It's Time to Mandate Vaccines

[letsgoteam]

5 hours ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

https://www.cnn.com/2021/10/25/health/covid-antibody-treatment-doctors/index.html

 

How is it possible that 2 full months after this treatment became readily available to everyone in Florida so much of the country is unaware it exists? Literally today I saw a sign outside a clinic that they have them available. It would seem those that work for Pfizer, like Sundancer, want to keep us in the dark that there is a good medicine.

I know Tennessee has a gov website with info where to get it. I looked at and have about 15 locations to choose from in a 25 mile radius from where I live. Not sure if that means any of those 15 could give it to me right this minute, but I'm glad it seems we have a lot of options where I live

[Orlando Tim]

8 minutes ago, letsgoteam said:

I know Tennessee has a gov website with info where to get it. I looked at and have about 15 locations to choose from in a 25 mile radius from where I live. Not sure if that means any of those 15 could give it to me right this minute, but I'm glad it seems we have a lot of options where I live

It is obviously possible that CNN is printing garbage, but it makes liberals look bad so I did trust it.

[Big Blitz]

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha they don't even know what the word vaccinated means anymore but ok.....

 

Your dystopia awaits folks

 

 

 

Unvaccinated Americans to face tighter COVID testing requirements in new US travel system

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/news/2021/10/25/unvaccinated-american-travelers-face-covid-testing-upon-return-us/6173830001/

 

 

 

Just 15 more days!

[SoCal Deek]

2 hours ago, Sundancer said:

Back with more lies? I guess that’s what liars do. 
 

The story to end the pandemic is simple: Get vaccinated. Don’t defend the people not getting vaccinated because they are wrong. Get vaccinated. End the pandemic. 
 

What lies tomorrow liar? 

Liar? You’re clueless a twit. I asked a question! I didn’t make a statement. For the millionth time…I AM VACCINATED! I’m asking a simple question: if you’all are on here day and night commenting on a thread entitled “Time for vaccine mandates”…why hasn’t the President mandated them then? Why? Anyone? 

[JaCrispy]

If this pandemic was truly the apocalyptic plague we are led to believe it is, we wouldn’t need mandates...think about that for a moment...😉

 

If this virus was truly so dangerous, why does the government need to threaten people to take a vaccine?

 

We know that people 65 and up are the most vulnerable...and yet 95% of them are vaccinated without being forced...

 

Why? Simple... Because these people assessed the level of danger and took action to protect themselves...no mandate required...

 

But the rest of the population simply doesn’t trust a government, controlled by Big Pharma, that tries to force them to get medicated when the danger is just not that high...

 

Even the smart people, who are vaccinated, don’t want the mandate- because they are wise enough to see where this will lead to, down the road...and they don’t want to be forced either...👍

[ALF]

Well it's the unvaccinated who are stressing the hospitals at a very high cost. They should be mandated to pay higher healthcare premiums then. 

[GaryPinC]

7 hours ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

Do you do anything except shill for your employer? The pandemic is not ending due to vaccines, even if everyone who can safely get the vaccine does get it there will still be people getting Covid. Covid will always be with us in perpetuity and anyone honest has been saying that since last summer when we started seeing the variants. 

The pandemic is ending when we can stabilize Covid occurrences with a minimum of deaths and hospitalizations.  The world has shown that natural immunity from free/semi-free circulating and mutating Covid is a horribly wrong idea.  See Russian numbers.

 

Vaccines coupled with slowly rising natural immunity is what gets us there.  

For those worried about long term effects of the vaccines, go take a hard look at the long term effects of Covid and realize that is riskier.

 

Florida and the south showed us that as of late summer we're not there yet.  California, on the other hand, fared much better.

 

The holidays are almost upon us and corresponding winter outbreak in Jan/Feb will tell us how close we are to ending the pandemic.

 

Edited October 26, 2021 by GaryPinC

[JaCrispy]

40 minutes ago, ALF said:

Well it's the unvaccinated who are stressing the hospitals at a very high cost. They should be mandated to pay higher healthcare premiums then. 

