John Warrow’s High Praise For Beane & McDermott Regime

[BADOLBILZ]

1 minute ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

C'mon Baldo....you're the one who specifically brought up one stat which was Josh's running yards.  That was in your first reply to me.

Well yes, the opposite of cherry picking is not cherry picking.  

 

Okay if scores are what it's all about then we only gave up 13.  Our defense brought it that day.  So in a game where both offenses didn't play well, our defense was better.

75% of Detroit's passing  yards came to one guy.  

 

Belichick has dominated rookie QB's at home.  He's 11-0.  I showed you the link.  It's not Flores game plan that did it....it's Belichick.  He's the constant.

 

The defenses employed by Flores also held the 2nd highest scoring team in the league led by McVay to one first down in the first half of the Super Bowl and 3 total points.  You're being especially hard on Allen, a rookie among several rookies that have been held completely in check by Belicheck.  Belicheck has done it to everyone....

 

Again.........the Bills season averages are irrelevant...........they were getting blown out left and right early in the season........why are you using those numbers to show that they were doing "OK"............that's just poorly constructing an argument.

 

And I'm not being hard on Allen at all.

 

The Bills simply didn't have an answer that worked for those defenses..........that's been a common thread with McDermott against Belichick.

 

He has been THE worst Bills HC against Belichick thru 4 games since BB came to NE.........it's on HIM to prove he is not enslaved.    

 

That's the way it works in the NFL.............your record = who you are. 

[K-9]

6 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

C'mon Baldo....you're the one who specifically brought up one stat which was Josh's running yards.  That was in your first reply to me.

Well yes, the opposite of cherry picking is not cherry picking.  

 

Okay if scores are what it's all about then we only gave up 13.  Our defense brought it that day.  So in a game where both offenses didn't play well, our defense was better.

75% of Detroit's passing  yards came to one guy.  

 

Belichick has dominated rookie QB's at home.  He's 11-0.  I showed you the link.  It's not Flores game plan that did it....it's Belichick.  He's the constant.

 

The defenses employed by Flores also held the 2nd highest scoring team in the league led by McVay to one first down in the first half of the Super Bowl and 3 total points.  You're being especially hard on Allen, a rookie among several rookies that have been held completely in check by Belicheck.  Belicheck has done it to everyone....

Might as well face it, Allen has no chance against Flores and the Dolphins. He’s even better than Patricia at keeping a QB in the pocket! And Patricia is a defensive genius because he figured out that you need to maintain pass rush discipline and containment to keep a good running QB in the pocket. 

[Royale with Cheese]

Just now, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Again.........the Bills season averages are irrelevant...........they were getting blown out left and right early in the season........why are you using those numbers to show that they were doing "OK"............that's just poorly constructing an argument.

 

And I'm not being hard on Allen at all.

 

The Bills simply didn't have an answer that worked for those defenses..........that's been a common thread with McDermott against Belichick.

 

He has been THE worst Bills HC against Belichick thru 4 games since BB came to NE.........it's on HIM to prove he is not enslaved.    

 

That's the way it works in the NFL.............your record = who you are. 

 

The last post you replied to of mine doesn't have anything about season averages.

[Gugny]

2 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

You are not seeing the big picture at all.  Comments about being worse last year is a fail than 2017 indicates that.

 

I don’t see a resemblance at all with this regime with previous ones.  I think you want to see the resemblance so you can have another gripe.

 

 

[Shaw66]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Who said anything about Flores "emerging".    Patricia was just 6-10 last year when he nearly engineered a surprise win in Buffalo. .

 

I don't expect anything special from Flores and I don't of Patricia either..............but I know that Belichick has OWNED McDermott...........OWNED..........make all the excuses you want for Sean but no Bills HC has been less competitive against Belichick in his first 4 games against him.........and that's saying A LOT considering the lack of success they've had against him in the past 2 decades.    Flores and Patricia have made a killing the past two years bringing out the worst in McDermott's woeful offense's.    

 

Now the other point here is you have said you don't like speculation..........well that's what we are doing here.........so why read it if it makes you upset?   Put me on ignore if you don't like us discussing the topic.   I'm not here to cater to your very specific wishes about what should be discussed.   

 

Somebody has to call you out on the BS you spew, and when they do, you get upset.

