Biden, A Good American President, Pilfers Classified Docs

[Doc]

So because this was "discovered and reported" (days before the election yet not a single word about it to the public and after Mar-a-Lago was raided), it's different.  Yeah, OK.

[Orlando Tim]

1 hour ago, ChiGoose said:

Just to reiterate: whether the documents were classified or not is legally irrelevant here. The second someone is no longer president, they lose the right to possess any presidential documents, classified or not. 

That is not true, Can you give me a topic of which  we can't have access to something that is not classified.

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

45 minutes ago, Doc said:

So because this was "discovered and reported" (days before the election yet not a single word about it to the public and after Mar-a-Lago was raided), it's different.  Yeah, OK.

Holy cr*p--the story gets worse.  The documents apparently date from 2013-2016, deal with American interests in Iran, the UK and, get this ---Ukraine--and were first moved to the office in mid-2017 before being discovered last year.  One must wonder where they were from 2016-2022, and in fact wonder where they were during Biden's time in office?  They were found intermingled with personal papers and matters dealing with his son's death in 2015, and for quite a stretch of time when he was a private citizen and shielded somewhat  from government oversight.   

 

So, document dealing with top secret issues are left unattended for 6-9 years, exist without rhyme, reason and organization, and it certainly appears Biden considered them his own personal property. 

 

Oh, and that little part about informing the American people about the documents two months after an important election...he sure gets some lucky breaks in that regard, huh?

 

 

 

 

Edited January 10, 2023 by leh-nerd skin-erd

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

1 hour ago, JDHillFan said:

It’s ok to possess classified information for a period as long as 6 years in an unsecured manner so long as you eventually give it back. What’s so difficult to understand?

@ChiGoose says anything less than 11 years is considered 'immediately' notifying the federal government if a democrat. 

[B-Man]

 

 

 

 

22 hours ago, ChiGoose said:

 

 

21 hours ago, Roundybout said:

 

 

21 hours ago, BillStime said:

 

 

[Roundybout]

10 minutes ago, B-Man said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I was hoping for a schmear of contemplation and critical thinking, but I guess that's too much to ask. Republicans are so easily lead. 

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

1 minute ago, Roundybout said:

 

I was hoping for a schmear of contemplation and critical thinking, but I guess that's too much to ask. Republicans are so easily lead. 

Actually, what you just exhibited is a lack of leadership acumen.  If you lead correctly you would have gotten your  schmear, especially  if the subject was easy to lead as you have suggested.

 

 

 

[ChiGoose]

1 hour ago, Orlando Tim said:

That is not true, Can you give me a topic of which  we can't have access to something that is not classified.

Under the Presidential Records Act, any presidential documents become property of the archives the moment the president’s time in office ends. This is true regardless of whether or not the documents are classified. 
 

So even if a regular citizen may not have any prohibitions against learning the info contained in the documents, possession of the documents themselves without agreement from the archives would be prohibited. 

[Orlando Tim]

29 minutes ago, ChiGoose said:

Under the Presidential Records Act, any presidential documents become property of the archives the moment the president’s time in office ends. This is true regardless of whether or not the documents are classified. 
 

So even if a regular citizen may not have any prohibitions against learning the info contained in the documents, possession of the documents themselves without agreement from the archives would be prohibited. 

So you are actually at the point of arguing that the piece of paper it is printed on is now important? Nice job of becoming even more pedantic. BTW you are arguing that Biden is certainly guilty also.

[ExiledInIllinois]

The Donald's lawyers would have flushed those documents down the toilet.

 

Nothing to see here folks, move along!

 

 

[Roundybout]

Just now, ExiledInIllinois said:

The Donald's lawyers would have flushed those documents down the toilet.

 

Nothing to see here folks, move along!

 

 

The ones they didn’t sell to Russia and Iran, you mean

[ExiledInIllinois]

22 minutes ago, Roundybout said:

The ones they didn’t sell to Russia and Iran, you mean

Yup... 😕 😞 

[ChiGoose]

50 minutes ago, Orlando Tim said:

So you are actually at the point of arguing that the piece of paper it is printed on is now important? Nice job of becoming even more pedantic. BTW you are arguing that Biden is certainly guilty also.

