Is Rudolph their guy?

[LABILLBACKER]

Rudolph @ 22, maybe but at 12 no way. 

[FeelingOnYouboty]

Why are we taking a 3rd Rd prospect in the 1st?

[MrEpsYtown]

6 minutes ago, Laughing Coffin said:

Rudolph will be there in the 2nd !@#$ing round.

He will likely be there in the 3rd and possibly fourth. 

[PIZ]

Greg Gabriel (former NFL guy) likes Rudolph.

 

www.buffalosportspage.com/greg-gabriels-scouting-reports-mayfield-rudolph/

[OldTimer1960]

I'm not saying that Mason Rudolph IS who they want, but I can why they might like him.  I know that some folks on here spend a good deal of time actually watching game cut ups of the prospects, but it feels like a lot of folks have read one or two draft lists and they have formed an opinion only on that.

 

All that I am saying is that Rudolph his excellent size, was a 3 year starter, was highly productive and is reportedly smart and a good leader.  Would it be better if his arm was stronger?  Sure, but there are definitely things to like about him.

 

For anyone who would like to war has some of his games, several can be found on draftbreakdown.com.  Here is one last season against Pitt.  Note thieves contain every play involving him during the game - they aren't highlights.

http://draftbreakdown.com/2017/12/11/mason-rudolph-vs-pittsburgh-2017/

 

Edited March 18, 2018 by OldTimer1960

[MrEpsYtown]

18 minutes ago, OldTimer1960 said:

I'm not saying that Mason Rudolph IS who they want, but I can why they might like him.  I know that some folks on here spend a good deal of time actually watching game cut ups of the prospects, but it feels like a lot of folks have read one or two draft lists and they have formed an opinion only on that.

 

All that I am saying is that Rudolph his excellent size, was a 3 year starter, was highly productive and is reportedly smart and a good leader.  Would it be better if his arm was stronger?  Sure, but there are definitely things to like about him.

 

The issue is that his skills are really not projectable for the NFL. Yes, our brass may like him, but he in no way whatsoever improves our quarterback situation. He has very little upside and has small hands. He is basically just really big and put up ridiculous numbers in a simple offense surrounded by some really good players. Guys like Brandon Weeden and Zac Robinson were very similar. In terms of arm strength, Nate Peterman probably has more. At least Peterman had some experience in a pro style offense coming in. The thing that grinds my gears is people talking about taking this guy in the first round. It's lunacy.  

 

People complain about Josh Allen and Mayfield having footwork problems etc etc. Rudolph has all of those problems without any of the upside. He is unathletic and a future backup quarterback. Taking him would be a wasted pick. He seems like a very nice guy, but does not move the needle for us. I could see him going in the 2nd, but that team will definitely regret that selection. He is a 3rd or 4th round pick. 

 

People would rather not trade up and I get that, but convincing yourself we don't have to trade up while completely wasting the 22nd pick on this guy is just ludicrous. The Jackson thing, while I don't like it, I get it. He has ridiculous athletic upside. Rudolph is so ordinary and besides his frame, is not projectable as an NFL starter. 

Edited March 18, 2018 by MrEpsYtown

[OldTimer1960]

It isn't that I am opposed to trading up, rather I think they have been shutout of that chance now that the Jets are at 3.  It is hard to imagine that Rosen and Darnold won't both be gone by pick 3.  Denver is at pick 5 and will take Allen or Mayfield.  

 

If if you trade with Cleveland at 4, you might get your choice of Allen and Mayfield, but that will be very costly to get one of them.

 

if you can't get ahead of Denver, then you are likely left with one of Allen/Mayfield and Lamar Jackson.  If, say it is Allen and Jackson left, do you really want to take one of them?  I'm not asking to be snarky, just saying that they are both very risky projections.

[Teddy KGB]

18 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

If Rudolph were "their guy", they could have stayed at 21 and 22 w/o the need to move up at all. 

 

Link ? 