How about we just hire more staff (instead of firing staff)? Ya know- the thing most companies do when business goes up...😉

Edited October 26, 2021 by JaCrispy

[Sundancer]

6 hours ago, SoCal Deek said:

Liar? You’re clueless a twit. I asked a question! I didn’t make a statement. For the millionth time…I AM VACCINATED! I’m asking a simple question: if you’all are on here day and night commenting on a thread entitled “Time for vaccine mandates”…why hasn’t the President mandated them then? Why? Anyone? 

 

You already know your a liar from your lies a few days ago that you can’t own because you have no honor. And to imply that I support a federal mandate is further evidence of what you are, a liar. 

 

This has become the thread to talk about vaccines. I don’t think you support govt mandates because you’re posting in it. 

50 minutes ago, ALF said:

Well it's the unvaccinated who are stressing the hospitals at a very high cost. They should be mandated to pay higher healthcare premiums then. 

 

Not legal to do that. They could pay higher life insurance premiums though. 

1 hour ago, JaCrispy said:

If this pandemic was truly the apocalyptic plague we are led to believe it is, we wouldn’t need mandates...think about that for a moment...😉

 

If this virus was truly so dangerous, why does the government need to threaten people to take a vaccine?

 

We know that people 65 and up are the most vulnerable...and yet 95% of them are vaccinated without being forced...

 

Why? Simple... Because these people assessed the level of danger and took action to protect themselves...no mandate required...

 

But the rest of the population simply doesn’t trust a government, controlled by Big Pharma, that tries to force them to get medicated when the danger is just not that high...

 

Even the smart people, who are vaccinated, don’t want the mandate- because they are wise enough to see where this will lead to, down the road...and they don’t want to be forced either...👍

 

How have you felt about other vaccine mandates for kids? 

 

BTW, people resisted the smallpox vaccine too. People can be dumb. 

[ALF]

37 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

 

 

Not legal to do that. They could pay higher life insurance premiums though. 

 

 

 

Well in some cases

 

Delta Air Lines is raising health insurance premiums for unvaccinated employees by $200 a month to cover higher Covid costs

 

“The average hospital stay for COVID-19 has cost Delta $50,000 per person,” Bastian said in an employee memo. “This surcharge will be necessary to address the financial risk the decision to not vaccinate is creating for our company.

 

Delta, which self-insures its employees, stands out in its plans to raise premiums for unvaccinated workers to cover the higher costs of insuring employees who get Covid.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/08/25/delta-air-lines-unvaccinated-employees-will-face-200-fees-if-they-dont-get-covid-vaccine.html

[JaCrispy]

47 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

 

You already know your a liar from your lies a few days ago that you can’t own because you have no honor. And to imply that I support a federal mandate is further evidence of what you are, a liar. 

 

This has become the thread to talk about vaccines. I don’t think you support govt mandates because you’re posting in it. 

 

Not legal to do that. They could pay higher life insurance premiums though. 

 

How have you felt about other vaccine mandates for kids? 

 

BTW, people resisted the smallpox vaccine too. People can be dumb. 

Well, with regards to the vaccines for kids, a few scientific studies have recently come out saying that young boys 12-15 were 4-6 times more likely to end up in the hospital due to vaccine side effects (myocarditis) than actually getting sick from covid...that’s actually quite a bit...

 

Another study came out and said kids under 12 are extremely low risk of, not just being hospitalized, but even getting sick from covid...they are actually more immune to the virus than a middle aged vaccinated person...So mandating vaccination for kids does not seem like it would be following the science...

 

As for people being dumb, that is their right...that’s why people should make their own individual choices to best protect themselves...it’s not a “one size fits all” situation...👍

Edited October 26, 2021 by JaCrispy

[Irv]

Demented Biden is re-assigning Hyena from her stellar job on the border to Vaccine Czar. 

 

Edited October 26, 2021 by Irv

[Sundancer]

1 hour ago, JaCrispy said:

Well, with regards to the vaccines for kids, a few scientific studies have recently come out saying that young boys 12-15 were 4-6 times more likely to end up in the hospital due to vaccine side effects (myocarditis) than actually getting sick from covid...that’s actually quite a bit...

