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that Spiller is running a lot harder off tackle?

 

 

Is Freddie rubbing off on him? There was a few plays where I was sure it was Fred in the backfield and it was CJ.

 

It would be a very good development if the kid finally understands taking what the defense gives him - make himself small, running hard, with a lot less dancing around. This offense could use another weapon and if defenses are not tuned into Jackson by now they are on stupid pills, so I could see CJ becoming more involved. If nothing else, as a good change of pace back to spell Fred after one of his, "I'll take that 5 yard screen 50 yards thank you very much" plays.

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that Spiller is running a lot harder off tackle?

 

 

Is Freddie rubbing off on him? There was a few plays where I was sure it was Fred in the backfield and it was CJ.

 

It would be a very good development if the kid finally understands taking what the defense gives him - make himself small, running hard, with a lot less dancing around. This offense could use another weapon and if defenses are not tuned into Jackson by now they are on stupid pills, so I could see CJ becoming more involved. If nothing else, as a good change of pace back to spell Fred after one of his, "I'll take that 5 yard screen 50 yards thank you very much" plays.

 

Yeah.....those 16 yards from scrimmage sure do legitimize using a #9 selection in an NFL draft on him! :thumbsup:

 

Seriously, CJ gets a ton of room because he was drafted so high. I understand this. Whitner had supporters til the end as well. Who really wants to face the ugly fact that the team we love so much wasted premium draft picks?

 

Like you, I hope that CJ can contribute to this football team. As a matter of fact he threw a nice block on a touchdown pass on Sunday. That said, the chances of him even approaching what one would want from a #9 running back are remote at best. Do you think Nix is glad that he made this selection as we speak?

 

We never, ever will know, but I will always suspect that this pick was mandateded by Mr. Wilson.

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that Spiller is running a lot harder off tackle?

 

 

Is Freddie rubbing off on him? There was a few plays where I was sure it was Fred in the backfield and it was CJ.

 

It would be a very good development if the kid finally understands taking what the defense gives him - make himself small, running hard, with a lot less dancing around. This offense could use another weapon and if defenses are not tuned into Jackson by now they are on stupid pills, so I could see CJ becoming more involved. If nothing else, as a good change of pace back to spell Fred after one of his, "I'll take that 5 yard screen 50 yards thank you very much" plays.

I agree with Freddie rubbing off on Spiller as well as agreeing with Freddie being straight amazing. Spiller has looked hesitant in hitting the holes in games past but now he seems to be turning up field quicker, rather than dancing behind the line. Maybe more so than Freddie's tutelage has been the excellent play of the offensive line this year. Spiller can commit easier when there are larger holes for him to run through. An increase in Spiller's ability or determination seems a reflection of the team's smashmouth style of football.

 

Go Bills!

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Yeah.....those 16 yards from scrimmage sure do legitimize using a #9 selection in an NFL draft on him! :thumbsup:

 

Seriously, CJ gets a ton of room because he was drafted so high. I understand this. Whitner had supporters til the end as well. Who really wants to face the ugly fact that the team we love so much wasted premium draft picks?

 

Like you, I hope that CJ can contribute to this football team. As a matter of fact he threw a nice block on a touchdown pass on Sunday. That said, the chances of him even approaching what one would want from a #9 running back are remote at best. Do you think Nix is glad that he made this selection as we speak?

 

We never, ever will know, but I will always suspect that this pick was mandateded by Mr. Wilson.

16 yards on 2 carries, not too shabby yards/carry, but it is hard to fault Gailey for leaving Jackson in when he is playing at the absolute top of his game.

 

I will never agree with the luxury pick for Spiller that Nix made (I feel that Gailey is really the one that wanted Spiller for his offense), we needed help on both sides of the line and a decent TE and I would have preferred to have seen them trade down for more picks on that first draft, but it is what it is and may still pay dividends.

 

Buddy's second draft was defense, defense, and more defense. The jury is still out, but I think that Dareus, Sheppherd, Searcy, and Aaron Williams are going to develop into very good defensive players and this may go down as one of the more solid Bills drafts that we have seen in years - heck, even Hairston looked like a player on Sunday stepping in at LT.

