Is anyone else starting to feel the way I do about the NFL?

[Got_Wood]

The entire league, including the owners and players, are filled with greed. I mean, it's getting to the point where I can't stand these people. I've been a Bills fan, and football fan in general, for my entire life. And the league as it stands is threatening to take football away from the average fan, even if they decide to take the field this year. Ticket prices continue to rise (not so much in Buffalo as other cities), parking lot fees are expensive, stadiums seats are being replaced with luxury boxes, beer and food is unaffordable, etc etc. Players aren't as loyal to their teams anymore because they want the best paycheck they can find. Cities can't keep their stadiums anymore, because they don't have enough luxury seating, jumbo trons, or tourist attractions. And the average tax payer is expected to foot a good percentage of the bill for a new stadium to support the wealthy that the league wants attending these games.

 

If they think fans care about the billionaires vs. millionaires battle going on right now, they can stuff it.

 

I'd be pissed if there wasn't football this year, but it won't ruin my year by any means. These guys need a reality check. "Growth" has it's limits. And the NFL can't forget the fans that made the league what it is today. The average, blue collar, hard working man.

 

This article has some great insight into the current state of the league...

 

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/117500703.html

Edited March 9, 2011 by Got_Wood

[Pete]

I am with you. Football is almost unwatchable with all the commercials. I remember games used to start at 1:00 and would finish sometimes at 3:30. Now 1:00 games sometimes are on past 5, trying to squeeze every advertising $ they can. I didn't go to a live football game for years then went to a Sunday night game- and could not believe how much the players stood around during tv timeouts.

 

Money is the ruiner of all things good

[Captain Hindsight]

I am with you. Football is almost unwatchable with all the commercials. I remember games used to start at 1:00 and would finish sometimes at 3:30. Now 1:00 games sometimes are on past 5, trying to squeeze every advertising $ they can. I didn't go to a live football game for years then went to a Sunday night game- and could not believe how much the players stood around during tv timeouts.

 

Money is the ruiner of all things good

I have seasons and i remember my first game wondering why they stood around so much. Its silly really but what can you do? They know they have a great product

[....lybob]

Almost every facet of life has been financialized, sports is just an obvious example.

[Pete]

Me and my friends would always talk about how cool it would be if we could organize fans and have a fan union. And if we could cooridinate with NFL fans all across the country- we could all not go into the stadium until the second quarter. Wow. What a statement that would be! In the age of the internet that makes it possible. I would love to see fans stand up to owners and corporations and be noticed. !@#$ greed and !@#$ greedy people

 

Almost every facet of life has been financialized, sports is just an obvious example.

Money is the ruiner of all things good

[Got_Wood]

Its silly really but what can you do? They know they have a great product

 

They have a great product that is deteriorating the more they allow commercial interests to taint the fabric of what makes football great. It's a tough mans game, an endurance game, and a display of sheer athleticism. We still have great athletes, but their increasingly more worried about not getting injured. And the endurance part of the game is gone. This may come as a shock to some of you... but the average NFL game has 11 MINUTES OF ACTION. See this article in the WSJ as evidence. So that 3 1/2 hours of game we're watching is filled with timeouts, commercial breaks, and running clock.

[Captain Hindsight]

Me and my friends would always talk about how cool it would be if we could organize fans and have a fan union. And if we could cooridinate with NFL fans all across the country- we could all not go into the stadium until the second quarter. Wow. What a statement that would be! In the age of the internet that makes it possible. I would love to see fans stand up to owners and corporations and be noticed. !@#$ greed and !@#$ greedy people

 

The US is becoming an oligarchy sadly. The only thing that will change the world now is a group of fed up pissed off people that can't be bought off. I'm just not sure people cant be bought off

[Ramius]

I am with you. Football is almost unwatchable with all the commercials. I remember games used to start at 1:00 and would finish sometimes at 3:30. Now 1:00 games sometimes are on past 5, trying to squeeze every advertising $ they can. I didn't go to a live football game for years then went to a Sunday night game- and could not believe how much the players stood around during tv timeouts.

 

Money is the ruiner of all things good

 

while i agree with a lot of what you said, i've never seen a 1pm start time game last until after 5, unless it goes deep into OT. The latest i've ever seen a regulation game finish was about 4:20pm.

