The Organizational Incompetence of the Buffalo Bills

[Ayjent]

3 minutes ago, BigBuff423 said:

 

As I said, the Defense was not great - but they were not as bad as the score or fans would indicate. It was a cumulative effect outside of the first drive. They were clearly still getting themselves acclimated but the Ravens had 34 rushes, for a 3.4 yard average and possessed the ball for over 35 minutes. That, takes a cumulative effect on a Defense and had the Bills Offense been able to sustain a few drives, those numbers would look quite different. Additionally, keep in mind Lamar Jackson contributed to that rushing total. Ravens had 261 passing yards, not great but not abysmal. The score was the score because the Bills Offense couldn't get out of their own end and field position was generally not good for them, with the Defense needing to Defend a short field. Are they excused? Hell no! But it's not nearly the beat down the score would say it was. Additionally when put into context, we can see why there is hope for the Defense. The Offense is another issue - with Allen I think there's hope, with Peterman the Offense is toast. 

The Ravens scored on their first three drives and had somewhere around 10 yds/play in the first quarter. The Bills had the ball for 2 minutes to the Ravens 11 late in the first quarter - you can blame the two minutes on both the offense and defense - the offense couldn’t stay on it and the defense couldnt get off of it. But they both came out of the gate looking like crap. 

[Sky Diver]

17 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

He's talking about the pay cut he was offered, accepted, and then regretted.  He should have accepted it because $3.65M is infinitely better than $0.

 

He walked away with $2.15M and didn't have to play a down.

 

"What seems to have happened is that Athletes First negotiated a new contract for Incognito, he now wishes he hadn’t signed that contract, he knows he can’t get out of the contract by retiring because then he’d have to pay back his signing bonus, and now he wants the Bills to cut him so he doesn’t have to pay his signing bonus."

 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/04/15/richie-incognito-asks-to-be-released-from-his-contract/

Edited September 10, 2018 by Sky Diver

[Doc]

7 minutes ago, Sky Diver said:

He walked away with $2.15M and didn't have to play a down.

 

"What seems to have happened is that Athletes First negotiated a new contract for Incognito, he now wishes he hadn’t signed that contract, he knows he can’t get out of the contract by retiring because then he’d have to pay back his signing bonus, and now he wants the Bills to cut him so he doesn’t have to pay his signing bonus."

 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2018/04/15/richie-incognito-asks-to-be-released-from-his-contract/

 

He walked away with nothing but what was already given to him in prior years.  At a severely under-market rate.

[pocoboy]

6 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

He walked away with nothing but what was already given to him in prior years.  At a severely under-market rate.

 

It's almost as if he had a checkered past..........

[Sky Diver]

9 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

He walked away with nothing but what was already given to him in prior years.  At a severely under-market rate.

 

Yeah, the Bills screwed him, but he still got the $1.15M from the 2016 contract the the $1M from the new contract.

 

In fact, the Bills screwed themselves because the OL is a shambles.

Edited September 10, 2018 by Sky Diver

[SoTier]

43 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

That's called putting your plan in place.  They got rid of a malcontent in Dareus who was not playing to a level anywhere near where his contract said he should.  They traded Darby and Watkins.  Watkins I disagreed with but time shows he has not done much since he left.  Darby one could argue they should have kept, but there was just an article in si.com about how they expect he won't get resigned by the Eagles.

 

They knew they'd take a cap hit this year.  One can argue about whether they could have restructured contracts or something else, but they decided to rip the band aid off rather than slowly pull on it.  The success or failure of that plan will be dictated by how they use the excess cap dollars they'll have next year.

McDermott is a "my way or the highway" HC.  Dareus was not a "malcontent" in the locker room.  He didn't fit in with whatever McDermott wanted in his players, so McDermott wanted him gone without regard to the consequences for the team on the field or for the cap.  The same with the Watkins trade; again a player was sent packing because he didn't "fit" the HC's mold, leaving the Bills without any speed or reliabilty among the WRs.

