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Can Stefon Diggs Emerge as a Superstar in Buffalo?

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14 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

If he puts up numbers, he will be.  And that’s my worry.  Diggs could play major role in the offense and not have the numbers to show for it.  Julio Jones’ numbers don’t come close to reflecting what he means to the Falcons.  Diggs should draw coverage to help out other receivers but will he happy doing that? He wasn’t in Minnesota.  I think it could be a Disaster if Allen has to force him the ball.  

 

It's comforting to me that you find reasons to worry about even the good things that happen to the Bills.

 

You should stay inside today.  It might rain pianos.

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8 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I'm intrigued as to who you think all these other playmakers are? Last season Brown had a thousand yards, Beasley had just under 800. Dawson Knox was the next best with 388. Diggs is going to take some of Brown's targets and he will take targets that didn't exist last year (ie the use of a 2nd genuine outside receiver). He may even eat into Beasley's targets a little if the Bills get creative and move him around. I guess I just think the Bills should be throwing to Diggs 8-10 times every game. He is a guy they should make an effort to feature. If I am coordinating against the Bills next year and Diggs goes 3 for 45 but Beasley has 8 for 80 I think I have won that battle. I like Beas, he is a good slot receiver, but if the Bills are going to truly become a dangerous NFL offense they are going to have to feature Stefon Diggs and sometimes that will mean forcing the ball to him, because he is the only elite playmaker on the team.

The other people are still going to get their touches and it is the people you named. Another year in the system and another year of growth for all of them. Brown, Beasley, Knox, then we added Davis and Hodgins. We still have to see where/if Duke/Foster fit in. We also added Moss to pair with Singletary so I believe we will still run the ball quite a bit, as well as utilize them out of the backfield. Unless this offense turns into a juggernaut then Diggs is not going to have a 100 catch, 1'400 yd, 10 TD season where they start to classify him as a superstar. 

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6 minutes ago, H2o said:

The other people are still going to get their touches and it is the people you named. Another year in the system and another year of growth for all of them. Brown, Beasley, Knox, then we added Davis and Hodgins. We still have to see where/if Duke/Foster fit in. We also added Moss to pair with Singletary so I believe we will still run the ball quite a bit, as well as utilize them out of the backfield. Unless this offense turns into a juggernaut then Diggs is not going to have a 100 catch, 1'400 yd, 10 TD season where they start to classify him as a superstar. 

 

So I think Brown and Beasley's numbers will both be down. I think Knox's could have a nice uptick if he just makes the plays that were there for him and he missed last year. But the Bills need to feature Stefon Diggs. He is so much better than everyone else they have it is scary. 1,400 yards and 10 touchdowns? Maybe not... but I don't think it is that far out of the ball park for where expectations should be.

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I’ve been trying to be cautiously optimistic about the acquisition of Diggs. But, I gotta say it’s not like drafting a “Watkins” and rolling the dice with what kind of professional you will get! Maybe it will work out, maybe not. Diggs is a known commodity! Tremendous will to compete and wants to win badly!! It sounds like that is what led to his problems in Minnesota. He knows he can be used more and he wasn’t. Of course things like injuries could keep him sidelined but if he is on the field he will be a difference maker. He will open this offense up! Josh will have to spread the ball around to keep defenses guessing but there is no question who is the primary target now!!!

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As long as he realizes that he will get the bulk of the coverage and he's willing to except that role and he's able to keep his inner Diva under raps to be the team player that they hope he is then everything will be alright but if he can't keep i think not only the coaches will have trouble with it but i know myself as a fan I will !

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3 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I'm intrigued as to who you think all these other playmakers are? Last season Brown had a thousand yards, Beasley had just under 800. Dawson Knox was the next best with 388. Diggs is going to take some of Brown's targets and he will take targets that didn't exist last year (ie the use of a 2nd genuine outside receiver). He may even eat into Beasley's targets a little if the Bills get creative and move him around. I guess I just think the Bills should be throwing to Diggs 8-10 times every game. He is a guy they should make an effort to feature. If I am coordinating against the Bills next year and Diggs goes 3 for 45 but Beasley has 8 for 80 I think I have won that battle. I like Beas, he is a good slot receiver, but if the Bills are going to truly become a dangerous NFL offense they are going to have to feature Stefon Diggs and sometimes that will mean forcing the ball to him, because he is the only elite playmaker on the team.