 

YOU envisioned the Bills struggling against Flores.  All I did was envision Daboll succeeding.  Why is your vision valid and beyond attack?

 

Speculation is NOT what we're doing here.   NOT.  This is not a thread about what anyone thinks might happen in 2019.   This is a discussion about whether McBeane have done a good, bad or indifferent job so far.  It's a discussion, which is advanced by presentation of fact and argument.   YOU tried to score points in support of your view of the Bills' leadership by suggesting your "vision" of Flores.  I pointed out that one's "vision" does not advance the discussion, because I can have my own vision.  

 

Then, when by example I show that your argument is pointless, you tell me the thread is about speculation,  and if I don't like speculation I should leave the discussion. 

 

Your behavior demonstrates that you're here to argue and to win, not to have a meaningful discussion.  

 

Put you on ignore?   I've thought about it, but generally I just don't read what you write.  You're quite knowledgeable about the Bills and you say some interesting things sometimes.  And if I put you on ignore, it makes it more difficult for me to reply once in a while to demonstrate that your idle negative speculation is a useless substitute for logic.  

[teef]

This is fun!

[Shaw66]

5 minutes ago, teef said:

This is fun!

Not as much fun as the regular season.  

[oldmanfan]

Badobilz is spinning a victory over the Lions as a negative.  And when I and others bring up how ridiculous it is that some here exist only to criticize the team to somehow either boost their ego or try and be cute, we're wrong?  And when we do so we're told we should just ignore it?  Comical.

[K-9]

15 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

Badobilz is spinning a victory over the Lions as a negative.  And when I and others bring up how ridiculous it is that some here exist only to criticize the team to somehow either boost their ego or try and be cute, we're wrong?  And when we do so we're told we should just ignore it?  Comical.

I don’t see why us mere mortals and football neophytes should complain when we have one so astute who can point out the sheer genius of Matt Patricia! I mean, he held a quarterback to a mere 16 yards rushing! He gave up a 42 yard 4th quarter bomb for a TD to that same QB and lost the game, but that is beside the point. It’s all about not giving up rushing yards to a QB! That’s what wins games in this league! 

 

Although Allen did have a rushing TD in the game. Hmm.

 

https://www.buffalobills.com/video/josh-allen-rushes-for-a-3-yard-touchdown

Edited June 8, 2019 by K-9

[BADOLBILZ]

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

The last post you replied to of mine doesn't have anything about season averages.

 

 

The previous one DID and that's the basis for your continued arguing.

 

 I didn't give you enough discredit for it because I thought you might have realized the mistake by now.

 

I've established that the Lions/Pats games greatly contrasted with the other 4 in terms of Allen's rushing yardage.

 

You didn't like that stat.

 

But also in those "other" 4 games they averaged 375 yards of offense.........which when projected over the course of the season would have ranked them 9th in the NFL.

 

That's good and that's the statistical support for the eyeball test they were passing offensively in those games.

 

In the Lions/Pats games they had only 312 and 289.......an average of 301 yards of offense..........a number would project to 28th in the NFL.

 

You were saying........"hey we averaged 298 for the season and we had 312 in that Lions game so that's not a drop".............yeah it's not a drop from the 30th ranked yardage offense that they finished up as but it's a BIG drop from the other post-injury Allen games.

 

It wasn't insignificant........those defense's knocked 20% of the yardage production off of what the Bills had been doing...........that showed up on the scoreboard.

 

It was just a poorly thought out argument on your part and this is what happens when you guys get emotional about the subject. 

 

[BADOLBILZ]

27 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

Badobilz is spinning a victory over the Lions as a negative.  And when I and others bring up how ridiculous it is that some here exist only to criticize the team to somehow either boost their ego or try and be cute, we're wrong?  And when we do so we're told we should just ignore it?  Comical.

 

 

 

What I am saying is that they struggled against the Lions defensive tactics............which the Patriots,  not surprisingly, copied the next week with even more success.

 

The Bills were riding a wave of offensive momentum coming into that game but were certainly lucky to squeeze past the Lions.........which you'd agree with if Gunner or Bandit was saying it.

 

What you guys need to let go of is this idea that your constant arguing with well supported points is going to hurt my feelings.............it's not.........it just makes you look kinda' dumb.........others are just too nice to tell you so.