 

I am willing to be patient with Spiller as long as I see progress in his game and I see the kid getting stronger and running with a lot less hesitation. That first year it was a lot of dancing behind the line, a cloud of dust, and the slightest tap seemed to bring him down for a loss. He is playing much more solid this year, and it may have a bit to do with how spread out the defense is, but they often key on him when he is subbing for Jackson and he is still getting yards after the first hit.

 

We may be very happy that Chan found ways to get Spiller at least a few touches each game if Jackson ever gets dinged up and needs to sit out a few games.

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I've noticed that he's been consistently making plays with his limited touches so far this season. He's even breaking tackles and playing physical. Yesterday on the play before the Nelson TD, he lowered his shoulder into Asomugha on the sideline and knocked him 5 yards out of bounds. I think he's at or getting to the point where he would be a #1 RB on most teams in the league. The fact that he's not there yet on this team is more a testament to Jackson than an indictment of Spiller.

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If you look at the 10-15 players that went after Spiller on draft day, there aren't a ton of legitimate candidates for the Bills at 9. I wish we had gone with Jason Pierre-Paul, but I dont remember anyone at the time having him tabbed as a top-10 prospect. The way the top 8 shook out left our options limited. This likely takes away any chance of a trade-down, and makes it easier to understand their gambling on the upside of Spiller to become a Chris Johnson or a Jamaal Charles.

 

I don't believe Spiller will ever live up to those lofty expectations coming out of college. With that said, my answer to the thread title is yes; the kid's improvement seems obvious to me. His sense for where to go and how quickly to go there is immeasurably better. He probably won't do us much good while Captain Jackson is performing as one of the top halfbacks in the league, but he can be a useful player.

Edited by Big Bad Boone
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that Spiller is running a lot harder off tackle?

 

 

Is Freddie rubbing off on him? There was a few plays where I was sure it was Fred in the backfield and it was CJ.

 

It would be a very good development if the kid finally understands taking what the defense gives him - make himself small, running hard, with a lot less dancing around. This offense could use another weapon and if defenses are not tuned into Jackson by now they are on stupid pills, so I could see CJ becoming more involved. If nothing else, as a good change of pace back to spell Fred after one of his, "I'll take that 5 yard screen 50 yards thank you very much" plays.

 

yes I did, and lets hope Freddy is influencing him! The one time, I actually thought it was Jackson base on the effort and style. If CJ starts emulating FJ, it will be a good thing for all involved.

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spiller's been playing well. Remember Aaron rodgers... He sat for a few years behind Favre. Give Spiller a flipping break. He's sitting behind a RB who's playing his tail off. Long term this can be great for CJ. Not to mention - he IS running much more patiently and hitting holes a ton harder, like Fred.

 

For the guy's questioning Gailey wanting CJ, just remember Gailey is the same coach who recruited Calvin Johnson. The dude knows talent.

 

One thing i did notice at the game about CJ that was different - During some kickoffs he was up by the LOS, including on the 'fake' that Andra Davis jumped on. I wonder if Dehaven knew something was coming or what - but great way to have the ST prepared and have your best hands guy, CJ, up there.

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I agree Spiller has looked much better lately. On the few runs he made the last couple of games, he looked exactly like a clone of Fred Jackson out there. I had to look at the number on the jersey twice to check that it actually wasn't Jackson. I think "the light has gone on" for Spiller, its just that he is stuck behind a guy who is right now playing as one of the top 5 backs in the league. Maybe Gailey/Nix weren't completely sold on Jackson and now they have two clones in place. Spiller (on one play where he broke up the sideline) is noticably faster than Jackson, but Jackson seems to have more strength and tackle breaking ability.

 

In terms of the draft pick being wasted, I really don't see any OMYGOD-weMISSEDoutON guys being drafted right behind Spiller.

 

9 Bills C.J. Spiller RB

10 Jaguars Tyson Alualu DE

11 49ers Anthony Davis OT

12 Chargers Ryan Mathews RB

13 Eagles Brandon Graham DE

14 Seahawks Earl Thomas SS

15 Giants Jason Pierre-Paul DE

16 Titans Derrick Morgan DE

17 49ers Mike Iupati OG

18 Steelers Maurkice Pouncey C

19 Falcons Sean Weatherspoon LB

 

Some of these alternate guys would have filled holes that we had last year, but this year we have roughly equivalent players in those positions and the jury is still out on Spiller in my opinion.