[MrEpsYtown]

3 minutes ago, OldTimer1960 said:

It isn't that I am opposed to trading up, rather I think they have been shutout of that chance now that the Jets are at 3.  It is hard to imagine that Rosen and Darnold won't both be gone by pick 3.  Denver is at pick 5 and will take Allen or Mayfield.  

 

If if you trade with Cleveland at 4, you might get your choice of Allen and Mayfield, but that will be very costly to get one of them.

 

if you can't get ahead of Denver, then you are likely left with one of Allen/Mayfield and Lamar Jackson.  If, say it is Allen and Jackson left, do you really want to take one of them?  I'm not asking to be snarky, just saying that they are both very risky projections.

 

It's a fair question. Allen is going way higher than you think. And my answer is yes. This franchise has need a true franchise quarterback for so long. They have spinned their wheels on Ryan Fitzpatricks (marginal talent) and JP Losmans (5th best quarterback in a class). We need a true, high upside quarterback. Sure Allen might be Jake Locker, but he could be big Ben. Lamar Jackson could flame out, or could become Michael Vick. Mason Rudolph is probably somewhere between Christian Ponder and Brandon Weeden. A move like this would make absolutely zero sense. Even Nathan Peterman projects as possibly becoming something like Kirk Cousins. Rudolph is Peterman with less upside. 

 

There is always risk involved when acquiring high level talent. Heck Rosen and Darnold are risky in their own ways as well. But we need a high ceiling quarterback prospect, otherwise we will keep having these same conversations for the next 20 years. 

[KRT88]

On 3/17/2018 at 1:56 PM, PIZ said:

Greg Gabriel has his QBs ranked:

 

1st Round

1.  Mayfield.

2.  Darnold.

3.  Rosen.

4.  Rudolph.

 

2nd Round

5.  Jackson.

 

3rd Round

6.  Lauletta.

7.  Allen.

8.  Falk.

If this clown has Allen as a 3rd round pick BUT Rudolph as a first round pick, he is completely clueless.  Rudolph is a system player that uses one read only.  Had he also included Mason as a 3rd round pick, then maybe his assessment would be more accurate. 

[PIZ]

Chargers, Giants, Steelers meet with Rudolph.

 

Bucky Brooks said Rudolph had a great pro day.

 

http://www.nfl.com/labs/rr/pathtothedraft/rudolph

 

[Dkollidas]

Does anyone know if Beane was there? I believe Rudolph and Rosen had Pro-days in the same day, was curious if anyone knew if they chose one to go to, or made both in a day or split the scouts into groups and sent some to each pro day? 

[DCOrange]

38 minutes ago, Dkollidas said:

Does anyone know if Beane was there? I believe Rudolph and Rosen had Pro-days in the same day, was curious if anyone knew if they chose one to go to, or made both in a day or split the scouts into groups and sent some to each pro day? 

I don't think Beane has personally gone to any of the Pro Days to this point.

[K-9]

On 3/17/2018 at 10:30 PM, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Just as important people should actually watch some of his games. 

And watch them several times over at that. Then break down every 3, 5, and 7 step drop while noting the route combinations and defensive alignment. Oh, and be sure to note the game situation for each event as well. That's a good start, anyway. 

[Misterbluesky]

On 3/17/2018 at 1:38 PM, Dkollidas said:

Moving to 12 might end up being the right spot to take him. Browns, Giants, Jets, Broncos, Dolphins could all take Quarterback. 4 will likely be gone. All of these guys have major questions, Rudolph might have the highest floor, besides Rosen. 

 

Darnold- turnovers, Fumbles plus the knowledge that his small hands have lead to fumbles, might make him a bad fit in snowy buffalo. Plus he’s likely Cleveland’s guy at #1. 

 

Rosen- Injury history, specifically concussions, could be red flags.

 

Allen- Innacuracy could be a major red flag. It’s highly believed accuracy is one trait that can’t really  be improved from college to pros, you either have the touch or you don’t.