 

 

[Deranged Rhino]

1 hour ago, Shaw66 said:

Somebody has to call you out on the BS you spew, and when they do, you get upset.

 

YOU envisioned the Bills struggling against Flores.  All I did was envision Daboll succeeding.  Why is your vision valid and beyond attack?

 

Speculation is NOT what we're doing here.   NOT.  This is not a thread about what anyone thinks might happen in 2019.   This is a discussion about whether McBeane have done a good, bad or indifferent job so far.  It's a discussion, which is advanced by presentation of fact and argument.   YOU tried to score points in support of your view of the Bills' leadership by suggesting your "vision" of Flores.  I pointed out that one's "vision" does not advance the discussion, because I can have my own vision.  

 

Then, when by example I show that your argument is pointless, you tell me the thread is about speculation,  and if I don't like speculation I should leave the discussion. 

 

Your behavior demonstrates that you're here to argue and to win, not to have a meaningful discussion.  

 

Put you on ignore?   I've thought about it, but generally I just don't read what you write.  You're quite knowledgeable about the Bills and you say some interesting things sometimes.  And if I put you on ignore, it makes it more difficult for me to reply once in a while to demonstrate that your idle negative speculation is a useless substitute for logic.  

 

It's been his MO for years.  

[oldmanfan]

4 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

 

What I am saying is that they struggled against the Lions defensive tactics............which the Patriots,  not surprisingly, copied the next week with even more success.

 

The Bills were riding a wave of offensive momentum coming into that game but were certainly lucky to squeeze past the Lions.........which you'd agree with if Gunner or Bandit was saying it.

 

What you guys need to let go of is this idea that your constant arguing with well supported points is going to hurt my feelings.............it's not.........it just makes you look kinda' dumb.........others are just too nice to tell you so.

 

 

One game.  They won.  And you spin it negatively and assume that the new HC of the Fish will somehow beat them.  Because it gives you a cute little way to spin something negatively.  Because it's what you do for whatever bizarre reason.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

3 hours ago, HappyDays said:

 

Who was it that said you've forgotten more football than other people have learned? I'm beginning to think they were right.

 

 

...but sparks from continually grinding the "negative ax" can be blinding as well, right??....masochistic returnee ad infinitum.....good Lord...

[2020 Our Year For Sure]

4 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

 

What I am saying is that they struggled against the Lions defensive tactics............which the Patriots,  not surprisingly, copied the next week with even more success.

 

The Bills were riding a wave of offensive momentum coming into that game but were certainly lucky to squeeze past the Lions.........which you'd agree with if Gunner or Bandit was saying it.

 

What you guys need to let go of is this idea that your constant arguing with well supported points is going to hurt my feelings.............it's not.........it just makes you look kinda' dumb.........others are just too nice to tell you so.

 

 

I dont think there's much question Patricia did a nice job of keeping Allen in the pocket, the best he'd seen to that point since he'd raised his game midseason, and it did hurt our offensive output.

 

Howevet I re-watched that game a couple months ago and I was actually shocked to see how well Allen played in a game in which we only scored 14. I'm pretty sure that's the game where he converted a 3rd & 10-ish, had a penalty, re-converted again on 3rd & 20-ish, suffered another penalty and we had to punt. There were a number of examples in that game of poor execution by the offense as a whole-- penalties, drops, poor protection and a wanting running game.

 

However if you think Allen himself was stifled being forced to work from the pocket that day, I implore to watch that game back play-by-play because I don't see it that way at all. I actually think, despite numbers, it was low-key one of his very best days so far. He was accurate and decisive and did not make many, if ANY mistakes. The numbers are what they are but even so, in my opinion 17 balled out.

 

 

[K-9]

5 minutes ago, 2018 Our Year For Sure said:

I dont think there's much question Patricia did a nice job of keeping Allen in the pocket, the best he'd seen to that point since he'd raised his game midseason, and it did hurt our offensive output.

 

Howevet I re-watched that game a couple months ago and I was actually shocked to see how well Allen played in a game in which we only scored 14. I'm pretty sure that's the game where he converted a 3rd & 10-ish, had a penalty, re-converted again on 3rd & 20-ish, suffered another penalty and we had to punt. There were a number of examples in that game of poor execution by the offense as a whole-- penalties, drops, poor protection and a wanting running game.