 

That's not having a plan, that's accommodating the HC's my-way-or-the-highway mentality.

 

 

[BigBuff423]

22 minutes ago, Ayjent said:

The Ravens scored on their first three drives and had somewhere around 10 yds/play in the first quarter. The Bills had the ball for 2 minutes to the Ravens 11 late in the first quarter - you can blame the two minutes on both the offense and defense - the offense couldn’t stay on it and the defense couldnt get off of it. But they both came out of the gate looking like crap. 

 

Again, the three and outs have a cumulative effect. I'm not saying the Defense was good, I'm saying it's not as bad as some are making it out to be when you look at the totality of circumstances. Dumping all over the Defense without taking into consideration just how much was asked of them in context of what the Offense *didn't* do, is failing to put it in perspective, IMHO. 

[Doc]

2 minutes ago, Sky Diver said:

Yeah, the Bills screwed him, but he still got the $1.15M from the 2016 contract the the $1M from the new contract.

 

In fact, the Bills screwed themselves because the OL is a shambles.

 

He didn't honor the new contract so he didn't get the $1M.  That's how it works.  He did however earn that $1.15M bonus he got 2 years ago.  Top-5 OG play for bottom-2 starting OG money?  That was a steal for the Bills!  But all good things must come to an end and Richie screwed himself more than anyone since he'll make no money this year and never play again in the NFL.  You have to live with the consequences of your actions.

[oldmanfan]

5 minutes ago, SoTier said:

McDermott is a "my way or the highway" HC.  Dareus was not a "malcontent" in the locker room.  He didn't fit in with whatever McDermott wanted in his players, so McDermott wanted him gone without regard to the consequences for the team on the field or for the cap.  The same with the Watkins trade; again a player was sent packing because he didn't "fit" the HC's mold, leaving the Bills without any speed or reliabilty among the WRs.

 

That's not having a plan, that's accommodating the HC's my-way-or-the-highway mentality.

 

 

No, that is actually having a plan.  Your hatred blinds you to anything else.

[Doc]

7 minutes ago, SoTier said:

McDermott is a "my way or the highway" HC.  Dareus was not a "malcontent" in the locker room.  He didn't fit in with whatever McDermott wanted in his players, so McDermott wanted him gone without regard to the consequences for the team on the field or for the cap.  The same with the Watkins trade; again a player was sent packing because he didn't "fit" the HC's mold, leaving the Bills without any speed or reliabilty among the WRs.

 

That's not having a plan, that's accommodating the HC's my-way-or-the-highway mentality.

 

You can't be serious with this line.  Dareus showed up late to work all the time.  No coach wants that in any of his players.

[Sky Diver]

1 minute ago, Doc said:

 

He didn't honor the new contract so he didn't get the $1M.  That's how it works.  He did however earn that $1.15M bonus he got 2 years ago.  Top-5 OG play for bottom-2 starting OG money?  That was a steal for the Bills!  But all good things must come to an end and Richie screwed himself more than anyone since he'll make no money this year and never play again in the NFL.  You have to live with the consequences of your actions.

 

He signed a contract which included $1M bonus and the Bills chose to release him. He keeps the money. If he retires, he has to pay it back, plus the $1.15M from the 2016 contract.

[Doc]

 

As for Watkins, he's not worth nearly what he wanted and especially what he is getting.

[Jasovon]

3 hours ago, dezertbill said:

Title of this thread is ridiculous.  This front office has made some great decisions. 

 

One area it seems Beane fell short is the OL.  They underestimated the loss of Richie, Woods, and Glenn.

 

Frustrating?  Yes.  Leading to total FO incompetence?  Not even close.

 

Back off the ledge.  It's week 1.  Lets see how the coaches, team, and FO rebound from this.

 

 

 

 

 

 

O-Line depth sucks around the league, the Colts and Seahawks have both struggled to keep their franchise guy upright. What you do need is someone that can catch and bail a QB out.

