Catch-22: Support a losing team or lose the franchise altogether?

[ndirish1978]

It seems we as Buffalo fans are being held hostage by the owner. Why? This is what most people on the board here have expressed.

 

1- Fans cannot revolt. If fans stop buying merchandise and going to games, the team may be sold and moved somewhere else. So,

2- In order to keep our team here, albeit a festering turd of a team with a terrible FO and a roster that is 70% putrid, we are stuck supporting Ralph's losing formula until he kicks the bucket. At which time we may or may not lose the team after all.

 

The question is, what do fans do? I love the Bills, but this has been the first season I have not been able to stomach watching every game in full. I'm not supporting the franchise anymore by buying merchandise or tickets to show my displeasure at this teams, direction. This, is the only real voice I have and 1 person removing their patronage means little. But, if I suggested others stop doing so as well then I am a "bad fan" who hates the team. I have been a Bills fan for years. Like everyone else, I wish there was some way to convey to our owner that he needs to either sell the team, or make wholesale changes. But it looks like that will never happen.

 

So the question is. How do we as fans get through to the organization that we're not "buying" their bs? Are the 2 options above all we have?

Edited October 3, 2010 by ndirish1978

[DarthICE]

Honestly, quit being wimps. Ralph isn't going to sell nor will the team move for quite some time. So grow a pair and boycott

[bills1960]

Honestly, quit being wimps. Ralph isn't going to sell nor will the team move for quite some time. So grow a pair and boycott

+1. we're not moving. People use that as an excuse for the Bills awful products but the truth is we make money but Ralph chooses to lose over spending money. The fans need to do something to stress that this losing has become unacceptable.

[PromoTheRobot]

Dream on. The vultures are already circling the Bills waiting for Ralph to crump. If you think the Bills aren't leaving Buffalo then I'd like to offer an ownership stake in the Peace Bridge.

 

I'm not saying supporting the team will keep them here, but not supporting the team gives the NFL every excuse to take our team away.

 

PTR

[Dr. Trooth]

Honestly, quit being wimps. Ralph isn't going to sell nor will the team move for quite some time. So grow a pair and boycott

 

I agree. It's time to put up or shut up. If I had season tickets (I'm not that stupid)...

 

1) I would be too embarrassed to admit it

2) I'd burn them

3) Mr. Wilson should be indicted for gend theft for ripping off the fans

 

Buffalo may have a team in the NFL, but they sure as hell don't have an NFL quality team. They are not only an embarrassment to Buffalo and Western New York, they are an embarrassment to professional football. If I were the commissioner I'd fine the Bills for "conduct detrimental to the league".

 

Pay for tickets to bear witness to crap? They ought to pay fans to watch such trash.

[Helpmenow]

Don't support the owner. Being a bills fan is a living hell.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Being a bills fan is a living hell.

 

Word.

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

The sad thing is that I bet right after the team moves to LA, they win a Super Bowl. Such is the bad luck of being a fan of this team.

[KD in CA]

There is no way to know who might buy the team or what that person(s) or group's motivation will be, so there is no way to know what will happen when the team is sold.

 

The only sure thing is that the Bills will be the worst franchise in the NFL until the team is no longer owned by Ralph Wilson.

[Kelly2Reed]

Honestly, quit being wimps. Ralph isn't going to sell nor will the team move for quite some time. So grow a pair and boycott

 

 

 

I'd love to see an organized exodus from the stadium right before halftime. Do it to make a statement as fans during one game. It won't

impact Ralphie boy financially if it's done for just one game. It will, or it should embarass him as an owner. DO IT

[notwoz]

I'd love to see an organized exodus from the stadium right before halftime. Do it to make a statement as fans during one game. It won't

impact Ralphie boy financially if it's done for just one game. It will, or it should embarass him as an owner. DO IT

I think Ralph Wilson is beyond embarrassment.

[BillsfaninFl]

Dream on. The vultures are already circling the Bills waiting for Ralph to crump. If you think the Bills aren't leaving Buffalo then I'd like to offer an ownership stake in the Peace Bridge.

 

I'm not saying supporting the team will keep them here, but not supporting the team gives the NFL every excuse to take our team away.

