Will the Bills Make A Trade?

[appoo]

1 minute ago, That's No Moon said:

The Eagles have no reason to trade Graham or Robey-Coleman. They are in a playoff race they can win 

 

at 2-4-1. I hate that freakin division

[Ed_Formerly_of_Roch]

Could see Beane telling every other GM other than Oliver and Johnson, any other D lineman is available, to the best offer.  And I'm looking for CB and LB  in return.

 

With the extra wild card, there are more teams overall still in the hunt so may be harder all over to find willing trade partners.  I could see 10 teams in the AFC still feeling they have a shot and 13 in the NFC.  Legit shot maybe not, but are they will to start trading away players??

[appoo]

Just getting out infront of this - Hard pass on Everson Griffen

[ILBillsfan]

Nah they really don't have cap room for any big splash trades that people want and I think they are content to ride it out and make changes that need to be done in the offseason and I'm perfectly fine with that 

[billsfan89]

1 hour ago, Logic said:

Theoretically, that’s true.

 

You’ll have to excuse me if I don’t see Brandon Beane trading for a $10million player when the Bills have only $3.5million in space and are going into a 2021 needing to re-sign Matt Milano and seeing a shrunken salary cap league-wide.

 

I don’t think it’s realistic that a responsible and cap-conscious guy like Beane is gonna trade for a guy the Bills can’t rightly afford, let alone an over-30 D-lineman or TE — nor do I think those guys would be the saviors fans are hoping for.

 

The most realistic trade scenario continues to be young guys on rookie deals. The Dalvin Tomlinsons and Josh Jackson’s. Even then, I don’t see it. I’m not saying I wouldn’t LIKE it, just that I don’t think it will happen.  

 

I think you are correct but I also don't think the NFL cap will be 175 next season. I know 175 is the worst case scenario but neither the owners nor the players want that scenario. For one the owners don't want to be completely up against the cap. Secondly the players don't want to risk being pressured to restructure, get cut or take lesser more risky one year deals. 

 

I think they will smooth out the cap for 2021, by that I mean they will borrow from the 2022 and 2023 projected increases from the 17th game and other deals going up. So I think they would be willing to try and get the cap to 195 million in 2021 even if it means the 2022 cap (Which was initially projected to be 227 million) has to stay at 207 million. 

 

The cap would effectively stay relatively flat in 2021 avoiding the traumatic consequences of a 175 million dollar cap and then moderately increase in 2022 and then ramp back up in 2023 and 2024 as expected. 

 

As for the Bills cap situation in 2021 if the cap is 175 they can make some cuts (Hughes, Butler, and Lee Smith being cut get you to 21.1 million dollars in space) and restructure some deals (Easily could restructure Mitch and either Klein or Addision to make some additional space) and probably get to 25-30 million in space which would be enough for rookie deals, resigning Milano and maybe a mid-level addition. 

 

But if they can find a way to get the cap to 195 that would open up a lot of interesting possibilities. They would open with about 23 million in space and then free up another 20-25 million rather easily. The team would be then have 37 players under contract with about 45 million in cap space if you cut Hughes, Lee Smith and Butler. 

 

That would leave you with enough space to resign Milano, sign your rookies, have emergency money and either make a big addition or several mid-level additions. You basically would have about 15-18 million (depending on what type of deal Milano wants and what the rookie slots are) to add to a solid roster. 

[MAJBobby]

4 hours ago, ngbills said:

I think the Bills need moves on the Defense anywhere. The offense could use help at TE, possibly RB and OL depth. 

 

List any realistic targets:

 

Defense

DT - Atkins, Q Williams, Tomlinson, Jarrett

DE/LB - Dunlap, Fowler, Kerrigan, Hewitt

DB -  Poole, King, Gilmore

 

Offense

TE's - Rudolph, Fells or Njoku

WR's - Will Fuller or John Ross 

RB's - Breida, Freeman, Lindsay

 

I don’t think they can actually. Have to move money out first. 
 

only sitting at 3.1M in space. 

[Augie]

3 hours ago, Rc2catch said:

I think some fans on here have unrealistic expectations. How many players are actually available for trade? How many can we afford into our cap? How many can be had at a decent value? The options are getting a little slim now aren’t they? 

Fans like to talk about trades. Trades RARELY happen. 