[Doc]

Just now, Sky Diver said:

He signed a contract which included $1M bonus and the Bills chose to release him. He keeps the money. If he retires, he has to pay it back, plus the $1.15M from the 2016 contract.

 

He signed a contract that said that he'd get a $1M bonus if he took a pay cut.  Since he didn't end up honoring that contract, he didn't get the $1M.  That's how it works.  I gave you proof of that (Spotrac link) and you have nothing to back you up so there's no reason for anyone to believe what you claim.  You are free to continue to believe it if you wish because it's a free country.

[Batman1876]

We needed help all over the field and had limited resources to fill those holes. Getting a stud QB and MLB in the draft when both are positions of need is a good move. Could we have spent our 20 mil of cap space better than on AJ, Star, Murphy and Davis? Sure. Could we have filled all our needs with that cash? Nope. 

[Sky Diver]

Just now, Doc said:

 

He signed a contract that said that he'd get a $1M bonus if he took a pay cut.  Since he didn't end up honoring that contract, he didn't get the $1M.  That's how it works.  I gave you proof of that (Spotrac link) and you have nothing to back you up so there's no reason for anyone to believe what you claim.  You are free to continue to believe it if you wish because it's a free country.

 

What didn't he honor? The Bills gave him a $1M bonus and then made a decision to release him.  

[Doc]

Just now, Sky Diver said:

What didn't he honor? The Bills gave him a $1M bonus and then made a decision to release him.  

 

 

 

You're kidding, right?

[Sky Diver]

1 minute ago, Batman1876 said:

We needed help all over the field and had limited resources to fill those holes. Getting a stud QB and MLB in the draft when both are positions of need is a good move. Could we have spent our 20 mil of cap space better than on AJ, Star, Murphy and Davis? Sure. Could we have filled all our needs with that cash? Nope. 

 

They got who they could to fill needs, and unfortunately the players we could afford that were willing to come here aren't very good.

 

Benjamin is a real bummer. He's terrible and unfortunately, Zay Jones looks like a potential bust.

[SoTier]

36 minutes ago, BuffaloRush said:

 

Yes I totally agree.  But did they really underestimate the OL?  Or were there just not many good options out there?  People are forgetting that Beane didn’t have the cap flexibility to sign players like Nate Solder or Andrew Norwell to huge deals.   

 

I guess you could say that they could have drafted some linemen.  But remember the #1 priority in the draft was QB, the second was defense.  There were a lot of needs on this and you can’t all address them at once - especially given the cap situation.  Whether it was OL, LB, WR or whatever other position it’s impossible to fix everything in a year.  This is why I am certain that Beane and McDermott were privately bracing for an off year given the roster they have.  

 

Nate Solder is a LT.  They didn't need him because LT was the only OL position where the Bills actually had depth with Cordy Glenn healthy, Dion Dawkins looking good as a rookie, and Seantrel Henderson a solid backup.  McDermott/Beane fixed that in short ordper.  They let Henderson walk away in FA to the Texans for whom he became their starting LT.  Then they traded away Cordy Glenn, incurring a $9.6 million cap hit.  Glenn is Cinci's starting LT.

 

If the Bills had kept Dareus so that they wouldn't have to sign Star, they would have something like $7 million extra to spend on FAs -- like maybe re-signing EJ Gaines rather than spending on Vontae Davis and Phillip Gaines.  If they had kept Taylor, they wouldn't have had to sign AJ McCarron ... and face having Nate Peterman wasting a roster spot ... and saved $9.7 million in dead cap space for Taylor and McCarron. 

 

[Sky Diver]

1 minute ago, Doc said:

 

 

 

You're kidding, right?

 

About what? You really think he paid back the $1M?

[May Day 10]

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, Soda Popinski said:

This "look at the tape" BS is a song and dance we've heard before.   Hell at least Dick Jauron's defenses kept games close, we get blown out by Baltimore?   The offensive juggernaut?   Pffftttt, that was sad.    

 

Soda Pop, the proof will be in the pudding, but Baltimore just may be more of an offensive juggernaut than one thinks.