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We've seen more from him in the past couple weeks and he does look like he's progressing...still a ways to go though (and still nowhere near his draft position). It's difficult to know where he is because Jackson is rightfully getting the bulk of the snaps.

 

Biggest complaint from Sunday...he had a decent run around the right side of the line and he skirted out of bounds rather than lowering his shoulder (like he'd done earlier in the game).

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i hope freddy is mentoring him. it would be nice if spiller would play with as much heart as jackson.

How do you know that he doesn't :wallbash:

 

In his limited opportunities, Spiller has excelled. If this offense can continue to click, I see Spiller playing a big role come December/January, when the weather changes around.

 

The only need guy from that list would have been Anthony Davis. Earl Thomas has been pretty good for the West Coast birds, but picking another Safety at 9 would have sent the fan base spiraling down. Pouncey would have been nice, but we already had Levitre and Wood. We needed a LT or DE and there really was no blue chip player @ that point.

 

 

9 Bills C.J. Spiller RB

10 Jaguars Tyson Alualu DE

11 49ers Anthony Davis OT

12 Chargers Ryan Mathews RB

13 Eagles Brandon Graham DE

14 Seahawks Earl Thomas SS

15 Giants Jason Pierre-Paul DE

16 Titans Derrick Morgan DE

17 49ers Mike Iupati OG

18 Steelers Maurkice Pouncey C

19 Falcons Sean Weatherspoon LB

 

Some of these alternate guys would have filled holes that we had last year, but this year we have roughly equivalent players in those positions and the jury is still out on Spiller in my opinion.

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yes I did, and lets hope Freddy is influencing him! The one time, I actually thought it was Jackson base on the effort and style. If CJ starts emulating FJ, it will be a good thing for all involved.

with all the WRs out, you'd better hope he emulates Wes Welker from the slot for the next 4 or 5 weeks .

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Yeah.....those 16 yards from scrimmage sure do legitimize using a #9 selection in an NFL draft on him! :thumbsup:

 

Seriously, CJ gets a ton of room because he was drafted so high. I understand this. Whitner had supporters til the end as well. Who really wants to face the ugly fact that the team we love so much wasted premium draft picks?

 

Like you, I hope that CJ can contribute to this football team. As a matter of fact he threw a nice block on a touchdown pass on Sunday. That said, the chances of him even approaching what one would want from a #9 running back are remote at best. Do you think Nix is glad that he made this selection as we speak?

 

We never, ever will know, but I will always suspect that this pick was mandateded by Mr. Wilson.

Maenwhile that Best guy in Detroit is running wild attimes. Think he was drafted about 20 pix later than CJ and also was thought to be only a 3rd down scat back type....

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Maenwhile that Best guy in Detroit is running wild attimes. Think he was drafted about 20 pix later than CJ and also was thought to be only a 3rd down scat back type....

prior to last night's game, best's career hasn't really been anything special...

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Maenwhile that Best guy in Detroit is running wild attimes. Think he was drafted about 20 pix later than CJ and also was thought to be only a 3rd down scat back type....

 

Best just had his first 100 yd game of his career last night - as the featured back in their offense. Whether or not you agree with where Spiller was selected, it is what it is. Done. Over. Can't change it. He is here now and it is clear he has some major talent. Gailey is a good offensive mind and if anyone can find a way to get Spiller to manifest that talent into something productive on the field, it is Gailey. I'm willing to wait and see. In the meantime, it is not such a bad thing he continues to learn behind someone like Jackson.

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Yeah.....those 16 yards from scrimmage sure do legitimize using a #9 selection in an NFL draft on him! :thumbsup:

 

Seriously, CJ gets a ton of room because he was drafted so high. I understand this. Whitner had supporters til the end as well. Who really wants to face the ugly fact that the team we love so much wasted premium draft picks?

 

Like you, I hope that CJ can contribute to this football team. As a matter of fact he threw a nice block on a touchdown pass on Sunday. That said, the chances of him even approaching what one would want from a #9 running back are remote at best. Do you think Nix is glad that he made this selection as we speak?

 

We never, ever will know, but I will always suspect that this pick was mandateded by Mr. Wilson.

 

I love you to death, Bill, but you've been banging this "Wilson forced Nix to draft Spiller" drum tiresomely for a couple of years. I've never thought this was a credible theory, but even if it is, is it possible there is anyone here who doesn't know your opinion on this?

