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Democracy’s Fiery Ordeal: The War in Ukraine 🇺🇦


Tiberius

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5 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Possibly. Keep in mind I’m only restating an opinion/strategy I heard. It remains to be seen if this pundit is correct. 

 

Oh I think the pundit is correct.  It's just that Putin badly miscalculated and the irony is he will have severely tarnished his reputation as a result.  When millions of Russians are suffering because he wanted to invade another country and the world made him pay, the history books won't be too kind to him even if he were to get that land, which he won't.

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31 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Oh I think the pundit is correct.  It's just that Putin badly miscalculated and the irony is he will have severely tarnished his reputation as a result.  When millions of Russians are suffering because he wanted to invade another country and the world made him pay, the history books won't be too kind to him even if he were to get that land, which he won't.

Quite possibly true. If this pundit is correct, he doesn't care what the current history will say. He only cares what the long-term history will show.....he got Ukraine back. Russian society is not like American society. It doesn't blow in the wind waiting for the next election cycle. It's so hard for Americans to understand that, but I'm guessing it's just as hard for them to understand us and why we waste so much time flip-flopping back and forth between regimes and dogmas.

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9 hours ago, Tiberius said:


“The purpose of the visit is to confirm the unequivocal support of the entire European Union for the sovereignty and independence of Ukraine. The aim of this visit is also to present a broad package of support for Ukraine and Ukrainians."

 

 

 

Those things cannot co-exist.  

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56 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Quite possibly true. If this pundit is correct, he doesn't care what the current history will say. He only cares what the long-term history will show.....he got Ukraine back. Russian society is not like American society. It doesn't blow in the wind waiting for the next election cycle. It's so hard for Americans to understand that, but I'm guessing it's just as hard for them to understand us and why we waste so much time flip-flopping back and forth between regimes and dogmas.

He ain’t got Ukraine back….in fact odds are against that.

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It looks like Russia is building a cover story to justify the use of nuclear weapons in Ukraine. They are now claiming the US is advising Ukraine on the development of nuclear weapons, that the Ukrainian government has everything it needs, and that they cannot allow Ukraine to obtain nuclear capacity...

 

Sounds like Putin is itching to go nuclear, no?

 

https://www.jpost.com/international/article-701359

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From the BBC:

An international peacekeeping mission with military capability should be sent to Ukraine, the leader of Poland's ruling party has suggested while on a symbolic trip to Kyiv.

"I think that it is necessary to have a peace mission - Nato, possibly some wider international structure - but a mission that will be able to defend itself, which will operate on Ukrainian territory," Jaroslaw Kaczynski said.

He made the suggestion at a press conference in Ukraine's capital, where he appeared tonight alongside the country's president Volodymyr Zelensky and the prime ministers of Poland, the Czech Republic, and Slovenia.

The central European leaders have made the risky trip to Kyiv by train in a show of support for Ukraine.

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A very reasonable, accurate assessment of many issues tht have come up in this thread, specifically, the air war.

The guy with the Navy shirt on is Ward Carroll, a retired F-14 RIO, (back seater).

Many things I have mentioned are explained in detail, ie., no fly zone, providing airplanes etc.

 

Time spent watching this is far better spent than watching the TV nonsense spewed out by ignorant "hosts."

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iBARgW_vHVE&t=79s

 

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53 minutes ago, sherpa said:

A very reasonable, accurate assessment of many issues tht have come up in this thread, specifically, the air war.

The guy with the Navy shirt on is Ward Carroll, a retired F-14 RIO, (back seater).

Many things I have mentioned are explained in detail, ie., no fly zone, providing airplanes etc.

 

Time spent watching this is far better spent than watching the TV nonsense spewed out by ignorant "hosts."

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iBARgW_vHVE&t=79s

 

That was really good. Ya, I see the no fly zone might back fire. Putin’s lost, it’s just hard to take watching him murder this country, but staying patient might be the best plan. 

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6 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

That was really good. Ya, I see the no fly zone might back fire. Putin’s lost, it’s just hard to take watching him murder this country, but staying patient might be the best plan. 

