It's Time to Mandate Vaccines

[716er]

1 hour ago, Big Blitz said:

Why is everything even open

 

To piss you off

[billsfan4ever63]

what i don't understand is that if the vaccine works as good as they say then if you've had the vaccine you shouldn't be worried about the people who are not vaccinated. and why doesnt anyone talk about the treatments for covid, like monoclonal antibodies and ivermectin.

[Sundancer]

1 hour ago, Big Blitz said:

Anti Mandate Freedom loving Americans: 

 

"The government is out of control with mandates and protocols.  We did our jobs it's been 2 f...ing years and 75% of us are vaxxed why are we still in masks and why are they mandating anything at this point?  Isolating people still....still sending people home despite being vaccinated.  This is unsustainable and illogical and won't end."

 

 

 

Sundancer:

 

"Here is some data on the effectiveness of vaccines."

 

Sprechen Sie English? 

1 hour ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

You mentioned numbers were up but no sure wheres so I highlighted the elevated States..

 

Sorry this was a miscommunication. The thing I couldn't find was that some state started tracking people hospitalized with covid vs people hospitalized with covid and comorbidities. I just can't remember where I saw that. It was helpful data to see, especially in the northeast where this time of year, hospitals rise normally. 

6 minutes ago, billsfan4ever63 said:

what i don't understand is that if the vaccine works as good as they say then if you've had the vaccine you shouldn't be worried about the people who are not vaccinated. and why doesnt anyone talk about the treatments for covid, like monoclonal antibodies and ivermectin.

 

People do talk about the proven treatments. There are a few now. It's great news. 

[billsfan4ever63]

sheep

 

[Sundancer]

Ya think vaccines don't work because of case counts in certain states? Pretty sure older folks think they are working well in my state despite delta:

 

 

Under 20s, the least likely to be vaccinated, driving the case counts. 

 

But VACCINES DON'T WORK and Fauci and something something angry.  

[SoCal Deek]

17 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

 

But VACCINES DON'T WORK and Fauci and something something angry.  

Of course vaccines work…and…Fauci is still a swamp creature.

[Sundancer]

23 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Of course vaccines work…and…Fauci is still a swamp creature.

 

Agreed re Fauci to an extent. He's had the bad role of being the face of an ever-changing landscape for a deadly virus and politicians making bad decisions since day one at every level DeSantis policy-wise only, made the best decisions. No one else comes close. But leadership-wise for encouraging people to get vaccinated and stay safe, he's been a turd. Fauci has been far too confident in his predictions, which makes him look like a fool. 

 

Plenzmd1 said today on PPP: "so [people should] take the shot even if the real world date is proving [the vaccines] dont work?" 

 

Plenty like him believe the vaccine studies and data are hoaxes/conspiracies. 

Edited November 24, 2021 by Sundancer

[Big Blitz]

53 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

Ya think vaccines don't work because of case counts in certain states? Pretty sure older folks think they are working well in my state despite delta:

 

 

Under 20s, the least likely to be vaccinated, driving the case counts. 

 

But VACCINES DON'T WORK and Fauci and something something angry.  

 

 

 

Are you ever going to respond to the actual problem of mandates protocols masks and maybe perhaps go on record with what you think should happen going forward.  

 

We know what these vaccines do and don't do.   The problem is the politicians will never let this end because there is a large number of cowards out there looking to them to "do something."  And that is unacceptable.  It's un-American.  And it defies all logic.  

 

Stop making excuses for these thugs in government and answer the question about forever pandemic and mandates.  

[Beach]

mr. dancer, we dont want mandates.  i dont care if the vaccine is safe/effective or anything else.  everyone who wants a shot can get one.  

[JaCrispy]

6 minutes ago, Beach said:

mr. dancer, we dont want mandates.  i dont care if the vaccine is safe/effective or anything else.  everyone who wants a shot can get one.  