 

I voted no/no. I don’t want to overpay for anyone, but I’ll trust our FO. I try not to make myself crazy over things I can’t control. 

[GreggTX]

I can't say how much of our problems are injury related. Perhaps we have several players playing at 90% because they are playing hurt. If I don't know more about this, I can't say we need to replace anyone.

 

Hughes can still play well and we just added Addison and Epenese. We could use a true NT, but no more average DT's please. A CB would be good, but would have to fit our scheme and we have several average CB's so it would need to be a very good player. A Guard or LT (move Dawkins inside) would be really nice, but again, I'd only want a very good one. Same with TE as Kroft is average and Knox hasn't come around yet.

 

If they feel the need and it's a favorable deal, OK, but get an elite player or don't bother.

[machine gun kelly]

57 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

 

I think you are correct but I also don't think the NFL cap will be 175 next season. I know 175 is the worst case scenario but neither the owners nor the players want that scenario. For one the owners don't want to be completely up against the cap. Secondly the players don't want to risk being pressured to restructure, get cut or take lesser more risky one year deals. 

 

I think they will smooth out the cap for 2021, by that I mean they will borrow from the 2022 and 2023 projected increases from the 17th game and other deals going up. So I think they would be willing to try and get the cap to 195 million in 2021 even if it means the 2022 cap (Which was initially projected to be 227 million) has to stay at 207 million. 

 

The cap would effectively stay relatively flat in 2021 avoiding the traumatic consequences of a 175 million dollar cap and then moderately increase in 2022 and then ramp back up in 2023 and 2024 as expected. 

 

As for the Bills cap situation in 2021 if the cap is 175 they can make some cuts (Hughes, Butler, and Lee Smith being cut get you to 21.1 million dollars in space) and restructure some deals (Easily could restructure Mitch and either Klein or Addision to make some additional space) and probably get to 25-30 million in space which would be enough for rookie deals, resigning Milano and maybe a mid-level addition. 

 

But if they can find a way to get the cap to 195 that would open up a lot of interesting possibilities. They would open with about 23 million in space and then free up another 20-25 million rather easily. The team would be then have 37 players under contract with about 45 million in cap space if you cut Hughes, Lee Smith and Butler. 

 

That would leave you with enough space to resign Milano, sign your rookies, have emergency money and either make a big addition or several mid-level additions. You basically would have about 15-18 million (depending on what type of deal Milano wants and what the rookie slots are) to add to a solid roster. 

89, you’re making way too much logical sense when there are so many Madden/Fantasy people and by nature not reality thinks we should trade for Donald, and 20 other people that will never happen in a million years.  I can’t stand you’re common sense.
 

All kidding aside, thanks for injecting a little reality.

 

[dgrochester55]

I feel a little better about the defense after seeing the effort in the second half yesterday, but Buffalo still needs help in the front seven, particularly linebacker depth behind Edmunds and Milano.   Dodson was serviceable until he got hurt, but Lacey hasnt shown me anything, Makavetich is a special teamer and Klein is a complete liability on passing downs.

 

I wouldn't want to give up too much, but a good veteran linebacker would be worth giving up a late round pick.  If not a trade, there has to be some upgrades on a practice squad somewhere or on the free agent market.

Edited October 26, 2020 by dgrochester55

[Nextmanup]

I voted "yes" and "no."

I think we do a minor trade and bring in a minor player that doesn't get anyone too excited.

 

If we don't, it doesn't really bother me.

 

 

[ColoradoBills]

1 hour ago, billsfan89 said:

 

I think you are correct but I also don't think the NFL cap will be 175 next season. I know 175 is the worst case scenario but neither the owners nor the players want that scenario. For one the owners don't want to be completely up against the cap. Secondly the players don't want to risk being pressured to restructure, get cut or take lesser more risky one year deals. 

 

I think they will smooth out the cap for 2021, by that I mean they will borrow from the 2022 and 2023 projected increases from the 17th game and other deals going up. So I think they would be willing to try and get the cap to 195 million in 2021 even if it means the 2022 cap (Which was initially projected to be 227 million) has to stay at 207 million. 

 

The cap would effectively stay relatively flat in 2021 avoiding the traumatic consequences of a 175 million dollar cap and then moderately increase in 2022 and then ramp back up in 2023 and 2024 as expected. 

