A Few Thoughts about the Bucs Game, in no particular order

[bmur66]

I know you didn't want to do this so I will do it for you

^ This is Diggs

Edited December 13, 2021 by bmur66

[BobbyC81]

8 hours ago, SirAndrew said:

Yeah, I didn’t know we’d sneak back in the game when down 24-3, so called Allen runs really drove me crazy at that point. I’m not sure if most fans understand how much of a unnecessary beating Josh is taking. It’s ridiculous for a guy with an elite arm. 

Diggs effort has looked subpar the past few games. I’ve seen injury suggested, which is possible. I just hope this isn’t like Minnesota where he shuts down a bit when things aren’t going according to plan.

There have been plays where he catches the ball and starts to go down as if he’s expecting a hit and no defender is there yet. Last season he was so good after the catch.  Even the broadcast team commented about him ducking on one play

[Gugny]

9 hours ago, Virgil said:

While this season is one of parody and week to week results, the Bills fell to one gave over .500 in a game where they didn't look like they belonged on the same field for half the game.  As I look back on this season versus my previous seasons writing these, it's hard for me to tell if it's harder to write during a season of blown expectations or during the drought.  At least during the drought, we could focus on improvement and hope.  In this season, it's been more so about meeting expectations or letdowns.  At this point, it's very clear where the problems lay with this team and not it's only a matter of how the Bills will fix it in the off-season through personnel or coaching changes.

 

1 - Allen - I'm sure many will discuss the interception before the half, but even by that point in the game, it's almost impossible for me to blame Josh for much of anything he does.  Behind this offensive line where he was running for his life on almost every play, because Daboll can't seem to figure out how to block more than 5, and receivers that don't magically get open in less than 2 seconds, Josh is constantly being asked to make something out of nothing.  I'm not saying he doesn't have opportunities (high throws to the sideline) nor is he perfect, I'm just saying it's impossible to tell.  He had a great touchdown run off the RPO and had a solid completion percentage for a bit, but then was down 21 and had to start playing hero ball.  Josh is our entire offense and sets up the success of everyone else on the team.  His ability to move in the pocket brings up safeties and he actually avoided more sacks than the stat sheet will show . But it's unrealistic to expect him to carry this team on his own.  I feel good knowing that, no matter what changes happen on this team, we have our QB to build around.

 

2 - Daboll - Coming into this game, you knew thew Bucs could do one thing well on defense, and that was rush the passer.  With that being said, why did Daboll leave only 5 players in to block so much?  More so, with the amount of DB blitzes, leave Motor in the backfield as extra pass protection.  I say Motor very specifically because Breida got absolutely run over when he tried to make a block.  McKenzie ran a Jet Sweep threat only one time which pretty much sums up Daboll's attempt to confuse the defense, move the pocket, or do anything at all to slow down the Bucs pass rush.  While we did get it going in the second half, there's still no excuse for the first half performance or the 3 and out in OT.  I don't feel like this team has any "go to" plays anymore and there's no overall theme on offense.  Each drive and 3rd down play feels like a toss up.  This has been an ongoing theme this past month and it's one thing to just get beat up front, it's another to not plan for it at all. 

 

3 - Running backs in the first half - 

 

4 - I seem to recognize your face
Haunting familiar, yet I can't seem to place it
Cannot find the candle of thought to light your name
Lifetimes are catching up with me
All these changes taking place
I wish I'd seen the place
But no one's ever taken me

 

5 - Defensive Line - I almost labeled this thought pass rush, but that would indicate that the Bills have one.  Brady had literally all day to throw and this 40 million dollar defensive line with multiple first round pics was beyond pathetic in this game.  You can see the frustration brewing from the players and Oliver is a ticking time bomb of a personal foul.  I've been able to tolerate McD's rotation on the line, but we aren't able to rush the passer or stop the run with these guys and aren't getting a ROI.  Groot has been non-existent since the first few weeks.  Addison's had one good game, and threw in an offside in this game.  Hughes is the kind of almost sacks and missed holding calls.  Oliver is high motor, undisciplined, and I'm waiting for more PFs against him.

