 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Ha ha...good one. You think too highly of yourself. Looks like benjamin (in bold above) has you pegged to a T. I don't have to be smarter than you to teach you something. Â I also don't have to be above average intelligence to teach you something. Â Lastly, I don't have to be above average intelligence to be smarter than you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Seriously. Â As I said, I belonged to a Power Lifting gym where a gay competitor worked out...no, he didn't stare. Yes, I felt totally comfortable showering when he was in the locker room. The reason I felt comfortable was that neither one of us went out of our way to make it weird. He did as any other guy did in the locker room: showered, got dressed, said hi to the people he knew, and didn't stare at other people's nude figures in a creepy fashion. Dude, it was Bally's. You're seriously in denial. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 if you say so.. Â Not sure what you are disagreeing with? His 3 social sciences degrees make him more knowledgable on the subject than I am. Everyone is free to give their opinion, some are just more informed than others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwight in philly Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Not sure what you are disagreeing with? His 3 social sciences degrees make him more knowledgable on the subject than I am. Everyone is free to give their opinion, some are just more informed than others. well, i agree with the operative word "opinion" .. everyone has one, is entitled to one.. and that is why i signed up for this forum.. it is opinion based.. i get tired of all the "non -experts " calling out those who's opinions may differ from their's.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjamin Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 (edited) Also to your second point. Gender and gender identity are relatively new fields, and poorly understood, if not entirely manufactured. I do not profess to be an expert here, and I have read a good deal of literature and I also cede that there is some truth that GID appears to be a real thing, but as I stated, I did not make any assertions on gender in this thread. Â It's always interesting when non-experts tell experts stuff. Science changes, yes, and new data is collected because (unlike rocks, chemistry, etc.) the social world changes and is pretty multifaceted. It sure is annoying when people think that the social sciences are therefore, soft or unreal. But only non-scientists so easily disregard thousands of studies and hundreds of thousands of research hours with the wave of a hand and such smug disregard. The Sociologists for Women in Society conference was just in Nashville this past weekend, you should go next year and tell them how a large part of what they do is potentially 'entirely manufactured.' Â I don't have to be smarter than you to teach you something. Â I also don't have to be above average intelligence to teach you something. Â Lastly, I don't have to be above average intelligence to be smarter than you. Â I completely agree with this sentiment, by the way! I'd be a fool if I didn't! Edited February 10, 2014 by benjamin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanCity Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 I have participated in team sports and individual sports with gay athletes and have never seen an issue in the locker room or on the field/court. I don't care one bit if a person is gay or straight. My only opinion of athletes as people is formed in their respect for others. Michael Sam is a courageous individual and one that, I feel, will be an excellent ambassador and, hopefully, allow other athletes to acknowledge their homosexuality publicly without fear. Â Sport has been as harmful to the equal rights fight as hip hop music, and the opportunity to lead the charge to allow people to express themselves without fear of persecution and intolerance is there. Over the last few years, the media has caught numerous tweets and interviews from athletes expressing outright homophobia and intolerance towards having a gay athlete on their team. This passes down to the youth who look up to these athletes and take their mentality to heart, carrying forth their mindset to the locker room at their grade school, high school and college. Macklemore has done wonders in pop culture and athletes like Michael Sam can do just as much in sports culture. This, in my opinion, was a momentous day in sports history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Dude, it was Bally's. You're seriously in denial. Â Bally's is practically a Power Lifting gym compared to the Planet Fitness-type places. Look, I've got no issue when a place caters to the non-meat-head/pump-and-tone crowd; totally fine. Where I draw the line is an official edict sent down from corporate that outlaws basic weight lifting staples like squats and deadlifts simply because some members might get intimidated by the big meanies that want to get stronger...and to make it worse, the same outfit turns around and serves pizza, bagels, and donuts to their members as "rewards" for showing up. Â Sorry...rant over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tennesseeboy Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Look...who was the greatest linebacker of all time? Dick Buttkiss. Now if that isn't a gay name I just don't know what would be. All boils down to this...can the guy do the job, get us to the playoffs, win us a superbowl? If he can contribute there will be no problem. this is a profession and your advancement in the profession depends on what the team can do, and if Sam can make a significant contribution I say draft him and anyone who doesn't like it can find some other line of work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numark Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 (edited) Numark –   Hey, Numark, have you ever asked yourself why in any court trial where one side produces and expert psychologist, and the other side does, and that they both have access to the exact same data how either of these two experts could possibly interpret the data so diametrically opposed to each other? Some discipline, eh?   