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Southern Bills Fan

Bills are 2013 Houston Astros.

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I believe that they have decided to follow the Astros model of rebuilding, which is a total tear down from top to bottom. They are getting the pieces in place while suffering big losses to build a consistent winner for the future. Consistently putting a band aid on the problems by handing out bad contracts to remain 8-8 or 7-9 isn’t going to build a winner. Building through the draft and when you’re ready to win, adding the needed veterans is the proper way to rebuild. The Astros had Altuve, Springer and drafted Correa and Bregman. When they were ready, they got Verlander. They lost over 100 games for several years in a row but set themselves up for long term success. I believe that’s the model they are following. We have excellent pieces on defense and hopefully our QB. 

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What young good Bills players/prospects do the Bills have?

 

With the exception of White and maybe Edmunds.

 

I like Allen and I HOPE he will be great one day, but I remain skeptical.

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You can't compare this to baseball. Baseball teams have minor league teams all over the country developing players and getting them ready for the majors.  Some players are in the minors 3-5 years before playing in the big leagues. Football players have to be ready to play in first 1-2 years....

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Im not sure if they were supposed to be this awful.

 

They also do things like keep old guys and refuse to trade them.  A true tear down team would have gotten what they can for mccoy.

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Just now, nucci said:

You can't compare this to baseball. Baseball teams have minor league teams all over the country developing players and getting them ready for the majors.  Some players are in the minors 3-5 years before playing in the big leagues. Football players have to be ready to play in first 1-2 years....

The only way the analogy works at all is if you include NCAA players that haven't been drafted yet. Who knows who they are at this point? I rather doubt we will find enough help through free agency to effectively improve the dreadful offense. 

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There are very few pieces in place to build on, and if the plan is to add to the talent pool through free agency, they are in big trouble. Why would any talented free agent want to come into this situation?

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So does that mean that we are no longer the Pittsburgh Pirates?

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Why is everyone so sure that current ineptitude is an indicator of future Championships?  Were that the case, over the last 20 years we probably would have hung more Championship banners from the rafters than the Colts hung "AFC South Participation Banner 201[X]" banners.  

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1 minute ago, Jauronimo said:

Why is everyone so sure that current ineptitude is an indicator of future Championships?  Were that the case, over the last 20 years we probably would have hung more Championship banners from the rafters than the Colts hung "AFC South Participation Banner 201[X]" banners.  

I believe it’s because we always tried the band aid fix of signing a few overpriced veterans to try and remain 8-8. 

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The big assumption in this approach would be the current leadership is capable of assessing/stocking the team with quality talent and managing the rebuild properly. Based on their track record to date, I am not so sure that is the case. The jury is still out.

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Bad contracts to remain mediocre ? Good players get paid, so you keep the most important ones ( cannot keep them all) and replace others via draft and FA. The Bills problem wasn’t bad contracts, but a lack of a star QB and few good young players on cheap deals. Their structure was perhaps a bit different because they didn’t have a top QB eating up a certain percentage of cap $$, but this notion that contracts were the problem with the Bills is overblown. They are now completely bereft of talent on one side of the ball, and the D may be a tad overrated as well. The Beane / McD plan is practically doomed to fail because they’ve set themselves up to need a few spectacular drafts and a great FA haul to be competitive. They’ll be fired before they can see it through. 

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44 minutes ago, Southern Bills Fan said:

I believe that they have decided to follow the Astros model of rebuilding, which is a total tear down from top to bottom. They are getting the pieces in place while suffering big losses to build a consistent winner for the future. Consistently putting a band aid on the problems by handing out bad contracts to remain 8-8 or 7-9 isn’t going to build a winner. Building through the draft and when you’re ready to win, adding the needed veterans is the proper way to rebuild. The Astros had Altuve, Springer and drafted Correa and Bregman. When they were ready, they got Verlander. They lost over 100 games for several years in a row but set themselves up for long term success. I believe that’s the model they are following. We have excellent pieces on defense and hopefully our QB. 

 

I admire your optimism man, I really do.  I talked myself into it for a lot of the season but I honestly can't right now.  Granted I have only been a Bills fan for about 20 years (awesome timing huh!), but I think this is about the worst I have felt about this team.

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4 minutes ago, Southern Bills Fan said:

I believe it’s because we always tried the band aid fix of signing a few overpriced veterans to try and remain 8-8. 

They were 8-8 mostly due to the lack of a top QB. They were average to above in most other areas. They are now well below average on offense; the most important side of the ball in the current NFL. 

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1 minute ago, LittleSammy said:

The big assumption in this approach would be the current leadership is capable of assessing/stocking the team with quality talent and managing the rebuild properly. Based on their track record to date, I am not so sure that is the case. The jury is still out.

 

I swear if we bring in one more player from Carolina, I'm going to just go ahead and root for Carolina.

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4 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

They were 8-8 mostly due to the lack of a top QB. They were average to above in most other areas. They are now well below average on offense; the most important side of the ball in the current NFL. 

I agree with you that they are on offense. We have 10 draft picks and a ton of cap money next year. You can’t tell me that 2-3 solid O lineman and 2 playmakers at WR would make us a good offense. Zay can be a solid possession receiver with outside threats. That’s only adding 4-5 players. 

Edited by Southern Bills Fan

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No team has a ton of just young stud players.  When I look at this team, I'm looking at players we can build on for the next 3-5 years.