 

6 - Zone Defense - While Poyer and Hyde are great safeties, how were they left to cover Godwin and Evans so much?  I understand that Tre is out and we need to compensate to a degree, but our great passing defense gave up over 200 passing yards in the first half, with each pass looking to fall right in front of either safety.  Also, with zero pass rush, zone defense is only good if you force the QB to make bad reads and throw into coverage.  With Brady having all day, it was surgical how easily he picked us apart.  As we transitioned to the second half, it does look like we started playing man, and saw more success.  With that, shout out to Dane Jackson for playing well 1 on 1 in coverage against Gronk.  

 

7 - Edmunds - With this thought, I will be retiring any future comments about Edmunds, as I'm just over him as a player.  While Milano didn't have a great game, I can at least remember seeing him on the field (Brady sack was beautiful) with some big tackles and pass knock downs.  Edmunds had one good tackle in the open field against Gronk.  Other than that, Edmunds was just a big bodied player in the middle of the field who occupies space.  Edmunds got engulfed by blocks, couldn't beat a man when rushing the passer, took terrible angles on both Fournette long runs and overall invisible.  He did start to play better in the second half, but he's no where near a play maker or worthy of his draft selection.  I don't blame the game winning touchdown on him, but I do blame him for the converted 3rd and 1 in OT.  Edmunds was clearly behind the LOS and still allowed Fournette to get 2 yards from the point of contact.  When we need a hero, it continues to not be him.

 

8 - Knox - If there's a bright spot this season, it has to be the emergence of Knox in this offense.  Needing to forget his terrible play last week, Knox was decent on the plays he was left in to block and scored one of our only two passing touchdown of the game.  With that catch, he leads the NFL in touchdown passes by a TE.  In an upcoming off-season where a lot of touch decisions are going to be made, TE is no longer one of the positions we need to worry about. 

 

9 - McD - I want to give McD props for clearly getting involved with the defensive play calling early in the game.  However, why the defensive game plan needed to be adjusted so early in the game is another question.  But what will be talked about more so than anything else tomorrow will be his decision making again on 4th down.  Sure, if the fake punt worked, then everything is fine.  But the choice to give Breida the ball over Allen on 4th and short is a head-scratcher to me.  Then, when the Bills actually have some momentum, he punts on 4th and short.  I'm all for continuity and we did just sign him to an extension, but I don't think that gets him out of having to present a solid plan of change to the owners going forward.  I hope he's willing to adapt his defensive line rotation, as well as start to take a bigger interest in the offensive game planning.  Being 7-6 with this schedule and roster is a joke.

 

10 - 2nd Half - I know a lot are going to take the second half as a positive sign that the offense woke up and hopefully will be good down the stretch.  And while I do try to take a positive approach to these games, I'm also human and tired of not winning a close game this season.  I remember expecting to convert every 3 and 4th down play last year, versus expecting not to this year.  I think we were 1-9 on 3rd downs at one point.  The offense did wake up, but I still attribute that more to Allen playing hero ball as much as finally remembering Davis and Beasley are on the field.  To that point, I don't care if Sanders plays another snap for us.  Since his arrival, he's taken snaps away from guys who proved it on the field last year, has had maybe 3 good games, and has disappeared since.  I'm happy it was a game, but also felt like I lost twice today.  This game felt over at half, but the Bills did the most Billsy thing they could by coming back, giving hope, only to lose again.   

 

*Should we start to get worried about Digg's ability to track the deep ball?  This is two games in a row where that's cost us

**The only reason I'm not talking about the refs is because of promise earlier in the season to stop blaming games on them.  Yes, the 50/50 calls for PI went against the Bills and never in their favor, but we need to stop expecting them to help us.  To call that play on 3rd and 2 if you don't plan on going for it on 4th is stupid and on us.