 

2014: Kubiak as OC brings Baltimore to playoffs, and packs his bags to coach in Denver. Last time Baltimore sees playoffs of recent years.

2015: Trestman as OC.  Offense slides from #8 prev year to #25.

2016: #21 offense Trestman is fired in October and replaced by Mornhinweg

2017: Ravens offense improves from #21 to #9 (they also added Roman as run game coordinator and changed OL coach)

2018: Ravens sign Crabtree and Brown to bolster their WR corps as well as drafting two TE, two WR, and a QB

 

I guess we'll see.

1 minute ago, SoTier said:

 

Nate Solder is a LT.  They didn't need him because LT was the only OL position where the Bills actually had depth with Cordy Glenn healthy, Dion Dawkins looking good as a rookie, and Seantrel Henderson a solid backup.  McDermott/Beane fixed that in short ordper.  They let Henderson walk away in FA to the Texans for whom he became their starting LT.  Then they traded away Cordy Glenn, incurring a $9.6 million cap hit.  Glenn is Cinci's starting LT.

 

If the Bills had kept Dareus so that they wouldn't have to sign Star, they would have something like $7 million extra to spend on FAs -- like maybe re-signing EJ Gaines rather than spending on Vontae Davis and Phillip Gaines.  If they had kept Taylor, they wouldn't have had to sign AJ McCarron ... and face having Nate Peterman wasting a roster spot ... and saved $9.7 million in dead cap space for Taylor and McCarron. 

 

 

There's no question that to say the Bills lacked the cap space to sign FA, is simply to beg the question "why?"

The lack of cap space is a bed the Bills quite deliberately created for themselves with their roster moves, and chose to lie in.

 

[Soda Popinski]

2 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Soda Pop, the proof will be in the pudding, but Baltimore just may be more of an offensive juggernaut than one thinks.

 

2014: Kubiak as OC brings Baltimore to playoffs, and packs his bags to coach in Denver. Last time Baltimore sees playoffs of recent years.

2015: Trestman as OC.  Offense slides from #8 prev year to #25.

2016: #21 offense Trestman is fired in October and replaced by Mornhinweg

2017: Ravens offense improves from #21 to #9 (they also added Roman as run game coordinator and changed OL coach)

2018: Ravens sign Crabtree and Brown to bolster their WR corps as well as drafting two TE, two WR, and a QB

 

I guess we'll see.

Their offense may be good, but no way our offense was supposed to be that bad or get blown out the way we did.  Now I do think that their oline got better once a certain OL coach was replaced.........*cough* *cough*

[Doc]

4 minutes ago, Sky Diver said:

About what? You really think he paid back the $1M?

 

No I'm saying he never got it.  Otherwise his dead cap for this year would be $2.15M. 

[North Buffalo]

Ravens did a helluv a job getting pieces but already had a QB and D line, McBrain decided to clear house, but last year’s performances were better than expected.  The rest of the clearing was done throughout off season plus Woods retirement.  Guessing they planned this all along to get their guys in but last season raised expectations.  Now the Bills really stink in all the areas mentioned. Oline needs to continued replacement.  Need more D line and another stud linebacker as well as another CB and WRs are a mess.  Cap space is available next year.  They had to know this year was going to be a disaster but maybe they started to believe their own hype coaching abilities to turn trash into gold... maybe if only a few players but not this much trash.  Gonna be a rough tank year...

Edited September 10, 2018 by North Buffalo

[CuddyDark]

Dude for one their GM is another Russ Brandon. He's a contract guy being asked to pick players. It's the dumbest thing we do here. It's like they're afraid to hire a real football man because he won't get along with them in meetings and on an interpersonal level.

[CamboBill]

2 hours ago, North Buffalo said:

Short term, this season is going to suck.  The only worry is if it screws up Josh Allen... given his temperament... don't think it will.  That being said, not addressing wide receiver and O-line.  Especially when Ducasse was such a tire fire last year.  Heck he got let go by the Giants.

