BillsFan4 Posted August 30, 2018 Share Posted August 30, 2018 17 hours ago, cle23 said: If he sits out the year, he won't be a FA next year. I think he has to report by Week 10, but they can fine him $800k+ per game missed. I'm guessing he blinks before they do. And no, they won't get 2 1sts for him. Does that apply to Mack though, since he’s already played 4 full seasons? https://raiderswire.usatoday.com/2018/07/27/raiders-de-khalil-mack-has-upper-hand-in-contract-dispute/ Quote That could be for as long as Mack wants especially because he has already played for four seasons and is not bound to the Aug. 7 deadline when many other players are required to report to training camp ignorer to acquire an accrued season, which can impact their retirement pension or even whether or not they’re an unrestricted free agent at the end of their contract. No matter what I just can’t imagine him sitting out an entire season. Even if if he did, the raiders could always just tag him I believe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted August 30, 2018 Share Posted August 30, 2018 50 minutes ago, GreggTX said: No way. We will have a top 5 or even top 3 pick in the next draft and 2 picks in the top 37. I'm sure we can get a great pair of day 1 starters if Beane gets it together. What does that even mean Beane has been doing a outstanding job Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MTBill Posted August 30, 2018 Share Posted August 30, 2018 Too rich for my blood. I get he's a stud. But you can't pay that much for a guy who has 1 year left on his contract and has proven he wants to get paid what he deserves and is willing to sit out and eat 800K per week to do so. I love KM, don't get me wrong. I can't see us burning 2 1st rounders. And frankly - I don't think anyone else will either unless they have the draft capital to burn or are 1 player away from a Superbowl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuvian Posted August 30, 2018 Share Posted August 30, 2018 Funny how Gruden thinks every team is as dumb as the Raiders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unbillievable Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 13 hours ago, Soda Popinski said: The mistake was moving up at all, had they stayed put and drafted BPA they would have come away with ODB or Mike Evans without sacrificing a 1st round pick the following year. They still wouldn't have had a shot at Mack though The consensus would have been TE Ebron, who has similar production (and pay) to Charles Clay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoTier Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 18 hours ago, Starr Almighty said: You can't say they are trying to save a buck and then turn around and say none of the guys that were let go have done anything significant in the league. My point was just that The Bills almost always miss on 1st round picks. If they traded for Mack we know it's a hit and not a miss for sure. The guys that have been traded for the most part have done zip just like they did in a Bills uniform. It's been many regimes over that time all failed. You can't fail on a sure thing The Bills do not "almost always miss on 1st round picks". Since 2001 the Bills have had 17 first round draft picks. Only 4 have been busts, and Shaq Lawson may be one. However, 7 were Pro Bowlers, 4 went to multiple Pro Bowls, and 2 were All Pros. The reason that it may seem that the Bills haven't had much success with their first draft picks is because the Bills like to get rid of their most talented players rather than paying them. Many of these players had their most success after the Bills sent them packing. 2001 - Nate Clements, CB,12 years in NFL, Pro Bowl 2002 - Mike Williams, OT, bust 2003 - Willis McGahee, RB, 9 years in NFL, 2 Pro Bowls 2004 - Lee Evans, WR, 8 years in NFL 2004 - JP Losman, QB, bust 2006 - Donte Whitner, S, 11 years in NFL, 2 Pro Bowls 2007 - Marshawn Lynch, RB, 12 years in NFL, 5 Pro Bowls, All Pro 2008 - Leodis McKelvin, CB, 9 years in NFL 2009 - Aaron Maybin, DE, bust 2009 - Eric Wood, C, 8 years in NFL 2010 - CJ Spiller, RB, 9 years in NFL, Pro Bowl 2011 - Marcell Dareus, DT, 8 years in NFL, 2 Pro Bowls, All Pro 2012 - Stephon Gilmore, CB, 7 years in NFL, Pro Bowl 2013 - EJ Manuel, QB, bust 2014 - Sammy Watkins, WR, 5 years in NFL 2016 - Shaq Lawson, DE, 3 years in NFL 2017 - Tre'Davious White, CB, 2 years in NFL Bolded players are currently active NFL players. There's no such thing as a "sure thing" in horse racing or NFL football. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maryland-bills-fan Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/report-raiders-have-offers-want-two-first-round-picks-for-khalil-mack-trade-conversation/ They want two first round picks for a guy who is 27. 