 

However if you think Allen himself was stifled being forced to work from the pocket that day, I implore to watch that game back play-by-play because I don't see it that way at all. I actually think, despite numbers, it was low-key one of his very best days so far. He was accurate and decisive and did not make many, if ANY mistakes. The numbers are what they are but even so, in my opinion 17 balled out.

 

 

Yep. Allen actually hurt them from the pocket at times. Thank you Matt Patricia, super genius!

 

On Allen’s three yard scramble for our first TD in that game, the Lions did a crap job of keeping him in the pocket at all. They lost contain and he beat them when he couldn’t find the open man. And in a goal line situation to boot! Thanks again, football genius Matt Patricia!

[Patrick Duffy]

4 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Defensively.

 

In the 3 games prior to Detroit Josh Allen had rushed for 99, 135 and 101 yards.........against Detroit he ran 9 times for just 16 yards..........the following week against NE he ran 5 times for 30 yards.........then in the finale back to 95 yards rushing against Miami.

 

Patricia created the gameplan to stop Allen from running wild and nearly pulled off an upset...........then Belichick used it against Allen in that utter domination by the Pats when NE was looking very vulnerable.

 

 

Lol, your post are getting down right silly. Sad.

[Royale with Cheese]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

The previous one DID and that's the basis for your continued arguing.

 

 I didn't give you enough discredit for it because I thought you might have realized the mistake by now.

 

I've established that the Lions/Pats games greatly contrasted with the other 4 in terms of Allen's rushing yardage.

 

You didn't like that stat.

 

But also in those "other" 4 games they averaged 375 yards of offense.........which when projected over the course of the season would have ranked them 9th in the NFL.

 

That's good and that's the statistical support for the eyeball test they were passing offensively in those games.

 

In the Lions/Pats games they had only 312 and 289.......an average of 301 yards of offense..........a number would project to 28th in the NFL.

 

You were saying........"hey we averaged 298 for the season and we had 312 in that Lions game so that's not a drop".............yeah it's not a drop from the 30th ranked yardage offense that they finished up as but it's a BIG drop from the other post-injury Allen games.

 

It wasn't insignificant........those defense's knocked 20% of the yardage production off of what the Bills had been doing...........that showed up on the scoreboard.

 

It was just a poorly thought out argument on your part and this is what happens when you guys get emotional about the subject. 

 

 

There isn't a person that gets more emotional than you Baldo.  SEVERAL posters have commented on it and notice it all the time.  I mean look at your exchange with Wawrow.  You literally got your panties in a wad over what he wrote.  

You have a strange machismo on this board.  

 

It wasn't my basis, you just can't comprehend.  If it was my basis in the next reply, I would have added it.  Nothing literally in that next posted alluded to season averages at all.  Just because you can't comprehend doesn't mean I'm wrong. 

[BADOLBILZ]

54 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

One game.  They won.  And you spin it negatively and assume that the new HC of the Fish will somehow beat them.  Because it gives you a cute little way to spin something negatively.  Because it's what you do for whatever bizarre reason.

 

 

I don't assume that at all..............we were discussing scenarios where a repeat of a 6-10 season might lead to The Pegs deciding to cut bait on McDermott and Beane and you and a few others jumped in looking for an argument.

 

I assume that they will have a winning season in 2019.............just as I did at this point in 2017 when I said they were taking a 10 win team to training camp while others were making excuses and predicting tanks etc..  

 

This idea that I am just constantly negative is laughable.    Some of you just seek out things to be mad at other fans about.   Displacing frustration or anger about the teams lack of success I suppose.  

 

 

[Royale with Cheese]

44 minutes ago, K-9 said:

Yep. Allen actually hurt them from the pocket at times. Thank you Matt Patricia, super genius!

 

On Allen’s three yard scramble for our first TD in that game, the Lions did a crap job of keeping him in the pocket at all. They lost contain and he beat them when he couldn’t find the open man. And in a goal line situation to boot! Thanks again, football genius Matt Patricia!