 

You have certain players (D. Bell is another) that I am convinced you will never feel good about no mater how well they play. You will never forgive Bell for not being Jason Peters, as if Bell himself sent Peters to the Eagles (where he has performed so stellarly).

 

For whatever it's worth, I think Spiller has so far not given the team what you want from such a high draft pick, but I also think he may yet turn out to be a huge asset to the team.

 

Focus on something else.

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I agree Spiller has looked much better lately. On the few runs he made the last couple of games, he looked exactly like a clone of Fred Jackson out there. I had to look at the number on the jersey twice to check that it actually wasn't Jackson. I think "the light has gone on" for Spiller, its just that he is stuck behind a guy who is right now playing as one of the top 5 backs in the league. Maybe Gailey/Nix weren't completely sold on Jackson and now they have two clones in place. Spiller (on one play where he broke up the sideline) is noticably faster than Jackson, but Jackson seems to have more strength and tackle breaking ability.

 

In terms of the draft pick being wasted, I really don't see any OMYGOD-weMISSEDoutON guys being drafted right behind Spiller.

 

9 Bills C.J. Spiller RB

10 Jaguars Tyson Alualu DE

11 49ers Anthony Davis OT

12 Chargers Ryan Mathews RB

13 Eagles Brandon Graham DE

14 Seahawks Earl Thomas SS

15 Giants Jason Pierre-Paul DE

16 Titans Derrick Morgan DE

17 49ers Mike Iupati OG

18 Steelers Maurkice Pouncey C

19 Falcons Sean Weatherspoon LB

 

Some of these alternate guys would have filled holes that we had last year, but this year we have roughly equivalent players in those positions and the jury is still out on Spiller in my opinion.

 

This guy.

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Guy is averaging like 8 yards per carry... give him a break.

 

 

This is TSW, it is common practice for people to bash 1st round picks. In fact, this is the only place on the planet where picking a potential game changing running back when our starter is 30 years old could ever be discussed as a luxury pick.

 

Your logic carries no weight here.

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i was okay then , andI am now okay with spiller he is in his second years, and produces when given the chance....fact is I love Fred and he is physical wonder considering his age....and that he seem to be getting better but the other side of that in 2 year maybe 3...Fred will be 33...and CJ 25.... Sometime you have to secure your future...

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Spiller looked better on Sunday, but after watching Jackson, he seems small.

 

I worry that he will be a washout, because Chan really wanted him and usually can make the most out of an offensive threat.

 

With Spiller, Chan keeps saying he hasn't figured it out yet. He's had two years to "figure things out'. Must be a slow learner, or he's just too small.

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Spiller looked better on Sunday, but after watching Jackson, he seems small.

 

I worry that he will be a washout, because Chan really wanted him and usually can make the most out of an offensive threat.

 

With Spiller, Chan keeps saying he hasn't figured it out yet. He's had two years to "figure things out'. Must be a slow learner, or he's just too small.

 

 

Not buying the 'too small' concern. Wes Welker is on pace to smash all single season receiving records (we helped him immensly) and Jones-Drew is must see.

 

I see Spiller turning the corner -no pun- and beginning to get it. Once we get him in the secondary on the screens we run Freddy with, CJ won't be caught.

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Yeah.....those 16 yards from scrimmage sure do legitimize using a #9 selection in an NFL draft on him! :thumbsup:

 

Seriously, CJ gets a ton of room because he was drafted so high. I understand this. Whitner had supporters til the end as well. Who really wants to face the ugly fact that the team we love so much wasted premium draft picks?

 

Like you, I hope that CJ can contribute to this football team. As a matter of fact he threw a nice block on a touchdown pass on Sunday. That said, the chances of him even approaching what one would want from a #9 running back are remote at best. Do you think Nix is glad that he made this selection as we speak?

 

We never, ever will know, but I will always suspect that this pick was mandateded by Mr. Wilson.

 

This Sunday CJ had 13 yards off of 2 carries which I believe comes to 6.5yds/carry. On the year CJ has 15 carries for for 107 yards for 7.1yards/carry. Jackson by comparison has 90 for 480 at 5.3yds/carry. That's pretty DAMN good for getting 3 carries a game.