Exactly...if people were that worried about the virus, everyone would get the shot...👍

[OrangeBills]

5 hours ago, Big Blitz said:

Why is everything even open

 

 

People are dying and will continue to worthless masks and vaccines or not. 

 

Should be full lockdown if you truly care.  Would also slow down flu season. 

 

Shut down KeyBank Center for 6 months. 

 

Do it.   F... your freedoms and businesses.  

 

Why live anyway?

[Big Blitz]

25 minutes ago, JaCrispy said:

Exactly...if people were that worried about the virus, everyone would get the shot...👍

 

 

It's so bad.....100s of thousands are protesting mandates all across Europe.

 

That's how much death and sickness we've seen. 

 

Enough to convince massive numbers (Fauci speak) of people protesting the power grabbing freedom infringing mandates.   

 

 

 

And they still won't answer the question about permanent protocols because in case you missed it they have moved the goal posts to:

 

1.  A cure 

2.  It's eradicated.  

 

 

 

Exactly what we signed up for.  

 

This all ends very very very badly.  

[JaCrispy]

14 minutes ago, Big Blitz said:

 

 

It's so bad.....100s of thousands are protesting mandates all across Europe.

 

That's how much death and sickness we've seen. 

 

Enough to convince massive numbers (Fauci speak) of people protesting the power grabbing freedom infringing mandates.   

 

 

 

And they still won't answer the question about permanent protocols because in case you missed it they have moved the goal posts to:

 

1.  A cure 

2.  It's eradicated.  

 

 

 

Exactly what we signed up for.  

 

This all ends very very very badly.  

That’s how you know there’s an ulterior motive...Biden’s top covid response guy already acknowledged we are never getting rid of covid...best we can hope for is that it becomes endemic... 

 

This is our WW3- global fight against pharmaceutical tyranny and authoritarianism....

 

Welcome to the rebellion...👍

[JaCrispy]

37 minutes ago, John Adams said:

 

You’re too stupid to ever read. I’ve said a million times that I’m anti mandates unless hospitals are literally crushed (NY/NJ in March and April 2020). And I’ve said that I agreed with almost every policy DeSantis enacted. 

 

Don’t be such an idiot.

 

 

I keep posting about vaccines because so many people here keep posting about their ineffectiveness, including one guy today over and over. 

 

You can be anti-mandate and pro vaccine. 

I think just about everyone on here is anti mandate and pro vaccine...👍

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

4 hours ago, Sundancer said:

 

Sprechen Sie English? 

 

Sorry this was a miscommunication. The thing I couldn't find was that some state started tracking people hospitalized with covid vs people hospitalized with covid and comorbidities. I just can't remember where I saw that. It was helpful data to see, especially in the northeast where this time of year, hospitals rise normally. 
 

Unless the co-morbids catch the eye of a comely nurse during a sponge bath, I’m suggesting you rule out Penthouse magazine as the source of this story. 

 

 

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

9 minutes ago, JaCrispy said:

I think just about everyone on here is anti mandate and pro vaccine...👍

Seems that way.  
 

My biggest issue is that as the federal government oversteps it’s authority with things like mandates, we cede ground to the inevitable creep of power. 
 

There’s never been a mandate, only highly selective manipulation of organizations with deep pockets under threat of confiscation of revenue.  
 

I was watching an interview with the CEO of United Airlines the other day.  He was being praised for his company mandate that requires all customer facing employees to be vaxxed, but non-customer facing employees have no such requirement.  When being soft tugged for his brilliance here, he was asked about guests on the plane and vaccination requirements.   Suddenly, he’s the free will guy.   Doesn’t support it. What a douche.   
 

This is about creating classes of winners and losers, about how far they can push it before people reject overreach.  

[Big Blitz]

8 hours ago, Sundancer said:

 

By the way, Covid hospitalizations are about half what they were last year at this time currently on a much less steep incline, but, VACCINES DON'T WORK. 

 

 

VACCINES DON'T WORK is the work of plenzmd1, based on the his own studies published on a Bills Political board. 

