Not challenging Dalton sideline catch or Cook TD

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

  On 10/8/2024 at 9:46 PM, BillsShredder83 said:

I agree with the intent of what youre saying and the rule...... but timeout was not a game changer, and the challenge loss is nothing.

TO ME, THE BIGGEST POINT IS WITH THESE REFS.... WHO, FREAKING, KNOWS?!?!? Id say if u gave that plat to 10 crews, 2 would overturn it from incompetence. We see stupid isht like that alllllll the time!!!!

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But you only know this because you got to watch the offense stall out with a minute to go and three timeouts before halftime and react to it in hindsight from your couch or the stands in the stadium or local sportsbar 🤣.  That extra timeout can be and often is the difference between 3 and 7 points before halftime in situations like that.  This is what starts to irk me about the gameday thread hindsight posters.  Yea obviously if mcd knew the offense was not gonna get in scoring range he knows he has nothing to lose by challenging the Kincaid play.  But how the heck can he know that when that decision presents itself. 
 

Let’s say we challenge it and lose, then the offense drives and we were a timeout short from punching it into the end zone.  The hindsight posters would be just as mad for the wasted timeout.  This feels like bizarro world because we are consistently and correctly goin after McDermott for blowing timeouts on hopeless challenges from time to time lol this was one of those 

Edited October 8, 2024 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[Bermuda Triangle]

 

[DCOrange]

  On 10/10/2024 at 5:33 AM, Bermuda Triangle said:

 

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Looks to me like his toe hit out of bounds before this screen shot and his elbow isn't touching the ground in this screenshot. When his elbow hits the ground, it appears to be out of bounds. I don't think he got any body part in.

[Brand J]

  On 10/10/2024 at 1:09 PM, DCOrange said:

Looks to me like his toe hit out of bounds before this screen shot and his elbow isn't touching the ground in this screenshot. When his elbow hits the ground, it appears to be out of bounds. I don't think he got any body part in.

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No, his foot was the first thing that landed and that was for sure in bounds. We need to get the actual video and break that down because watching it live, I thought his elbow hit the green and white simultaneously. I did believe he was out, but it was closer than what people on this board were saying. Also didn’t think his elbow landed that far in bounds, picture looks doctored or something because here it’s clearly a catch. You can see the pellets from his elbow.

[uninja]

  On 10/7/2024 at 9:20 PM, PetermansRedemption said:

The thing that infuriated me on the Kinkcaid no catch, is that McDermott took a timeout right after. If you’re going to blow a timeout, challenge the play. You at least have a small chance at upside and you get a much longer break than the standard 30 second timeout. 

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That's a reasonable take, it's really close to the 2 minute mark so you can't challenge after that anyway. The downside is minimal to the massive upside.

[Breakout Squad]

  On 10/7/2024 at 9:20 PM, PetermansRedemption said:

The thing that infuriated me on the Kinkcaid no catch, is that McDermott took a timeout right after. If you’re going to blow a timeout, challenge the play. You at least have a small chance at upside and you get a much longer break than the standard 30 second timeout. 

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100% this. 

[DCOrange]

  On 10/10/2024 at 1:30 PM, Brand J said:

No, his foot was the first thing that landed and that was for sure in bounds. We need to get the actual video and break that down because watching it live, I thought his elbow hit the green and white simultaneously. I did believe he was out, but it was closer than what people on this board were saying. Also didn’t think his elbow landed that far in bounds, picture looks doctored or something because here it’s clearly a catch. You can see the pellets from his elbow.

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The pellets in that screenshot are from the defender, not Cook. His elbow was pretty clearly out of bounds IMO and the foot was close but I think it initially landed in and then slid out of bounds before lifting off the ground.

  On 10/10/2024 at 1:47 PM, Breakout Squad said:

100% this. 

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McDermott did not take a timeout after the Kincaid pass. He took a timeout after the Cook one.

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

  On 10/10/2024 at 1:52 PM, DCOrange said:

The pellets in that screenshot are from the defender, not Cook. His elbow was pretty clearly out of bounds IMO and the foot was close but I think it initially landed in and then slid out of bounds before lifting off the ground.

McDermott did not take a timeout after the Kincaid pass. He took a timeout after the Cook one.

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Idk what the heck is going on with this board about the Kincaid catch lol.  He 100% didn’t take a timeout right after and it was a 3rd down play so it literally would not have made sense to. They could’ve taken a delay deciding if he wants to challenge 

 

his decision to not blow a timeout on the challenge was validated when his offense got the ball back with three timeouts instead of two with very limited time in the half. 

 

Edited October 10, 2024 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[JohnNord]

  On 10/10/2024 at 1:52 PM, DCOrange said:

The pellets in that screenshot are from the defender, not Cook. His elbow was pretty clearly out of bounds IMO and the foot was close but I think it initially landed in and then slid out of bounds before lifting off the ground.

McDermott did not take a timeout after the Kincaid pass. He took a timeout after the Cook one.

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It was the Cook catch that he took the timeout after and I thought the same thing.  Why not just throw the flag.