 

Mayfield- On field attitude, off-field issues, height could all be red flagged. Played in Spread could also be a red flag, but that’s always difficult to tell and NFL is moving more towards spread & RPO’s anyways. Just look at Goff and Wentz’s offenses this past season. 

 

Jackson- Athletic ability may concern teams that he’ll always look for the run as opposed to keeping his eyes downfield. 

 

Rudolph- Biggest concern is lack of arm strength. But really, his arm is strong enough, it’s not Chad Pennington or anything like that. Other weakness is that he came from a spread, but again, that seems to be where the league is going anyways. To me he has the highest floor besides Rosen. 

You have any film on this guy?

[SinatraSinger]

It amazes me how many unemployed NFL GM's are Bills fans.  Just amazing.

[BadtasteinQBs]

On 3/17/2018 at 9:38 AM, Dkollidas said:

Moving to 12 might end up being the right spot to take him. Browns, Giants, Jets, Broncos, Dolphins could all take Quarterback. 4 will likely be gone. All of these guys have major questions, Rudolph might have the highest floor, besides Rosen. 

 

Darnold- turnovers, Fumbles plus the knowledge that his small hands have lead to fumbles, might make him a bad fit in snowy buffalo. Plus he’s likely Cleveland’s guy at #1. 

 

Rosen- Injury history, specifically concussions, could be red flags.

 

Allen- Innacuracy could be a major red flag. It’s highly believed accuracy is one trait that can’t really  be improved from college to pros, you either have the touch or you don’t.

 

Mayfield- On field attitude, off-field issues, height could all be red flagged. Played in Spread could also be a red flag, but that’s always difficult to tell and NFL is moving more towards spread & RPO’s anyways. Just look at Goff and Wentz’s offenses this past season. 

 

Jackson- Athletic ability may concern teams that he’ll always look for the run as opposed to keeping his eyes downfield. 

 

Rudolph- Biggest concern is lack of arm strength. But really, his arm is strong enough, it’s not Chad Pennington or anything like that. Other weakness is that he came from a spread, but again, that seems to be where the league is going anyways. To me he has the highest floor besides Rosen. 

I love how you pointed out criticisms of the others, but then get to Rudolph and then minimize his lack of arm strength, like it isn't a big deal. The dude is a 3rd round talent. Rosen, Darnold, and Mayfield can spin the hell out of the ball. Your criticism of Jackson is juvenile as well. The guy threw for 9000 yards in 3 years. That is an exciting player. Just because he can also run, people want to try to doubt him. He is far more intriguing that Rudolph and may be there at 12. 

[Dkollidas]

1 hour ago, BadtasteinQBs said:

I love how you pointed out criticisms of the others, but then get to Rudolph and then minimize his lack of arm strength, like it isn't a big deal. The dude is a 3rd round talent. Rosen, Darnold, and Mayfield can spin the hell out of the ball. Your criticism of Jackson is juvenile as well. The guy threw for 9000 yards in 3 years. That is an exciting player. Just because he can also run, people want to try to doubt him. He is far more intriguing that Rudolph and may be there at 12. 

I was just trying to point out that all of these guys have warts. You’re correct, I might be understating Rudolph’s lack of arm strength. But at the same time, he seems to have the greatest success of any of these with his deep ball. But again, that could be because of his receiver talent. 

 

I just think all these guys have their warts. My feeling is that Darnold is the only one worth trading up for.

 

As for Jackson, you make a good point, he’s an exciting athelete and has put up numbers. 

 

Ultimately though, I think the Bills are looking for certain things that will lower some of these guys on their boards.

 

Mayfield’s height, along with his need to work from a lot of play action or roll outs in order to make plays (look at Georgia’s 2nd half keeping him restrained in the pocket). Also I think his personality will clash with what Beane and McDermott are looking for.