 

Another study came out and said kids under 12 are extremely low risk of, not just being hospitalized, but even getting sick from covid...they are actually more immune to the virus than a middle aged vaccinated person...So mandating vaccination for kids does not seem like it would be following the science...

 

As for people being dumb, that is their right...that’s why people should make their own individual choices to best protect themselves...it’s not a “one size fits all” situation...👍

Cool but not what I asked. “How have you felt about other vaccine mandates for kids? ”

[Sundancer]

1 hour ago, ALF said:

 

Well in some cases

 

Delta Air Lines is raising health insurance premiums for unvaccinated employees by $200 a month to cover higher Covid costs

 

“The average hospital stay for COVID-19 has cost Delta $50,000 per person,” Bastian said in an employee memo. “This surcharge will be necessary to address the financial risk the decision to not vaccinate is creating for our company.

 

Delta, which self-insures its employees, stands out in its plans to raise premiums for unvaccinated workers to cover the higher costs of insuring employees who get Covid.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/08/25/delta-air-lines-unvaccinated-employees-will-face-200-fees-if-they-dont-get-covid-vaccine.html

 

1 hour ago, ALF said:

 

Well in some cases

 

Delta Air Lines is raising health insurance premiums for unvaccinated employees by $200 a month to cover higher Covid costs

 

“The average hospital stay for COVID-19 has cost Delta $50,000 per person,” Bastian said in an employee memo. “This surcharge will be necessary to address the financial risk the decision to not vaccinate is creating for our company.

 

Delta, which self-insures its employees, stands out in its plans to raise premiums for unvaccinated workers to cover the higher costs of insuring employees who get Covid.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/08/25/delta-air-lines-unvaccinated-employees-will-face-200-fees-if-they-dont-get-covid-vaccine.html

I am no insurance expert and I think someone here works for an insurance company because he mentioned it before. My Google PhD says that insurers cannot charge unvaccinated people more (but they can charge smokers more?). But maybe employers can charge more for the policies—perhaps that’s the wrinkle? I dunno. I would have thought employers would do it as an incentive: Get vaxxed, lower premium. A million years ago I used to get a premiums discount from a company for going to the gym. 

Edited October 26, 2021 by Sundancer

[JaCrispy]

38 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

Cool but not what I asked. “How have you felt about other vaccine mandates for kids? ”

Unfortunately, attempting to give an answer on those other vaccines would do a disservice to the conversation, as I am not knowledgeable on those topics...

Edited October 26, 2021 by JaCrispy

[SoCal Deek]

2 hours ago, Sundancer said:

 

You already know your a liar from your lies a few days ago that you can’t own because you have no honor. And to imply that I support a federal mandate is further evidence of what you are, a liar. 

 

This has become the thread to talk about vaccines. I don’t think you support govt mandates because you’re posting in it. 

 

 

Wait ….you forgot the classic…”pants on fire”.  
 

So you don’t want to talk about federal mandates? Okie Dokie, how about State mandates then? I live in deep blue California and even we don’t have a State mandate. Again I ask…why?

Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

[Orlando Tim]

4 hours ago, GaryPinC said:

The pandemic is ending when we can stabilize Covid occurrences with a minimum of deaths and hospitalizations.  The world has shown that natural immunity from free/semi-free circulating and mutating Covid is a horribly wrong idea.  See Russian numbers.

 

Vaccines coupled with slowly rising natural immunity is what gets us there.  

For those worried about long term effects of the vaccines, go take a hard look at the long term effects of Covid and realize that is riskier.

 

Florida and the south showed us that as of late summer we're not there yet.  California, on the other hand, fared much better.

 

The holidays are almost upon us and corresponding winter outbreak in Jan/Feb will tell us how close we are to ending the pandemic.

 

Interesting you would pick Russian numbers and not Sweden who remained open the entire time, yet has a rate of death about 2/3 ours. The simple fact that in Florida well more than half of those eligible to get the vaccine got it by early summer yet our numbers went to the highest marks after that should give you pause on the effectiveness of the vaccine to stop Covid. In Florida we have been almost completely free since June 2020, why would Covid have spiked in Sept of 2021 if the vaccine is the way to beat it?