 

 

 

Don't you understand this is what's most disturbing to people like us?

 

This is what we signed up for - this exactly - flatten curves don't overwhelm hospitals.  

 

So why are you still in masks - where is the leadership to explain the goal and direction and exit strategy?  Why is everyone in these local commercials in freaking masks??

 

We got these hospitalizations down in 2021 with NO VACCINE MANDATES.  None.  

 

The OSHA EOs is on hold.  The most recent (last 3 months) of threats of job losses haven't impacted the numbers.  Florida does not have mandates - lowest case rate in America.

 

 

 

I'll kindly await your next reply on vaccine effectiveness.  

[RiotAct]

I find it very disturbing that the public at large, at least here in Western NY, is being beholden to hospital capacity numbers.  Can’t wait to go through this every fall and winter ad nauseam.

[JaCrispy]

4 minutes ago, RiotAct said:

I find it very disturbing that the public at large, at least here in Western NY, is being beholden to hospital capacity numbers.  Can’t wait to go through this every fall and winter ad nauseam.

When number of deaths isn’t working, the media has to turn to hospital capacity numbers to scare people...and yet people fall for it, even though society is going on as normal for the most part...

 

 

Edited November 25, 2021 by JaCrispy

[JaCrispy]

 

[Big Blitz]

44 minutes ago, JaCrispy said:

When number of deaths isn’t working, the media has to turn to hospital capacity numbers to scare people...and yet people fall for it, even though society is going on as normal for the most part...

 

 

 

 

Right??  

 

We've met all their fake ever changing or actually the have yet to be clarified metrics (that we had them as a nation is disturbing) and did all we can do here.  

 

 

This is something much more sinister made possible by the cowards that refuse to call it out only double down on the stupid.  

[Doc Brown]

5 hours ago, JaCrispy said:

When number of deaths isn’t working, the media has to turn to hospital capacity numbers to scare people...and yet people fall for it, even though society is going on as normal for the most part...

Last year on this date the rolling seven day daily average of US Covid deaths was 1,854 per day.  This year on the same date it's at 1,067 deaths per day.  A better number but still worth monitoring.

 

I'm thankful to be able to have a Thanksgiving meal with my extended family today.  I'm thankful the Bills get to play in front of full stadiums now.  I'm thankful most people are back at work.  I couldn't care less about the minor inconvenience of wearing a mask to go into a grocery store.

[Sundancer]

7 hours ago, Big Blitz said:

 

 

 

Don't you understand this is what's most disturbing to people like us?

 

Why do you think I posted this?

 

7 hours ago, Big Blitz said:

 

This is what we signed up for - this exactly - flatten curves don't overwhelm hospitals.  

 

So why are you still in masks - where is the leadership to explain the goal and direction and exit strategy?  Why is everyone in these local commercials in freaking masks??

 

We got these hospitalizations down in 2021 with NO VACCINE MANDATES.  None.  

 

The OSHA EOs is on hold.  The most recent (last 3 months) of threats of job losses haven't impacted the numbers.  Florida does not have mandates - lowest case rate in America.

 

 

 

I'll kindly await your next reply on vaccine effectiveness.  

 

I am anti mandate anti mask (except doc offices…that’s prob a good policy) as I’ve said many times.

 

Get vaccinated get boosted. And I’ll keep posting about effectiveness because people keep questioning effectiveness and go unchallenged by the likes of you.

[Sundancer]

15 hours ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

You mentioned numbers were up but no sure wheres so I highlighted the elevated States..

 

Found what I was remembering ring on with anf for Covid.

 

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2021/09/covid-hospitalization-numbers-can-be-misleading/620062/

 

People are still dying from Covid at a high rate, as born out by the provisional death counts. But it would be great to know these finer numbers. Places like Erie County are massively overreacting.

 

2 hours ago, Doc Brown said:

Last year on this date the rolling seven day daily average of US Covid deaths was 1,854 per day.  This year on the same date it's at 1,067 deaths per day.  A better number but still worth monitoring.

