Fred Says Whaley Dishonest With Him

[YoloinOhio]

Will your heart and guts still tell you that if Jackson gets hurt again this year in Seattle? Then remember that if he was with the bills he is carrying a multi million dollar salary?

 

I am in the Fred Jackson fan club.....but the injuries are mounting quick to go along with the age.....why cant people see that?

releasing him simultaneously breaks my heart, and makes a ton of sense to me.

[Heels20X6]

Professional sports teams have for years used plants to perform social media damage control and manipulate discussion. This is a fact. Longtime contributors on message boards, twitter and comment sections of newspapers are often hired and paid to post. If they leave the fold the account is transfered to someone else.

 

It's not as "altruistic" as people want to believe. Those quickest to attack such realities as "insane" or "ridiculous" are either painfully naive or on the payroll.

 

Sorry to have to burst the bubble folks, but read the members over time who seem to always be the most aggressive in defending the FO, and then form your own opinions.

 

Santa, the Easter Bunny and the Tooth Fairy are as real as some of the member accounts on this and every other popular forum. It's costumed to look like genuine opinion, but behind the curtain you'll find the Wizard is a fraud.

 

Sweet baby Jeebus....This has got to be the dumbest thing I have ever read on this board.

 

Anyways, gotta go, having lunch with Russ Brandon, Terry Pegula's dog and Nanker to figure out how to control the message here.

[Nanker]

yes. I figured they'd pay you better than the last regime paid the jills. respect is good.

Damn straight!

[Heels20X6]

 

And yet you come at some of us that have been very targeted in our criticism(s) of the front office and claim we're shills.

 

Was I shilling when I ripped the Darby pick back in April? Was I shilling when I repeatedly blasted Marrone/Hacket's use of Sammy Watkins, or my disdain for the Kouandjio selection?

 

To claim to have read certain members' posting history, and then have drawn such a conclusion means one of two things:(1) you're lying, or (2) you're incapable of deductive reasoning. Of course I suppose it could be both.

(3) He's an idiot. Trademark and Copyright DC Tom

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

 

The Bills are smarter than you think. They realized what could have happened in 2000 so they began putting board plants in after that, knowing eventually this situation would arise again and it would be very helpful to have board veterans 'towing' the company line.

 

Which reminds me, has anyone else gotten time and a half this week?!? The OT is killing me! Might be time for a class-action wage lawsuit.

Lol- I havnt gotten time in a half since the high school summer job... If only

[Hapless Bills Fan]

It was an open field strip but it wasn't like he was being careless with the ball. He can't cough the ball up, that is for sure. But Fred fumbled 5 times last year in about 200 touches. Brown has fumbled once in the last two with about 140 touches or so.

 

It's hard to inject facts into an internet discussion.

 

Fred had a period of time where he was considered to have fumble potential around the league - 2009 and 2010. He worked on it and his # went down, but then climbed up again.

 

Facts last 3 years:

 

Fred Jackson 612 total touches (run + rec + KR + PR), 13 Fumbles (8 Unrecovered). That's a fumble rate of 2.1%.

Bryce Brown 274 total touches , 5 fumbles (4 Unrecovered). That's a fumble rate of 1.8% . Unrecovered fumbles is 1.5%

 

For those who like to hedge, Unrecovered fumbles 1.3% for Fred, 1.5% for Bryce Brown. I don't because a fumble stops the momentum of the play potentially resulting in loss of down or loss of points even if it's recovered, and there's a very strong element of luck involved in what team recovers.

 

If you want to look at just last year, Fred has 5 fumbles on 210 touches, 2.4%

Bryce had 1 fumble on 55 touches, 1.8%.

 

Fumbles are a pretty straightforward stat yet people are still out here referring to Brown as a "fumbler" and speaking as though Fred is Mr Reliable Hands. I don't want to Dis Fred or take anything away from him, but the Cold Hard Football Facts paint a different picture. Fred is a good player but he's had his share of turnovers.

Edited September 2, 2015 by Hopeful

[birdog1960]

Damn straight!

however, soliciting, by any other name is still soliciting.

[BillsVet]

 

This sums up my views on Whaley quite nicely. I'll add: he's very green for a GM and still learning how to play well in the sandbox.

 

Shouldn't someone with going on 20 seasons in NFL personnel be more savvy than what Whaley is now? Especially the part about understanding how different departments must work together in a NFL Front Office? I'm sure Pittsburgh does things differently in some ways than Buffalo, but DW has been here through 6 off-seasons now.

[Snorom]

 

Sweet baby Jeebus....This has got to be the dumbest thing I have ever read on this board.

 

Anyways, gotta go, having lunch with Russ Brandon, Terry Pegula's dog and Nanker to figure out how to control the message here.

 

 

he has more.. he been spamming the dumb a lot recently

[eball]

 

Shouldn't someone with going on 20 seasons in NFL personnel be more savvy than what Whaley is now? Especially the part about understanding how different departments must work together in a NFL Front Office? I'm sure Pittsburgh does things differently in some ways than Buffalo, but DW has been here through 6 off-seasons now.

 

Because Whaley didn't notify the marketing department he was cutting Fred he's now not "savvy" and doesn't know how front offices work? And since he is only doing Rex's bidding (as you have consistently stated) why didn't Rex notify the marketing folks?

[Hapless Bills Fan]

 

Sweet baby Jeebus....This has got to be the dumbest thing I have ever read on this board.

 

Anyways, gotta go, having lunch with Russ Brandon, Terry Pegula's dog and Nanker to figure out how to control the message here.