 

LOL the Lions brought it.  We were 2.5 favorites at HOME and we both finished 6-10....he's talking like it was an almost major upset.  It was two poor teams with bad offenses playing each other...that's it.

[BADOLBILZ]

57 minutes ago, 2018 Our Year For Sure said:

I dont think there's much question Patricia did a nice job of keeping Allen in the pocket, the best he'd seen to that point since he'd raised his game midseason, and it did hurt our offensive output.

 

Howevet I re-watched that game a couple months ago and I was actually shocked to see how well Allen played in a game in which we only scored 14. I'm pretty sure that's the game where he converted a 3rd & 10-ish, had a penalty, re-converted again on 3rd & 20-ish, suffered another penalty and we had to punt. There were a number of examples in that game of poor execution by the offense as a whole-- penalties, drops, poor protection and a wanting running game.

 

However if you think Allen himself was stifled being forced to work from the pocket that day, I implore to watch that game back play-by-play because I don't see it that way at all. I actually think, despite numbers, it was low-key one of his very best days so far. He was accurate and decisive and did not make many, if ANY mistakes. The numbers are what they are but even so, in my opinion 17 balled out.

 

 

 

 

Oy vey.

 

It's NOT ABOUT ALLEN.

 

I'm a huge supporter of Allen and have had nothing but praise for the kid and the pick since he was drafted. 

 

What we are talking about here is the fact that the Bills struggled offensively against Patricia and his mentor relative to how they played in the the other portion of Allen's return.

 

 

[Shaw66]

53 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

 

What I am saying is that they struggled against the Lions defensive tactics............which the Patriots,  not surprisingly, copied the next week with even more success.

 

The Bills were riding a wave of offensive momentum coming into that game but were certainly lucky to squeeze past the Lions.........which you'd agree with if Gunner or Bandit was saying it.

 

What you guys need to let go of is this idea that your constant arguing with well supported points is going to hurt my feelings.............it's not.........it just makes you look kinda' dumb.........others are just too nice to tell you so.

 

 

Got it.  I don't recall the season in perspective well enough to argue with this, but what you say sounds correct in terms of being an accurate description of the events.  What those events mean is a different thing.

 

This was a team with a makeshift offensive line, weak receivers and a rookie qb. It would have been miraculous for that team to have had consistently good weekly performance. 

 

I believe them when they say they are building for long-term sustained excellence.   What that means is that there isn't going to be excellence in the short term, just building toward excellence. What that means is sometimes players will look good, sometimes bad.  Sometimes coaches will look good, sometimes not.  Sometimes GMS too.  

 

It doesn't matter what anyone else has done. It matters what these people do, and they are building in accordance with their plan.  So long as the plan seems to be headed in the right direction,  I'm okay.  Moreover, so long as it seems to the Pegulas to be headed in the right direction, the coach and GM will be employed. 

 

Having said that, it will be a serious  disappointment if the Bills aren't a seriously competitive team in 2020.  In 2019, they have to be competitive with all but the very best.  Anything short of that means what they're doing needs to reviewed and perhaps acted on.  

[K-9]

1 minute ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

LOL the Lions brought it.  We were 2.5 favorites at HOME and we both finished 6-10....he's talking like it was an almost major upset.  It was two poor teams with bad offenses playing each other...that's it.

And seeing as how the home team automatically gets a 3 point advantage, the Bills were actually a 1.5 point underdog! Understandable, considering they were going up against Matt Patricia’s otherworldly brand of football genius! 

 

Seriously though, you’re right; just a couple of poor teams squaring off. Not an upset by either team winning that game. 

 

But when you’re trying to make a futile point, you have to grasp at whatever straws you can find. 

[Royale with Cheese]

1 minute ago, K-9 said:

And seeing as how the home team automatically gets a 3 point advantage, the Bills were actually a 1.5 point underdog! Understandable, considering they were going up against Matt Patricia’s otherworldly brand of football genius! 

 

Seriously though, you’re right; just a couple of poor teams squaring off. Not an upset by either team winning that game. 

 

But when you’re trying to make a futile point, you have to grasp at whatever straws you can find. 

 

Hey...winning arguments on the internet is important.  

[K-9]

2 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Hey...winning arguments on the internet is important.  

Well, when arguments are poorly conceived, poorly presented, and poorly supported, it can be a daunting task. 