 

PTR

 

The NFL needs no excuse to take the team away. That is a falacy. They can already point to a diminishing small market that has lost a significant amount of corporate presence. So not supporting the team does nothing that doesn't already exist. Furthermore, Wilson wouldn't move the team now, even if he could, because it is expensive up front and the payback comes over a period of several years. He may not have several years and there is no reason for him to kill the cash cow by investing additional money into it. For eleven years he has refused to invest any more into it than he has to.

 

The fans don't realize they DO have some power. And Wilson has been trying his darndest to keep us from realizing it. It's time to wake up and take a stand.

[Helpmenow]

The see the gate receipts after the games and laugh. The Bills know the fans will fill the place.

[sweet baboo]

take the team, i've suffered enough

[billsfan_34]

It seems we as Buffalo fans are being held hostage by the owner. Why? This is what most people on the board here have expressed.

 

1- Fans cannot revolt. If fans stop buying merchandise and going to games, the team may be sold and moved somewhere else. So,

2- In order to keep our team here, albeit a festering turd of a team with a terrible FO and a roster that is 70% putrid, we are stuck supporting Ralph's losing formula until he kicks the bucket. At which time we may or may not lose the team after all.

 

The question is, what do fans do? I love the Bills, but this has been the first season I have not been able to stomach watching every game in full. I'm not supporting the franchise anymore by buying merchandise or tickets to show my displeasure at this teams, direction. This, is the only real voice I have and 1 person removing their patronage means little. But, if I suggested others stop doing so as well then I am a "bad fan" who hates the team. I have been a Bills fan for years. Like everyone else, I wish there was some way to convey to our owner that he needs to either sell the team, or make wholesale changes. But it looks like that will never happen.

 

So the question is. How do we as fans get through to the organization that we're not "buying" their bs? Are the 2 options above all we have?

The NFL owners treat it as a business...the players treat it as a business...fans now have to treat it as a business and not go or buy crap from Ralphy boy. If they leave...who cares anymore. My life will go on.

[TheChimp]

The sad thing is that I bet right after the team moves to LA, they win a Super Bowl. Such is the bad luck of being a fan of this team.

Yeah and just like when the Raiders were there, nobody in LA would give a ****.

[papazoid]

ever hear: "Cutting off the nose to spite the face" ?

 

it's an expression used to describe a needlessly self-destructive over-reaction to a problem.

 

sellouts are the ONLY thing that will keep this team in buffalo. especially when this franchise has a new owner. if keeping our Bills isn't the single most important thing, then you are either not a fan or dumb.

 

now if your talking about buying tickets but NOT showing up?.....maybe, but most folks around here are not in a financial position to just throw money away (yea yea, i know, you already are)so that isn't going to work either.

 

figure out some other way to show your disatisfaction....start a petition, if your a season ticket holder send a letter. but understand one thing.....the only excuse a new owner can use to move this franchise is poor attendance.

[ndirish1978]

The NFL owners treat it as a business...the players treat it as a business...fans now have to treat it as a business and not go or buy crap from Ralphy boy. If they leave...who cares anymore. My life will go on.

 

 

ever hear: "Cutting off the nose to spite the face" ?

 

it's an expression used to describe a needlessly self-destructive over-reaction to a problem.

 

sellouts are the ONLY thing that will keep this team in buffalo. especially when this franchise has a new owner. if keeping our Bills isn't the single most important thing, then you are either not a fan or dumb.

 

now if your talking about buying tickets but NOT showing up?.....maybe, but most folks around here are not in a financial position to just throw money away (yea yea, i know, you already are)so that isn't going to work either.

 

figure out some other way to show your disatisfaction....start a petition, if your a season ticket holder send a letter. but understand one thing.....the only excuse a new owner can use to move this franchise is poor attendance.

 

I agree with bf34. Papa's comment is typical of way too many people on this board... "but we will lose the team!" Wake up! This team will or will not be sold when Ralph Wilson dies and not before. Something HAS to be done to bring a change to the organization. I did like the idea of staging a mass walk-out. Empty seats show a lack of interest in a team, while a walkout is an intentional protest.

[Cory]

I'm not sure what a boycott really proves. Would it be to let the front office know the fans aren't happy? I'm sure they know. There's only so much that can be done. The hole is deep. No amount of money could bring a higher profile coach and you bringing in "blue chip" players won't help if there are too many holes to fill around them. Face it, we're at the bottom. Every team sees it at some point. I for one will continue to support them right till the very end. "In Ralph/Buddy/Russ/Chan We Trust"...