 

 

I know the season isn't over and we still have a good chance to make the playoffs, but there's no reason to believe this team is capable of winning a game against any team who's physical in the trenches or be able to come back and win a game from behind.  The beauty of the drought was having no expectations.  I don't even know how to process this season besides it being a disappointment.  There's a lot of off-season work to do and I don't know if it will be possible in just one year.  We've proven that we need to upgrade at least 3 spots on the offensive line, get a genuine pass rusher (not a rotation!), a big space eater up the middle, a DB to fill in for Tre (Tre won't be back until November and Wallace is a UFA), and a MLB who can actually make a play.  This team needs to change at a core level, and I hope it can be done with tweaks, but I honestly don't know anymore.

 

Go Bills

 

Here are my thoughts:

McDermott is not a good HC.

Daboll flat out sucks.

Beane has failed this team miserably in many ways.  The "he got us Allen," pass has expired.

Edmunds sucks.  People need to stop explaining it away.  He sucks.

Because of all of the aforementioned sucktitude, the Bills suck.

[bmur66]

15 minutes ago, BobbyC81 said:

There have been plays where he catches the ball and starts to go down as if he’s expecting a hit and no defender is there yet. Last season he was so good after the catch.  Even the broadcast team commented about him ducking on one play

Diggs is a ducker. He is not a big guy and it is self preservation. I don't blame him. He cranked it up in the playoffs last year and didn't duck the hit. Caught some DB's by surprise.

[colin]

10 hours ago, Best Williams Available said:

Thanks Virgil!

 

2- our “go to plays” only work if our player makes an incredible play, they’re never easy or take advantage of mis matches.

5- I can deal with Oliver being a mean a**hole as long as he performs.

6- Dane Jackson did incredible for what he was asked to do.

7- utter garbage is Edmunds. We win if Klein plays today.

9- I don’t want McD near the offense or we get more Moss-like runs every set of downs. Dump Daboll and promote Dorsey or get some recently fired offensive minded head coach out for redemption.

 

im a huge fan of frank reich, but after beating the pats i hope the colts go into a total tailspin, he gets fired, and we sign him as our OC.

[Billsatlastin2018]

6 minutes ago, colin said:

 

im a huge fan of frank reich, but after beating the pats i hope the colts go into a total tailspin, he gets fired, and we sign him as our OC.

As the HC! 

[colin]

1 minute ago, Billsatlastin2018 said:

As the HC! 

 

 

look man, im not proud to say it, but if reich demands that beane wear high heels and full clown make up and act as his personal rickshaw driver year round, then i see those as reasonable demands and we must comply.

[muppy]

virgil Sir thank you as always for your time to post. I want to acknowledge it but say Im still raw from last night I call it mourning monday...I mentally was in disbelief mode as the comeback happened I need a total replay viewing of the 2nd half to adequately process what I saw last night

 

#numb

[Boatdrinks]

20 minutes ago, colin said:

 

im a huge fan of frank reich, but after beating the pats i hope the colts go into a total tailspin, he gets fired, and we sign him as our OC.

As Bills fans, I don’t think we want the Colts to win that game. Or did something change w yesterday’s results? A Colts win seemed bad for Buffalo in the ESPN playoff machine on Saturday. 

[Boatdrinks]

Just now, ScottLaw said:

Well if you still think the Bills can win the division, you want the Colts to win…. Not sure it matters if Josh is limping throughout the rest of the season. 

Ok got it. The machine was giving the Bills a solid chance at the division if they beat TB and NE ( our 2 toughest remaining ) We know how that turned out. our chances went down dramatically to make the playoffs w a loss to NE plus a Colts win over NE. 

[SectionC3]

5 hours ago, Nihilarian said:

The one thing that bothers me most about this game... and there were plenty of things in this game!

 

Red zone TD scoring. The 2021* Buffalo Bills are currently ranked 18th in the league. Currently at 58.93% and that is up from their last 3 games were they were 46.5%.

 

Last season I believe they were close to #1 for awhile and settled in at #12. 

 

The Bills score a TD when it's 3rd and 2 at the TB 7 yard line... or even go for it on fourth down instead of a field goal. If the Bills get a TD there I doubt even miracle worker Brady gets a TD with 22 seconds or less left in the game.

 

I'll be happy when I see the door hitting Dabs on his way out...

 

 

Lastly, What happened with Diggs in this game, along with Sanders and did the offense do better after Sanders left the game? Targeting Bease, Davis more often?