I’m explaining what the law is. If the president scrawls notes from a meeting on the back of a BBQ takeout menu, the archives will take that menu into its possession by the end of the president’s term. 
 

And yes, Biden also violated the law. 

[Orlando Tim]

4 minutes ago, ChiGoose said:

I’m explaining what the law is. If the president scrawls notes from a meeting on the back of a BBQ takeout menu, the archives will take that menu into its possession by the end of the president’s term. 
 

And yes, Biden also violated the law. 

Ok- we do agree on what the law is but I think this more like 5 miles over the speed limit on a highway, technically illegal but not worth the attention. You can obviously disagree. 

[ChiGoose]

13 minutes ago, Orlando Tim said:

Ok- we do agree on what the law is but I think this more like 5 miles over the speed limit on a highway, technically illegal but not worth the attention. You can obviously disagree. 

Generally, I agree. This is only an issue when people are asked to return the documents and don’t, destroy them, or give them away. 
 

As I stated earlier, if Trump had just handed the documents over when NARA asked, it would be a nothingburger. 

Edited January 11, 2023 by ChiGoose

[BillsFanNC]

Trump! Russia! Collusion!

 

They're always projecting. Always.

 

 

[Wacka]

The dems should be called the tion party (pronounced shun) because all they do is projection nd deception.

Edited January 11, 2023 by Wacka

[Doc]

4 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

Holy cr*p--the story gets worse.  The documents apparently date from 2013-2016, deal with American interests in Iran, the UK and, get this ---Ukraine--and were first moved to the office in mid-2017 before being discovered last year.  One must wonder where they were from 2016-2022, and in fact wonder where they were during Biden's time in office?  They were found intermingled with personal papers and matters dealing with his son's death in 2015, and for quite a stretch of time when he was a private citizen and shielded somewhat  from government oversight.   

 

So, document dealing with top secret issues are left unattended for 6-9 years, exist without rhyme, reason and organization, and it certainly appears Biden considered them his own personal property. 

 

Yeah, just learned they were moved twice (even once would have been bad enough).  There goes the "they just learned about them!" claim.

 

And he wasn't even President so he couldn't declassify them.  And they held in an even less secure location than Mar-a-Lago.

 

4 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

Oh, and that little part about informing the American people about the documents two months after an important election...he sure gets some lucky breaks in that regard, huh?

 

That and the fact that no one leaked the news anytime during the 6 days before the election.  What a coincidink!

 

There goes the last hope for a criminal conviction for Trump.  Again I told y'all he wasn't going to jail over this.  Sorry libs you (again) don't got him now.

 

 

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

2 hours ago, ExiledInIllinois said:

The Donald's lawyers would have flushed those documents down the toilet.

 

Nothing to see here folks, move along!

 

 

The Donald’s home was raided by an armed task force, kept under control of the govt for 10 hours, they seized items outside the scope of the investigation, fought judicial efforts to have an independent third party go through the material and remove items not relevant to the probe, prevailed on appeal, maintain possession of items they have no right to hold, and cited national security as the primary reason they should be allowed to self-report.  Meanwhile, confidential attorney-client correspondence is said to be in play, though the DOJ pinky swears they won’t look at anything again that  they may probably should not look at.    
 

All of the foregoing is completely legal, of course, and if you prefer, brought on by The Donald getting porky over what he should or shouldn’t have.  
 

The flip side of the argument you’re making is a career politician scoops up top secret documents apparently over a 3 year time frame, in violation of the law, whereabouts unknown from 2013-mid2017, apparently files them between his Hair Club for men treatment plan, the Macy’s credit card bill and Jill’s student loan documents, and apparently cannot account for who may/may mit have had access.  Then, they’re found prior to the election,  they fall off the radar for a couple months and stage argument is what brave and honest soldiers they are because they immediately told someone they had documents for 6 years.  
 