[BADOLBILZ]

13 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

LOL the Lions brought it.  We were 2.5 favorites at HOME and we both finished 6-10....he's talking like it was an almost major upset.  It was two poor teams with bad offenses playing each other...that's it.

 

 

 

I don't think most Bills fans would agree with that assessment of the Bills after Allen's return........they had averaged nearly 400 yards of offense in the prior two games........they were on a roll and there was a good deal of excitement about the offense at that point.   

 

 

 

 

5 minutes ago, K-9 said:

Well, when arguments are poorly conceived, poorly presented, and poorly supported, it can be a daunting task. 

 

 

Hey!.........it's MY job to trash Royale's takes!

[Royale with Cheese]

12 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

 

I don't think most Bills fans would agree with that assessment of the Bills after Allen's return........they had averaged nearly 400 yards of offense in the prior two games........they were on a roll and there was a good deal of excitement about the offense at that point.   

 

 

 

 

 

Here's you saying a few pages earlier, that "scores are what it's all about".  Now you're using yardage as the indicator our offense was on a roll.

In those two games prior, we scored 17 and 23 points.  That's not an offense that's rolling if "scores are what it's all about".  

[Patrick Duffy]

32 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

 

I don't think most Bills fans would agree with that assessment of the Bills after Allen's return........they had averaged nearly 400 yards of offense in the prior two games........they were on a roll and there was a good deal of excitement about the offense at that point.   

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hey!.........it's MY job to trash Royale's takes!

 

[BADOLBILZ]

31 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Here's you saying a few pages earlier, that "scores are what it's all about".  Now you're using yardage as the indicator our offense was on a roll.

In those two games prior, we scored 17 and 23 points.  That's not an offense that's rolling if "scores are what it's all about".  

 

 

Right and we already covered that.......it's about the scoring..........the Lions and Pats limited the Bills to 14 and 12...........so a TD less per game.

 

YOU were going on about some other stats..............which I addressed.

 

It was a dumb tact for you to take considering you were using the Bills OVERALL stats for the year as a basis and those were ridiculously poor because of the unbelievably bad offense for most of the first two months.

 

But blame Allen all you want I still say they played A LOT better offensively after his return from injury.    

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 8, 2019 by BADOLBILZ

[SoTier]

22 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

You are not seeing the big picture at all.  Comments about being worse last year is a fail than 2017 indicates that.

 

I don’t see a resemblance at all with this regime with previous ones.  I think you want to see the resemblance so you can have another gripe.

 

Really????

 

A summary of the Bills record since 2000 shows this record ...

• In 2000 the Bills won 8 games but went 3-13 in 2001.  
• In 2002 the Bills won 8 games but went 6-10 in 2003. 
• In 2004 the Bills won 9 games but went 5-11 in 2005.  
• Between 2006 and 2013, the Bills failed to win more than 7 games in a season.
• In 2014 the Bills won 9 games and then 8-8 in 2015 but then 7-9 in 2016.
• In 2017 the Bills won 9 games but they went 6-10 in 2018.

The "big picture" of the Bills organization over the past two decades has been one of losing seasons infrequently interrupted by a handful of non-losing ones.  The Bills only managed to put together back-to-back non-losing seasons in 2014 and 2015 when Marrone coached the team to 9-7 and Ryan coached the team to 8-8.    Their only playoff appearance occurred in 2017.

 

Bills HCs since 2000 ...

• 2000 Wade Phillips, 8-8
• 2001-2003 Gregg Williams, 17-21
• 2004-2005 Mike Mularkey, 14-18
• 2006-2009 Dick Jauron,  24-33
• 2009 Perry Fewell, 3-4
• 2010-2012 Chan Gailey, 16-32
• 2013-2014 Doug Marrone, 15-17
• 2015-2016 Rex Ryan, 15-16
• 2016 Anthonly Lynn, 0-1
• 2017-2018 Sean McDermott, 15-17

 

Dick Jauron also had a plan, significant control of the roster, and tried to create a team which fit his plan.  Unfortunately, his plan was seriously flawed.  In some ways, McDermott's insistence of building a team that fits his plan -- specifically preferring attitude and effort over talent -- echoes Jauron's plan.  McDermott's issues with his offensive assistants, including his OCs, echo Jauron's  poor choices for offensive coaches.

