Bills vets on the bubble

[machine gun kelly]

Hogan is more reliable for ST and offense. Goodwin's problem is like Dungy always said, ability is about availability.

 

Too small, too frail, and so on.

[DrDawkinstein]

Hogan is more reliable for ST and offense. Goodwin's problem is like Dungy always said, ability is about availability.

 

Too small, too frail, and so on.

 

Goodwin wasnt injured most of last year. He just ended up on the same Marrone list as Mike Williams, Kraig Urbik, and others.

[Maybe Someday]

 

Goodwin wasnt injured most of last year. He just ended up on the same Marrone list as Mike Williams, Kraig Urbik, and others.

 

Not exactly. He was injured early on and as a result was never able to work his way back up the depth chart after that. So there was at least a reason he was so far down the depth chart. Same with Mike Williams. By all accounts he was lazy and didn’t put in the work required. If true, he has no one but himself to blame for not being on a roster right now. Urbik was a head scratcher, no idea why he wasn’t playing sooner.

 

Goodwin is a heck of an athlete but in my opinion, Hogan is a better all around football player. I think which one makes the final cut, if either of them do, it will depend more so on what we keep at other positions. If we need to keep another of the core special teams guys, Hogan would make it over Goodwin. If we have enough other guys for that, then Goodwin makes it because you can’t teach speed.

[26CornerBlitz]

I have to think Chris Williams will be expendable if Miller cracks the starting lineup. Chris Hogan could be in jeopardy as well.

[Deranged Rhino]

 

So there was at least a reason he was so far down the depth chart. Same with Mike Williams.

 

There was a reason. We had a terrible offensive philosophy with a head coach who had no idea how to use the assets available to him.

[DrDawkinstein]

 

Not exactly. He was injured early on and as a result was never able to work his way back up the depth chart after that. So there was at least a reason he was so far down the depth chart. Same with Mike Williams. By all accounts he was lazy and didn’t put in the work required. If true, he has no one but himself to blame for not being on a roster right now. Urbik was a head scratcher, no idea why he wasn’t playing sooner.

 

Goodwin is a heck of an athlete but in my opinion, Hogan is a better all around football player. I think which one makes the final cut, if either of them do, it will depend more so on what we keep at other positions. If we need to keep another of the core special teams guys, Hogan would make it over Goodwin. If we have enough other guys for that, then Goodwin makes it because you can’t teach speed.

 

So after all of that, you came around to the exact same conclusion I did. Except I believe I can predict that Goodwin will make the team over Hogan, for the reasons we both stated.

 

We have plenty of guys who can fill in and cover on ST. But Hogan doesnt have the deep speed to take the top off the defense. He's just another underneath guy. And out of Sammy, Harvin, Clay, McCoy, Woods, and Hogan, he's the least talented underneath guy. We dont have anyone that can go deep like Goodwin.

[billykaykay]

Do you know where the Bills ranked in slot receiving yards last year (where Hogan played)?

 

Answer: 31st....I think that the point was that you could find pretty much any NFL caliber player that could produce the same if given the same opportunity. Would Dez Lewis or Caleb Holley be a significant drop off?

I know that you are not real big on Hogan, but what's not to like? He runs pretty good routes. He has good hands. He is much faster than most give him credit for. Any stats that show minimal production are obviously skewed by the guys throwing him the ball among other things like poor OL & play calling. The answer to your Q is that they might very well be a significant drop off. We already have 2 burners in Sammy & Percy. I like Goodwin, DL, & CH but 3 burners aren't a need. We need to move the sticks & Hogan will probably be in there in those situations.

[Deranged Rhino]

I know that you are not real big on Hogan, but what's not to like? He runs pretty good routes. He has good hands. He is much faster than most give him credit for. Any stats that show minimal production are obviously skewed by the guys throwing him the ball among other things like poor OL & play calling. The answer to your Q is that they might very well be a significant drop off. We already have 2 burners in Sammy & Percy. I like Goodwin, DL, & CH but 3 burners aren't a need. We need to move the sticks & Hogan will probably be in there in those situations.

 

But the one area Hogan has shown repeatedly to be lacking in is field awareness. If we need a first down, throwing the ball to Hogan is the last resort. He consistently comes up a yard or two short because he has no understanding of where he is relation to the first down marker. That can be learned with experience of course, but so far he had demonstrated none of the skills required to be a go-to WR on third and medium.

[Kelly the Dog]

I know that you are not real big on Hogan, but what's not to like? He runs pretty good routes. He has good hands. He is much faster than most give him credit for. Any stats that show minimal production are obviously skewed by the guys throwing him the ball among other things like poor OL & play calling. The answer to your Q is that they might very well be a significant drop off. We already have 2 burners in Sammy & Percy. I like Goodwin, DL, & CH but 3 burners aren't a need. We need to move the sticks & Hogan will probably be in there in those situations.