 

As for the Bills cap situation in 2021 if the cap is 175 they can make some cuts (Hughes, Butler, and Lee Smith being cut get you to 21.1 million dollars in space) and restructure some deals (Easily could restructure Mitch and either Klein or Addision to make some additional space) and probably get to 25-30 million in space which would be enough for rookie deals, resigning Milano and maybe a mid-level addition. 

 

But if they can find a way to get the cap to 195 that would open up a lot of interesting possibilities. They would open with about 23 million in space and then free up another 20-25 million rather easily. The team would be then have 37 players under contract with about 45 million in cap space if you cut Hughes, Lee Smith and Butler. 

 

That would leave you with enough space to resign Milano, sign your rookies, have emergency money and either make a big addition or several mid-level additions. You basically would have about 15-18 million (depending on what type of deal Milano wants and what the rookie slots are) to add to a solid roster. 

 

Great post and well said 89.  I spend a lot of time looking at the money side of the NFL and I think you are dead on.

I might not think 195M is a hard number but it should be above the 175M floor.

Your scenario for the Bills cap is well thought out.  I'd say Hughes and/or Addison but that's just me.  Keep 1 or get some UFAs who get dumped by

teams in worse cap money than the Bills.

 

I'm still waiting to see how the Ravens fit in the Yannick trade.  They still are 6+M over cap and they got a lot of work to do signing high dollar

UFAs next year.  Yannick's 5 day Covid period should be over tomorrow or the next day.

[billsfan89]

3 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

Great post and well said 89.  I spend a lot of time looking at the money side of the NFL and I think you are dead on.

I might not think 195M is a hard number but it should be above the 175M floor.

Your scenario for the Bills cap is well thought out.  I'd say Hughes and/or Addison but that's just me.  Keep 1 or get some UFAs who get dumped by

teams in worse cap money than the Bills.

 

I'm still waiting to see how the Ravens fit in the Yannick trade.  They still are 6+M over cap and they got a lot of work to do signing high dollar

UFAs next year.  Yannick's 5 day Covid period should be over tomorrow or the next day.

 

Looking at the 2022, 2023 and 2024 cap numbers and its actually very easy for the NFL to keep the cap at 195 for 2021, by 2024 the cap is supposed to be 256 million. I think they could easily borrow money from each of those caps to make the 2021 cap stay flat at 200 million or simply be a small cut. I don't see why it makes sense from the players perspective and the NFL's competitive perspective to have the cap go from 175 million in 2021 to 227 million in 2022. Why not just keep the 2021 cap at 195 and the 2022 at 207? The cap still goes up 12 million in 2022 and then the 2023 and 2024 increases still occur unobstructed. 

[The Jokeman]

2 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

Great post and well said 89.  I spend a lot of time looking at the money side of the NFL and I think you are dead on.

I might not think 195M is a hard number but it should be above the 175M floor.

Your scenario for the Bills cap is well thought out.  I'd say Hughes and/or Addison but that's just me.  Keep 1 or get some UFAs who get dumped by

teams in worse cap money than the Bills.

 

I'm still waiting to see how the Ravens fit in the Yannick trade.  They still are 6+M over cap and they got a lot of work to do signing high dollar

UFAs next year.  Yannick's 5 day Covid period should be over tomorrow or the next day.

The Bills can cut Butler next year and  clear out $6.8 million alone toss in Trent Murphy's $10 million won't be there. I'm not worried about cap space as Beane structure most of his contracts well for next few seasons.

[ColoradoBills]

3 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

 

Looking at the 2022, 2023 and 2024 cap numbers and its actually very easy for the NFL to keep the cap at 195 for 2021, by 2024 the cap is supposed to be 256 million. I think they could easily borrow money from each of those caps to make the 2021 cap stay flat at 200 million or simply be a small cut. I don't see why it makes sense from the players perspective and the NFL's competitive perspective to have the cap go from 175 million in 2021 to 227 million in 2022. Why not just keep the 2021 cap at 195 and the 2022 at 207? The cap still goes up 12 million in 2022 and then the 2023 and 2024 increases still occur unobstructed. 

 

First, the way I see it is the 175M was an agreement for the floor.  It seems if all the games are played and the TV revenue comes in that alone

can make the number go up.  How much I'm not sure but that will be looked at first I believe.

 

As to the "borrowing" that makes a lot of sense and I'm sure they NFL/NFLPA will discuss that and other options.  If the Covid looks like it's under

control then I'm sure they can figure out where the "borrowed" cash comes from.  They would have to get the real dollars from somewhere.

Then again if the Covid is still a thing come March 2021 then I'm not sure it's a lock.

 

Please don't get me wrong, I'm hoping you are right and I'm sure all the GMs are too!  The GMs got to be talking about this and I'm sure they got

some numbers in mind.

9 minutes ago, The Jokeman said:

The Bills can cut Butler next year and  clear out $6.8 million alone toss in Trent Murphy's $10 million won't be there. I'm not worried about cap space as Beane structure most of his contracts well for next few seasons.

 

I agree about Butler and Murphy's numbers are already gone from next years dollars.  IF the 175M happened it would be very tight for the Bills

but like 89 said in his post, we both believe that number will be higher.  The question is how much higher.

[billsfan89]

2 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

First, the way I see it is the 175M was an agreement for the floor.  It seems if all the games are played and the TV revenue comes in that alone

can make the number go up.  How much I'm not sure but that will be looked at first I believe.

 

As to the "borrowing" that makes a lot of sense and I'm sure they NFL/NFLPA will discuss that and other options.  If the Covid looks like it's under

control then I'm sure they can figure out where the "borrowed" cash comes from.  They would have to get the real dollars from somewhere.

Then again if the Covid is still a thing come March 2021 then I'm not sure it's a lock.

 

Please don't get me wrong, I'm hoping you are right and I'm sure all the GMs are too!  The GMs got to be talking about this and I'm sure they got

some numbers in mind.

 

The "borrowed" cash comes from the cap not going up as much in later years. I think 175 cap would be a complete mess. They have to at least get to 190. But in the end if I can figure this out I am sure high paid football executives can too

[Luka]

All cap issues, draft capital etc aside... I would love to see Quinnen Williams on the line next to Oliver. Really, you could put anyone next to him, he's a monster. Jets are misusing him in a 3-4 and the price is a 2nd rounder (allegedly) for a guy who was 3rd overall in 2019. Rookie deal... help where we need it most...

[ColoradoBills]

3 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

 

The "borrowed" cash comes from the cap not going up as much in later years. I think 175 cap would be a complete mess. They have to at least get to 190. But in the end if I can figure this out I am sure high paid football executives can too

 

I understand that.  It's the actual cash to cap they will have to figure out.  They can't give players money next year they haven't collect yet.

 

[Bigantall]

5 hours ago, ChanticleerBillsFan said:

2017 - making a playoff push we traded for Benjamin. Clearest issue was offense. 
2018 - no playoffs hopes at deadline  
2019 - attempted to trade for Diggs. Clearest is was offense. 
2020 - playoff push, clearest issue is Defense. They won’t overspend and I think that is what has to be kept in mind but I expect them to make a move defensively to try and get our Defense back on track. 

 

5 hours ago, Rc2catch said:

I think some fans on here have unrealistic expectations. How many players are actually available for trade? How many can we afford into our cap? How many can be had at a decent value? The options are getting a little slim now aren’t they? 

I for one hope we do something especially on defense but l swear if they go to our farm team Carolina Panthers l will scream no more players from that team!

[BADOLBILZ]

5 hours ago, ngbills said:

I think the Bills need moves on the Defense anywhere. The offense could use help at TE, possibly RB and OL depth. 

 

List any realistic targets:

 

Defense

DT - Atkins, Q Williams, Tomlinson, Jarrett

DE/LB - Dunlap, Fowler, Kerrigan, Hewitt

DB -  Poole, King, Gilmore

 

Offense

TE's - Rudolph, Fells or Njoku

WR's - Will Fuller or John Ross 

RB's - Breida, Freeman, Lindsay

 

 

 

Will Fuller please.

 

He is averaging 15.8 yards per reception......not an anomaly for a guy with a career 14.6 average.

 

That makes him an ideal John Brown replacement(he'd benefit from 4-6 weeks on the shelf).

 

And Fuller is a guy who would under different circumstances probably fetch a late 3rd rounder.........but his expiring contract, an injury history that makes him unlikely to be re-signed in Houston and $5M still due this season should reduce him to something like a 5th round value.  

 

To me,  as far as the bigger and more commonly discussed names he is probably the biggest potential bang for the buck for the Bills.......who really need to get back to putting up 30 points per game more than anything else, IMO.