[clearwater cadet]

Dream on. The vultures are already circling the Bills waiting for Ralph to crump. If you think the Bills aren't leaving Buffalo then I'd like to offer an ownership stake in the Peace Bridge.

 

I'm not saying supporting the team will keep them here, but not supporting the team gives the NFL every excuse to take our team away.

 

PTR

 

agree 110%, a day of losing football, is hell of a lot better then no football.

[bowery4]

God, this really is the 60s all over again, at least the county is not building him a stadium this time. A protest happened today when everyone left during that crap 3rd quarter. The seats were less than 50% filled and by the 4th you could hear the players talking on the field from the sideline mics. If RW isn't embarrassed by today the guy really has no pulse left already. I lost all my optimistic outlook today.

 

SELL THE TEAM RW, Jim says he has the new owners lined up take him to task, PLEASE!!!!!!! Complete your legacy in a good way, give the fans some hope, we deserve it for supporting you and your product. Give us something to really believe.

[RyanC883]

The sad thing is that I bet right after the team moves to LA, they win a Super Bowl. Such is the bad luck of being a fan of this team.

 

 

I bet this happens. Like when the Browns moved to Balt. and won the Super Bowl. But what are the odds Buffalo gets a new team if the Bills leave town???

[Drew026]

so what happens when we have this walkout during a game. Ralph is gonna fire the coach? We're gonna get a new GM? All of that will be real appealing for coaches to want to come here

[Thurman#1]

Honestly, quit being wimps. Ralph isn't going to sell nor will the team move for quite some time. So grow a pair and boycott

 

 

Yeah, if many fans do, we would love the new, competent, talented Los Angeles Bills.

 

They're already making wholesale changes. New GM, new coach, rebuild. The first year of a rebuild always sucks. Don't complain when you get what you want.

[BillsInMaine]

its time to brown bag these horrible games.

[Meathead]

Dream on. The vultures are already circling the Bills waiting for Ralph to crump. If you think the Bills aren't leaving Buffalo then I'd like to offer an ownership stake in the Peace Bridge.

 

I'm not saying supporting the team will keep them here, but not supporting the team gives the NFL every excuse to take our team away.

listen up

 

this is just the reality here

 

if you do not support the team it will leave. support is the only thing keeping it here

 

boycott if you want but think about how it will be when there is no team. boycotting will feel good for a few days or weeks. no team might be forever

 

teams eventually get good again. some teams more than others. but you cant enjoy those years if they dont exist

[Omar Little]

agree 110%, a day of losing football, is hell of a lot better then no football.

 

This is not ordinary losing football. This is embarrassing, dull, vomit-inducing football. I'd take no football over that any day; hence the reason I stopped watching in the second quarter and moved on to other things.

[Spiderweb]

Yeah, if many fans do, we would love the new, competent, talented Los Angeles Bills.

 

They're already making wholesale changes. New GM, new coach, rebuild. The first year of a rebuild always sucks. Don't complain when you get what you want.

 

This year kinda reminds me of 2001. The beginning of the Tom Donahoe era, with Greg Williams who promised us an energetic, aggressive defense and team, only to give us crap. New regimes having to rebuild do frequently have rough beginnings.

 

With this said though, it only makes the extension of Kelsay that much more perplexing. Why drag known mediocrity along with you through the process? An undrafted FA could be playing better than him.

[NaPolian8693]

It's not so much that these fans are afraid of losing the team, it's more that they actually like the losing.

 

There is a certain charm to the lovable loser identity, after all.

 

Aww, those crazy Bills! How many different heartbreaking ways can they lose? How will they mess it up this time? They'll always give you a run for your money on a snowy December day up in Buffalo, though!

[Thurman#1]

I agree with bf34. Papa's comment is typical of way too many people on this board... "but we will lose the team!" Wake up! This team will or will not be sold when Ralph Wilson dies and not before. Something HAS to be done to bring a change to the organization. I did like the idea of staging a mass walk-out. Empty seats show a lack of interest in a team, while a walkout is an intentional protest.

 

 

 

Just not true. A lot of the reason Mr. Wilson has kept the team in Buffalo is that he has felt the care and concern and love this community genuinely has for the Bills. Mr. Wilson could probably double the value of the team (well, increase it by 30 - 50%, anyway, by moving to a bigger market.