 

Thankful for vaccines despite delta!

 

2 hours ago, Doc Brown said:

 

I'm thankful to be able to have a Thanksgiving meal with my extended family today.  I'm thankful the Bills get to play in front of full stadiums now.  I'm thankful most people are back at work.  I couldn't care less about the minor inconvenience of wearing a mask to go into a grocery store.

 

[Irv]

On 11/18/2021 at 4:37 PM, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

I read or heard somewhere recently that the CDC suggests the J&J booster 60 days after the initial dose. 
 

Crazy. 

What a mess.  Demented Biden and his communist buddies continue to botch everything. He even botched the pardoning of the turkeys.  He ended up pardoning three pigeons and and a stray cat.  
 

 

Edited November 25, 2021 by Irv

[plenzmd1]

14 hours ago, Sundancer said:

 

Agreed re Fauci to an extent. He's had the bad role of being the face of an ever-changing landscape for a deadly virus and politicians making bad decisions since day one at every level DeSantis policy-wise only, made the best decisions. No one else comes close. But leadership-wise for encouraging people to get vaccinated and stay safe, he's been a turd. Fauci has been far too confident in his predictions, which makes him look like a fool. 

 

Plenzmd1 said today on PPP: "so [people should] take the shot even if the real world date is proving [the vaccines] dont work?" 

 

Plenty like him believe the vaccine studies and data are hoaxes/conspiracies. 

Here is what i was talking about...and to be clear....that was in a thread wanting to make people broke if they contracted Covid while not being vax... 

 

Caes counts same dates year apart in November, except Florida used August as that has been their peak both years

         2000        2001

NY...5400--     7200

Fla  10,400,     26K

CA  8444-      5672

nc   3415-      2225

il     5200--     7100

MI  3415--     1200

CO 5700--    2600

TX  12K--    4k ....they had peaks different months last year, that is Nov 20 to Nov 20...if compare peaks of Dec 20 and August 21 its 32k in 20, 24 K in 21

 

 

Can keep going through and see numbers numbers like this...some up marginally, some down marginally....all of it with growing immunity based on just simple case numbers, and the vaccine hitting over 60% in most places. 

 

Now you subscribe to the fact that means the vaccine work exactly as advertised and as in studies.

 

I see little difference in the numbers of cases.

 

My resistance to this the last few months, (and if you go back to spring /early summer, I was a huge proponent of the vax, but not mandates)  is people have their head in the sand and are so entrenched in the "only way we get back to normal is to keep getting more shots into people"...when it appears to me it has little effect. 

 

 

The massive drops in the spring might just be attributed to a flu like virus being ,,,wait for it, more contagious in the winter when we are all inside. And maybe as we go forward as more and more people keep getting infected, the numbers will keep coming down. And that will ascribed to the vax, instead of any kind of real analysis being done ....cause a whole lot of folks have a whole lot invested in the vax working as advertised.

 

 

 

 

Either way, hope you all have a wonderful Thanksgiving with your family and friends....and Go Bills

 

[JaCrispy]

3 hours ago, Sundancer said:

 

Found what I was remembering ring on with anf for Covid.

 

https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2021/09/covid-hospitalization-numbers-can-be-misleading/620062/

 

People are still dying from Covid at a high rate, as born out by the provisional death counts. But it would be great to know these finer numbers. Places like Erie County are massively overreacting.

 

 

Thankful for vaccines despite delta!

 

 

High rate, meaning still under 1%? Come on, man! 😉

 

 

Edited November 25, 2021 by JaCrispy

[SoCal Deek]

3 hours ago, Sundancer said:

 

I am anti mandate anti mask (except doc offices…that’s prob a good policy) as I’ve said many times.

 

Get vaccinated get boosted. And I’ll keep posting about effectiveness because people keep questioning effectiveness and go unchallenged by the likes of you.