Yet benjamin would have us all believe that he’s part of some field of scientists that have the utmost integrity. Not suggesting benjamin doesn’t I don’t know him, but broadly speaking there’s plenty of evidence to prove my point, and I’, willing to let it rest there.   Tim-  Any research or data can be manipulated. No discipline is immune to that. I don't see your point Edited February 10, 2014 by Numark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 I have participated in team sports and individual sports with gay athletes and have never seen an issue in the locker room or on the field/court. I don't care one bit if a person is gay or straight. My only opinion of athletes as people is formed in their respect for others. Michael Sam is a courageous individual and one that, I feel, will be an excellent ambassador and, hopefully, allow other athletes to acknowledge their homosexuality publicly without fear. Â This ^ is the bottom line Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 well, i agree with the operative word "opinion" .. everyone has one, is entitled to one.. and that is why i signed up for this forum.. it is opinion based.. i get tired of all the "non -experts " calling out those who's opinions may differ from their's.. Â Fair enough, I am fine with differing to the experts. Â In terms of opinions everyone is entitled to one. The fact that someone has an issue with a person based solely on whom they love is ignorant and intolerant IMO. Who are we to tell people how to live their lives? Â I don't know Michael Sam but from everything that I have seen he seems like a good teammate, a good player and a guy that has overcome a lot of personal tragedy. It's not like he is breaking any laws. Sam is brave enough to take this step to potentially open the door for others. I don't know how people could not route for this guy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Assless chaps. Â I have literally got tears in my eyes from laughing so hard. I never knew chaps even came with asses. Aren't all chaps assless? Â But on a serious note, is Nike making these now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tu-Toned Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 who cares. Seems attention seeking to me. I do not approve of that lifestyle, but I don't care how he lives. Can he play football? His life choices are his own. Nail meet head! I also do not approve of that lifestyle, but also could care less. In other news, there will be a fairly huge contingent of heterosexual men entering the draft this May. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Tuesday Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Nail meet head! I also do not approve of that lifestyle, but also could care less. In other news, there will be a fairly huge contingent of heterosexual men entering the draft this May. Â Sorry, what is "that lifestyle"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numark Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Â Â Sorry, what is "that lifestyle"? Â They don't approve of another human being attracted to another human of the same sex for one reason or another. Apparently it's a lifestyle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Sorry, what is "that lifestyle"? Â You know. It's the one with the "agenda." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwight in philly Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Fair enough, I am fine with differing to the experts. Â In terms of opinions everyone is entitled to one. The fact that someone has an issue with a person based solely on whom they love is ignorant and intolerant IMO. Who are we to tell people how to live their lives? Â I don't know Michael Sam but from everything that I have seen he seems like a good teammate, a good player and a guy that has overcome a lot of personal tragedy. It's not like he is breaking any laws. Sam is brave enough to take this step to potentially open the door for others. I don't know how people could not route for this guy? i guess , again, depends on how one defines "ignorance" ..in this case the assumption is that anyone who finds homosexuality undesirable is somehow ignorant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 (edited) i guess , again, depends on how one defines "ignorance" ..in this case the assumption is that anyone who finds homosexuality undesirable is somehow ignorant? Â How can there be opposing definitions of ignorance? Â Ignorance is a lack of knowledge, learning, information, or awareness. Edited February 10, 2014 by K-9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 i guess , again, depends on how one defines "ignorance" ..in this case the assumption is that anyone who finds homosexuality undesirable is somehow ignorant? Â The fact that they care is ignorant (maybe intolerant fits better here). If it is not effecting us and is not illegal I don't know why we should care? It's really not my place to determine who someone else cares for. I live my life and they live theirs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 i guess , again, depends on how one defines "ignorance" ..in this case the assumption is that anyone who finds homosexuality undesirable is somehow ignorant? Â depends i suppose. i dont mean to speak for others, but id venture most of us are probably not desiring a homosexual relationship for ourselves. in that sense its not particularly desirable to me. Â the split seems to be whether or not we think others should be able to land wherever they want on that spectrum without judgement. i desire that people get to go do what the want and not be held back based on who they are attracted to. that, frankly, has little to do with homosexuality and a lot to do with giving your fellow man the common courtesy to pursue their happiness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanCity Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 i guess , again, depends on how one defines "ignorance" ..in this case the assumption is that anyone who finds homosexuality undesirable is somehow ignorant? Â I also broadly used this term earlier and, perhaps, it is not the best chosen one. However, what I find ignorant is the lack of respect for another human based on who they are. The ignorant individuals