[Direhard Fan]

It's unreal how long the breaks are in a game. I used to think the Ref called the time outs. Not so. It's a guy down the side line with bright gloves on working for the network who calls the time outs by signaling the Ref. The Ref is always watching that guy. Ever notice when you try to switch to the other game it has the same commercial on. Its the networks who pay the big bucks and call all the shots.

[dwight in philly]

I am with you. Football is almost unwatchable with all the commercials. I remember games used to start at 1:00 and would finish sometimes at 3:30. Now 1:00 games sometimes are on past 5, trying to squeeze every advertising $ they can. I didn't go to a live football game for years then went to a Sunday night game- and could not believe how much the players stood around during tv timeouts.

 

Money is the ruiner of all things good

i have been saying that for years. the NFL has become the "mtv" of sports. hate the pre-game shows also. i am old enough to remember the half-hour pre-game shows that focused entirely on the game or games to be played. now we watch michael irvin interview T O. Who, with half a brain, gives a sh-t about what T O thinks. the whole game is very much a "me" spectacle. the chest thumping after a routine tackle, etc. i will still watch, just not happy where the game has gone.

Edited March 9, 2011 by dwight in philly

[reddogblitz]

I see the whole thing as selfish greed.

 

There are a lot of Joe Schmucks out there that's income at least in part depends on the NFL. Most concession stands at NFL stadiums are now run by charities to raise money. Hotels, vendors, suppliers are all hurt if there is a lockout/strike. The guy that sells detergent to the teams to wash socks and jocks will feel it if there's a lockout.

 

My father was a commission printing salesman in Dallas and sold to the Cowboys. In the strike year he didn't get paid for the games that were canceled. In college I worked for a small time tortilla manufacturer that sold nacho chips to Texas Stadium. When the games were canceled they felt it big time.

 

During the last strike I saw school teachers picketing in support of the players union. What are those players doing now that unions are under attack to lose collective bargaining rights in some states that have NFL teams? Sorry, they're too busy trying to get more millions.

 

I don't care which side wins, they're both greedy selfish knuckleheads who need to have their head banged together.

 

Appears to me anyway, that the players don't care about the fans. If all the little guys who help make NFL football what it is are hurt, tough beans.

[The Cincinnati Kid]

I love football, and I love it at the highest level. I think that there are many people like me who will continue to front the Money despite the NFL. A second league that could compete with the NFL in the Spring would be the best way to combat the NFL. A league like the USFL. It will scare the NFL especially if they start getting players like the USFL did. Thats the only way.

[PromoTheRobot]

The Bills are the only reason I care about the NFL. No Bills and the NFL no longer exists to me.

 

PTR

[Guest three3]

it's practically wrestling..how about player weight limits

[BUFFALOKIE]

Me and my friends would always talk about how cool it would be if we could organize fans and have a fan union. And if we could cooridinate with NFL fans all across the country- we could all not go into the stadium until the second quarter. Wow. What a statement that would be! In the age of the internet that makes it possible. I would love to see fans stand up to owners and corporations and be noticed. !@#$ greed and !@#$ greedy people

 

 

Money is the ruiner of all things good

 

I'm in.

 

I suggest beginning a new thread to state your goal and solicit a boycott for the first quarter. If it is met with support on this board, step it up a notch and take it to other team message boards. Before you know it PFT will catch wind of it and it will make MSNBC.

 

If Facebook can be used to overthrow governments, then surely the lil ol NFL will hear us too?

Edited March 9, 2011 by Buffalokie

[Acantha]

Me and my friends would always talk about how cool it would be if we could organize fans and have a fan union. And if we could cooridinate with NFL fans all across the country- we could all not go into the stadium until the second quarter. Wow. What a statement that would be! In the age of the internet that makes it possible. I would love to see fans stand up to owners and corporations and be noticed. !@#$ greed and !@#$ greedy people

I don't get it. You'd pay for a full game, pay parking, pay for 3 quarters of concessions, and that's supposed to teach someone a lesson? Why pay all that money and lose out on watching the whole game? Doesn't that really hurt the fan more than anything else?