 

I am proud of you Tibs.

 

There are a few components to that link.

One is the drastic diminution of the Russian Air Force and their obvious inability to coordinate and support their ground forces.

Two is the obvious lack of training, especially in close air support, which is training and com intense.

Three is something we have always known from debriefing, which is that the Russians have limited capability to prevent friendly shoot downs.

They simply haven't cared.  

 

Four is that Putin is screwed.

His only out card is a NATO intervention.

Th last ten minutes or so discuss that in detail.

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3 minutes ago, sherpa said:

 

I am proud of you Tibs.

 

There are a few components to that link.

One is the drastic diminution of the Russian Air Force and their obvious inability to coordinate and support their ground forces.

Two is the obvious lack of training, especially in close air support, which is training and com intense.

Three is something we have always known from debriefing, which is that the Russians have limited capability to prevent friendly shoot downs.

They simply haven't cared.  

 

Four is that Putin is screwed.

His only out card is a NATO intervention.

Th last ten minutes or so discuss that in detail.

Really surprised about the Ukrainian intermediate SAMs. Don’t hear much about them. 

 

Also, how well the low budget, small drones they have in small numbers are performing. 

 

And Russias inability to use drones because we have compromised their communications. Never thought of that! But now it seems obvious. 

 

Our drones would simply punish the Russians very severely, but that might not be necessary 

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50 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

That was really good. Ya, I see the no fly zone might back fire. Putin’s lost, it’s just hard to take watching him murder this country, but staying patient might be the best plan. 


Yay!   Finally coming around. 👍🏻

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3 hours ago, Tiberius said:

That was really good. Ya, I see the no fly zone might back fire. Putin’s lost, it’s just hard to take watching him murder this country, but staying patient might be the best plan. 

 

From your lips to Congress' ears. 

 

Doing more might feel good, but it also feels like interrupting your enemy while he's making a mistake.

 

Then again, Putin could go completely insane.

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'We all will be judged.' Russian prisoners of war voice disquiet, shame over war in Ukraine

 

 I want to tell Russian servicemen: lay down your arms and leave your stations, don't come here. Everyone wants peace here."
Vladimir then went a big step further, saying: "I want to tell our commander-in-chief to stop terror acts in Ukraine because when we come back we'll rise against him."


Another reconnaissance officer at the same event echoed the sentiment, addressing Putin directly.
"You won't hide this for long. There are many like us here. Sooner or later, we'll come home."


Speaking to CNN, Maxim, the pilot, became emotional about the suffering inflicted on civilians since the invasion.

 

https://www.cnn.com/2022/03/15/europe/ukraine-russian-prisoners-of-war-intl/index.html

 

Here is more hope when the Russian military thinks Putin is evil

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Yes 

 

The Biden administration is considering providing Ukraine with U.S.-made killer drones — cutting-edge guided missiles that could accurately target Russian tanks and artillery positions from miles away — two congressional officials briefed on the matter told NBC News.

No decisions have been made, but the officials said the White House is mulling whether to equip Ukraine with explosives-laden “loitering missiles,” called Switchblades, as part of a new package of military aid President Joe Biden is expected to discuss Wednesday.

 

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/national-security/ukraine-asks-biden-admin-armed-drones-jamming-gear-surface-air-missile-rcna20197

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15 hours ago, Motorin' said:

It looks like Russia is building a cover story to justify the use of nuclear weapons in Ukraine. They are now claiming the US is advising Ukraine on the development of nuclear weapons, that the Ukrainian government has everything it needs, and that they cannot allow Ukraine to obtain nuclear capacity...

 

Sounds like Putin is itching to go nuclear, no?

 

https://www.jpost.com/international/article-701359

 

WMD as an invasion excuse…. Where did they come up with that idea???

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1 hour ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

 

WMD as an invasion excuse…. Where did they come up with that idea???

 

If you watched Putin's whole speech spelling out his reasoning for the invasion, he justified everything against the back drop of Iraq. 

1 minute ago, aristocrat said:

 

 

What a POSchiff

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