 

And that's saying a lot considering some of this chap's other posts.

 

Pegula's dog, that one had me laughing around a mouthful of tea. Heels, I christen thee KOK (killer of keyboards). Can I come too, I'm sure I fall into the "Shill" category to the Tin Foil Hat brigade.

[Rob's House]

Rogue - used to describe something or someone that is different from others in usually a dangerous or harmful way.

 

1 :resembling or suggesting a rogue elephant especially in being isolated, aberrant, dangerous, or uncontrollable <capsized by a rogue wave>

2 :corrupt, dishonest <rogue cops>

3 :of or being a nation whose leaders defy international law or norms of international behavior <rogue states>

Edited September 2, 2015 by Rob's House

[DC Tom]

(3) He's an idiot. Trademark and Copyright DC Tom

 

I hereby grant license to any and all to use "idiot" and "moron" to describe negativo in the context of this thread.

 

But only because Whaley promised me a bonus if I did.

[LabattBlue]

 

It's hard to inject facts into an internet discussion.

 

Fred had a period of time where he was considered to have fumble potential around the league - 2009 and 2010. He worked on it and his # went down, but then climbed up again.

 

Facts last 3 years:

 

Fred Jackson 612 total touches (run + rec + KR + PR), 13 Fumbles (8 Unrecovered). That's a fumble rate of 2.1%.

Bryce Brown 274 total touches , 5 fumbles (4 Unrecovered). That's a fumble rate of 1.8% . Unrecovered fumbles is 1.5%

 

For those who like to hedge, Unrecovered fumbles 1.3% for Fred, 1.5% for Bryce Brown. I don't because a fumble stops the momentum of the play potentially resulting in loss of down or loss of points even if it's recovered, and there's a very strong element of luck involved in what team recovers.

 

If you want to look at just last year, Fred has 5 fumbles on 210 touches, 2.4%

Bryce had 1 fumble on 55 touches, 1.8%.

 

Fumbles are a pretty straightforward stat yet people are still out here referring to Brown as a "fumbler" and speaking as though Fred is Mr Reliable Hands. I don't want to Dis Fred or take anything away from him, but the Cold Hard Football Facts paint a different picture. Fred is a good player but he's had his share of turnovers.

Great post...except it will be ignored by those who are ripping Whaley and want him tar and feathered.

[jeffismagic]

Just checked in with Doug Whaley. We are going to get extra this month as the Fred cut is just the start. There will be more second guessing soon enough and Russ wants us ready to interact with the Bills fan community. Total Football Awareness.

 

 

Now, let's talk about the idea that the Bills were 8-8 last year. Is this the new thing? Do we just create the record we want, not the record they had? Ok, I'll bite. This was a 10 win team last year but the college coaches in Marrone and Hackett, and their playcalling and offensive line coaching held back a 10 win team roster assembled by Doug.

[Kelly the Dog]

I hereby grant license to any and all to use "idiot" and "moron" to describe negativo in the context of this thread.

 

But only because Whaley promised me a bonus if I did.

Did Whaley notify the football ops and marketing department and local banks before promising that bonus? That reeks of unsavviness.

[Snorom]

Great post...except it will be ignored by those who are ripping Whaley and want him tar and feathered.

 

 

It just makes me laugh that there is always a contingent that has to have a fall guy that needs to blame someone for everything and grind that ax non stop

 

I love Whaley as our GM. He makes bold moves and has definitely helped make this team much better is short time. I don't expect perfection but I'm enjoying what I see on the field compared to what we had pre Whaley

[YoloinOhio]

Are our paychecks coming via M&T Bank?

[Wayne Cubed]

Are our paychecks coming via M&T Bank?

Gee, I hope so.

[NoSaint]

Doug keeps the Pegula's, coaching and Russ involved with what he is thinking. This move should not have caught anyone off guard. A few questions would have been asked candidly. "When you say that Fred might not be here are you saying that it is a 70% chance or a 1% chance?"

 

Russ takes this information to the Sr. Staff meeting and says something like, "there is a chance that Freddy wont be on the roster this upcoming year. Please try to steer clear of featuring him in promotional material. I am not saying that it is likely but it is better to be safe than sorry. Do your best to do so and that doesn't leave this room."

 

It then falls on the department head's (who ultimately sign off on all of this stuff) to guide the process. As an example when the department heads meet with their management teams as they guide the different organizational initiatives (that is kind of where I fell). They guide the marketing themes, the ticket sales, the sponsor sales, the ticket service, the sponsor service, the pr, the marketing, the community relations, etc... There is a staff below them that really executes these tasks (may be one more layer of management here as well).

 

I am not suggesting that the information is shared with the 150 or so people in the organization but with all of the key decision makers. Think about it like this. What kind of calls do you think that they are receiving today? If a plan had been drafted at the sr. level they could begin carrying it out instead of reacting. The plan could have been further developed (and had more people clued in) as the possibility became more real. It is not perfect but it certainly cuts down on situations like this.

again, always appreciated.

 

i guess my follow up would be - if this wasnt a shock to many here, how was it to anyone in house, unless whaley was actively telling others that there was no chance of a cut? i could see moderate surprise, but blindsided would be a surprise to me.

 

we knew they were exploring other backs, we knew there were rumors around this all offseason, there were plenty here that connected the dots of diminishing role, and price that might not match, of course age, injury history..... wouldnt you think that most, even if not explicitly briefed of the possibility probably shouldve had an idea he was some degree of risk? i dont know how anyone couldve had him at a slam dunk to make it unless whaley was giving mis-information.