 

I could see if the idea was to boycott one game a year...only season ticket holders show up.

 

Edit: I'll add that in order for this to really make any difference, it would have to be done at home as well. Everyone shuts their TV's off, nobody goes to sports bars, etc...

Actually, using the first quarter boycott for television would work FAR better. I still don't think it would do much, but it would be better than the stadium.

Edited March 9, 2011 by Faustus

[Buftex]

I love football, and I love it at the highest level. I think that there are many people like me who will continue to front the Money despite the NFL. A second league that could compete with the NFL in the Spring would be the best way to combat the NFL. A league like the USFL. It will scare the NFL especially if they start getting players like the USFL did. Thats the only way.

 

 

Sounds good on paper, but it didn't work for the USFL, or the WFL before it.

 

Only the AFL, in the 60's had any success...the market for pro-football was more open then. There were still plenty of un-tapped markets back then, and the AFL helped itself by crossing the color/race line that still existed in 1960.

 

The NFL is pretty much at the saturation point, IMO. How many markets in America could sustain a pro-team, that lured away top NFL and college talent?

 

What I mean is, if, say, the Raleigh-Durham Devils, of some competing league, drafted Cam Newton, and another franchise lured Drew Brees to sign with them, all of the sudden, ticket prices start going up...it isn't Arena leauge, where you can take a family of 5 to a game for $50...the NFL has the market tied up. You either have pro-football, NFL style, or college football...also, to start a new leauge to compete with the big boys, you would need 8-12 wealthy men or women, who don't mind losing a bunch of money...while the USFL made some strides, in the end, guys like Trump ruined it. Deep down, they just wanted to be invited to sit at the big kids table of the NFL.

 

I love football. I don't really follow college ball all that closely. Sure, I still watch a college game (or at least part) almost every week...but, I want to see the very best compete...not just a bunch of guys playing a game. I don't want to see Jim Kelly or Steve Young breaking every pro-football passing record, against guys who are no longer eligible for college football, and not talented enough to make an NFL roster. It would take so much time, and money, for a competing league to succeed. I just don't think there is enough of either.

Edited March 9, 2011 by Buftex

[Mr. WEO]

 

I'd be pissed if there wasn't football this year, but it won't ruin my year by any means. These guys need a reality check. "Growth" has it's limits. And the NFL can't forget the fans that made the league what it is today. The average, blue collar, hard working man.

 

The average blue-collar fan gets his football for free--on TV, just like over 90% of every teams fan base does. It was free decades ago and still is. Not much "growth" in free.

 

Also, the majority of stadium concessions are run by large catering corporations or chain restaurants.

 

 

 

Me and my friends would always talk about how cool it would be if we could organize fans and have a fan union. And if we could cooridinate with NFL fans all across the country- we could all not go into the stadium until the second quarter. Wow. What a statement that would be! In the age of the internet that makes it possible. I would love to see fans stand up to owners and corporations and be noticed. !@#$ greed and !@#$ greedy people

 

 

Like LA fans!

 

It's unreal how long the breaks are in a game. I used to think the Ref called the time outs. Not so. It's a guy down the side line with bright gloves on working for the network who calls the time outs by signaling the Ref. The Ref is always watching that guy. Ever notice when you try to switch to the other game it has the same commercial on. Its the networks who pay the big bucks and call all the shots.

 

You just noticed this?

 

"TV time outs" have been around in the NFL, NCAA Football, NBA, etc...for many years, so it's not quite as wildly incredible as your descripiton paints this regular telecast function. The network is guaranteed 20 commercial breaks throughout a game. 10 in each half. The vast majority of these come during necessary stoppages in play--injury, TD, FG, turnover, end of quarter, two minute warning and during replay.

 

 

 

I love football, and I love it at the highest level. I think that there are many people like me who will continue to front the Money despite the NFL. A second league that could compete with the NFL in the Spring would be the best way to combat the NFL. A league like the USFL. It will scare the NFL especially if they start getting players like the USFL did. Thats the only way.

 

Go ahead and start that league. Find the poster who claimed there are "billionaires lining up" to buy NFL teams". Or, better yet, team up with the above posters and redirect your money towards a league of Green Bay-type "fan owned" teams". Let us know how it goes.