Trump made his bed, and exposed his throat to his political enemies.   You support whatever comes next, I assume.  
 

This isn’t about Trump.  Biden, too, made his bed, and exposed his throat to his political enemies.  He’s sloppy, as is consistent with his political career.  An independent review of his actions, especially illegal activity while a private citizen can only be undertaken by an independent special counsel.  
 

This is a great opportunity to rebuild some trust in our system, but I sincerely doubt that’s the game plan.  Like the 1/6 committee showed, side deals and protecting an ally is the order of the day.  

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

13 minutes ago, Doc said:

 

Yeah, just learned they were moved twice (even once would have been bad enough).  There goes the "they just learned about them!" claim.

 

And he wasn't even President so he couldn't declassify them.  And they held in an even less secure location than Mar-a-Lago.

 

 

That and the fact that no one leaked the news anytime during the 6 days before the election.  What a coincidink!

 

There goes the last hope for a criminal conviction for Trump.  Again I told y'all he wasn't going to jail over this.  Sorry libs you (again) don't got him now.

 

 

You have more faith in them than I do.  I absolutely think they will push forward with any charge they possibly can, and not think twice about any potential issue with Biden.  They pitched the idea that 74 year old Donald Trump—one of the most recognizable people in the world—-was an agent of the Kremlin, and people bought it.  
 

Now, I think they don’t charge  him if he’s got intel that paints the US govt/dem leadership in a bad light, which he likely does.  That’s a trade off they could live with. 

[Doc]

10 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

You have more faith in them than I do.  I absolutely think they will push forward with any charge they possibly can, and not think twice about any potential issue with Biden.  They pitched the idea that 74 year old Donald Trump—one of the most recognizable people in the world—-was an agent of the Kremlin, and people bought it.  
 

Now, I think they don’t charge  him if he’s got intel that paints the US govt/dem leadership in a bad light, which he likely does.  That’s a trade off they could live with. 

 

If they do, the Repubs will impeach Joke.  It won't be worth it for them.

[ChiGoose]

1 hour ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

The Donald’s home was raided by an armed task force, kept under control of the govt for 10 hours, they seized items outside the scope of the investigation, fought judicial efforts to have an independent third party go through the material and remove items not relevant to the probe, prevailed on appeal, maintain possession of items they have no right to hold, and cited national security as the primary reason they should be allowed to self-report.  Meanwhile, confidential attorney-client correspondence is said to be in play, though the DOJ pinky swears they won’t look at anything again that  they may probably should not look at.    
 

All of the foregoing is completely legal, of course, and if you prefer, brought on by The Donald getting porky over what he should or shouldn’t have.  
 

The flip side of the argument you’re making is a career politician scoops up top secret documents apparently over a 3 year time frame, in violation of the law, whereabouts unknown from 2013-mid2017, apparently files them between his Hair Club for men treatment plan, the Macy’s credit card bill and Jill’s student loan documents, and apparently cannot account for who may/may mit have had access.  Then, they’re found prior to the election,  they fall off the radar for a couple months and stage argument is what brave and honest soldiers they are because they immediately told someone they had documents for 6 years.  
 

Trump made his bed, and exposed his throat to his political enemies.   You support whatever comes next, I assume.  
 

This isn’t about Trump.  Biden, too, made his bed, and exposed his throat to his political enemies.  He’s sloppy, as is consistent with his political career.  An independent review of his actions, especially illegal activity while a private citizen can only be undertaken by an independent special counsel.  
 

This is a great opportunity to rebuild some trust in our system, but I sincerely doubt that’s the game plan.  Like the 1/6 committee showed, side deals and protecting an ally is the order of the day.  

There was absolutely zero precedent for the legal relief that Trump wanted. When asked by the appellate court, his lawyers could not cite one case that supported their motion for the special master.

 

If Trump didn’t want a search warranted executed against him, he should have returned the government’s property when they first asked instead of obstructing for months, then returning some and lying that he returned it all. 
 

Trump isn’t some victim or martyr to the deep state, here. All of this is singularly because he refused to obey the law despite being given ample opportunity to do so. Had he just handed over the property when asked, none of this would have happened to him. 