Agree! 

Agree on sanders.   Hate to say it, but our best mix doesn’t include him.  It’s Gabe Davis time. 

[Steve O]

The game was a microcosm  of being a bills fan. First half - almost unwatchable a la teams of the late 60's and late 70's, mid 80's, and first decade and a half of this century. Second half - excitement and reason for hope, a la OJ in his prime years,  early 80's Knox teams, late 80's and 90's Kelly etc. teams, and of course the McBeane era. OT - Great comeback only to have our hearts ripped out at the end...Ferguson delay of game, Harmon drop, HR throwback, and of course 4 SB losses to name just a few. The feeling after the game was familiar to long time Bills fans. For those that have become fans during the past two decades, well, get used to this feeling. Why did Dad have to move to from Mass. to Western NY before starting a family, I could have been a New England fan.

[corta765]

1 - Allen - My only positive after this game is I feel confident knowing he will win us a SB. I genuinely feel bad we are wasting another good year by him.

 

2 - Daboll - Call me a conspiracist but I am starting to think Daboll is not the problem and want to pass more and McD is the issue. I say this because McD's conservative nature really has shown true this season and Daboll has seemingly indicated he want to never run again. He is not without his faults, I think this has been Dabolls worst year as OC, but it is starting to show the issues might be less him and the big tuna instead.

 

3 - Running backs in the first half - 

 

4 - Elderly Women Elderly Women! love this song it evokes such interesting feels and you visually see everything as Eddie sings.

 

5 - Defensive Line - Biggest failure on the season to me is the DL. They kept certain players and drafted guys believing it would work and it hasn't. Star has stunk and they should've got a back up 1T for him. They really need to re-evaluate this entire area.

 

6 - Zone Defense - I think they did what they could with the parts they had. The defense did hold TB

 

7 - Edmunds - So my view on Edmunds is there is a $ amount I'd pay and there is a $ amount I won't. He is not the worst LB in the league and at times he plays very well with Milano. The difference is Milano makes farrrr more plays that you see and don't see. Truthfully for LB I do not value the position $ wise unless the player is regularly an impact player. Milano it is so noticeable what he does and his impact when he is out. Edmunds not so much. If he would would take $6-8 mil I would consider it. But I am not doing some giant deal for him, you can get a replacement cheap. Heck Klein played well when he was out to the point I forgot Tremaine wasn't there. Someone is going to overpay Tremaine and realize the 2 Pro Bowl appearances were because of the guy next to him.

 

8 - Knox - Disagree. Knox single handedly cost the team last week on three separate plays. I am not letting him go, but I would bring in or draft another TE to have another solid option. No doubt Knox has taken a step forward and go for him, but we need another guy so if Knox is out a true target exists and to potentially replace him as he just isn't as dependable as we hope.

 

9 - McD - Last week I said in rational thoughts that we are not firing McD. I am not firing him but the honeymoon is over, the clock is ticking, and at this point next year is the decider on if he stays. His playing not to lose has costed this team games this year and the times he actually decides to go for it on 4th down have been weirdly bad play calls made to. The 4th down punt was self fulfilling as Brady marched right past the area of punt with ease. Last week it was not going for 2 when you are down 8-6 after the TD. Fast fact Sean if you go for two you either or tied or down by 2. If you kick the EP your still down so what the heck is the difference. Just in general it has been utterly maddening the decisions made and it is costing his team. I do not want to waste Josh and if Sean can't figure out this stuff he needs to go. I appreciate the raised level of success and expectation, but his in game decision making going back to the AFC title are hugely problematic.

 

10 - 2nd Half - Agreed

 

*Should we start to get worried about Digg's ability to track the deep ball? I said this last night that he needs to take some blame for this season too. Last week he blew the TD catch which would've won the game, this week two different deep balls he seemed unprepared. In general this year he has been off at the worst possible moments. Still love Diggs though and happy he is ours.

 

[Just in Atlanta]

3 hours ago, Gugny said:

 

Here are my thoughts:

McDermott is not a good HC.

Daboll flat out sucks.