 

Regarding Jackson, I look at Beane’s comments about wanting a quarterback who stands tall in the pocket and makes the throws. Now I’m not saying Jackson can’t become that guy. But with the type of athleticism he has, you have to wonder if he’ll ever really throw consistently “from the pocket”. He’ll always look for the run because ultimately it’s his greatest weapon. 

 

The greatest ability is availability, according to McDermott & Beane. That alone should knock Rosen down a few pegs on their board. He’s had the shoulder injury that kept him out most of his sophomore season, and two separate concussions this season as well. 

 

Allen’s innacuracy seems to be his greatest issue. Saw some scouts saying that it’s overblown, so he’ll likely go higher than the Draftniks and us fans believe he will. He has an incredible skill set but is really raw. 

 

 

Again, I’m just spitballing at what I assume the Bills Brass is thinking. I just feel that they’ll appreciate what a guy like Rudolph has done. Although Beane has discussed the importance of arm strength and being able to “make all the throws”. And that’s where I think Rudolph’s arm isn’t as big an issue as others. It’s not the strongest, but he can make all the throws.

 

 

[BadtasteinQBs]

14 hours ago, Dkollidas said:

I was just trying to point out that all of these guys have warts. You’re correct, I might be understating Rudolph’s lack of arm strength. But at the same time, he seems to have the greatest success of any of these with his deep ball. But again, that could be because of his receiver talent. 

 

I just think all these guys have their warts. My feeling is that Darnold is the only one worth trading up for.

 

As for Jackson, you make a good point, he’s an exciting athelete and has put up numbers. 

 

Ultimately though, I think the Bills are looking for certain things that will lower some of these guys on their boards.

 

Mayfield’s height, along with his need to work from a lot of play action or roll outs in order to make plays (look at Georgia’s 2nd half keeping him restrained in the pocket). Also I think his personality will clash with what Beane and McDermott are looking for.

 

Regarding Jackson, I look at Beane’s comments about wanting a quarterback who stands tall in the pocket and makes the throws. Now I’m not saying Jackson can’t become that guy. But with the type of athleticism he has, you have to wonder if he’ll ever really throw consistently “from the pocket”. He’ll always look for the run because ultimately it’s his greatest weapon. 

 

The greatest ability is availability, according to McDermott & Beane. That alone should knock Rosen down a few pegs on their board. He’s had the shoulder injury that kept him out most of his sophomore season, and two separate concussions this season as well. 

 

Allen’s innacuracy seems to be his greatest issue. Saw some scouts saying that it’s overblown, so he’ll likely go higher than the Draftniks and us fans believe he will. He has an incredible skill set but is really raw. 

 

 

Again, I’m just spitballing at what I assume the Bills Brass is thinking. I just feel that they’ll appreciate what a guy like Rudolph has done. Although Beane has discussed the importance of arm strength and being able to “make all the throws”. And that’s where I think Rudolph’s arm isn’t as big an issue as others. It’s not the strongest, but he can make all the throws.

 

 

Eh, Rudolph feels like a Brandon Weeden pick to me.

[Dkollidas]

9 minutes ago, BadtasteinQBs said:

Eh, Rudolph feels like a Brandon Weeden pick to me.

Except he won’t be drafted at 28yrs of age like Weeden was. 

 

Besides both having gone to Oklahoma state, I don’t see it. 

[billsredneck1]

21 hours ago, SinatraSinger said:

It amazes me how many unemployed NFL GM's are Bills fans.  Just amazing.

no shiz...right?

[BadtasteinQBs]

6 hours ago, Dkollidas said:

Except he won’t be drafted at 28yrs of age like Weeden was. 

 

Besides both having gone to Oklahoma state, I don’t see it. 

I guess you are right. Weeden was seen as having a way better arm... lol

[Jamie Muellers Ghost]

Chris Trepasso on Rudolph and others.

http://www.wgr550.com/media/audio-channel/3-20-chris-trapasso-cbs-sports-talks-draft-qbs-schopp-and-bulldog

 

[JohnC]

Chris Trapasso of CBS Sports was on WGR with Schoop and the Bulldog. He discussed Rudolph and the variety of options they can take on the qb position. He gave some interesting views on Rudolph and Jackson how he would be a good fit for Buffalo. As the draft approaches I'm becoming more open to staying at our spot and selecting our qb without giving up picks. This is about an 8 minute segment. 