Edited January 11, 2023 by ChiGoose

[L Ron Burgundy]

31 minutes ago, ChiGoose said:

There was absolutely zero precedent for the legal relief that trump wanted. When asked by the appellate court, his lawyers could not cite one case that supported their motion for the special master.

 

If Trump didn’t want a search warranted executed against him, he should have returned the government’s property when they first asked instead of obstructing for months, then returned int some and lying that he returned it all. 
 

Trump isn’t some victim or martyr to the deep state, here. All of this is singularly because he refused to obey the law despite being given ample opportunity to do so. Had he just handed over the property when asked, none of this would have happened to him. 

Exactly.   These cases may have the same offence but from there, they are vastly different.   

 

Biden should get some sort of hand slap if it's truly sensitive classified stuff we don't want 3rd parties seeing.  But comparing his situation to what Trump did is dumb yet inevitable. 

[ExiledInIllinois]

1 hour ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

The Donald’s home was raided by an armed task force, kept under control of the govt for 10 hours, they seized items outside the scope of the investigation, fought judicial efforts to have an independent third party go through the material and remove items not relevant to the probe, prevailed on appeal, maintain possession of items they have no right to hold, and cited national security as the primary reason they should be allowed to self-report.  Meanwhile, confidential attorney-client correspondence is said to be in play, though the DOJ pinky swears they won’t look at anything again that  they may probably should not look at.    
 

All of the foregoing is completely legal, of course, and if you prefer, brought on by The Donald getting porky over what he should or shouldn’t have.  
 

The flip side of the argument you’re making is a career politician scoops up top secret documents apparently over a 3 year time frame, in violation of the law, whereabouts unknown from 2013-mid2017, apparently files them between his Hair Club for men treatment plan, the Macy’s credit card bill and Jill’s student loan documents, and apparently cannot account for who may/may mit have had access.  Then, they’re found prior to the election,  they fall off the radar for a couple months and stage argument is what brave and honest soldiers they are because they immediately told someone they had documents for 6 years.  
 

Trump made his bed, and exposed his throat to his political enemies.   You support whatever comes next, I assume.  
 

This isn’t about Trump.  Biden, too, made his bed, and exposed his throat to his political enemies.  He’s sloppy, as is consistent with his political career.  An independent review of his actions, especially illegal activity while a private citizen can only be undertaken by an independent special counsel.  
 

This is a great opportunity to rebuild some trust in our system, but I sincerely doubt that’s the game plan.  Like the 1/6 committee showed, side deals and protecting an ally is the order of the day.  

Rebuilding trust in system is exactly what it does. His own lawyers did the right thing.

 

I can't imagine what Don's lawyers would have done knowing that nobody was looking for what Biden had. They would have buried it.

 

Kudos to the Biden legal team. Pretty stand-up!  Instill transparency... Repairs the damage Don did. Everyone gets sloppy.  This with Biden was easily hidden, but they didn't hide it! 

 

It's called: Integrity.

Edited January 11, 2023 by ExiledInIllinois

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

46 minutes ago, ChiGoose said:

There was absolutely zero precedent for the legal relief that Trump wanted. When asked by the appellate court, his lawyers could not cite one case that supported their motion for the special master.

 

If Trump didn’t want a search warranted executed against him, he should have returned the government’s property when they first asked instead of obstructing for months, then returning some and lying that he returned it all. 
 

Trump isn’t some victim or martyr to the deep state, here. All of this is singularly because he refused to obey the law despite being given ample opportunity to do so. Had he just handed over the property when asked, none of this would have happened to him. 

This deep state stuff makes you sound a little bit off your rocker, Chi.  If you can’t have a reasonable conversation about actions undertaken by the DOJ you’re wasting your time. 
 

While Trump is most certainly a victim of political persecution—AG Barr and common sense tell us as much, it’s important to differentiate between  events that clearly were malicious and problems that are potentially self-inflicted. Perhaps a separate post could be dedicated to his state of mind and psychological trauma as a result of the persecution and how it may have impacted him here, but let’s put that aside.  
 