[el Tigre]

I have lost most of my enthusiasm for the NFL over the past few years as well,for all of the reasons the OP stated and more. It is such a cookie cutter league. You can turn on a game on Sunday and if it weren't for the uniforms being different,you wouldn't be able to tell one team from another. With few exceptions,all the stadiums are the same,they all run similar offensive and defensive systems and the players are just mercenaries playing for a paycheck.Not that I blame them,they are professionals and are just looking out for their best interests.I would do the same. For me college football is where it's at. After watching college ball all day Saturday,NFL Sundays are boring in comparison.

[Buftex]

I have lost most of my enthusiasm for the NFL over the past few years as well,for all of the reasons the OP stated and more. It is such a cookie cutter league. You can turn on a game on Sunday and if it weren't for the uniforms being different,you wouldn't be able to tell one team from another. With few exceptions,all the stadiums are the same,they all run similar offensive and defensive systems and the players are just mercenaries playing for a paycheck.Not that I blame them,they are professionals and are just looking out for their best interests.I would do the same. For me college football is where it's at. After watching college ball all day Saturday,NFL Sundays are boring in comparison.

 

 

I agree, on a certain level...but for me, the disparity between talent levels in college football make it far less interesting than the NFL.

[Wagon Circler]

I blame Obama.

Edited March 9, 2011 by Why Not Levi

[Pete]

The Bills are the only reason I care about the NFL. No Bills and the NFL no longer exists to me.

 

PTR

same here. The day the Bills leave Buffalo is the day I stop watching football.

 

The sad thing is I think the skill level of the NFL is at an all time high right now. The product might be the highest quality ever. But like we have reiterated the commercials are killing the game. Sports like hockey or soccer have such great flow and are fun to watch. The NFL has had an MTV makeover. There is no flow and I couldn't care less about TO's tweets. And please spare me the big half time show. I go to games to watch football

[reddogblitz]

But like we have reiterated the commercials are killing the game.

I've solved this problem. I TIVO the game and start watching it about an hour after the game starts. I catch up late in the 4th Quarter. I can watch the whole game in an hour's less time AND not have to watch commercials or blathering at 1/2 time.

[Pete]

I've solved this problem. I TIVO the game and start watching it about an hour after the game starts. I catch up late in the 4th Quarter. I can watch the whole game in an hour's less time AND not have to watch commercials or blathering at 1/2 time.

Tivo is good for that. What do you do if you are watching a game live?

[Got_Wood]

Ok, I'm glad I started this thread. Clearly this is the way many fans think out there.

 

Soon enough the NFL will need to start thinking about how they can make watching football entertaining, while still affordable. Not just issuing threats like blackouts for games that aren't sold out. Eventually the growth becomes unsustainable.

[Drifter]

I have to agree with the flow of the game being ruined. After a team scores I go and get some things done around the house. There are 2 minutes of commercials after the extra point, a kick off for 10 seconds then another 2-3 minutes of commercials. In a high scoring game I can get a lot accomplished.

 

The price of the Sunday ticket has made me finally end the automatic renewal after 10 years. I'm anticipating the price to go up like it has every year and it has reached that point of not being worth it. I'll wait and see the edited game during the week on NFL network.

[DC Tom]

I don't get it. You'd pay for a full game, pay parking, pay for 3 quarters of concessions, and that's supposed to teach someone a lesson? Why pay all that money and lose out on watching the whole game? Doesn't that really hurt the fan more than anything else?

 

I could see if the idea was to boycott one game a year...only season ticket holders show up.

 

Edit: I'll add that in order for this to really make any difference, it would have to be done at home as well. Everyone shuts their TV's off, nobody goes to sports bars, etc...

Actually, using the first quarter boycott for television would work FAR better. I still don't think it would do much, but it would be better than the stadium.

 

Thank you. I was just going to point out all the same things.

 

Particularly about the TV boycott...the league cares more about its advertising revenue than it does the gate revenue. 16 empty stadiums for a single quarter will have nowhere near the impact of a single letter from the CEO of Moslon-Coors.