Beane has failed this team miserably in many ways.  The "he got us Allen," pass has expired.

Edmunds sucks.  People need to stop explaining it away.  He sucks.

Because of all of the aforementioned sucktitude, the Bills suck.

One of the reasons I love this board is that so many people avoid hyperbole.

[MJS]

I'm kind of sick of Daboll at this point. He is so stubborn. When things are working it is great, but when they aren't he fails to adjust. And he is just deficient as a run game coordinator.

 

And it is alarming to me that we have seen every single individual offensive lineman play better than they are this season together. We need a better oline coach that can get these guys to play as a cohesive unit that communicates, passes off defenders effectively, and doesn't let free rushers through on every single play.

[Jerome007]

7 hours ago, Bill from NYC said:

I have a question.....Are we 100% sure that we are not overrating our safeties at this point? I must say that I was not overly impressed with them last night. 

Are you serious? Yes yesterday was not their best game, for Hyde anyway. But did you not notice that Brady was having a comfortable time? The Bills secondary is VERY good, even without Tre, to allow so few big plays when the opposing QBs have so much time and clean pockets. 

[Livinginthepast]

4 hours ago, Steve O said:

The game was a microcosm  of being a bills fan. First half - almost unwatchable a la teams of the late 60's and late 70's, mid 80's, and first decade and a half of this century. Second half - excitement and reason for hope, a la OJ in his prime years,  early 80's Knox teams, late 80's and 90's Kelly etc. teams, and of course the McBeane era. OT - Great comeback only to have our hearts ripped out at the end...Ferguson delay of game, Harmon drop, HR throwback, and of course 4 SB losses to name just a few. The feeling after the game was familiar to long time Bills fans. For those that have become fans during the past two decades, well, get used to this feeling. Why did Dad have to move to from Mass. to Western NY before starting a family, I could have been a New England fan.

I agree. I saw a several ghosts of Bills teams past in last nights game. It was very SBesque in parts of the game. Unfortunately the huge gut punch as we lost in tragic fashion was all to familiar.  My wife questions why I dont get a new team (after 40 years of heartbreak). 

[Alphadawg7]

18 hours ago, Virgil said:

 

 

5 - Defensive Line - I almost labeled this thought pass rush, but that would indicate that the Bills have one.  Brady had literally all day to throw and this 40 million dollar defensive line with multiple first round pics was beyond pathetic in this game.  You can see the frustration brewing from the players and Oliver is a ticking time bomb of a personal foul.  I've been able to tolerate McD's rotation on the line, but we aren't able to rush the passer or stop the run with these guys and aren't getting a ROI.  Groot has been non-existent since the first few weeks.  Addison's had one good game, and threw in an offside in this game.  Hughes is the kind of almost sacks and missed holding calls.  Oliver is high motor, undisciplined, and I'm waiting for more PFs against him.

 

 

Well honestly, this is a tale of 2 halves.  We pressured Brady a lot into bad throws in the second half, so I would say they did a MUCH better job and was part of the reason why we dominated the Bucs for the most part the second half.  

[Bill from NYC]

2 hours ago, Jerome007 said:

Are you serious? Yes yesterday was not their best game, for Hyde anyway. But did you not notice that Brady was having a comfortable time? The Bills secondary is VERY good, even without Tre, to allow so few big plays when the opposing QBs have so much time and clean pockets. 

Hyde was getting beat like a drum from what I saw. He is also now into his 30's. I am not saying that he is a bad player. I do however suspect that maybe we are just not AS set at the safety position that many (myself included) seemed to think.

Just an observation, nothing to get alarmed about.  

[HappyDays]

9 hours ago, Bill from NYC said:

I also think that Josh makes these receivers look quite a bit better than they are.

 

Numerous receivers have had career years with Allen. It is no longer a coincidence. The last two weeks he is the only offensive player that has been making exceptional plays. Even Diggs has been disappointing. I think Diggs last year would have caught the long TD pass against the Pats and another long TD pass right before halftime yesterday. Those two plays alone are the difference between 9-4 controlling our own destiny for the #1 seed, and 7-6 fighting for a wildcard spot. This offense badly needs playmakers.