[ALF]

22 minutes ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

 In Florida we have been almost completely free since June 2020, why would Covid have spiked in Sept of 2021 if the vaccine is the way to beat it?

 

It's called the Delta variant infected those still unvaccinated.

[Orlando Tim]

8 minutes ago, ALF said:

 

It's called the Delta variant infected those still unvaccinated.

You believe that despite the majority of adults are vaccinated in Florida, almost 2/3, that the 1/3 not vaccinated were infected at 3 times the rate of those not vaccinated last summer and winter? If you believe that I can't argue but that is how your math works.

[JaCrispy]

14 minutes ago, ALF said:

 

It's called the Delta variant infected those still unvaccinated.

This is not entirely true...While the unvaccinated remained the larger group getting sick, the original covid vaccine has a lower efficacy against Delta...so more vaccinated people were getting sick and hospitalized as well...

[Sundancer]

1 hour ago, SoCal Deek said:

Wait ….you forgot the classic…”pants on fire”.  
 

So you don’t want to talk about federal mandates? Okie Dokie, how about State mandates then? I live in deep blue California and even we don’t have a State mandate. Again I ask…why?

Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

I believe there’s 1-2 people here advocating government mandates. Otherwise you’re talking to strawmen. 
 

And still a liar. 

[GaryPinC]

4 hours ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

Interesting you would pick Russian numbers and not Sweden who remained open the entire time, yet has a rate of death about 2/3 ours. The simple fact that in Florida well more than half of those eligible to get the vaccine got it by early summer yet our numbers went to the highest marks after that should give you pause on the effectiveness of the vaccine to stop Covid. In Florida we have been almost completely free since June 2020, why would Covid have spiked in Sept of 2021 if the vaccine is the way to beat it?

I use Russia because their population is extremely distrustful of the government, has been severely under-vaccinated, the government has enacted few restrictions through this, and I've seen articles for over a year on how the population is apathetic to Covid (life sucks, throw Covid on the pile and tough it out).

https://www.arkansasonline.com/news/2021/oct/19/apathy-mistrust-in-russia-cited-for-low/  This, to my eyes and ears, most closely mirrors the comments of the anti-vaxxers on here.

 

You look at their deaths and hospitalizations and see how they've never come back to baseline and are just stair stepping upwards.  Now, of course, they are finally enacting restrictions and lockdowns.

 

Sweden is a country that has trusted their government and is generally regarded as taking a proactive approach as citizens.  Given the difference in population distribution and world location, I am not sure it's fair to compare Sweden's numbers to the US.  Plus, there are high government officials who feel the Swedish approach failed pre-vaccination.  https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-12-17/sweden-s-top-covid-strategist-is-losing-the-population-s-trust

 

“The Swedish people have suffered enormously in difficult conditions,” King Carl XVI Gustaf told state broadcaster SVT. When it comes to the strategy deployed in Sweden, he said, “I think we have failed.”

Much of the blame has been directed toward the chief architect of Sweden’s strategy, Anders Tegnell, its state epidemiologist. A poll published on Thursday showed that support for him and his employer has slumped over the past two months."

 

"Almost 8,000 Swedes have died of Covid-19. That compares with less than 1,000 in Denmark, about 480 in Finland and just over 400 in Norway." 

 

The other countries are about half the size of Sweden.

 

WRT Florida, they got bent over pretty good by Delta a couple months ago.  When you can show me data that large percentages of the hospitalizations and deaths were from vaccinated people then you might have a point, but thus far what I've seen is vaccinated percentages of these are still very small.  So yes, the vaccines are not perfect and a little less effective against Delta but still the way to beat it.

[SoCal Deek]

5 hours ago, Sundancer said:

I believe there’s 1-2 people here advocating government mandates. Otherwise you’re talking to strawmen. 
 

And still a liar. 

I’m just asking a really simple question. It’s the premise for this entire thread! Care to give a simple answer? 

Or do you want to stick with the “I know you are but what am I” crap?