 

Do you REALLY expect that CJ or ANY RB is going to replace Jackson? The guy is 3rd in rushing and 2nd in yards for scrimmage in the ENTIRE LEAGUE? You don't take carries away from a guy like that. You ride that horse. Don't be retarded.

 

You don't say Steve Young sucks because he didn't replace Joe Montana in his second year.

Edited by PDaDdy
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Yeah.....those 16 yards from scrimmage sure do legitimize using a #9 selection in an NFL draft on him! :thumbsup:

 

Seriously, CJ gets a ton of room because he was drafted so high. I understand this. Whitner had supporters til the end as well. Who really wants to face the ugly fact that the team we love so much wasted premium draft picks?

 

Like you, I hope that CJ can contribute to this football team. As a matter of fact he threw a nice block on a touchdown pass on Sunday. That said, the chances of him even approaching what one would want from a #9 running back are remote at best. Do you think Nix is glad that he made this selection as we speak?

 

We never, ever will know, but I will always suspect that this pick was mandateded by Mr. Wilson.

 

It's getting to the point that you are obsessing over the Spiller pick. Your speculating that Wilson possibly made the pick is a very extended reach. Do you really think that the over 90 yr old owner had a clue as to who Spiller was coming out of the college ranks? You are insultingly diminishing Nix as a GM and his authority in the two drafts he was involved in by insinuating Wilson's involvement in his drafts. I'm not suggesting that the owner hasn't interfered in prior drafts but I'm confident that he wasn't involved in the two Nix drafts.

 

There is nothing sinster or complicated in Nix's drafting of Spiller. He took a top ten rated player in the top ten location of the draft. He drafted a player whom he felt was going to be a playmaker. While you have for the most part written him off in his short stint as a pro player I haven't. As it stands Spiller is not getting much playing time because Fred Jackson has been playing superbly. What is wrong with that?

 

You originally wrote off Bell as a LT based on his early playing time. This year he seems to have taken a quantum leap in improvement. Is he going to be a longterm impact LT? I can't say for sure. But what I can say is that with more playing time he is getting better. It's simply the maturation process taking place. For some reason you strenuously resist that process working for Spiller. You want instant ingratification. It usually doesn't work out as quickly as one wants it to work out.

 

I'm confident that in the not too distant future Spiller is going to make a number of big plays. From what I have observed I have seen a greater discipline to his running style. In the few opportunities he has had this year he has produced. That's all you can ask of him.

 

At times it seems you are more invested in his failure in order to support your contention that he was a bad pick. There is no doubt that over the years the organization has made a regular habit of making bad early round picks. I'm very confident that in this case you are going to be proven very wrong that he won't develop into a very good and impactful player for us.

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Like you, I hope that CJ can contribute to this football team. As a matter of fact he threw a nice block on a touchdown pass on Sunday. That said, the chances of him even approaching what one would want from a #9 running back are remote at best. Do you think Nix is glad that he made this selection as we speak?

 

 

Well, I do think Spiller has a bit of an excuse so far this year. He's just not getting opportunities, which says less about how he's playing in this particular case, and instead more about Fred Jackson. Jackson is on pace to have about 2200 yards from scrimmage right now, and with production like that, its going to be difficult for anyone else to get on the field at that position, especially with the defense as bad as it is and the Bills being forced to pass more than run.

 

There's certainly a real possibility he will never live up to expectations, but under the current circumstances, I think its way too early to give up on him.

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[/font]

I'm not suggesting that the owner hasn't interfered in prior drafts but I'm confident that he wasn't involved in the two Nix drafts.

 

Wow.....OK. NGU said that Mr. Wilson has been known to interfere. I think that is almost a given. Did he interfere with the Spiller pick? Neither of us know. You are "confident" that he did not. I "suspect" that he did. I don't see a problem with this.

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[/font]

You originally wrote off Bell as a LT based on his early playing time. This year he seems to have taken a quantum leap in improvement. Is he going to be a longterm impact LT? I can't say for sure. But what I can say is that with more playing time he is getting better. It's simply the maturation process taking place. For some reason you strenuously resist that process working for Spiller. You want instant ingratification. It usually doesn't work out as quickly as one wants it to work out.

 

This year I have praised Bell week after week. The way things were handled wrt Bell were insane. The kid was green, hurt, smallish, and thrown to the wolves. Not a good place for an NFL team to be at the LT position, wouldn't you say?