I saw something that said there are now almost 200 million fully vaccinated Americans, so I’m guessing there’s quite a few million more that are partially vaccinated, and still millions more who already had Covid. If you take out the population under 30 wouldn’t that mean that the vast vast majority of Americans have now crossed the goal line? I’m not sure how much more coaxing you’re going to be able to do here. 

Edited November 25, 2021 by SoCal Deek

[Sundancer]

2 hours ago, plenzmd1 said:

Here is what i was talking about...and to be clear....that was in a thread wanting to make people broke if they contracted Covid while not being vax... 

 

Caes counts same dates year apart in November, except Florida used August as that has been their peak both years

         2000        2001

NY...5400--     7200

Fla  10,400,     26K

CA  8444-      5672

nc   3415-      2225

il     5200--     7100

MI  3415--     1200

CO 5700--    2600

TX  12K--    4k ....they had peaks different months last year, that is Nov 20 to Nov 20...if compare peaks of Dec 20 and August 21 its 32k in 20, 24 K in 21

 

 

Can keep going through and see numbers numbers like this...some up marginally, some down marginally....all of it with growing immunity based on just simple case numbers, and the vaccine hitting over 60% in most places. 

 

Now you subscribe to the fact that means the vaccine work exactly as advertised and as in studies.

 

I see little difference in the numbers of cases.

 

My resistance to this the last few months, (and if you go back to spring /early summer, I was a huge proponent of the vax, but not mandates)  is people have their head in the sand and are so entrenched in the "only way we get back to normal is to keep getting more shots into people"...when it appears to me it has little effect. 

 

 

The massive drops in the spring might just be attributed to a flu like virus being ,,,wait for it, more contagious in the winter when we are all inside. And maybe as we go forward as more and more people keep getting infected, the numbers will keep coming down. And that will ascribed to the vax, instead of any kind of real analysis being done ....cause a whole lot of folks have a whole lot invested in the vax working as advertised.

 

 

 

 

Either way, hope you all have a wonderful Thanksgiving with your family and friends....and Go Bills

 

 

How do you put in this work and still get this SO wrong? The case rate, death rate, and hospital rate is 50% in the US compared to last year at this time, despite a 2x contagious delta. 

 

And based on this, you still believe that vaccines don’t work? 

 

Can’t help ya there. 

 

Go science.

 

Go Bills. 

2 hours ago, JaCrispy said:

High rate, meaning still under 1%? Come on, man! 😉

 

 

 

We are still well above the pandemic death threshold. 

[Beach]

my friend got mandated for his work.  for his 2nd shot he didnt have his card with him so now he has 2 cards.   

[ALF]

It looks like the 2nd dose is wearing off , boosters will keep needing to be had. The unvaccinated will prolong this disaster.

[Sundancer]

2 hours ago, Beach said:

my friend got mandated for his work.  for his 2nd shot he didnt have his card with him so now he has 2 cards.   

 

I have two cards. Just carry the photos of them. No biggie.

[Boatdrinks]

1 hour ago, ALF said:

It looks like the 2nd dose is wearing off , boosters will keep needing to be had. The unvaccinated will prolong this disaster.

The unvaccinated will prolong nothing. They will either survive Covid ( very likely ) or they won’t. Soon they will be able to take a pill to treat it . Most of us will get vaccinated to protect ourselves to varying degrees. The only prolonging is being done by politicians drunk on power and control. Poloncarz is a great example of this. Most people except for the extremely liberal/ terrified have adapted and moved on from Covid. Mask wearing tribalism over 600 days into this is overkill of the highest order. 

[Sundancer]

20 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

The unvaccinated will prolong nothing. They will either survive Covid ( very likely ) or they won’t. Soon they will be able to take a pill to treat it . Most of us will get vaccinated to protect ourselves to varying degrees. The only prolonging is being done by politicians drunk on power and control. Poloncarz is a great example of this. Most people except for the extremely liberal/ terrified have adapted and moved on from Covid. Mask wearing tribalism over 600 days into this is overkill of the highest order. 