I don't agree with this.   I think the Bills will have a balanced offense, and no one except Allen will be talked about as a superstar.   I think the objective is to have an offense where there are a lot of players are threats because of the balance.   Look at Kansas City.   There's no one there who dominates in a way that makes me say superstar.   Not Kelce, not Hill, not a running back.   Really good players, but no one who is the focus of the offense.   Their offense doesn't succeed by forcing the ball to anyone.  

 

Diggs should be the most talented guy on the offense, but I don't think the offense will go through him.  There will be games when he goes 3 for 45 because the DC has sold out to stop him, but Brown or Beasley or Singletary or Moss will have big days.  At least that's the objective.   You're describing the Belichick philosophy - stop what the other team does best and challenge them to beat you.   McDermott's objective is to be happy to oblige.   

 

Brown is an excellent #2 and Beasley is a good #3.   They're going to do damage if the defense overloads on Diggs.   Singletary is a very good running back, and it looks like Moss may be the same.   They're going to do damage if the defense sells out to stop the pass.   

 

Balance is the objective, not superstars.  

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7 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I don't agree with this.   I think the Bills will have a balanced offense, and no one except Allen will be talked about as a superstar.   I think the objective is to have an offense where there are a lot of players are threats because of the balance.   Look at Kansas City.   There's no one there who dominates in a way that makes me say superstar.   Not Kelce, not Hill, not a running back.   Really good players, but no one who is the focus of the offense.   Their offense doesn't succeed by forcing the ball to anyone.  

 

Diggs should be the most talented guy on the offense, but I don't think the offense will go through him.  There will be games when he goes 3 for 45 because the DC has sold out to stop him, but Brown or Beasley or Singletary or Moss will have big days.  At least that's the objective.   You're describing the Belichick philosophy - stop what the other team does best and challenge them to beat you.   McDermott's objective is to be happy to oblige.   

 

Brown is an excellent #2 and Beasley is a good #3.   They're going to do damage if the defense overloads on Diggs.   Singletary is a very good running back, and it looks like Moss may be the same.   They're going to do damage if the defense sells out to stop the pass.   

 

Balance is the objective, not superstars.  

 

Hill and Kelce are superstars.

 

And I know what the Bills as a team that goes 8 for 80 with Beasley they are a 21 point offense. If we want them to be more than that it comes down to can they make maximum use of this elite weapon they have just added. It isn't a knock on Beasley or Brown. They are good players. But if this offense is going to take off then it needs to take off by using Stefon Diggs early and often. He needs to be the focal point of the game plan offensively and they need to have ways to get him touches.

Edited by GunnerBill
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1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Hill and Kelce are superstars.

See, there's a definitional problem here.   

 

I have trouble calling any tight end a superstar, because tight ends, even one as good as Kelce, don't carry an offense.   I'll give you that he's been excellent - four straight thousand-yard seasons, but he doesn't carry their offense the way you were saying that Diggs needs to.   They don't force the ball to Kelce.  

 

Hill is definitely not a superstar.  He is a sensational player, but they definitely do not force the ball to him.   They run plays to get him the ball, sure.   

 

A superstar is a guy who can have impact even a bad team.   If the Bills had traded a first, a fourth and a seventh for Hill, I would have been unhappy.   Actually, I would have been unhappy if they'd traded that for Kelce, because Kelce would have had the impact on the Bills offense that I expect Diggs will have.     

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2 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

See, there's a definitional problem here.   

 

I have trouble calling any tight end a superstar, because tight ends, even one as good as Kelce, don't carry an offense.   I'll give you that he's been excellent - four straight thousand-yard seasons, but he doesn't carry their offense the way you were saying that Diggs needs to.   They don't force the ball to Kelce.  

 

Hill is definitely not a superstar.  He is a sensational player, but they definitely do not force the ball to him.   They run plays to get him the ball, sure.   

 

A superstar is a guy who can have impact even a bad team.   If the Bills had traded a first, a fourth and a seventh for Hill, I would have been unhappy.   Actually, I would have been unhappy if they'd traded that for Kelce, because Kelce would have had the impact on the Bills offense that I expect Diggs will have.     