 

He has stayed here so far. That doesn't mean he will feel an obligation to do so if fans don't support the team. In fact, he won't feel any obligation. I wouldn't. You wouldn't. Why should he? Don't kid yourself that we have some kind of right to this team until he passes away. We don't.

 

It's not so much that these fans are afraid of losing the team, it's more that they actually like the losing.

 

There is a certain charm to the lovable loser identity, after all.

 

Aww, those crazy Bills! How many different heartbreaking ways can they lose? How will they mess it up this time? They'll always give you a run for your money on a snowy December day up in Buffalo, though!

 

 

I don't think you'll find a single fan who would rather lose than win. Sure, there's a bit of a kick to the lovable loser feeling, but that's just because we only have two choices right now, deal with being losers in a positive way or deal with being losers in a negative way. Positive feels better. But nobody here's confused about the fact that winning would be much much better.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

ever hear: "Cutting off the nose to spite the face" ?

 

it's an expression used to describe a needlessly self-destructive over-reaction to a problem.

 

sellouts are the ONLY thing that will keep this team in buffalo. especially when this franchise has a new owner. if keeping our Bills isn't the single most important thing, then you are either not a fan or dumb.

 

now if your talking about buying tickets but NOT showing up?.....maybe, but most folks around here are not in a financial position to just throw money away (yea yea, i know, you already are)so that isn't going to work either.

 

figure out some other way to show your disatisfaction....start a petition, if your a season ticket holder send a letter. but understand one thing.....the only excuse a new owner can use to move this franchise is poor attendance.

 

Good, take them. Take thema nd their horrid play elsewhere and let someone else deal with the nonagenarian and his trusted advisors.

[ExiledInIllinois]

I'm not sure what a boycott really proves. Would it be to let the front office know the fans aren't happy? I'm sure they know. There's only so much that can be done. The hole is deep. No amount of money could bring a higher profile coach and you bringing in "blue chip" players won't help if there are too many holes to fill around them. Face it, we're at the bottom. Every team sees it at some point. I for one will continue to support them right till the very end. "In Ralph/Buddy/Russ/Chan We Trust"...

 

Thank you salary cap! BFLO was doing just fine in the old system with a good businessman like Ralph. Everybody in favor screams this or that about the salary cap and how it will help small markets. BS. Everybody sees what is happening to the NFL, it is becoming a games for the "elites" in our culture.

 

Good, take them. Take thema nd their horrid play elsewhere and let someone else deal with the nonagenarian and his trusted advisors.

 

Trust me, they won't (move)... BFLO is good business in a very poor economy.

 

I don't care if BFLO loses. What is funny to see is a team like Dallas crash and burn after spending all that dough on a new stadium. Enjoy your PSL's other fans!

[EasternOHBillsFan]

Thank you salary cap! BFLO was doing just fine in the old system with a good businessman like Ralph. Everybody in favor screams this or that about the salary cap and how it will help small markets. BS. Everybody sees what is happening to the NFL, it is becoming a games for the "elites" in our culture.

 

TOTAL BS. It is not the fault of the other teams in the NFL that the Bills have made horrible personnel decisions over the last decade and a half. We made our bed, and now we are lying in it. These excuses only perpetuate a lie- how else does New Orleans win the Super Bowl, with all of the money their market has?? COME ON, MAN!! We're paying for the sins of the past and present... point the finger at our team, not others!!!!

[ExiledInIllinois]

TOTAL BS. It is not the fault of the other teams in the NFL that the Bills have made horrible personnel decisions over the last decade and a half. We made our bed, and now we are lying in it. These excuses only perpetuate a lie- how else does New Orleans win the Super Bowl, with all of the money their market has?? COME ON, MAN!! We're paying for the sins of the past and present... point the finger at our team, not others!!!!

 

Sorry if I sounded off as the cap being solely to blame. It always has been a "starting point." I foreseen this happening many years ago. Ralph is a good businessman... He will ALWAYS come under the cap. It is the cap that is destroying the marquee players and coaches from coming to BFLO... And that has been happening for a long time now. True losing isn't helping... Things are just spiraling out of control that are not just the owner's fault.

 

We need a free-market system in the NFL that will allow teams to overspend and destroy themselves. The thing is, how can somebody destroy a business by being financially sound? Only in the NFL! The NFL rewards (under the current system) bad business choices in the name of "winning." In some stadiums, enjoy your 50 dollar parking fees!

[Hapless Bills Fan]

It seems we as Buffalo fans are being held hostage by the owner. Why? This is what most people on the board here have expressed.