[JPicc2114]

The entire league, including the owners and players, are filled with greed. I mean, it's getting to the point where I can't stand these people. I've been a Bills fan, and football fan in general, for my entire life. And the league as it stands is threatening to take football away from the average fan, even if they decide to take the field this year. Ticket prices continue to rise (not so much in Buffalo as other cities), parking lot fees are expensive, stadiums seats are being replaced with luxury boxes, beer and food is unaffordable, etc etc. Players aren't as loyal to their teams anymore because they want the best paycheck they can find. Cities can't keep their stadiums anymore, because they don't have enough luxury seating, jumbo trons, or tourist attractions. And the average tax payer is expected to foot a good percentage of the bill for a new stadium to support the wealthy that the league wants attending these games.

 

If they think fans care about the billionaires vs. millionaires battle going on right now, they can stuff it.

 

I'd be pissed if there wasn't football this year, but it won't ruin my year by any means. These guys need a reality check. "Growth" has it's limits. And the NFL can't forget the fans that made the league what it is today. The average, blue collar, hard working man.

 

This article has some great insight into the current state of the league...

 

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/117500703.html

 

 

Yet, we the fan are willing to dish it out... whos fault is it really?

[RTW2012]

I am with you. Football is almost unwatchable with all the commercials. I remember games used to start at 1:00 and would finish sometimes at 3:30. Now 1:00 games sometimes are on past 5, trying to squeeze every advertising $ they can. I didn't go to a live football game for years then went to a Sunday night game- and could not believe how much the players stood around during tv timeouts.

 

Money is the ruiner of all things good

 

You must be thinking of baseball. I don't ever remember 2.5 hour games (possibly pre-1980, if you go back that far), and 1pm games today rarely hit 4:30pm (with OT), let alone 5pm.

 

Getting rid of all public subsidies for every team would be a start.

Edited March 9, 2011 by mobywale

[C.Biscuit97]

Football players are gladiators in an arena that generates billions. They deserve every cent they get. Hopefully, the greedy owners don't kill the golden goose.

[CodeMonkey]

The Bills are the only reason I care about the NFL. No Bills and the NFL no longer exists to me.

 

PTR

This is absolutely the case for me as well.

I watch very few non-Bills games. And when I do, the only way I can tolerate it is I have software to record shows and strip out the commercials. It doesn't kill all the wasted time between plays etc., but just no commercials makes the game significantly more watchable.

[The Cincinnati Kid]

Like many other posters, I agree that the Bills are it for me. I am such a die-hard bills fan that if they did leave, I just couldn't root for another team. If the current players went with the Bills to the new city, I could watch till most of them left, but after that, the disconnect would be too large. I could never root for the Jets, Patriots, Steelers or Browns who would likely fill the Regional Action on CBS or Fox. It just wouldn't be the same. I guess I would just cheer on Penn State on Saturdays, or not really watch at all. Its a sad thought, but its probably what would happen for me if the Bills left Buffalo. I hope that never happens because watching the Bills on Sundays is often what gets me to either shake a hangover or have another...usually both.

[gizmo6824]

The entire league, including the owners and players, are filled with greed. I mean, it's getting to the point where I can't stand these people. I've been a Bills fan, and football fan in general, for my entire life. And the league as it stands is threatening to take football away from the average fan, even if they decide to take the field this year. Ticket prices continue to rise (not so much in Buffalo as other cities), parking lot fees are expensive, stadiums seats are being replaced with luxury boxes, beer and food is unaffordable, etc etc. Players aren't as loyal to their teams anymore because they want the best paycheck they can find. Cities can't keep their stadiums anymore, because they don't have enough luxury seating, jumbo trons, or tourist attractions. And the average tax payer is expected to foot a good percentage of the bill for a new stadium to support the wealthy that the league wants attending these games.

 

If they think fans care about the billionaires vs. millionaires battle going on right now, they can stuff it.

 

I'd be pissed if there wasn't football this year, but it won't ruin my year by any means. These guys need a reality check. "Growth" has it's limits. And the NFL can't forget the fans that made the league what it is today. The average, blue collar, hard working man.

 

This article has some great insight into the current state of the league...