 

Yea. We differ pretty wildly on our view of Hill and Kelce. There is no point debating this point we are miles away from each other. 

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8 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

See, there's a definitional problem here.   

 

I have trouble calling any tight end a superstar, because tight ends, even one as good as Kelce, don't carry an offense.   I'll give you that he's been excellent - four straight thousand-yard seasons, but he doesn't carry their offense the way you were saying that Diggs needs to.   They don't force the ball to Kelce.  

 

Hill is definitely not a superstar.  He is a sensational player, but they definitely do not force the ball to him.   They run plays to get him the ball, sure.   

 

A superstar is a guy who can have impact even a bad team.   If the Bills had traded a first, a fourth and a seventh for Hill, I would have been unhappy.   Actually, I would have been unhappy if they'd traded that for Kelce, because Kelce would have had the impact on the Bills offense that I expect Diggs will have.     

 

Who in the league other than QB is superstar by your definition? 

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11 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

See, there's a definitional problem here.   

 

I have trouble calling any tight end a superstar, because tight ends, even one as good as Kelce, don't carry an offense.   I'll give you that he's been excellent - four straight thousand-yard seasons, but he doesn't carry their offense the way you were saying that Diggs needs to.   They don't force the ball to Kelce.  

 

Hill is definitely not a superstar.  He is a sensational player, but they definitely do not force the ball to him.   They run plays to get him the ball, sure.   

 

A superstar is a guy who can have impact even a bad team.   If the Bills had traded a first, a fourth and a seventh for Hill, I would have been unhappy.   Actually, I would have been unhappy if they'd traded that for Kelce, because Kelce would have had the impact on the Bills offense that I expect Diggs will have.     

Lol what?

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2 minutes ago, No_Matter_What said:

 

Who in the league other than QB is superstar by your definition? 

For me, a superstar is a generational player, for sure a first-ballot Hall of Famer.    He is a player who drives the game planning of opponents virtually every game.   He has been consistently top-10 statistically.    Putting aside quarterbacks, there may be only five or ten superstars in the league at any time.  

 

JJ Watt is one.  I'm not sure there's a receiver in the league I'd call a superstar - maybe Julio Jones.   Let's see how Hopkins does in Arizona before I give him the nod.   Fitgerald was.   Megatron.   These are guys who are or were truly dominant year after year.   

 

I don't know the offensive linemen, but I assume there's an Orlando Pace type guy out there somewhere.   I've never been a huge Jason Peters fan, but I won't argue if someone wants to put him in the category.   

 

I think people attach the word to guys like Vonn MIller and Kahlil Mack, but from my point of view the league has figured out how to control those guys, how to keep them from blowing up games.  People were calling that tight end who played for the Saints a superstar.  Then he went to the Seahawks and then the Packers and we don't hear it now.   

 

A superstar dominates wherever he goes.   I think Kelce would be good on any team, but not nearly so successful as he is with arguably the best QB in the league, one of the best offensive head coaches in the league, and Tyreek Hill and Sammy Watkins on the outside.  

20 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yea. We differ pretty wildly on our view of Hill and Kelce. There is no point debating this point we are miles away from each other. 

I agree.   I responded knowing we disagreed.   I wasn't trying to convince you.   As I just said, my definition of superstar is probably narrower than the way most people use the term these days.   

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28 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

A superstar dominates wherever he goes.   I think Kelce would be good on any team, but not nearly so successful as he is with arguably the best QB in the league, one of the best offensive head coaches in the league, and Tyreek Hill and Sammy Watkins on the outside.  

I agree.   I responded knowing we disagreed.   I wasn't trying to convince you.   As I just said, my definition of superstar is probably narrower than the way most people use the term these days.   

 

I pretty much find the term "Superstar" useless in the discussion of talent. Yes, some so-called superstars are very talented. But IMO the term is typically used to recognize celebrity. To truly be considered one you have a huge advantage if you play in a large media market, self promote, crave media exposure, etc. Diva's have the inside on the Superstar label. Like the label "Rock Star" it actually says little about the person's musical talent.