are those that believe that homosexuality is a choice. I recognize that people are given a choice in regards to whether they act on their preference towards someone of the same sex. People are also given a choice in regards to whether they act on a preference towards someone of the opposite sex. The former is still a homosexual whether they act on it or not and the latter still straight. People are not given a choice. It is not something that is learned. It is something that you are born with. I love women and really cannot see how a man is attracted to another man. But I couldn't care less if they are. Â depends i suppose. i dont mean to speak for others, but id venture most of us are probably not desiring a homosexual relationship for ourselves. in that sense its not particularly desirable to me. Â the split seems to be whether or not we think others should be able to land wherever they want on that spectrum without judgement. i desire that people get to go do what the want and not be held back based on who they are attracted to. that, frankly, has little to do with homosexuality and a lot to do with giving your fellow man the common courtesy to pursue their happiness. Â Â BINGO! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 They don't approve of another human being attracted to another human of the same sex for one reason or another. Apparently it's a lifestyle Clearly its a lifestyle choice. Didn't you read Tim's treatise on homosexuality? Were homosexuality a function of genetics it would have been phased out of the genome because any trait that is deleterious to the fitness of an individual is eventually phased out of the genome. Like albinism, dwarfism, sickle cell and everything else on this quick list of genetic disorders which also don't exist. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_genetic_disorders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwight in philly Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 I also broadly used this term earlier and, perhaps, it is not the best chosen one. However, what I find ignorant is the lack of respect for another human based on who they are. The ignorant individuals are those that believe that homosexuality is a choice. I recognize that people are given a choice in regards to whether they act on their preference towards someone of the same sex. People are also given a choice in regards to whether they act on a preference towards someone of the opposite sex. The former is still a homosexual whether they act on it or not and the latter still straight. People are not given a choice. It is not something that is learned. It is something that you are born with. I love women and really cannot see how a man is attracted to another man. But I couldn't care less if they are. Â Â Â Â BINGO! well said, there is not a measuring device i am aware of that could measure my indifference on this subject.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Linen Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Yes I am indeed intolerant of intolerance for intolerance sake. Murder, pedophilia,, the examples you used in your previous post, are things that effect other people. Homosexuality does not effect other people. I definitely agree that Christians interpret the Bible differently and always refrain from any name calling. That said I hate when people use religion in general, but specifically my religion, as a platform to condemn behaviors of others that have no bearing on them. I won't convert you over an internet message board. Your beliefs are your beliefs. I strongly oppose them and will speak up when the situation arises, this happens to be one of those cases as it hits very close to home for me. My Aunt was a god loving woman who sang in the choir every Sunday. During her funeral though my father, who did the eulogy, was not allowed to talk about her being a lesbian or anything to do with people that she loved and cared greatly for simply because they were gay. My interpretation is that we are meant to love one another not judge them based on their sexual orientation or anything else out of their control. Â Final piece to you is that our beliefs can change. You can change your belief system. Your faith is yours and yours alone nobody can tell you that they are right and you are wrong. I just strongly dislike when people use the name of my faith to preach intolerance. Â I'm not clinging to hate, it's just that when the topic comes up my opinion is that the act is wrong. I feel an obligation to stand up for what I believe the almighty believes. Obviously our interpretation of his beliefs on this matter differ. I don't pretend to have all the answers and obviously I can't change your mind on a message board either. I think there is room in this discussion to respectfully disagree with homosexuality and not be a hateful person. Â I agree with you that our beliefs can change. If we're strong enough to look beyond personal involvement, God can reveal. Â I do sympathize with you on the situation with your late Aunt. I never want to see any person hurting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Â Â Bally's is practically a Power Lifting gym compared to the Planet Fitness-type places. Look, I've got no issue when a place caters to the non-meat-head/pump-and-tone crowd; totally fine. Where I draw the line is an official edict sent down from corporate that outlaws basic weight lifting staples like squats and deadlifts simply because some members might get intimidated by the big meanies that want to get stronger...and to make it worse, the same outfit turns around and serves pizza, bagels, and donuts to their members as "rewards" for showing up. Â Sorry...rant over. Â Those no deadlift signs planet fitness has out are downright comical Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsRUs Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Clearly its a lifestyle choice. Didn't you read Tim's treatise on homosexuality? Were homosexuality a function of genetics it would have been phased out of the genome because any trait that is deleterious to the fitness of an individual is eventually phased out of the genome. Like albinism, dwarfism, sickle cell and everything else on this quick list of genetic disorders which also don't