 

http://www.wgr550.com/media/audio-channel/3-20-chris-trapasso-cbs-sports-talks-draft-qbs-schopp-and-bulldog

Edited March 20, 2018 by JohnC

[aristocrat]

23 hours ago, BadtasteinQBs said:

I love how you pointed out criticisms of the others, but then get to Rudolph and then minimize his lack of arm strength, like it isn't a big deal. The dude is a 3rd round talent. Rosen, Darnold, and Mayfield can spin the hell out of the ball. Your criticism of Jackson is juvenile as well. The guy threw for 9000 yards in 3 years. That is an exciting player. Just because he can also run, people want to try to doubt him. He is far more intriguing that Rudolph and may be there at 12. 

 

Watson has a weak arm too. He looked very legit. Flacco apparently has the strongest arm in the league and he’s not the best qb. It’s important but it isn’t you know?

[BadtasteinQBs]

Just now, aristocrat said:

 

Watson has a weak arm too. He looked very legit. Flacco apparently has the strongest arm in the league and he’s not the best qb. It’s important but it isn’t you know?

Watson has a weak arm? Are you sure? Never heard that criticism of him. Only that he played in an offense in college that threw a lot of screens. 
 

[aristocrat]

2 minutes ago, BadtasteinQBs said:

Watson has a weak arm? Are you sure? Never heard that criticism of him. Only that he played in an offense in college that threw a lot of screens. 
 

 

He Threw the ball 49 mph and I think no qb had ever been successful being under 5mph or something.  Widely talked about last year 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

...thought Rudolph may be McBeane's guy at 21, but not at 12.......probably available at 22 with Falk, Lauletta, White to following along thereafter.......so if the top dawgs are his target and Plan A and Plan 1-A are gone before 12 and he doesn't move up as draft unfolds, who would he pick at 12?.....

[Dkollidas]

3 hours ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

...thought Rudolph may be McBeane's guy at 21, but not at 12.......probably available at 22 with Falk, Lauletta, White to following along thereafter.......so if the top dawgs are his target and Plan A and Plan 1-A are gone before 12 and he doesn't move up as draft unfolds, who would he pick at 12?.....

At the same time, if you’re willing to take a QB at 21, why not just take him at 12, especially if 4 others are gone by the time you pick at 12??? You don’t take the chance. That’s 9 chances for another team to either take a guy, or someone to trade up and grab a guy. How pissed would we all be if we found out the Bills liked Rudolph but the Steelers or Patriots traded up to 20 or 21 to grab Rudolph and he ended up being good? If he’s your guys, take him. Same thing with any other guy and moving to 2. If they think that highly of a guy, go get him. 

Edited March 21, 2018 by Dkollidas

[Manther]

On 2018-03-17 at 1:57 PM, 26CornerBlitz said:

If Rudolph were "their guy", they could have stayed at 21 and 22 w/o the need to move up at all. 

Could and would are two different things.

 

They probably or possibly could at #22.  But, IF Rudolph is your guy you don’t chance it.

 

Whoever you identify as your guy you need to over draft him OR chance not getting him.  If you identify him as your guy you don’t chance it!

Edited March 21, 2018 by Manther

[26CornerBlitz]

1 minute ago, Manther said:

Could and would are two different things.

 

They probably ornposdibly could at #22.  But, IF Rudolph is your guy you don’t chance it.

 

Whoever you identify as your guy you need to over draft him OR chance not getting him.  If you identify him as your guy you don’t chance it!

 

He'll be there and if the hold that pick, I hope they'll.

 

 

[Manther]

1 minute ago, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

He'll be there and if the hold that pick, I hope they'll.