 

The 2017 Bills that made the playoffs was not a team that fit Sean McDermott's plan; it had been built by Doug Whaley to fit the "plans" of Doug Marrone and Rex Ryan with McDermott's "plan" tacked on to it.   McDermott owns the 6-10 2018 and he'll own the 2019 team because the rosters were/are filled with players he picked to fit his plan.  So,  if his plan is worth continuing on with, it has to show results this season.  Beane went out and got him more talent on the offense as well as adding some nice youngsters for the defense.  I don't think that's enough for the team to challenge NE or SD or KC but they should be good enough to win at least as many games as they lose (8-8).  The offensive assistants, including OC Brian Daboll, need to do better. The defense also needs to step up, especially against the run, and especially late in games.  McDermott needs to do better.  He needs to produce wins not losses masked as "moral victories", ie not getting blown out by NE or losing a close game in the closing seconds because the defense can't make a clutch play when it needs it.   It's put up or shut up time.

 

 

[Royale with Cheese]

1 hour ago, SoTier said:

 

Really????

 

A summary of the Bills record since 2000 shows this record ...

• In 2000 the Bills won 8 games but went 3-13 in 2001.  
• In 2002 the Bills won 8 games but went 6-10 in 2003. 
• In 2004 the Bills won 9 games but went 5-11 in 2005.  
• Between 2006 and 2013, the Bills failed to win more than 7 games in a season.
• In 2014 the Bills won 9 games and then 8-8 in 2015 but then 7-9 in 2016.
• In 2017 the Bills won 9 games but they went 6-10 in 2018.

The "big picture" of the Bills organization over the past two decades has been one of losing seasons infrequently interrupted by a handful of non-losing ones.  The Bills only managed to put together back-to-back non-losing seasons in 2014 and 2015 when Marrone coached the team to 9-7 and Ryan coached the team to 8-8.    Their only playoff appearance occurred in 2017.

 

Bills HCs since 2000 ...

• 2000 Wade Phillips, 8-8
• 2001-2003 Gregg Williams, 17-21
• 2004-2005 Mike Mularkey, 14-18
• 2006-2009 Dick Jauron,  24-33
• 2009 Perry Fewell, 3-4
• 2010-2012 Chan Gailey, 16-32
• 2013-2014 Doug Marrone, 15-17
• 2015-2016 Rex Ryan, 15-16
• 2016 Anthonly Lynn, 0-1
• 2017-2018 Sean McDermott, 15-17

 

Dick Jauron also had a plan, significant control of the roster, and tried to create a team which fit his plan.  Unfortunately, his plan was seriously flawed.  In some ways, McDermott's insistence of building a team that fits his plan -- specifically preferring attitude and effort over talent -- echoes Jauron's plan.  McDermott's issues with his offensive assistants, including his OCs, echo Jauron's  poor choices for offensive coaches.

 

The 2017 Bills that made the playoffs was not a team that fit Sean McDermott's plan; it had been built by Doug Whaley to fit the "plans" of Doug Marrone and Rex Ryan with McDermott's "plan" tacked on to it.   McDermott owns the 6-10 2018 and he'll own the 2019 team because the rosters were/are filled with players he picked to fit his plan.  So,  if his plan is worth continuing on with, it has to show results this season.  Beane went out and got him more talent on the offense as well as adding some nice youngsters for the defense.  I don't think that's enough for the team to challenge NE or SD or KC but they should be good enough to win at least as many games as they lose (8-8).  The offensive assistants, including OC Brian Daboll, need to do better. The defense also needs to step up, especially against the run, and especially late in games.  McDermott needs to do better.  He needs to produce wins not losses masked as "moral victories", ie not getting blown out by NE or losing a close game in the closing seconds because the defense can't make a clutch play when it needs it.   It's put up or shut up time.

 

 

 

Thats great work putting up stuff from 2000 that has nothing to do with this current team.

 

 

[oldmanfan]

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Thats great work putting up stuff from 2000 that has nothing to do with this current team.

 

 

Anything to be negative.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 hour ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Thats great work putting up stuff from 2000 that has nothing to do with this current team.