exist. http://en.wikipedia....netic_disorders  well done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 I'm not clinging to hate, it's just that when the topic comes up my opinion is that the act is wrong. I feel an obligation to stand up for what I believe the almighty believes. Obviously our interpretation of his beliefs on this matter differ. I don't pretend to have all the answers and obviously I can't change your mind on a message board either. I think there is room in this discussion to respectfully disagree with homosexuality and not be a hateful person. Â I agree with you that our beliefs can change. If we're strong enough to look beyond personal involvement, God can reveal. Â I do sympathize with you on the situation with your late Aunt. I never want to see any person hurting. Â The Almighty believes that we should love each other...that message is patently clear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerry Jabber Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Whether he's gay or straight, it shouldn't matter, just as long as the guy produces on the football field and stays out of trouble. Some people are acting as if he's Bruce Cuskeeoski from San Francisco University (from 3:29-3:49): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_L6IeH6KeaY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2o Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 The Almighty believes that we should love each other...that message is patently clear  True my friend. I don't care about his sexual orientation. I don't agree with the lifestyle, but I don't have to answer for his life either. I do think this will affect his draft stock, but It's not like he is Jadeveon Clowney and projected to go top 5. We're talking about a mid to late round prospect here who may have just caused his name being called to be more 6th or 7th than 4th or 5th Round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014  Clearly its a lifestyle choice. Didn't you read Tim's treatise on homosexuality? Were homosexuality a function of genetics it would have been phased out of the genome because any trait that is deleterious to the fitness of an individual is eventually phased out of the genome. Like albinism, dwarfism, sickle cell and everything else on this quick list of genetic disorders which also don't exist. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_genetic_disorders  You are killing me right now. Every post is spot on and hilarious. Well done!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 I think there is room in this discussion to respectfully disagree with homosexuality and not be a hateful person. Â i guess, ive never understood what there is to agree or disagree with. ive never felt like i "agree with homosexuality" so the idea that someone "disagrees" with it just seems strange to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubs Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Clearly its a lifestyle choice. Didn't you read Tim's treatise on homosexuality? Were homosexuality a function of genetics it would have been phased out of the genome because any trait that is deleterious to the fitness of an individual is eventually phased out of the genome. Like albinism, dwarfism, sickle cell and everything else on this quick list of genetic disorders which also don't exist. http://en.wikipedia....netic_disorders  I didn't get the sense that Tim was saying it was a choice. He as simply offering an alternative view of the topic. It seemed to me he just wanted to have a discussion about it. Frankly I am rather surprised at how quickly it turns into attacking Tim.  I was looking forward to reading that discussion between some members, but it never really materialized. Was just Tim offering some contra-points and everyone else attacking him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 You are killing me right now. Every post is spot on and hilarious. Well done!! Â He has a knack for that...makes him one of my favorite posters...his work in the Shoutbox in particular is Grade A material. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pondslider Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 I love the idea that God is supposed to be omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent and yet humans think that they have the authority to speak for this being or could even for a second fathom what such a being really wants or believes. Let alone knowing for a FACT that this all powerful all knowing being gets a case of the ickies whenever gay people touch each other. If there is something out there resembling the christian version of god I doubt anyone in this thread has the first clue what it really wants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section122 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 I'm not clinging to hate, it's just that when the topic comes up my opinion is that the act is wrong. I feel an obligation to stand up for what I believe the almighty believes. Obviously our interpretation of his beliefs on this matter differ. I don't pretend to have all the answers and obviously I can't change your mind on a message board either. I think there is room in this discussion to respectfully disagree with homosexuality and not be a hateful person. Â I agree with you that our beliefs can change. If we're strong enough to look beyond personal involvement, God can reveal. Â I do sympathize with you on the situation with your late Aunt. I never want to see any person hurting. As do I and yes they clearly do. Â I hope I have not come off as hateful as that is most definitely not my intention. As I stated earlier there is a marked difference between the god presented in the old testament (where leviticus lies) and the god portrayed in the new testament. The god in the old testament was responsible for the exile from eden, the flood and noah's arc, and soddom and gomorrah. The new testament god is one that gave us his only son to wash away all of our sins. The one who said I give you one commandment above all else, love one another as I have loved you. The new testament god is much more how I like to picture him, compassionate, forgiving, and kind. I do not view a vengeful and spiteful being as one that I would follow. One that is