[LeviF]

15 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

I’m just asking a really simple question. It’s the premise for this entire thread! Care to give a simple answer? 

Or do you want to stick with the “I know you are but what am I” crap?

 

It's motte/bailey. Don't bother.

[SoCal Deek]

1 hour ago, LeviF said:

 

It's motte/bailey. Don't bother.

I have literally no idea what that means.

2 hours ago, LeviF said:

 

It's motte/bailey. Don't bother.

Looked it up….never heard that term but boy does that fit this perfectly!

 Thanks for sharing

[Orlando Tim]

4 hours ago, SoCal Deek said:

I’m just asking a really simple question. It’s the premise for this entire thread! Care to give a simple answer? 

Or do you want to stick with the “I know you are but what am I” crap?

As Levi said he does not answer any questions about his position. He literally told me he works for Pfizer, or Moderna, I can't remember which, so I don't trust anything he says. 

[Sundancer]

13 minutes ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

As Levi said he does not answer any questions about his position. He literally told me he works for Pfizer, or Moderna, I can't remember which, so I don't trust anything he says. 

 

You're an idiot. 

4 hours ago, SoCal Deek said:

I’m just asking a really simple question. It’s the premise for this entire thread! Care to give a simple answer? 

Or do you want to stick with the “I know you are but what am I” crap?

 

You're a liar. That's the truth. You have no sense of honor. That's also the truth. 

 

Government mandates for vaccinating kids, in this case and at the moment, I'm against. 

 

But I'm more against the stupidity of people defending those who refuse the vaccines.

 

2 hours ago, SoCal Deek said:

I have literally no idea what that means.

Looked it up….never heard that term but boy does that fit this perfectly!

 Thanks for sharing

 

Only it doesn't fit here because you are, in fact, a liar. 

 

Where it does fit is you thinking I'm for mandates because I am pro vaccine. 

Edited October 27, 2021 by Sundancer

[Orlando Tim]

5 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

 

You're an idiot. 

 

You're a liar. That's the truth. You have no sense of honor. That's also the truth. 

 

Government mandates for vaccinating kids, in this case and at the moment, I'm against. 

 

But I'm more against the stupidity of people defending those who refuse the vaccines.

 

 

Only it doesn't fit here because you are, in fact, a liar. 

 

Where it does fit is you thinking I'm for mandates because I am pro vaccine. 

So everyone that disagrees with you is an idiot and a liar, especially those who quote you. Isn't that your favorite response " show me where I said that"?

[SoCal Deek]

Can someone PLEASE answer my simple question? It’s not hard….I know you can do it! 
 

Sundancer…you wanna go first?

[Big Blitz]

We listen and take orders from people that find this to be acceptable.  

 

If you still do for reasons other then you'll get fired, you're lost.  

[Big Blitz]

 

[Orlando Tim]

The redefining of words in America- I was called Anti Vax today because I will not allow my 16 year old or 12 year old to get the Vax. They have every single shot that has a long term track record against every illness that has been known to hurt kids, they even have gotten flu shot a couple of times. I have gotten Covid shot and about 8 times in past decade have gotten flu shot, but I don't want my kids to get a new shot to protect them from an illness that is a minimal risk to them and I am anti science? Anyone who states that there is no long term risk is either stupid or a liar. 

[Sundancer]

14 hours ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

So everyone that disagrees with you is an idiot and a liar, especially those who quote you. Isn't that your favorite response " show me where I said that"?

 

No. SoCal is a liar. I proved it. He refuses to apologize or admit it because he has no honor. 

 

 

2 hours ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

The redefining of words in America- I was called Anti Vax today because I will not allow my 16 year old or 12 year old to get the Vax. They have every single shot that has a long term track record against every illness that has been known to hurt kids, they even have gotten flu shot a couple of times. I have gotten Covid shot and about 8 times in past decade have gotten flu shot, but I don't want my kids to get a new shot to protect them from an illness that is a minimal risk to them and I am anti science? Anyone who states that there is no long term risk is either stupid or a liar. 

 

Shots for U18 who are not in risky environs should be up to the parents/private school rules. I would argue the evidence weighs heavily in favor of kids getting the vaccine though, for both themselves and more so to cut avenues of transmission. 