With our cap situation this year and the unexpected demise of both Wood and Incognito, I expected us to regress this year.  We over achieved last year and I can accept a bad year this year. 

 

Your point is 100% spot on in that what matters is Josh Allen's health and development.  A competent organization would center their offense on the development of Allen this year --- which most likely would mean some bench time and carefully managed relief opportunities and maybe some spot starts late in the year. Instead we have not even finished NFL week 1 yet and are in a position of HAVING to throw Allen to the wolves simply because we have nobody even remotely credible we can start in his place.

 

The same people braying about just throw him into deep water and seeing if he can swim are likely the same people who will be braying post season about what a wasted pick he was because because he got sacked 60 times and only had a 50% completion rate (because he had no time to throw). 

 

Even Allen's supporters mostly agreed he was a developmental prospect and not NFL ready.  He needs a competent OL and some motivated WRs to develop at all if playing.  We needed someone to absorb snaps while he learned.  We put all our eggs in the leaking basket of Nate Peterman instead, with no further contingencies.

[dollars 2 donuts]

4 hours ago, fansince88 said:

Agree 100% possibly even more. So much that I think this reply to the post is acceptable.

 

There's a reason why it is in AFI's top ten comedies of all time.

 

Because it deserves it.

[Batman1876]

43 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

Nate Solder is a LT.  They didn't need him because LT was the only OL position where the Bills actually had depth with Cordy Glenn healthy, Dion Dawkins looking good as a rookie, and Seantrel Henderson a solid backup.  McDermott/Beane fixed that in short ordper.  They let Henderson walk away in FA to the Texans for whom he became their starting LT.  Then they traded away Cordy Glenn, incurring a $9.6 million cap hit.  Glenn is Cinci's starting LT.

 

If the Bills had kept Dareus so that they wouldn't have to sign Star, they would have something like $7 million extra to spend on FAs -- like maybe re-signing EJ Gaines rather than spending on Vontae Davis and Phillip Gaines.  If they had kept Taylor, they wouldn't have had to sign AJ McCarron ... and face having Nate Peterman wasting a roster spot ... and saved $9.7 million in dead cap space for Taylor and McCarron. 

 

Darius saved us cap money last year and this year, despite the dead cap.  His savings were used to sign Star its basically a push. Cordy and Tyrod saved us 15 mil in cap space this year. That accounts for the salary of Davis, Murphy, AJ and Bodine, meaning we only would have had space for the depth guys we signed. This team is probably better with Darius Tyrod and Glenn but its still not a good team with them. I'll take the 2nd, 3rd, and 5th we got for those players to build for the future over having those three guys make our terrible team a little better. 

[CamboBill]

1 hour ago, Doc said:

 

He didn't honor the new contract so he didn't get the $1M.  That's how it works.  He did however earn that $1.15M bonus he got 2 years ago.  Top-5 OG play for bottom-2 starting OG money?  That was a steal for the Bills!  But all good things must come to an end and Richie screwed himself more than anyone since he'll make no money this year and never play again in the NFL.  You have to live with the consequences of your actions.

Both Richie AND the team lost.   Think what you will of Richie's off field persona he was an absolute beast on the field.  Richie strikes me as a guy who needs the NFL and football to keep his life and emotions together.   The Bills threw silly money at guys like lotulei and Murphy this year, yet low balled Richie when he already had one of the best value contracts in the NFL when you considered his performance over the past few years.  Richie, probably understood how much he needs football to keep his life together and accepted originally before understanding how much $$$ was going elsewhere.  Understandably pissed he protested and McDermott did his "My Way" thing leaving Richie out of the league and starting a predictable downward spiral.

 

Richie has his issues but the way the Bills handled his contract was classless.

 

Meanwhile we take on and throw away 3.5 million $$$  for two weeks of  Corey Coleman.

 

The epitome of Organizational Incompetence.