There was never any question about his agility. Not ever. The question wrt Bell (imo) is whether or not he can get bigger and stronger, and stay healthy. And btw, he does look bigger and better this season.

 

Well, I do think Spiller has a bit of an excuse so far this year. He's just not getting opportunities, which says less about how he's playing in this particular case, and instead more about Fred Jackson. Jackson is on pace to have about 2200 yards from scrimmage right now, and with production like that, its going to be difficult for anyone else to get on the field at that position, especially with the defense as bad as it is and the Bills being forced to pass more than run.

 

There's certainly a real possibility he will never live up to expectations, but under the current circumstances, I think its way too early to give up on him.

 

He absolutely does have an excuse. Fred is tearing up the field. But it is inevitable that Fred will need to rest at some point. I hope that Spiller can make things happen when the time comes.

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Spiller has looked much improved in his limited touches this season. I've seen him wait for blocks, hit holes hard, and even run through initial contact. Most notably running through a tackle this past week.

 

Anyone knocking the pick needs to realize we are one freak injury away from losing the leading rusher. Spiller is developing.

 

Be happy, you can put the pitchforks down.

 

Go Bills!

Edited by DrDareustein
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poierre, pouncey, matthews, davis or Graham would have been better choices given our needs at the time. That is water under the dam. Spiller is what we have and hopefully he will be used to best optimize his talents.

 

 

Kind of my take...I am far from giving up on the kid like I was with Maybin who should have had "welcome" printed on the front of his jersey with how often guys ran over him. I never wish any of our players ill, but his hold-out coupled with nothing on the field made me feel much the same way as Wood when he said, "start earning all the money they're pay'n you".

 

 

Spiller tries hard, and is getting stronger, and to me appears to be adapting to the NFL game - for me the glass is half full with this pick and I am alright with waiting for him to develop behind Jackson.

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Guy is averaging like 8 yards per carry... give him a break.

 

Exactly. What are they going to sit Freddy? He is one of the top 3 running backs this season and is in the MVP conversation.

 

Hia best way to contribute this year was going to be on KR and PR with Roscoe out. The NFL took away his value as a kickoff returner.

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Yeah.....those 16 yards from scrimmage sure do legitimize using a #9 selection in an NFL draft on him! :thumbsup:

 

Seriously, CJ gets a ton of room because he was drafted so high. I understand this. Whitner had supporters til the end as well. Who really wants to face the ugly fact that the team we love so much wasted premium draft picks?

 

Like you, I hope that CJ can contribute to this football team. As a matter of fact he threw a nice block on a touchdown pass on Sunday. That said, the chances of him even approaching what one would want from a #9 running back are remote at best. Do you think Nix is glad that he made this selection as we speak?

 

We never, ever will know, but I will always suspect that this pick was mandateded by Mr. Wilson.

The only reason Spiller is not getting more touches or production is because we have Fred Jackson. If you were the coach, would you take Fred out to allow Spiller to produce more? I don't think so. He is a solid back and was a good pick, it's just that Nix and Gailey did not realize what they had in Fred Jackson. Now that they know, Spiller won't get much of a chance. Doesn't mean he doesn't have talent, just a case of wrong place, wrong time. Given a starting job, I have no doubt he would do just fine. I am glad we have him as insurance and to give Fred a breather now and then.

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Yeah.....those 16 yards from scrimmage sure do legitimize using a #9 selection in an NFL draft on him! :thumbsup:

 

Seriously, CJ gets a ton of room because he was drafted so high. I understand this. Whitner had supporters til the end as well. Who really wants to face the ugly fact that the team we love so much wasted premium draft picks?

 

Like you, I hope that CJ can contribute to this football team. As a matter of fact he threw a nice block on a touchdown pass on Sunday. That said, the chances of him even approaching what one would want from a #9 running back are remote at best. Do you think Nix is glad that he made this selection as we speak?

 

We never, ever will know, but I will always suspect that this pick was mandateded by Mr. Wilson.

Point me to anyone who says that Spiller has lived up to his draft pick.

 

You're reaching.

 

That being said... those of us who look at it minus the draft status see a lot to like in how he is running this year. Hopefully he builds on this and becomes productive once Jackson's skills start diminishing.

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