I have previously stated he created the problem with classified material, that’s obvious to me.  Clearly he’s not a victim in that regard.  I think your argument that Merrick Garland had no middle ground between resolving differences with Trump and and the swat team approach and what followed is both silly and preposterous.  There’s always middle ground, but Garland chose the aggressive route to send the message he wanted to send.    He had the legal right to pursue as such, so it is what it is.  I should add this here—if Trump was selling or giving away intelligence, I’ll happily retroactively applaud AG Garland for his actions.  
 

Likewise, Biden is no victim.  The matter needs to be addressed, and given that the issues run the gamut from his time in the WH to time as private citizen, to his now quite hilarious declaration about playing fast and loses with top secret material, the most logical resolution is an independent party looking over what he knew, when he knew it, and why he was holding onto top secret material over a 6 or 7 year period.   I see a number of politicians expressing grave concerns over Biden’s actions, that concerns me.  
 

You should want this too, Chi, and I am surprised to see you defend the indefensible even though it’s  your guy with his hand in the cookie jar. 

[BillStime]

2 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

This deep state stuff makes you sound a little bit off your rocker, Chi.  If you can’t have a reasonable conversation about actions undertaken by the DOJ you’re wasting your time. 
 

While Trump is most certainly a victim of political persecution—AG Barr and common sense tell us as much, it’s important to differentiate between  events that clearly were malicious and problems that are potentially self-inflicted. Perhaps a separate post could be dedicated to his state of mind and psychological trauma as a result of the persecution and how it may have impacted him here, but let’s put that aside.  
 

I have previously stated he created the problem with classified material, that’s obvious to me.  Clearly he’s not a victim in that regard.  I think your argument that Merrick Garland had no middle ground between resolving differences with Trump and and the swat team approach and what followed is both silly and preposterous.  There’s always middle ground, but Garland chose the aggressive route to send the message he wanted to send.    He had the legal right to pursue as such, so it is what it is.  I should add this here—if Trump was selling or giving away intelligence, I’ll happily retroactively applaud AG Garland for his actions.  
 

Likewise, Biden is no victim.  The matter needs to be addressed, and given that the issues run the gamut from his time in the WH to time as private citizen, to his now quite hilarious declaration about playing fast and loses with top secret material, the most logical resolution is an independent party looking over what he knew, when he knew it, and why he was holding onto top secret material over a 6 or 7 year period.   I see a number of politicians expressing grave concerns over Biden’s actions, that concerns me.  
 

You should want this too, Chi, and I am surprised to see you defend the indefensible even though it’s  your guy with his hand in the cookie jar. 

holy %^{*{%{{ - 

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

23 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said:

Rebuilding trust in system is exactly what it does. His own lawyers did the right thing.

 

I can't imagine what Don's lawyers would have done knowing that nobody was looking for what Biden had. They would have buried it.

 

Kudos to the Biden legal team. Pretty stand-up!  Instill transparency... Repairs the damage Don did. Everyone gets sloppy.  This with Biden was easily hidden, but they didn't hide it! 

 

It's called: Integrity.

Integrity would actually be not breaking the law to begin with,  waiting 7 years to report it, and deep sixxing any comments about this major security breach until 60 days after the files were discovered, and counting.  

[ExiledInIllinois]

1 minute ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

Integrity would actually be not breaking the law to begin with,  waiting 7 years to report it, and deep sixxing any comments about this major security breach until 60 days after the files were discovered, and counting.  

Better than just burying it! Nobody knew they existed. Yet, they still reported it. 

 

That's a lot better than the previous administration. 

 

 

[ChiGoose]

21 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

This deep state stuff makes you sound a little bit off your rocker, Chi.  If you can’t have a reasonable conversation about actions undertaken by the DOJ you’re wasting your time. 
 

While Trump is most certainly a victim of political persecution—AG Barr and common sense tell us as much, it’s important to differentiate between  events that clearly were malicious and problems that are potentially self-inflicted. Perhaps a separate post could be dedicated to his state of mind and psychological trauma as a result of the persecution and how it may have impacted him here, but let’s put that aside.  
 