 

So I think we simply need to know if Diggs will be a great player, a true #1 WR. Leave the stardom out of this. Diggs has already proven to be a great #1 WR, so "emerge" isn't relevent here either.  Will Diggs continue to be a great #1 WR in Buffalo?  I suppose that is a legit question.

Edited by The Dean

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Diggs will enable us to score quickly instead of slogging through a long drive. I think he'll get the targets he's seeking. 

It's very astute of Beane to bring in someone like Diggs instead of hoping a rookie WR fulfills his promise given where Allen is in his development. 

We don't have forever. 

If Diggs and Allen get in sync it could be magical 

Edited by stuvian

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15 minutes ago, The Dean said:

 

I pretty much find the term "Superstar" useless in the discussion of talent. Yes, some so-called superstars are very talented. But IMO the term is typically used to recognize celebrity. To truly be considered one you have a huge advantage if you play in a large media market, self promote, crave media exposure, etc. Diva's have the inside on the Superstar label. Like the label "Rock Star" it actually says little about the person's musical talent.

 

So I think we simply need to know if Diggs will be a great player, a true #1 WR. Leave the stardom out of this. Diggs has already proven to be a great #1 WR, so "emerge" isn't relevent here either.  Will Diggs continue to be a great #1 WR in Buffalo?  I suppose that is a legit question.

Exactly.   

 

 

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20 hours ago, beavis said:

I'm very worried about the run defense. Jerry Hughes gets no favors from the officials. Edmunds has trouble shedding blockers. Oliver is showing everyone why he dropped. Phillips and Lawson gone. Lorax retired. So it's a complete rebuild. Watch the game, and it's all mistakes. Penalities. Getting the play in. Lining up. And new people have to learn all that.

 

If other teams run the ball all day, offense has less chances to score.

 

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30 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

For me, a superstar is a generational player, for sure a first-ballot Hall of Famer.    He is a player who drives the game planning of opponents virtually every game.   He has been consistently top-10 statistically.    Putting aside quarterbacks, there may be only five or ten superstars in the league at any time.  

 

JJ Watt is one.  I'm not sure there's a receiver in the league I'd call a superstar - maybe Julio Jones.   Let's see how Hopkins does in Arizona before I give him the nod.   Fitgerald was.   Megatron.   These are guys who are or were truly dominant year after year.   

 

I don't know the offensive linemen, but I assume there's an Orlando Pace type guy out there somewhere.   I've never been a huge Jason Peters fan, but I won't argue if someone wants to put him in the category.   

 

I think people attach the word to guys like Vonn MIller and Kahlil Mack, but from my point of view the league has figured out how to control those guys, how to keep them from blowing up games.  People were calling that tight end who played for the Saints a superstar.  Then he went to the Seahawks and then the Packers and we don't hear it now.   

 

A superstar dominates wherever he goes.   I think Kelce would be good on any team, but not nearly so successful as he is with arguably the best QB in the league, one of the best offensive head coaches in the league, and Tyreek Hill and Sammy Watkins on the outside.  

I agree.   I responded knowing we disagreed.   I wasn't trying to convince you.   As I just said, my definition of superstar is probably narrower than the way most people use the term these days.   

 

I tend to agree with you Shaw on the overuse of the term.  There are great players and the best of the great players are "Stars"!

The best of the "Stars" are "Superstars".  It's the hyped world that we live in that keeps elevating.

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21 hours ago, MJS said:

Harrison Phillips is coming back and we still have Star. Oliver was a top 10 pick! Edmunds has been getting better and better and soon will be considered an elite MLB

 

I don't think it makes sense to worry about the defensive line or the defense in general.

Oliver will probably be suspended for the 1st two games. I am expecting Oliver to have a big year.

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2 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

Diggs should be the most talented guy on the offense, but I don't think the offense will go through him.  There will be games when he goes 3 for 45 because the DC has sold out to stop him, but Brown or Beasley or Singletary or Moss will have big days.  

I don't think Diggs will ever have that low number of yards.  A DC can't really sell out to stop him because Smoke and Beas are too good already.   They've proven over the years they will hurt a defense.  Also, Diggs is good and getting open against zone or man.  If he did have a clunker of a game i suspect Josh had a clunker (i.e. Missing open throws down field).  

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