 

Allen

Dawkins

Zay

Star

Hughes

Harry

Shaq

Edmunds

Milano

White

Johnson

Hyde

Poyer

 

That's not a bad group to build on when you have 10 draft picks, which will include a high pick, and a ton of cap space.  Clearly our Offense will look entirely different next year and the Defense is pretty well stocked with young/prime talent.

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1 minute ago, Southern Bills Fan said:

I agree with you that they are on offense. We have 10 draft picks and a ton of cap money next year. You can’t tell me that 2-3 solid O lineman and 2 playmakers at WR would make us a good offense. Zay can be a solid possession receiver with outside threats. That’s only adding 4-5 players. 

This all assumes Allen pans out which is a big ???. 

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4 minutes ago, SCBills said:

No team has a ton of just young stud players.  When I look at this team, I'm looking at players we can build on for the next 3-5 years.

 

Allen

Dawkins

Zay

Star

Hughes

Harry

Shaq

Edmunds

Milano

White

Johnson

Hyde

Poyer

 

That's not a bad group to build on when you have 10 draft picks, which will include a high pick, and a ton of cap space.  Clearly our Offense will look entirely different next year and the Defense is pretty well stocked with young/prime talent.

They're going to have to hit on many of those 10 picks, half of which are later round picks. As far as free agency, there needs to be players that we want and then they will want to play here. It's not going to be easy.

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Whatever. 

 

We've heard this a million times. 

 

Just you wait, in 3-years this team will be invincible. 

 

The Centerpiece is Josh Allen. An inaccurate, marginal performer out of the Mountain West. And he wasn't looking too good before getting hurt. 

 

This team has one young player that is reliably good - Trey White. The defense has some nice veterans. The rest of the team is bottom of the barrel scrapings. 

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Two years into this supposed "rebuild", there are so many holes on this team that there will not be enough talent available in FA and the draft to fill all the holes even if the Bills could snap up every FA to hit the market and had all the picks in the first 3 rounds of the entire draft. 

 

They need virtually an entire offense.  Who is at least NFL caliber on the unit?  Allen, simply by virtue of the Bills investment in him.  Dawkins.  Jones.  Clay and McCoy if the Bills keep them.  Ivory.  Groy and -- I hate to say this -- Ducasse as strickly backups.  Maybe Miller is salvageable if he had better coaching, which is unlikely if McDermott remains HC.

 

The defense is better but it's living on borrowed time as it's old with 2 35-year-olds (Williams and Alexander) and a 30-year-old on the DL for starters.  The safeties are decent, and White is good at CB.  Edmunds and Howard are promising but they're rookies who can continue to develop -- or not.  Milano looks like the only other half way decent defensive player besides White to come out of the 2017 draft.

 

This roster doesn't resemble a "rebuild" so much as a dumpster fire.  McDermott is great at dismantling an NFL team but he's clueless about how to rebuild it.  He needs to go ... as does his henchman Beane.

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5 minutes ago, Southern Bills Fan said:

I agree with you that they are on offense. We have 10 draft picks and a ton of cap money next year. You can’t tell me that 2-3 solid O lineman and 2 playmakers at WR would make us a good offense. Zay can be a solid possession receiver with outside threats. That’s only adding 4-5 players. 

Easier said than done. Playmaking WRs in the draft ? That’s been a huge hit or miss around the league for awhile. As FA ? Good luck. The contracts being given out in FA to WRs are huge, and players have choices. They won’t want to come to Buffalo. It’s not so easy as going to the store and picking out stud players to stack your offense with. The FOs drafting ability is suspect to say the least. Then there’s the matter of if the OC is any good. I’d love to share your optimism, but it’s a pretty big ask of even a competent FO to pull off. 

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4 minutes ago, Jauronimo said:

This all assumes Allen pans out which is a big ???. 

That’s right. The future success depends on his development. 

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54 minutes ago, Dr. Who said:

The only way the analogy works at all is if you include NCAA players that haven't been drafted yet. Who knows who they are at this point? I rather doubt we will find enough help through free agency to effectively improve the dreadful offense. 

The Panthers are 4-2. The future is somewhat bright

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3 minutes ago, SoTier said:

Two years into this supposed "rebuild", there are so many holes on this team that there will not be enough talent available in FA and the draft to fill all the holes even if the Bills could snap up every FA to hit the market and had all the picks in the first 3 rounds of the entire draft. 

 

They need virtually an entire offense.  Who is at least NFL caliber on the unit?  Allen, simply by virtue of the Bills investment in him.  Dawkins.  Jones.  Clay and McCoy if the Bills keep them.  Ivory.  Groy and -- I hate to say this -- Ducasse as strickly backups.  Maybe Miller is salvageable if he had better coaching, which is unlikely if McDermott remains HC.

 

The defense is better but it's living on borrowed time as it's old with 2 35-year-olds (Williams and Alexander) and a 30-year-old on the DL for starters.  The safeties are decent, and White is good at CB.  Edmunds and Howard are promising but they're rookies who can continue to develop -- or not.  Milano looks like the only other half way decent defensive player besides White to come out of the 2017 draft.

 

This roster doesn't resemble a "rebuild" so much as a dumpster fire.  McDermott is great at dismantling an NFL team but he's clueless about how to rebuild it.  He needs to go ... as does his henchman Beane.

Clay and McCoy as staples of the offense should be over. 

 

They're old. Clay is 29, McCoy is 30. 

 

Those two are slowing down and our offense should not be built around them. 

 

Both of them need to be replaced with better players. 

 

 

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