Edited September 10, 2018 by CamboBill

[Boatdrinks]

5 hours ago, billsblood said:

I agree with this rant...... is it time for the KAP?

There is no time that would = KAP. Some things are bigger than trying to win a football game. Just my opinion. 

[BillsMafia13]

5 hours ago, CamboBill said:

We need a one year starter to absorb Snaps until we can create a better situation for Allen Next year.  A one year starter return would be exactly what Kaep needs to get back in the league and would give the Bills time and flexibility to spot Allen in places he can succeed.

 

I would be all in on Kaep but the F/O wankers would never court such "controversy"as offending some right wingers.

 

We need to get someone though.  Preferably someone who can run for their lives

Did you see the San Fran game last time he played here?  Bills fans might hate him more than any other fan base.  He and McBeane would be chased out of town with pitchforks if they tries that

[CuddyDark]

3 minutes ago, BUFFALOBART said:

With the McCarron deal, we paid $4 MILLION for a 2019 5th round pick.

Pegs has to be livid.

How about 5M to a corner who doesn't even dress?

[BillsVet]

3 hours ago, Hebert19 said:

Sorry but the dead cap was an inherited problem that he has addressed so we have 70M plus to spend next year.  He had to get us out if cap hell and this team is the result of that.  Think about it. We have 2/3s of what other teams have to spend on a roster this year...that's the issue.  You think he wants some of these people?  No.  But it's the hole we are in.  

 

1 draft pick doesnt fix but 1 pick and 70M can. 

 

Even if Buffalo uses their 2019 cap space, there aren't many options in UFA to spend it on. It's also proven that a team doesn't adequately build through UFA, only augmenting a base which, at least in Buffalo, doesn't exist.

 

2 hours ago, Sky Diver said:

Losing Eric Wood was a blow they couldn't control, but they screwed by low balling Richie. They did the best they could to back fill, but the OL is obviously a mess.

 

Your opinion and insistence on Richie returning are the equivalent of not using a helmet while sky diving.  Perhaps even a parachute.

 

The man is not mentally capable of playing in the NFL right now. End.

[dollars 2 donuts]

3 minutes ago, CuddyDark said:

How about 5M to a corner who doesn't even dress?

 

 

Honestly, this is not hindsight.  I wanted to sign EJ when it looked like it was down to 5-6 million.  

 

I'd rather have two health risk CBs on the opposite side of Tre than just one.

[AlCowlingsTaxiService]

1 hour ago, SoTier said:

McDermott is a "my way or the highway" HC.  Dareus was not a "malcontent" in the locker room.  He didn't fit in with whatever McDermott wanted in his players, so McDermott wanted him gone without regard to the consequences for the team on the field or for the cap.  The same with the Watkins trade; again a player was sent packing because he didn't "fit" the HC's mold, leaving the Bills without any speed or reliabilty among the WRs.

 

That's not having a plan, that's accommodating the HC's my-way-or-the-highway mentality.

 

 

Actual football talent > Football "DNA"

[CamboBill]

12 minutes ago, BUFFALOBART said:

With the McCarron deal, we paid $4 MILLION for a 2019 5th round pick.

Pegs has to be livid.

uggghhh --- is that cap hit or out of pocket?

 

its a 5th rounder?  for some reason I remember a 4th rounder

 

It just gets worse.

[May Day 10]

Should have hired Andy Reid instead of Doug Marrone

[87168]

3 hours ago, MJS said:

One game.

it was a very telling game. 

4 minutes ago, May Day 10 said:

Should have hired Andy Reid instead of Doug Marrone

yea, but there's a ton of things this organization could have and should have done differently (including this current regime).

[LSHMEAB]

3 hours ago, SoTier said:

 

I think that's because the right wingers they'd be offending would be their fellow owners and execs.   As history shows, the Bills don't really care if they offend their fanbase because they've done that repeatedly with the crap product they repeatedly have put on the field over the decades.

 

 

 

I'd wager many Bills fans would rather lose with Peterman than win with Kaep, so yes, the customer is factored into the equation.