 

1- Fans cannot revolt. If fans stop buying merchandise and going to games, the team may be sold and moved somewhere else. So,

2- In order to keep our team here, albeit a festering turd of a team with a terrible FO and a roster that is 70% putrid, we are stuck supporting Ralph's losing formula until he kicks the bucket. At which time we may or may not lose the team after all.

 

The question is, what do fans do?

 

At this point, I do revolt. I call the bluff.

 

Move the f***ing mess somewhere else, I'd rather have no team than a complete embarrassment of a team filled with

overpaid goof-offs who don't even care that they got their parts handed to them.

 

The team may move after Wilson's death even if the fans fill the seats every game, so how does #1 work really?

[GG]

A boycott will not amount to anything. Even if all fans stay away, Wilson is guaranteed $120 mil from the TV contracts, plus 40% of the gate from Bills' away games.

 

What you really are asking is for a 90-yr old man who's run things in the same way for the last 50 years to wake up and change his ways. Keep waiting.

 

This team is not moving while RW owns the team, and afterward it will be up to his successors to determine where the team will go. Until then, enjoy the ride on the mediocrity rollercoaster. The sooner you embrace reality, the more enjoyable fall Sundays will be.

Edited October 4, 2010 by GG

[weehawk]

We all need to remember that we're paying the third lowest ticket prices in the NFL to watch this junk, and that paying higher ticket prices does not guarantee a winner. So, considering that WNY almost has the economy of a third-world country, who's going to pay the higher ticket prices that are sure to come when the team is sold? I dont care if it's Jacobs, Rich, or anyone else with a "home-town connection." Prices are going up when RW passes. When that happens (and we're still losing), attendance will go way down and the team will eventually move.

 

I'll root for them until their last game. However, I'll not pay for Sunday Ticket, I wont see them live, I wont buy any stuff with the logo on it, etc. The measure of a fan is not how much he spends on stuff. I love the team, but I will no longer financially support them in any way. Folks that continue to invest their money in them are questionably not of sound mind. People are actually buying season tickets because they're afraid the team will move? Wow! Talk about ways to throw your money away and receive no value in return.

[billsfreak]

It seems we as Buffalo fans are being held hostage by the owner. Why? This is what most people on the board here have expressed.

 

1- Fans cannot revolt. If fans stop buying merchandise and going to games, the team may be sold and moved somewhere else. So,

2- In order to keep our team here, albeit a festering turd of a team with a terrible FO and a roster that is 70% putrid, we are stuck supporting Ralph's losing formula until he kicks the bucket. At which time we may or may not lose the team after all.

 

The question is, what do fans do? I love the Bills, but this has been the first season I have not been able to stomach watching every game in full. I'm not supporting the franchise anymore by buying merchandise or tickets to show my displeasure at this teams, direction. This, is the only real voice I have and 1 person removing their patronage means little. But, if I suggested others stop doing so as well then I am a "bad fan" who hates the team. I have been a Bills fan for years. Like everyone else, I wish there was some way to convey to our owner that he needs to either sell the team, or make wholesale changes. But it looks like that will never happen.

 

So the question is. How do we as fans get through to the organization that we're not "buying" their bs? Are the 2 options above all we have?

I have always said, that any team is better than no team. But as sunday after sunday go by, my thoughts on that have been wavering. Sure the Buffalo Bills have been a way of life for as long as I can remember, back to the O.J. days, but over the past decade, they haven't much more than something to mess up a good weekend. In a scenario, where they moved to a location on the east coast, relatively close to Western New York and it meant getting a new owner with a desire to win and not just make a buck like Ralphie does, it might not be so bad. If they go to the west coast or somewhere, then I will be done with them, but maybe football can be enjoyable again, and stress free. I doubt I could ever be a real fan of another team after bleeding Bills blue and red for almost 40 years, but I could be a neutral fan enjoying the games. The worst scenario would be if the Bills moved to say Oakland, got a good owner and became a perrenial playoff contender, won a few Super Bowls and showed us what we all know, just some are afraid to voice it, is that Ralph is no longer any good for this team or the NFL for that matter. The perfect scenario would be for Ralph to sell the team, live to be 200 years old (I don't hate the guy, he just sucks as an owner), we get an onwer with a real desire to win and they turn this franchise around and stay in Buffalo, but that is probably a pipe dream.