27 is the peak year for DL and after that they decline. http://socalledfantasyexperts.com/aging-curve-nfl-defensive-players-dl-lb-db If it takes 3 years until the Bills get enough quality players to be looking at deep in the playoffs, he would be 30 or 31. We would also LOSE 2 high draft picks- lets say we would lose two bookend offensive tackles. NOPE !! The team to get him at that cost will be a team near the cusp of the SB, who are peaking and need a boost to get to the top. And a team that are planning on a crash and burn for 2-5 years after that. NOPE 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starr Almighty Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 1 hour ago, SoTier said: The Bills do not "almost always miss on 1st round picks". Since 2001 the Bills have had 17 first round draft picks. Only 4 have been busts, and Shaq Lawson may be one. However, 7 were Pro Bowlers, 4 went to multiple Pro Bowls, and 2 were All Pros. The reason that it may seem that the Bills haven't had much success with their first draft picks is because the Bills like to get rid of their most talented players rather than paying them. Many of these players had their most success after the Bills sent them packing. 2001 - Nate Clements, CB,12 years in NFL, Pro Bowl 2002 - Mike Williams, OT, bust 2003 - Willis McGahee, RB, 9 years in NFL, 2 Pro Bowls 2004 - Lee Evans, WR, 8 years in NFL 2004 - JP Losman, QB, bust 2006 - Donte Whitner, S, 11 years in NFL, 2 Pro Bowls 2007 - Marshawn Lynch, RB, 12 years in NFL, 5 Pro Bowls, All Pro 2008 - Leodis McKelvin, CB, 9 years in NFL 2009 - Aaron Maybin, DE, bust 2009 - Eric Wood, C, 8 years in NFL 2010 - CJ Spiller, RB, 9 years in NFL, Pro Bowl 2011 - Marcell Dareus, DT, 8 years in NFL, 2 Pro Bowls, All Pro 2012 - Stephon Gilmore, CB, 7 years in NFL, Pro Bowl 2013 - EJ Manuel, QB, bust 2014 - Sammy Watkins, WR, 5 years in NFL 2016 - Shaq Lawson, DE, 3 years in NFL 2017 - Tre'Davious White, CB, 2 years in NFL Bolded players are currently active NFL players. There's no such thing as a "sure thing" in horse racing or NFL football. Why didn't you tell me EJ is still in the league lol Shaq is a bust BTW. When you included the years in the league you failed to realize most of those years were not in Buffalo for those players. Spiller was awful. Lee Evans was not that good either. Mcgahee was an awful pick and was nowhere near what was expected. Sammy did not produce worth 2 1st. Dareus wasn't worth the 3rd pick in the draft, he's very talented but for whatever reason he stopped playing for us. Whitner missed a lot of tackles unless he hit you with is infamous back tackle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 13 minutes ago, Starr Almighty said: Why didn't you tell me EJ is still in the league lol Shaq is a bust BTW. When you included the years in the league you failed to realize most of those years were not in Buffalo for those players. Spiller was awful. Lee Evans was not that good either. Mcgahee was an awful pick and was nowhere near what was expected. Sammy did not produce worth 2 1st. Dareus wasn't worth the 3rd pick in the draft, he's very talented but for whatever reason he stopped playing for us. Whitner missed a lot of tackles unless he hit you with is infamous back tackle. EJ just had the best game of any player possibly of the whole preseason. AJ struggled badly against 3rd stringers. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CajunBillsBacker Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 I know about the Hershel Walker trade, but has there been a recent player traded for two first round picks, say since the year 2000? When I see a team ask for two firsts for a player, I just take it as they have no intentions of ever trading the player, but everything has a price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 2 minutes ago, CajunBillsBacker said: I know about the Hershel Walker trade, but has there been a recent player traded for two first round picks, say since the year 2000? When I see a team ask for two firsts for a player, I just take it as they have no intentions of ever trading the player, but everything has a price. Set the price, hope a stupid team bites, then lower the price if you really want to make the trade. I will say next to qbs, the next most important position might be a dominant pass rusher. He is entering the prime of his career but who knows how long that will last. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 Nope not giving up two firsts and 21M a year for Mack. I would not even give a package that involves 2019 1st, 2020 sure but not getting rid of the 2019 first On 8/29/2018 at 10:03 PM, mrags said: The closer it gets to game day. And the more Mack stresses that he will not play and will sit out the entire year only to leave in FA in the offseason, the raiders will take what they can get for him. Asking everyone for 2 first rounds now will gauge if anyone is stupid enough to offer that for him. Amd no. At that price I would not. Mack will show up. He has to by week 10. Raiders then will tag him meaning he isnt going anywhere next year either so yes Raiders can hold out for a package they want 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 38 minutes ago, CajunBillsBacker said: I know about the Hershel Walker trade, but has there been a recent player traded for two first round picks, say since the year 2000? When I see a team ask for two firsts for a player, I just take it as they have no intentions of ever trading the player, but everything has a price. The price is most certainly based on the "non-exclusive" franchise tag. They will probably sign him to that next year, have the ability to match the offer or recieve 2 first round picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MILFHUNTER#518 Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 3 hours ago, SoTier said: The Bills do not "almost always miss on 1st round picks". Since 2001 the Bills have had 17 first round draft picks. Only 4 have been busts, and Shaq Lawson may be one. However, 7 were Pro Bowlers, 4 went to multiple Pro Bowls, and 2 were All Pros. The reason that it may seem that the Bills haven't had much success with their first draft picks is because the Bills like to get rid of their most talented players rather than paying them. Many of these players had their most success after the Bills sent them packing. 