 

I have the feeling that McDermott relies on John Parry on challenges these day which is a good idea.  It seems like the official on TV is right, more times than not.  The fact that he didn’t even consider makes me think reversal was a long shot

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

  On 10/10/2024 at 5:41 PM, JohnNord said:

It was the Cook catch that he took the timeout after and I thought the same thing.  Why not just throw the flag.

 

I have the feeling that McDermott relies on John Parry on challenges these day which is a good idea.  It seems like the official on TV is right, more times than not.  The fact that he didn’t even consider makes me think reversal was a long shot

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THIS!!! There were less than 2 minutes til booth review, what do you have to lose here?  

[Man with No Name]

As far as the Cook play goes, as usual, CBS DID NOT give us a good look from the proper angle. so who the heck knows. The announcers didn't even mention the elbow at all. Production and spotting continues to be ABYSMAL this year. 

[Breakout Squad]

  On 10/10/2024 at 1:52 PM, DCOrange said:

The pellets in that screenshot are from the defender, not Cook. His elbow was pretty clearly out of bounds IMO and the foot was close but I think it initially landed in and then slid out of bounds before lifting off the ground.

McDermott did not take a timeout after the Kincaid pass. He took a timeout after the Cook one.

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My bad. I could’ve sworn it was the Kincaid pass.

  On 10/8/2024 at 2:38 PM, djp14150 said:

You are just realizing this now…….this is universal.

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There’s always the a chance it could get overturned. The refs are so inconsistent so I think it was worth a shot but most likely would’ve been ruled incomplete. 
 

Kincaid needs to secure the pass better I think we can all agree on that 😎

[Breakout Squad]

  On 10/10/2024 at 6:34 PM, Bleeding Bills Blue said:

 

THIS!!! There were less than 2 minutes til booth review, what do you have to lose here?  

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Well if McD is being told it’s not going to be reversed then it’s probably the right call. I forgot the Bills hired Parry. However it’s clear that every ref can see it differently and call what they see fit. I don’t mind a challenge in the 1st half especially if it was as close as this was. 

[Brand J]

 

  On 10/10/2024 at 5:33 AM, Bermuda Triangle said:

 

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Not that it matters now, but I just saw a live action slow mo replay of the Cook catch from the angle of this picture. Looks good, folks.

[peterpan]

  On 10/7/2024 at 9:20 PM, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

This is my favorite example of gameday thread posters being out of their mind…would’ve unquestionably been a failed challenge then when our offense got the ball back with a minute left and one of the timeouts was wasted y’all would’ve complained about the challenge.  
 

we see those ball wobbling while going to the ground plays all the time around the nfl and they are never overturned 

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I agreed with you, and  thought the Cook non- catch was the correct call.  It wasn’t until the injury thread that I saw this — where his elbow is clearly down in bounds, making it a catch.

 

 

the “minor ball wobble”  the NFL had done away with.  Or so I thought, until the Kinkaid catch.  He never lost control it never touched the ground.  That’s a catch in a lot of NFL games even after replay.  NFL needs more consistency for sure 

[BigAl2526]

I don't think either call would have been overturned.  

[Rochesterfan]

  On 10/18/2024 at 12:53 PM, peterpan said:

I agreed with you, and  thought the Cook non- catch was the correct call.  It wasn’t until the injury thread that I saw this — where his elbow is clearly down in bounds, making it a catch.

 

 

the “minor ball wobble”  the NFL had done away with.  Or so I thought, until the Kinkaid catch.  He never lost control it never touched the ground.  That’s a catch in a lot of NFL games even after replay.  NFL needs more consistency for sure 

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I guess I am not seeing his Elbow hit in bounds for sure.

 

The spot  the video is stopped - the pellets flying up are not from his elbow, but from the defenders back foot.  His elbow is still in the air - it comes down and connects to the ground just as his forearm and lower body is hitting out of bounds.  It is also difficult to tell, but at 0.01 seconds on that video his toe hits right on the sideline in bounds, but slides - does it touch out of bounds?  At 0:02 seconds his arm comes down and the elbow and forearm hit simultaneously with his arm out of bounds.  

 

It was not going to be overturned because even as a homer of a Bills fan - it was the correct call.

 

 

The Dalton catch by the sidelines also would not be overturned in my opinion - not because of a small bobble, but because it is not a catch until he demonstrates control and control means not grabbing and having the 2 bobbles before he hits the ground.  He did not show control until he was out of bounds.  
 

If Dalton makes the catch clean at first with both hands and controls it until he hits the ground and it moves the small wobble that it did - then I could see the challenge, but he clearly loses control right after the catch as he is going down as the ball moves while falling and that to me is why the Refs called it correctly incomplete.

 

They were correctly not challenged - although you could use the Cook challenge as a timeout, but the effect was going to be the same - a play stoppage and incomplete.

[Big Turk]

  On 10/10/2024 at 5:33 AM, Bermuda Triangle said:

 

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Too bad his toe was already out of bounds well before this screenshot. People will do anything for clicks these days

 

Edited October 19, 2024 by Big Turk

[balln]

This thread

[Dr. Who]

  On 10/19/2024 at 2:54 AM, BigAl2526 said:

I don't think either call would have been overturned.  

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Of course not, we don't have an arrowhead on our helmets.