I have previously stated he created the problem with classified material, that’s obvious to me.  Clearly he’s not a victim in that regard.  I think your argument that Merrick Garland had no middle ground between resolving differences with Trump and and the swat team approach and what followed is both silly and preposterous.  There’s always middle ground, but Garland chose the aggressive route to send the message he wanted to send.    He had the legal right to pursue as such, so it is what it is.  I should add this here—if Trump was selling or giving away intelligence, I’ll happily retroactively applaud AG Garland for his actions.  
 

Likewise, Biden is no victim.  The matter needs to be addressed, and given that the issues run the gamut from his time in the WH to time as private citizen, to his now quite hilarious declaration about playing fast and loses with top secret material, the most logical resolution is an independent party looking over what he knew, when he knew it, and why he was holding onto top secret material over a 6 or 7 year period.   I see a number of politicians expressing grave concerns over Biden’s actions, that concerns me.  
 

You should want this too, Chi, and I am surprised to see you defend the indefensible even though it’s  your guy with his hand in the cookie jar. 

Ok, let’s try a different tact here. 
 

Let’s say you’re a member of law enforcement. You know John Doe has stolen property. He has been notified that he needs to return it. For more than half a year, he refuses to return it.  At one point, he then says he’s returning it but your sources tell you that he’s lying and still has much of the stolen property. 
 

At what point do you seek a search warrant? 6 months? 8? Never?

 

Because I think the DoJ was being more than reasonable waiting as long as it did for someone who clearly was never going to comply. 

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

9 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said:

Better than just burying it! Nobody knew they existed. Yet, they still reported it. 

 

That's a lot better than the previous administration. 

 

 

I feel like I’m talking to crazy people.  
 

Joe Biden knew they existed, he took them!  He took top secret files that clearly were not mixed in with his health savings account records, receipts for Meals and Entertainment, and Verizon Fiona bills while at the White House.  They’re top secret files for goodness sake!  He didn’t write them, it’s not his work product, and sometime between 2013-2016 ::::poof::::, they went from the WH to his personal filing cabinet.   

You’re argument seems to be if a thief steals something, forgets he has it, gets nervous a decade later and reports it, that he’s somehow a paragon of virtue. Let’s just acknowledge a serious investigation by people not beholden to him should take place.  
 

If it’s all upon the up and up and it was run of the mill law breaking, so be it. 

[ExiledInIllinois]

5 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

I feel like I’m talking to crazy people.  
 

Joe Biden knew they existed, he took them!  He took top secret files that clearly were not mixed in with his health savings account records, receipts for Meals and Entertainment, and Verizon Fiona bills while at the White House.  They’re top secret files for goodness sake!  He didn’t write them, it’s not his work product, and sometime between 2013-2016 ::::poof::::, they went from the WH to his personal filing cabinet.   

You’re argument seems to be if a thief steals something, forgets he has it, gets nervous a decade later and reports it, that he’s somehow a paragon of virtue. Let’s just acknowledge a serious investigation by people not beholden to him should take place.  
 

If it’s all upon the up and up and it was run of the mill law breaking, so be it. 

😆... Where were you last June! 

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

17 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said:

😆... Where were you last June! 

Reading the files in Biden’s office, obviously.  Turns out Hunter is an accomplished flautist.  It humanizes him, you know? 

[All_Pro_Bills]

6 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

I feel like I’m talking to crazy people.  
 

Joe Biden knew they existed, he took them!  He took top secret files that clearly were not mixed in with his health savings account records, receipts for Meals and Entertainment, and Verizon Fiona bills while at the White House.  They’re top secret files for goodness sake!  He didn’t write them, it’s not his work product, and sometime between 2013-2016 ::::poof::::, they went from the WH to his personal filing cabinet.   

You’re argument seems to be if a thief steals something, forgets he has it, gets nervous a decade later and reports it, that he’s somehow a paragon of virtue. Let’s just acknowledge a serious investigation by people not beholden to him should take place.  
 