 

The unvaccinated drive up hospitalizations and deaths unnecessarily but otherwise true.

[Doc Brown]

38 minutes ago, ALF said:

It looks like the 2nd dose is wearing off , boosters will keep needing to be had. The unvaccinated will prolong this disaster.

Zero covid isn't possible.  It's here to stay like the viruses that cause the common cold and the flue.  A combination of natural immunity and annual vaccines will help reduce cases and deaths over time.  Society is going to have to learn to live with it though.  Annual or semi annual vaccines should be highly encouraged for everyone (including children) and especially the most vulnerable.  I'm apathetic to mask mandates but I guess it's fine when you see a drastic increase in cases.  No shutdowns.

 

I'm against forced mandates though because the virus simply isn't deadly enough among the non vulnerable to justify it.  Vaccines should be optional for everyone and up to the parents to decide for their children.  Pitting the vaccinated against the unvaccinated is unnecessary.

[Boatdrinks]

44 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

Zero covid isn't possible.  It's here to stay like the viruses that cause the common cold and the flue.  A combination of natural immunity and annual vaccines will help reduce cases and deaths over time.  Society is going to have to learn to live with it though.  Annual or semi annual vaccines should be highly encouraged for everyone (including children) and especially the most vulnerable.  I'm apathetic to mask mandates but I guess it's fine when you see a drastic increase in cases.  No shutdowns.

 

I'm against forced mandates though because the virus simply isn't deadly enough among the non vulnerable to justify it.  Vaccines should be optional for everyone and up to the parents to decide for their children.  Pitting the vaccinated against the unvaccinated is unnecessary.

Good post and I agree on all but the mask mandates. Nothing should be mandated imo but wear if one desires it for what minimal extra protection it provides. Forcing people to cover their faces at the demand of a politician or group of them is strong arming and a mandated show of obedience and compliance that doesn’t belong in a free country such as ours. The covering of ones face in public is far outside of American cultural norms and should remain so. It’s typically reserved for Halloween , frigid days on ski slopes, and bank robberies. 

[Boatdrinks]

1 hour ago, Sundancer said:

 

The unvaccinated drive up hospitalizations and deaths unnecessarily but otherwise true.

They may slightly, but so do smokers , boozers, drug addicts etc. At this point it doesn’t matter much with vaccine widely available and therapeutics on the way. People die every single day and it’s no different with Covid 19 around. And we know it’s going to be around. 

[Doc Brown]

4 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

Good post and I agree on all but the mask mandates. Nothing should be mandated imo but wear if one desires it for what minimal extra protection it provides. Forcing people to cover their faces at the demand of a politician or group of them is strong arming and a mandated show of obedience and compliance that doesn’t belong in a free country such as ours. The covering of ones face in public is far outside of American cultural norms and should remain so. It’s typically reserved for Halloween , frigid days on ski slopes, and bank robberies. 

As long as the public indoor mask mandates are consistent and implemented/removed by local data (positive case rate, hospitalizations, deaths), I think most people won't have a problem with it.  Consistency is key though.

[Big Blitz]

1 hour ago, Doc Brown said:

Zero covid isn't possible.  It's here to stay like the viruses that cause the common cold and the flue.  A combination of natural immunity and annual vaccines will help reduce cases and deaths over time.  Society is going to have to learn to live with it though.  Annual or semi annual vaccines should be highly encouraged for everyone (including children) and especially the most vulnerable.  I'm apathetic to mask mandates but I guess it's fine when you see a drastic increase in cases.  No shutdowns.

 

I'm against forced mandates though because the virus simply isn't deadly enough among the non vulnerable to justify it.  Vaccines should be optional for everyone and up to the parents to decide for their children.  Pitting the vaccinated against the unvaccinated is unnecessary.

 

 

 

Its too late and we warned all of you from the second 15 days turned into "please government do something" and "the unvaccinated are prolonging all this!!"

 

 

 

[Big Blitz]