For one, he doesn't often run patterns to the first down marker like good WR do, and he doesn't seem to know where they are on the sidelines, so often he catches a pass but it is not a first down like it should be. He's also very easy to bring down. He has decent but not great hands, decent but not great speed, runs decent but not great patterns. He's a JAG, and maybe will be soon.

 

But the one area Hogan has shown repeatedly to be lacking in is field awareness. If we need a first down, throwing the ball to Hogan is the last resort. He consistently comes up a yard or two short because he has no understanding of where he is relation to the first down marker. That can be learned with experience of course, but so far he had demonstrated none of the skills required to be a go-to WR on third and medium.

Look above.

[Deranged Rhino]

For one, he doesn't often run patterns to the first down marker like good WR do, and he doesn't seem to know where they are on the sidelines, so often he catches a pass but it is not a first down like it should be. He's also very easy to bring down. He has decent but not great hands, decent but not great speed, runs decent but not great patterns. He's a JAG, and maybe will be soon.

Look above.

 

ha!

[Kirby Jackson]

 

But the one area Hogan has shown repeatedly to be lacking in is field awareness. If we need a first down, throwing the ball to Hogan is the last resort. He consistently comes up a yard or two short because he has no understanding of where he is relation to the first down marker. That can be learned with experience of course, but so far he had demonstrated none of the skills required to be a go-to WR on third and medium.

That is kind of how I feel.

I don't think that Hogan does anything above average. The more that he (and Chandler) got the ball the worse off the Bills were. Teams are fine if you throw the ball to Hogan on 3rd and 8 and he picks up 6. If you were a defensive coordinator and Goodwin and Hogan were the 2 WRs on the field who would scare you more? That is important here in terms of how our defensive minded coach views skill players. He wants match up problems.

 

It isn't that I hate Hogan. He is better than many of us (especially me) give him credit for. With that being said if we are going to use someone >10 snaps a game give me Goodwin over the top or Dez Lewis in the red zone. If someone goes out in preseason than I think that Hogan immediately jumps them all for that spot. Either way all 3 of them end up on NFL rosters.

[finhater]

I think as far as Goodwin being injured last year . I think it was the charger game and E.J. got him absolutely killed coming across the middle on a 3rd down throw that needed like 10 yards and was a 2 yard pass. And he never really got a chance after that .

[Formerly Allan in MD]

No McKelvin on the list? It's almost criminal.

Why not EJ as well?

[Direhard Fan]

Thought this was on vets getting cut. Not a Hogan/Goodwin thing. Neither will make the roster. We will care 4 WR. 3 Full Back and 5 RB. We are running the ball this year. Have we all forgotten?

[HeHateMe]

What good is a hurt Goodwin eating up a roster spot... he is not a football player. Yea he is talented but that doesn't make you a football player. You need to you know not get hurt every single time you get tackled. He is made of glass.

 

Give me the more proven Hogan. You are getting a solid WR who is reliable there.

 

Harvin is there to return kicks, don't need Goodwin for that.

 

Watkins, Woods, Harvin, Hogan, Easley with Goodwin outside looking in.

[Reed83HOF]

Hogan or Goodwin...it doesn't matter since our offense will be run run run run

[4merper4mer]

What good is a hurt Goodwin eating up a roster spot... he is not a football player. Yea he is talented but that doesn't make you a football player. You need to you know not get hurt every single time you get tackled. He is made of glass.

 

Give me the more proven Hogan. You are getting a solid WR who is reliable there.

 

Harvin is there to return kicks, don't need Goodwin for that.

 

Watkins, Woods, Harvin, Hogan, Easley with Goodwin outside looking in.

 

Hogan has proven that he is Brad Lamb. Any given week there are 14 street free agents out there that could step in and replace his productivity.

[Buftex]

No McKelvin on the list? It's almost criminal.

Why not EJ as well?

It would be criminally stupid to cut your 1st round pick QB after 14 starts, without any better options. And even stupider to cut one of the top two corners on your roster.

[dave mcbride]

That is kind of how I feel.

I don't think that Hogan does anything above average. The more that he (and Chandler) got the ball the worse off the Bills were. Teams are fine if you throw the ball to Hogan on 3rd and 8 and he picks up 6. If you were a defensive coordinator and Goodwin and Hogan were the 2 WRs on the field who would scare you more? That is important here in terms of how our defensive minded coach views skill players. He wants match up problems.

 

It isn't that I hate Hogan. He is better than many of us (especially me) give him credit for. With that being said if we are going to use someone >10 snaps a game give me Goodwin over the top or Dez Lewis in the red zone. If someone goes out in preseason than I think that Hogan immediately jumps them all for that spot. Either way all 3 of them end up on NFL rosters.

One could also argue that he's an improving player and that improving players should be kept. He looked solid by the end of the season to me.

[26CornerBlitz]

It would be criminally stupid to cut your 1st round pick QB after 14 starts, without any better options. And even stupider to cut one of the top two corners on your roster.

Dumb and Dumber?