If it’s all upon the up and up and it was run of the mill law breaking, so be it. 

Not crazy people.  But more than able to generate a host of excuses and explanations about why in the case of their guy having unauthorized possession of top secret files, and no detailed understanding and knowledge of the situation, to immediately dig in their heels to defend the idea its no big deal.  As their base assumption  is always their team is the pinnacle of virtue and truth did you expect anything else?     

[BillsFanNC]

6 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

I feel like I’m talking to crazy people.  
 

Joe Biden knew they existed, he took them!  He took top secret files that clearly were not mixed in with his health savings account records, receipts for Meals and Entertainment, and Verizon Fiona bills while at the White House.  They’re top secret files for goodness sake!  He didn’t write them, it’s not his work product, and sometime between 2013-2016 ::::poof::::, they went from the WH to his personal filing cabinet.   

You’re argument seems to be if a thief steals something, forgets he has it, gets nervous a decade later and reports it, that he’s somehow a paragon of virtue. Let’s just acknowledge a serious investigation by people not beholden to him should take place.  
 

If it’s all upon the up and up and it was run of the mill law breaking, so be it. 

 

 

That's because you are.

 

TDS.

Edited January 11, 2023 by BillsFanNC

[Tommy Callahan]

people are still talking about Trumps docs like that was not a huge nothing burger, while  those same people seem to be concerned that old biden would get the same scrutiny and investigation as the orange dude.

 

On a side note. I like many have had to take classes and get federal or state certified. and its crazy how in every one of those cases, its repeated over and over again what the penalties are for not securing said data.  Like secure servers, no cloud, no non encrypted emails, NEVER a Gmail or yahoo account.  

 

But that just something us little folks have to worry about..

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

6 hours ago, ChiGoose said:

Ok, let’s try a different tact here. 
 

Let’s say you’re a member of law enforcement. You know John Doe has stolen property. He has been notified that he needs to return it. For more than half a year, he refuses to return it.  At one point, he then says he’s returning it but your sources tell you that he’s lying and still has much of the stolen property. 
 

At what point do you seek a search warrant? 6 months? 8? Never?

 

Because I think the DoJ was being more than reasonable waiting as long as it did for someone who clearly was never going to comply. 

No, that’s not necessary when we can focus on the facts as they happened. 
 

Assuming Garland was negotiating for return over items in Trump’s possession for 6 or 8 months, there’s no reason to believe additional administrative/court action could not be undertaken.  It also implies to me that rumors of Trump betraying the country are quite unlikely to be true.   
 

Once Garland pulled the trigger on the raid, I’d think the process would take place with the utmost professionalism to avoid the obvious political ramifications that come with the AG appointed by one party sending investigators to another.  I don’t believe that happened.
 

I am uncomfortable painting the individuals carrying out the search (people do have responsibility and orders to follow), but when you control the premises for multiple hours, have specific data you are looking for, I would think great care would be taken to limit your search to that which you are there to take however long it takes.  Instead, we end up with leaks, inferences, photo shoots and the like and the DOJ rejecting the judges rather benign assignment of an independent party to render an opinion on items that apparently should not have been taken.  
 

Again, I get they can do all that.  I just don’t know that they should have. 
 

Anyway, this about Biden, and thankfully some folks not beholden to team Biden are going to look into it:

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/biden-comments-documents-classified-north-american-leaders-summit/?intcid=CNI-00-10aaa3b

 

He seems to be blaming his attorneys for grabbing the documents.  Interesting spin. 

[BillStime]

4 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

No, that’s not necessary when we can focus on the facts as they happened. 
 

Assuming Garland was negotiating for return over items in Trump’s possession for 6 or 8 months, there’s no reason to believe additional administrative/court action could not be undertaken.  It also implies to me that rumors of Trump betraying the country are quite unlikely to be true.   
 

Once Garland pulled the trigger on the raid, I’d think the process would take place with the utmost professionalism to avoid the obvious political ramifications that come with the AG appointed by one party sending investigators to another.  I don’t believe that happened.
 