 

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/117500703.html

I think we as fans should wait till the new cba is signed, wait until the first game of the regular season and then run a lock out of our own. no one attend the first game. Let then loose millions in one shot and see how it feels to want. just a thought. not that any of the fans out there would actually do it.

[machinegun12]

The Bills are the only reason I care about the NFL. No Bills and the NFL no longer exists to me.

 

PTR

I am 100% with you on this. My brother (a Lions fan) was joking with me one time about if the Bills were to leave Buffalo if I would start rooting for Detroit. It really put it in perspective for me...I am a BILLS fan, not an NFL fan. I could care less what happens to the game if Buffalo were no longer in the picture. My fall Sundays would probably become productive.

Edited March 9, 2011 by machinegun12

[bills1960]

Definitely. especially as Bills fan we realize that all the league cares about is money. Market size and money. Its sad cuz it hasnt always been this way.

[Got_Wood]

Thank you. I was just going to point out all the same things.

 

Particularly about the TV boycott...the league cares more about its advertising revenue than it does the gate revenue. 16 empty stadiums for a single quarter will have nowhere near the impact of a single letter from the CEO of Moslon-Coors.

 

I agree with this. A TV boycott would be huge, but hard to organize such a massive "fan blackout". But I'd love to shove our own blackout back in their face.

Edited March 10, 2011 by Got_Wood

[Billsguy]

I am with you. Football is almost unwatchable with all the commercials. I remember games used to start at 1:00 and would finish sometimes at 3:30. Now 1:00 games sometimes are on past 5, trying to squeeze every advertising $ they can. I didn't go to a live football game for years then went to a Sunday night game- and could not believe how much the players stood around during tv timeouts.

 

Money is the ruiner of all things good

 

If it wasn't for my DVR, football would be totally unwatchable. I can watch a recorded game in about an hour and I don't have to see or listen to commercials or insufferable commentators like Dan Dierdorf or Steve Tasker.

[ajzepp]

I agree, on a certain level...but for me, the disparity between talent levels in college football make it far less interesting than the NFL.

 

That's why I have fallen in love with SEC football. There are powerhouse programs scattered all around the country, but the SEC is easily the most competitive AND strongest conference in college ball. Both the east and west divisions are competitive, and a large proportion of the nations best players can be found here. I feel like I got dropped into football mecca and went from being a very casual observer of the game to an honest to goodness FAN of college football. I only wish that Lane Kiffin would have stayed at Tennessee...the way he was talking crap was really entertaining to me. I was loving when he was calling out Urban Meyer and damn near beating Florida with a far less talented squad. Hell, I even paid attention to the draft classes this season, which was a first. I already know like ten of the incoming freshman for the 'dawgs next season...that was unfathomable for me before I moved down here to Atlanta.

 

As for the NFL, I am a bit more tolerant of their greed since on any given day you can go from an all-star to a cripple in the blink of an eye. These guys' bodies truly take a pounding, and I think they deserve what they are paid. I don't agree with rooks getting to break the bank before even playing a single down, but I think the vets deserve what they get. That being said, they need to get this CBA done and overwith so that we can get back to football.

[Chef Jim]

Let me put it this way. My Sunday's have been open for a few years now but it has very little to do with greed. A wise man once said "greed is good." I just can't stand how slow the game moves. Yup for the "action" sport that it is there sure is a lot of down time and yabbering by two or three guys I'd rather not listen to. I read someplace that the average NFL game has 11 minutes of action. 11 !@#$ing minutes!!

 

I prefer hockey with lots of non-stop action and baseball that was never intended to be action packed. The NFL may not be dead to me but it's on life support and the family is gathering bedside.

[jester43]

same here. The day the Bills leave Buffalo is the day I stop watching football.

 

The sad thing is I think the skill level of the NFL is at an all time high right now. The product might be the highest quality ever. But like we have reiterated the commercials are killing the game. Sports like hockey or soccer have such great flow and are fun to watch. The NFL has had an MTV makeover. There is no flow and I couldn't care less about TO's tweets. And please spare me the big half time show. I go to games to watch football

the way they broadcast sports in this country is destroying my interest also. the commercials just drive me insane. i love watching pro rugby for that reason...no interruptions.