2001 - Nate Clements, CB,12 years in NFL, Pro Bowl 2002 - Mike Williams, OT, bust 2003 - Willis McGahee, RB, 9 years in NFL, 2 Pro Bowls 2004 - Lee Evans, WR, 8 years in NFL 2004 - JP Losman, QB, bust 2006 - Donte Whitner, S, 11 years in NFL, 2 Pro Bowls 2007 - Marshawn Lynch, RB, 12 years in NFL, 5 Pro Bowls, All Pro 2008 - Leodis McKelvin, CB, 9 years in NFL 2009 - Aaron Maybin, DE, bust 2009 - Eric Wood, C, 8 years in NFL 2010 - CJ Spiller, RB, 9 years in NFL, Pro Bowl 2011 - Marcell Dareus, DT, 8 years in NFL, 2 Pro Bowls, All Pro 2012 - Stephon Gilmore, CB, 7 years in NFL, Pro Bowl 2013 - EJ Manuel, QB, bust 2014 - Sammy Watkins, WR, 5 years in NFL 2016 - Shaq Lawson, DE, 3 years in NFL 2017 - Tre'Davious White, CB, 2 years in NFL Bolded players are currently active NFL players. There's no such thing as a "sure thing" in horse racing or NFL football. Awesome post thank you 15 minutes ago, MAJBobby said: Nope not giving up two firsts and 21M a year for Mack. I would not even give a package that involves 2019 1st, 2020 sure but not getting rid of the 2019 first Mack will show up. He has to by week 10. Raiders then will tag him meaning he isnt going anywhere next year either so yes Raiders can hold out for a package they want The Raiders can simply not trade him this season, dare him to sit out and if he does, chucky does not have to pay him a dime. Then next year franchise tag him, let him go sign with whomever he wants and the compensation the new team will have to give up will be two first round picks. Either way, the raiders are gonna get two first rounders for him, one way or the other. That being said, we need to sit tight and chive on. Next year we can draft a super good edge rusher and avoid the high price tag and baggage that comes with dealing with chucky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoTier Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 9 hours ago, Starr Almighty said: Why didn't you tell me EJ is still in the league lol Shaq is a bust BTW. When you included the years in the league you failed to realize most of those years were not in Buffalo for those players. Spiller was awful. Lee Evans was not that good either. Mcgahee was an awful pick and was nowhere near what was expected. Sammy did not produce worth 2 1st. Dareus wasn't worth the 3rd pick in the draft, he's very talented but for whatever reason he stopped playing for us. Whitner missed a lot of tackles unless he hit you with is infamous back tackle. Just because YOU don't like certain players doesn't mean they were/are busts. Moreover, the numerous examples over the last almost 20 years of ex-Bills players, whether former first rounders or former UDFAs, not only finding success on other teams but playing significant roles on Super Bowl contenders and winners totally refutes the claims of Bills apologists like you that these players "weren't good enough" or "weren't worth the money". How much is hoisting the Lombardi trophy worth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt_In_NH Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 On 8/30/2018 at 2:13 PM, papazoid said: if Mack was in next years draft....he'd be the first pick. Top 100 Players 2018 #16 Mack http://www.nfl.com/photoessays/0ap3000000930293 In terms of talent then probably true but the thing that gets overlooked is the contract. You cant have a bunch of all pros who are the highest paid at their position, but you can have a bunch of all pro's on your team if you acquire them through the draft. You have to consider the contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aristocrat Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 Not sure I do two firsts but one for sure and I think I mentioned before I’d do two non consecutive firsts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starr Almighty Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 21 minutes ago, SoTier said: Just because YOU don't like certain players doesn't mean they were/are busts. Moreover, the numerous examples over the last almost 20 years of ex-Bills players, whether former first rounders or former UDFAs, not only finding success on other teams but playing significant roles on Super Bowl contenders and winners totally refutes the claims of Bills apologists like you that these players "weren't good enough" or "weren't worth the money". How much is hoisting the Lombardi trophy worth? I never said I didn't like the players I spoke on their production, which lacked greatly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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