I am uncomfortable painting the individuals carrying out the search (people do have responsibility and orders to follow), but when you control the premises for multiple hours, have specific data you are looking for, I would think great care would be taken to limit your search to that which you are there to take however long it takes.  Instead, we end up with leaks, inferences, photo shoots and the like and the DOJ rejecting the judges rather benign assignment of an independent party to render an opinion on items that apparently should not have been taken.  
 

Again, I get they can do all that.  I just don’t know that they should have. 
 

Anyway, this about Biden, and thankfully some folks not beholden to team Biden are going to look into it:

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/biden-comments-documents-classified-north-american-leaders-summit/?intcid=CNI-00-10aaa3b

 

He seems to be blaming his attorneys for grabbing the documents.  Interesting spin. 

Spin? Look at you constantly turning yourself into a pretzel defending Trump - why is Trump above the law - ever?

 

He was told nicely to return the documents and kept telling the government F off.

Party of personal responsibility? 

 

[BillStime]

@Chris farley - wait, what? The government didn’t ask Trump repeatedly to return the classified documents?

 

Are you telling us that the feds just randomly showed up to Trumps pedo resort out of the blue without numerous prior requests?

 

Pathetic simps 

 

 

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

23 minutes ago, BillStime said:

Spin? Look at you constantly turning yourself into a pretzel defending Trump - why is Trump above the law - ever?

 

He was told nicely to return the documents and kept telling the government F off.

Party of personal responsibility? 

 

While you were home pitching a fit about the clothes your mom picked out for you, the rest of the class discussed this issue in some detail.  
 

As for personal responsibility, I’ve not defended Trump once in this scenario.  While you’re sharing tweets of how Team Biden “immediately” turned over records in his possession for 5-7 years, illegally it would seem, I place the blame where it goes—that’s a Donald Trump issue.  How it was handled thereafter is fair game.
 

Interestingly, Joe Biden has begun his Washington two step.  Turns out he had no idea he had top secret files in his possession.  That’s alarming. Turns out his lawyers put the files in his desk, just grabbed a bunch of documents and put them right with the electric bill, but Joe never looked at them.  That’s more alarming still.  
 

Turns out it’s just like those ladies he groped who just didn’t understand him and his touchy feely ways.  
 

It also turns out supporters of Joe don’t really care about national security after all.  Turns out they couldn’t stitch together what seemed pretty obvious to anyone with a sense of smell—most ordinary Americans give more thought to keeping their delicious Oreo cookies safe than our high ranking officials do for classified/top secret data.   We’re up to Clinton, Trump, Biden and we haven’t even started looking. 
 

Elige sapientiam, friend. 

[Tiberius]

2 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

While you were home pitching a fit about the clothes your mom picked out for you, the rest of the class discussed this issue in some detail.  
 

As for personal responsibility, I’ve not defended Trump once in this scenario.  While you’re sharing tweets of how Team Biden “immediately” turned over records in his possession for 5-7 years, illegally it would seem, I place the blame where it goes—that’s a Donald Trump issue.  How it was handled thereafter is fair game.
 

Interestingly, Joe Biden has begun his Washington two step.  Turns out he had no idea he had top secret files in his possession.  That’s alarming. Turns out his lawyers put the files in his desk, just grabbed a bunch of documents and put them right with the electric bill, but Joe never looked at them.  That’s more alarming still.  
 

Turns out it’s just like those ladies he groped who just didn’t understand him and his touchy feely ways.  
 

It also turns out supporters of Joe don’t really care about national security after all.  Turns out they couldn’t stitch together what seemed pretty obvious to anyone with a sense of smell—most ordinary Americans give more thought to keeping their delicious Oreo cookies safe than our high ranking officials do for classified/top secret data.   We’re up to Clinton, Trump, Biden and we haven’t even started looking. 
 

Elige sapientiam, friend. 

You have to admit that Biden simply gave the stuff back, while Trump refused to and they had to be seized by law enforcement, correct?  

 

I'm just pointing out that these two situations have very different actions by the two men.