compassionate to the point of sacrificing his son for me? That is the guy I can follow. Â To each their own though. I have no problem with someone disagreeing with homosexuality. Where I have a problem is the condemnation that some bring due to their disagreeing with it. Â I didn't get the sense that Tim was saying it was a choice. He as simply offering an alternative view of the topic. It seemed to me he just wanted to have a discussion about it. Frankly I am rather surprised at how quickly it turns into attacking Tim. Â I was looking forward to reading that discussion between some members, but it never really materialized. Was just Tim offering some contra-points and everyone else attacking him. I answered his questions but received no response. Some of his points were soft at best but I still tried to give him a fair shake to have a conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 (edited) Brilliant! Â I guess my question to anyone objecting to Sam's lifestyle for religious reasons is if Jesus Christ, the foundation of the Christian faith, were alive today, would he be condemning people who are gay? I could be wrong, but did he not preach love and tolerance? Â I never met the guy (Jesus) so I can't really speak for him, but my money would be on Jesus accepting and loving gay people. Â The only parts of the Bible that refer to homosexuality happen to be in the same parts that condone, and give the rules for, rape and slavery. So maybe we can agree there are some parts that the people who wrote it a couple millenia ago got a little wrong? Edited February 10, 2014 by DrDareustein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebandit27 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Brilliant! Â I guess my question to anyone objecting to Sam's lifestyle for religious reasons is if Jesus Christ, the foundation of the Christian faith, were alive today, would he be condemning people who are gay? I could be wrong, but did he not preach love and tolerance? Â Again--pretty clear: love each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D521646 Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 Juronimo – Clearly its a lifestyle choice. Didn't you read Tim's treatise on homosexuality? Were homosexuality a function of genetics it would have been phased out of the genome because any trait that is deleterious to the fitness of an individual is eventually phased out of the genome. Like albinism, dwarfism, sickle cell and everything else on this quick list of genetic disorders which also don't exist. http://en.wikipedia....netic_disorders Wow, twice in one thread. You seem to have a knack for the strawman; either that or you can’t comprehend what you’re reading? Judging by your comprehension of what I said, you clearly have no clue how genes work. Once more, but this time real slow like.. Ready? See if homosexuals were solely responsible for passing along the homosexual gene, it would have been long gone from our genome many eons ago. That my good man is a scientific fact, and not in dispute by anyone. What I did say is that, like albinism, dwarfism, and sickle-cell, if there is a gene or series of genes responsible for the expression of homosexuality it would be passed on by heterosexuals. Which means that although two perfectly functioning heterosexuals where at least one of them had the gene, but did not themselves express it, still possessed the gene, and as such through mating the gene itself reared its ugly head in their offspring because neither parent had dominant alleles that would have repressed the evolutionarily negative consequence of producing a purely homosexual human being. That would be a recessive gene, see also: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_a_recessive_gene#slide=3&article=What_is_a_dominant_gene_and_what_is_a_recessive_gene Are you clear now? Tim- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 I didn't get the sense that Tim was saying it was a choice. He as simply offering an alternative view of the topic. It seemed to me he just wanted to have a discussion about it. Frankly I am rather surprised at how quickly it turns into attacking Tim.  I was looking forward to reading that discussion between some members, but it never really materialized. Was just Tim offering some contra-points and everyone else attacking him. Tim has been very clear on his position that homosexuality is a choice. He was more measured in his delivery this time around, but the message was there down to the same examples pulled from Tim's peculiar brand of science. I've already been through this process with Tim and he isn't interested in a discussion.  In a darker corner of the internet, you might find a website where Tim drops the pretense about having an honest and open discussion and lets his real feelings regarding homosexuality be known.  Juronimo –  Wow, twice in one thread. You seem to have a knack for the strawman; either that or you can’t comprehend what you’re reading? Judging by your comprehension of what I said, you clearly have no clue how genes work. Once more, but this time real slow like.. Ready?  See if homosexuals were solely responsible for passing along the homosexual gene, it would have been long gone from our genome many eons ago. That my good man is a scientific fact, and not in dispute by anyone. What I did say is that, like albinism, dwarfism, and sickle-cell, if there is a gene or series of genes responsible for the expression of homosexuality it would be passed on by heterosexuals. Which means that although two perfectly functioning heterosexuals where at least one of them had the gene, but did not themselves express it, still possessed the gene, and as such through mating the gene itself reared its ugly head in their offspring because neither parent had dominant alleles that would have repressed the evolutionarily negative consequence of producing a purely homosexual human being. That would be a recessive gene, see also: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_a_recessive_gene#slide=3&article=What_is_a_dominant_gene_and_what_is_a_recessive_gene  Are you clear now?  Tim- I was clear on genetics before. Why don't you post your diatribe again since I can't reference the original? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts