Mr. WEO Posted August 29, 2020 Share Posted August 29, 2020 15 hours ago, folz said: We just don't have enough information to have an opinion on the companies internal workings...unless you or someone close to you works there. But this article, however, is definitely leading the reader to believe that there are major problems. He just doesn't back it up with enough evidence for me to accept it on good faith. More than one poster has addressed this in this thread. Scroll up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nextmanup Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 On 8/28/2020 at 9:10 PM, folz said: Ok, I'll admit that I way overestimated how many people would be in the Bills marketing department. I work for a non-major company and our marketing department is a lot more than 3 people (could just be a difference in which jobs are considered under which department in different companies and outsourcing as someone else said). And if it truly was only three people in the department, then I also take back that the headline was inaccurate. If three people were the entire department and they are all gone, then it was the "entire" department. I just assumed it would be more than that. However, why was that not mentioned in the article (that there were only three people in the department)? As written, it does lead one to assume that it was a much bigger department and therefore, a much bigger problem. That is why the number is relevant. If two employees leave a business because they are disgruntled, eh, no big deal, happens all the time. But if it were a wave of employees leaving, then "Oh my gosh, what is going on with the Bills/PSE?" (and as KD in CA has mentioned, you can hardly count a 23-24 year old who is leaving to go back to grad school as an example of a larger issue inside the company). So, I still think the headline was sensationalized, even if technically accurate. Again, I don't know what is going on at PSE and I don't care, as long as it doesn't affect the Bills negatively. That is for the people who work there to deal with as they see fit, or to leave. I'm not defending PSE, I was more commenting on how current "news" articles are specifically given headlines to stir people up about stuff. And I think that headline was specifically written to get people to say, "Oh my gosh, the whole department walked out? I guess it really is a sh&t show over at PSE." And of course, as Bills/Sabers fans we don't want the parent company to be a mess because we don't want it to affect the teams we love (we've been through enough), but I didn't see many people defend, say, Russ Brandon, when everything happened. People will accept a fact when given enough evidence to the fact. But little hints, rumors, and speculation from reporters are not enough to accept something as fact. What facts do we have up to now? There were layoffs a while back and people were unhappy about that and now, a Vice President of marketing has stepped down. Is that enough to assume the company is so poorly run that it is ready to collapse? Also, morale is low in a lot of companies around the country due to the pandemic. Many companies have reduced their staff's wages significantly for the year, while other companies (and there are a lot of them), like PSE, who laid off a lot of people to cope with the pandemic year. Many people are still working from home, which means there is probably less communication and just more ennui in general. And morale is always low at a job when a bunch of people get laid off. Some of those people were your friends, you start to worry about your own job security, etc. But, I have not heard anything specific about why morale is low (other than the layoffs) or how many people we are talking about that have low morale. What if their "sources" are 2-3 employees. Is that enough to say it is widespread? So, why would I jump to a conclusion one way or the other (to either defend or denounce PSE)? We just don't have enough information to have an opinion on the companies internal workings...unless you or someone close to you works there. But this article, however, is definitely leading the reader to believe that there are major problems. He just doesn't back it up with enough evidence for me to accept it on good faith. If 2 or 3 sources all gave independent testimony which corroborated itself and that testimony suggested that it was a widespread problem, going beyond the 3 people who testified, then yes, it can be presumed to be reliable, good information speaking to the state of mind of the entire department, or a large portion of it. Also, any discussion of dysfunctionality at the Bills has to be interpreted within the framework of total dysfunction at the Sabres, which is widespread, huge, and very well documented. The Pegulas don't enjoy a benefit of the doubt anymore. They've turned the Sabres into arguably the worst franchise in the NHL over a sustained period of time now. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 On 8/28/2020 at 7:11 PM, Mango said: Hahaha. You think that there is some corporate formula that necessitates, or even implies, the need for a President to be a Vice President? Or that this is even common. Dude, titles aren’t even linear in that way between departments in the same company, let alone enough to make this some big gotcha moment proving something.What a wild statement. There are a lot of people in this thread who have clearly never worked in a corporate environment. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted August 30, 2020 Share Posted August 30, 2020 42 minutes ago, KD in CA said: There are a lot of people in this thread who have clearly never worked in a corporate environment. Guilty as charged and lesson learned. But that's not even a major point. If a report trying to claim that an entire marketing department quit due to low morale boils down to one person leaving under unknown circumstances (because they were never interviewed), another who is a kid leaving to go back to grad school and a third who hasn't even been in the marketing department for probably a year and still working elsewhere for the company, it's shoddy journalism. I have little doubt that it was in response to McD signing that extension after Graham earlier saying he was having doubts and him trying to save face. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan2313 Posted August 31, 2020 Share Posted August 31, 2020 The VP left for a job in Chicago. The other two left on their own also. Not seeing the big deal here.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dablitzkrieg Posted August 31, 2020 Share Posted August 31, 2020 I just wanted to hop on and say I don't give two ***** about the marketing department. Just win baby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted August 31, 2020 Share Posted August 31, 2020 12 hours ago, BillsFan2313 said: The VP left for a job in Chicago. The other two left on their own also. Not seeing the big deal here.... Got a link on the VP? I see that her husband is (still?) a writer for the Buffalo News. And again one of them has been an athletic trainer since last year, not in the marketing department. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ndirish1978 Posted August 31, 2020 Share Posted August 31, 2020 TG has an axe to grind with the Pegulas. 3 people leave and "the entire marketing department" is used to try and fan the flames of pretty much nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corta765 Posted August 31, 2020 Share Posted August 31, 2020 On 8/27/2020 at 11:50 AM, Mango said: But to your point, they just aren't good with the people management portion of managing the business. I get the sense that they have had a bit too much money for a bit too long, and have lost touch. "Maintain family lifestyle" not only got said, but made it into a ***** slide deck. They own the team, they can do what they like with it, I get it. Doesn't change the fact that they are doing a poor job with most of it. I have always thought that once the Bills were bought the entire focus went to that and literally everything else became secondary. Up until the Bills it seemed like the general environment was pretty decent with the Sabres despite the losing and people had good things to say. The Bills made them a bit out of touch with whats underneath in their orgs and with the amount of family/friends that is in the org it makes it difficult for equal chances I would think. By the same token with these individuals leaving I can't imagine doing marketing in COVID when you have no fans etc.. to work with is a fun experience anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heitz Posted August 31, 2020 Share Posted August 31, 2020 On 8/28/2020 at 10:06 PM, Doc said: It certainly is material if they weren't good at their jobs. Or if their jobs are being consolidated. Or if one of them is a college kid going back to graduate school. Did Timmy bother to interview any of them? And the marketing department consists of just a VP of marketing, marketing coordinator and marketing manager? Who/where is the President of marketing? You'd think a marketing department would have one. BTW, the Kelly Baker that's mentioned was a "content marketing coordinator" for a brief period in 2019 and has been an athletic trainer for the Bills since. No idea. But if that person was someone who left, I nominate you to take his/her place. They also have a Director level, 'cause it's on TeamWork. And many companies don't have a President of Marketing, typically a CMO, a VP and some directors (at least in the F500 companies I work with). Also, as the leading marketing guy on TwoBillsDrive how have the Bills NOT contacted me about these jobs!? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted August 31, 2020 Share Posted August 31, 2020 (edited) So I guess there’s no possibility and that they just told the ‘marketing department’ of 3 that likely doesn’t have much work to do in 2020 given that they may not have any fan participation at all that the 3 positions are being eliminated, with the choice of resigning with a package, a lay-off or being termed? It it seems they are still marketing folks around but they may report into PSE Edited August 31, 2020 by Over 29 years of fanhood Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden*Wheels Posted August 31, 2020 Share Posted August 31, 2020 Did said marketing department have anything to do with the Toronto games? ANYTHING? If so, I can get on board with this. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan2313 Posted September 1, 2020 Share Posted September 1, 2020 (edited) On 8/31/2020 at 11:42 AM, Doc said: Got a link on the VP? I see that her husband is (still?) a writer for the Buffalo News. And again one of them has been an athletic trainer since last year, not in the marketing department. A friend of mine works for the Bills. No link Edit: my apologies, I read her text wrong. The coordinator left for a job in Chicago. The VP and Manager left on their own. Edited September 1, 2020 by BillsFan2313 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Posted September 1, 2020 Share Posted September 1, 2020 4 minutes ago, BillsFan2313 said: A friend of mine works for the Bills. No link Edit: my apologies, I read her text wrong. The coordinator left for a job in Chicago. The VP and Manager left on their own. I thought the coordinator left to go to grad school? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan2313 Posted September 1, 2020 Share Posted September 1, 2020 4 minutes ago, Doc said: I thought the coordinator left to go to grad school? Nope, new job in Chicago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffaloboyinATL Posted September 2, 2020 Share Posted September 2, 2020 What will we do without the creative minds behind the name Bills Stadium. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted September 2, 2020 Share Posted September 2, 2020 5 minutes ago, buffaloboyinATL said: What will we do without the creative minds behind the name Bills Stadium. Did you not know they resigned in protest of selection of that name? I wonder how much commission they lost being unable to sell name for a year..... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted September 2, 2020 Share Posted September 2, 2020 1 hour ago, sahilsharma said: It seems there is not enough stuff for marketing department. What about SEO-manager? Website promotion is an important step in marketing. Of course, marketing manager can do some optimization via different tools but still some areas can be done by real professional. Bills website is managed out of company in Chicago. One time they posted wrong score in game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Not at the table Karlos Posted September 3, 2020 Share Posted September 3, 2020 4 hours ago, Limeaid said: Bills website is managed out of company in Chicago. One time they posted wrong score in game. Do they at least have the 2020 schedule up? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted September 3, 2020 Share Posted September 3, 2020 Just now, Not at the table Karlos said: Do they at least have the 2020 schedule up? Check before you ask or take a cheap shot at someone who pays the Bills for this website. You really do not think that banner people see when they are not logged in pays for it, do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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