[Big Blitz]

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

 

 

 

 

 

Wait till they tell everyone oh I'd say a year from now it actually never will be....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

"The World Health Organization said Tuesday that the pandemic is “far from finished,” and urged greater equity in vaccine supply. The WHO’s emergency committee, which meets every three months, called for research into next-generation vaccines for longer-term control of you oops we meant the pandemic, as AFP reported.

 

https://www.rte.ie/news/world/2021/1026/1256015-pandemic-comments-who/

Edited October 27, 2021 by Big Blitz

[B-Man]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Jauronimo]

3 hours ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

The redefining of words in America- I was called Anti Vax today because I will not allow my 16 year old or 12 year old to get the Vax. They have every single shot that has a long term track record against every illness that has been known to hurt kids, they even have gotten flu shot a couple of times. I have gotten Covid shot and about 8 times in past decade have gotten flu shot, but I don't want my kids to get a new shot to protect them from an illness that is a minimal risk to them and I am anti science? Anyone who states that there is no long term risk is either stupid or a liar. 

Hard to generate a long term track record if no one will take the new drug because they want a decades long track record of success.  Kind of a catch-22.  Also, over 6 billion doses have been administered world wide.  Thats a significant number.

 

What are the long-term risks you fear?

[GaryPinC]

5 hours ago, Buffalo Timmy said:

The redefining of words in America- I was called Anti Vax today because I will not allow my 16 year old or 12 year old to get the Vax. They have every single shot that has a long term track record against every illness that has been known to hurt kids, they even have gotten flu shot a couple of times. I have gotten Covid shot and about 8 times in past decade have gotten flu shot, but I don't want my kids to get a new shot to protect them from an illness that is a minimal risk to them and I am anti science? Anyone who states that there is no long term risk is either stupid or a liar. 

Well here, it's the Guardian:  https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/sep/10/boys-more-at-risk-from-pfizer-jab-side-effect-than-covid-suggests-study

 

This compares  transient myocarditis to Covid hospitalization at ages 12-15 years.

 

On the other hand, my 15 year old son is over a month out from his Covid infection and still doesn't have his sense of taste back.  Why is that and what does it mean down the line?  Risks can be relative.

 

I don't know anyone who states there is no long term risk to vaccination, only that it is very minimal.  As a non-teen adult, risk of long term effects from Covid are far higher.

[Sundancer]

49 minutes ago, GaryPinC said:

Well here, it's the Guardian:  https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/sep/10/boys-more-at-risk-from-pfizer-jab-side-effect-than-covid-suggests-study

 

This compares  transient myocarditis to Covid hospitalization at ages 12-15 years.

 

On the other hand, my 15 year old son is over a month out from his Covid infection and still doesn't have his sense of taste back.  Why is that and what does it mean down the line?  Risks can be relative.

 

I don't know anyone who states there is no long term risk to vaccination, only that it is very minimal.  As a non-teen adult, risk of long term effects from Covid are far higher.

 

And myocarditis, while not something anyone wants, is easily treatable. 

 

Covid, which has widespread impact in the human body, is not. 

 

The FDA concluded that benefits outweigh risks for kids in most scenarios when Covid widespread. Only when Covid cases were very low in the community, and it looked to last summer for a benchmark, did it not appear beneficial to vaccinate children. CA would be a good example of a place where mandating vaccines, even according to the CDC, would not make sense. Good luck getting CA to follow that subtlety. 

[OrangeBills]

On 10/26/2021 at 4:46 AM, ALF said:

Well it's the unvaccinated who are stressing the hospitals at a very high cost. They should be mandated to pay higher healthcare premiums then. 

 

There are zero hospitals stressed anywhere, and there really haven't been during this entire 20 month hysteria

[ALF]

20 minutes ago, OrangeBills said:

 

There are zero hospitals stressed anywhere, and there really haven't been during this entire 20 month hysteria

 

Just in Buffalo a major Hospital  (Mercy) has been on strike for almost almost a month because of severe under staffing , a problem across the country and shortage of key supplies.  I would call that stress.