 

 

26 you are very passionate and outspoken on QBs......you and I both know IF he is your guy you don’t chance it.

 

Based on your opinion I would think Rudolph is not YOUR guy.

 

It takes only one other team to like him and get him before us.

[26CornerBlitz]

1 minute ago, Manther said:

26 you are very passionate and outspoken on QBs......you and I both know IF he is your guy you don’t chance it.

 

Based on your opinion I would think Rudolph is not YOUR guy.

 

It takes only one other team to like him and get him before us.

 

He's not and if another team takes him I'll be fine with it. 

[Manther]

Just now, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

He's not and if another team takes him I'll be fine with it. 

I don’t think he is the Bills guy either.  But, he could be.

 

But, if he is we can’t wait and hope he is there.

 

So, you only want a QB to do well for the Bills if he is YOUR guy?

[26CornerBlitz]

1 minute ago, Manther said:

I don’t think he is the Bills guy either.  But, he could be.

 

But, if he is we can’t wait and hope he is there.

 

So, you only want a QB to do well for the Bills if he is YOUR guy?

 

Of course not.  I want them to get the best available prospect and Rusdolph IMO is far from that. 

Edited March 21, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz

[Manther]

Just now, 26CornerBlitz said:

 

Of course not.  I want them to get the best available prospect and Rusdolph IMO is far from that. 

Did you ever think you could be wrong?

[26CornerBlitz]

26 minutes ago, Manther said:

Did you ever think you could be wrong?

 

Obviously I can and have been.  But I go on what I see. 

Edited March 21, 2018 by 26CornerBlitz

[MrEpsYtown]

3 hours ago, Dkollidas said:

At the same time, if you’re willing to take a QB at 21, why not just take him at 12, especially if 4 others are gone by the time you pick at 12??? You don’t take the chance. That’s 9 chances for another team to either take a guy, or someone to trade up and grab a guy. How pissed would we all be if we found out the Bills liked Rudolph but the Steelers or Patriots traded up to 20 or 21 to grab Rudolph and he ended up being good? If he’s your guys, take him. Same thing with any other guy and moving to 2. If they think that highly of a guy, go get him. 

But you have to take value into account. People are assuming this guy is a first round pick and he isn’t. Besides Chris Trappaso, Rudolph is not regarded as one of the top fifty picks in this draft. You just don’t draft a third round quarterback at 12 overall. You have to take rankings and values into account. You cannot simply draft for need. That is how you wind up with roster devoid of talent.

 

They really liked Nate Peterman last year and they got him in the fifth. Imagine how we would feel if the took him in the second instead of Dion Dawkins or Zay Jones? That’s what all if these Rudolph fans are suggesting. So we are going to take the 65th best player at 12? Why? That’s just terrible process. 

1 hour ago, Manther said:

Did you ever think you could be wrong?

I dont think 95 percent of the scouting communiy is wrong and Trappaso and a few people on a message board are right. That seems highly unlikely. 

[Reed83HOF]

6 hours ago, Jamie Muellers Ghost said:

Chris Trepasso on Rudolph and others.

http://www.wgr550.com/media/audio-channel/3-20-chris-trapasso-cbs-sports-talks-draft-qbs-schopp-and-bulldog

 

Trapasso (who I generally like) cannot eat a meal these days without Rudolph's balls falling out of his mouth....

 

[Tatonka68]

I love all these NFL "experts" who say that Rudolph is not good enough. I say Rudolph can be the man, He can do all things thru Christ. 

12. Mason Rudolph QB Oklahoma St 

22.  Harrison Phillips DT Stanford

53. James Washington WR Oklahoma St

56. Josey Jewell ILB Iowa

65. Bradley Boseman C Alabama

96. Darius Leonard OLB South Carolina St

121. Cedrick Wilson WR Boise State

166.  Bo Scarbrough RB Alabama

187. Marquis Hayes Edge Ole Miss

 

Edited March 21, 2018 by Tatonka68