 

 

 

....certainly has some pretty nasty callouses from 24/7...........

 

 

[Cripple Creek]

On 6/7/2019 at 8:01 AM, SoTier said:

 

I'm not sure what you consider a failure.  Obviously, you have much more tolerance for poor performance than I do, because  going 6-10 the season after a playoff appearance screams "FAIL!" to me.   IMO, McDermott has completely used up any and all of his free passes.  Because of league parity imposed by the salary cap, good coaching is essential.  Part of being a good NFL HC is hiring good assistants.  That's why certain HCs produce winners anywhere and everywhere they go and create "coaching trees" of former assistants who go on to become good HCs on their own.  McDermott's assistants on offense and special teams have been disasters.  That's what happens in almost any endeavor when you rely on nepotism to fill key positions.  Many of his  personnel decisions have been questionable at best ... Peterman and Jones from the 2017 draft are most notable.   McDermott puts a better product on the field -- ie, minimum 8 wins -- or he deserves to be unemployed for 2020.

 

As for Beane, at least he's not saddled with the 2017 draft but the only thing that he's done positive is go "all in" on a QB.  His fate will be determined by Josh Allen's success or failure, and at least he has tried to improve Allen's supporting cast this season which gives the kid at least a chance to succeed. 

Just curious. Since last year screamed failure to you what did the prior season w Tyrod Taylor as the starting QB scream to you?

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 minute ago, Cripple Creek said:

Just curious. Since last year screamed failure to you what did the prior season w Tyrod Taylor as the starting QB scream to you?

 

 

...this should be GOOD.......

 

[Cripple Creek]

On 6/7/2019 at 12:49 PM, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Hopefully it works better than Jauron's culture based re-build but that probably comes down ENTIRELY to Josh Allen.

It always comes down to the QB.

 

On 6/7/2019 at 12:57 PM, ScottLaw said:

Which is why I'm confused he used them as examples.

I’m sure that this has been answered, but I imagine that they were mentioned because they were fired and sent to the scrap heap before resurrecting their careers.

[HappyDays]

3 hours ago, SoTier said:

The "big picture" of the Bills organization over the past two decades has been one of losing seasons infrequently interrupted by a handful of non-losing ones. 

 

Are you aware that every member of the Bills organization from just 5 years ago has been replaced? Literally to a man it is an entirely different organization. The only commonality is the name of the team. This is just lazy analysis. Next time throw in a reference to Russ Brandon for the cherry on top.

Edited June 9, 2019 by HappyDays

[oldmanfan]

1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

 

Are you aware that every member of the Bills organization from just 5 years ago has been replaced? Literally to a man it is an entirely different organization. The only commonality is the name of the team. This is just lazy analysis. Next time throw in a reference to Russ Brandon for the cherry on top.

He doesn't care.  Go look back at some posts from him.  He thinks Pegula doesn't care about winning and only cares about $$, thinks he's the same as Ralph.  

 

Granted we all have have different opinions but opinions should be based in some modicum of fact and logic.  He has neither.

[GunnerBill]

48 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

Are you aware that every member of the Bills organization from just 5 years ago has been replaced? Literally to a man it is an entirely different organization. The only commonality is the name of the team. This is just lazy analysis. Next time throw in a reference to Russ Brandon for the cherry on top.

 

Overdorff remains. 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Overdorff remains. 

 

 

...and it's hard to tell exactly what his role is today....wonder if this is still accurate.....

 

Bills promote Overdorf to senior VP in minor restructuring

• Associated Press
• Published: Jan. 31, 2008 at 11:34 a.m.
• Updated: July 26, 2012 at 08:17 p.m.
•  

ORCHARD PARK, N.Y. -- Jim Overdorf was promoted to Buffalo Bills senior vice president of football administration, giving him control over contract negotiations and salary cap decisions.

 

The move announced Thursday was part of a minor front office restructuring that follows Russ Brandon's promotion to chief operating officer. Brandon's promotion came after the Bills elected not to fill the general manager's role after Marv Levy stepped down at the end of the season.

 

For Overdorf, the promotion means he formally becomes the team's top executive in day-to-day football matters, answering to Brandon and Bills owner Ralph Wilson. Overdorf is entering his 23rd season with the team and has handled contract talks for most of this decade.