Kirby Jackson Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 Just now, MJS said: I'd take like 15 backups over him, if not more. He's a raw rookie QB that played for a small school. So was Josh Allen... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 1 minute ago, Kirby Jackson said: So was Josh Allen... Not even close. Allen was a top 10 pick. And his rookie year before he took a snap I don't think Allen should have been considered one of the best backups in the league either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 Just now, MJS said: Not even close. Allen was a top 10 pick. And his rookie year before he took a snap I don't think Allen should have been considered one of the best backups in the league either. ...and Love could have been a top 10 pick. They are definitely similar as prospects. Allen came in and played after 1 half of the season and held his own. He WOULD have been one of the best backups in the league if he wasn’t immediately a starter. There’s no way Love would be any worse than guys like Chad Henne, Hoyer, Chase Daniel, Colt McCoy, etc... Those guys have a history of mediocrity and no chance to be better. They have never been better than okay and don’t do anything physically, ANYTHING, better than Love (or Herbert or Tua or Hurts). That’s a weird hill to die on. If you want to argue that you’re better with one of those guys or as Schaub or any other low ranked QB go for it. There isn’t a team in the league that would rather have one of those guys than the rookies. Those rookies are all more capable today than those trash vets. The only vets worth $.10 on that list are Keenum, Brissett, Jameis and Dalton. You can have Mariota and Trubisky. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJS Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 Just now, Kirby Jackson said: ...and Love could have been a top 10 pick. They are definitely similar as prospects. Allen came in and played after 1 half of the season and held his own. He WOULD have been one of the best backups in the league if he wasn’t immediately a starter. There’s no way Love would be any worse than guys like Chad Henne, Hoyer, Chase Daniel, Colt McCoy, etc... Those guys have a history of mediocrity and no chance to be better. They have never been better than okay and don’t do anything physically, ANYTHING, better than Love (or Herbert or Tua or Hurts). That’s a weird hill to die on. If you want to argue that you’re better with one of those guys or as Schaub or any other low ranked QB go for it. There isn’t a team in the league that would rather have one of those guys than the rookies. Those rookies are all more capable today than those trash vets. The only vets worth $.10 on that list are Keenum, Brissett, Jameis and Dalton. You can have Mariota and Trubisky. You never know until you see them play. So the rookie backups shouldn't even be ranked, in my opinion. Plenty of high drafted players have turned out to be bad. The list is too long to write here. And many of them won't even be backups because they'll get the chance to start right away or later in the season. And what do most teams do when they have a young QB? They bring in a veteran because they know the young guys can't handle it on their own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 24 minutes ago, MJS said: You never know until you see them play. So the rookie backups shouldn't even be ranked, in my opinion. Plenty of high drafted players have turned out to be bad. The list is too long to write here. And many of them won't even be backups because they'll get the chance to start right away or later in the season. And what do most teams do when they have a young QB? They bring in a veteran because they know the young guys can't handle it on their own. That’s such a weak argument. We don’t know what will happen with Chase Young until he plays a game technically. He is WAY more likely to have double digit sacks than he is to have less than 5. I don’t need him to play a season to realize that. I can look at the skill set and project. It’s the EXACT same with the QBs. Again, we aren’t projecting them to be Patrick Mahomes. We are projecting them to be better than Chad Henne!! It’s not that the young guys can’t handle it on their own. They just want to make sure that they don’t ruin such a big investment by throwing him into a bad situation like the Bills did with EJ. I don’t think that he was ever going to be good but they did him no favors. If Rodgers went down tomorrow for 1 year the Packers would be way better off with Love than those teams with the scrub vets. It’s the opposite of what you’re saying in a lot of ways. I’ve seen enough of Matt Schaub to know that, at 39, he’s not dangerous. The rookies are all potentially dangerous. They will ABSOLUTELY make more plays than the scrub vets because they have more talent. In a scoring league, you need need your number 2 to be able to generate points still. The playmakers can do that. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Otreply Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 2 hours ago, Bangarang said: Barkley is too high Kine bud, it’s why he’s got no arm strength... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thurst44 Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 3 hours ago, Bangarang said: Barkley is too high I'm never gonna get the Barkley hate here (although i'm relieved that it's not going the other way and no one's calling for him to start -- as much as i loved reich, that got old fast). Yes, he's never been great in the NFL, but as a Bill, he's started one game, on the road, against a defense that was having a good year up to that point and put up 41 pts and a 117.4 rtg. He wasn't great in his two games last year, but one was coming in cold against a defense that was having one of the better first halves in NFL history (and frankly, his numbers were comparable to Allen's in that game) and a mop-up meaningless game for us that the other team was trying to win. He's certainly replaceable, but hardly a concern or terrible and I definitely prefer him to A.J. McCarron, Ryan Finley, Jeff Driscoll or Joshua friggin' Dobbs (smart guy, mediocre quarterback). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChans Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 26 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said: That’s such a weak argument. We don’t know what will happen with Chase Young until he plays a game technically. He is WAY more likely to have double digit sacks than he is to have less than 5. I don’t need him to play a season to realize that. I can look at the skill set and project. It’s the EXACT same with the QBs. Again, we aren’t projecting them to be Patrick Mahomes. We are projecting them to be better than Chad Henne!! It’s not that the young guys can’t handle it on their own. They just want to make sure that they don’t ruin such a big investment by throwing him into a bad situation like the Bills did with EJ. I don’t think that he was ever going to be good but they did him no favors. If Rodgers went down tomorrow for 1 year the Packers would be way better off with Love than those teams with the scrub vets. It’s the opposite of what you’re saying in a lot of ways. I’ve seen enough of Matt Schaub to know that, at 39, he’s not dangerous. The rookies are all potentially dangerous. They will ABSOLUTELY make more plays than the scrub vets because they have more talent. In a scoring league, you need need your number 2 to be able to generate points still. The playmakers can do that. Talk that ***** son! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 1 minute ago, thurst44 said: I'm never gonna get the Barkley hate here (although i'm relieved that it's not going the other way and no one's calling for him to start -- as much as i loved reich, that got old fast). Yes, he's never been great in the NFL, but as a Bill, he's started one game, on the road, against a defense that was having a good year up to that point and put up 41 pts and a 117.4 rtg. He wasn't great in his two games last year, but one was coming in cold against a defense that was having one of the better first halves in NFL history (and frankly, his numbers were comparable to Allen's in that game) and a mop-up meaningless game for us that the other team was trying to win. He's certainly replaceable, but hardly a concern or terrible and I definitely prefer him to A.J. McCarron, Ryan Finley, Jeff Driscoll or Joshua friggin' Dobbs (smart guy, mediocre quarterback). There’s no hate, just the harsh reality that he sucks. Sorry. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thurst44 Posted May 8, 2020 Share Posted May 8, 2020 9 minutes ago, Bangarang said: There’s no hate, just the harsh reality that he sucks. Sorry. That's the point though. Playing for the Bills, he... has... not... sucked. But I'll just believe my eyes. I just don't like it when a player has a rep, performs well, but people still lazily go with the reps. You honestly think he's worse than those guys I mentioned even though he has played better than them as a Bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted May 9, 2020 Share Posted May 9, 2020 (edited) 8 minutes ago, thurst44 said: That's the point though. Playing for the Bills, he... has... not... sucked. But I'll just believe my eyes. I guess this would be true if you only count the one game against the Jets and ignore everything else. Quote I just don't like it when a player has a rep, performs well, but people still lazily go with the reps. You honestly think he's worse than those guys I mentioned even though he has played better than them as a Bill. Honestly, he sucks and my original comment was mostly a joke. However, I’m considering dying on this hill just for you. You want to convince he doesn’t suck, you’re going to need more than a decent performance in one game. Edited May 9, 2020 by Bangarang Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan89 Posted May 9, 2020 Share Posted May 9, 2020 6 hours ago, KD in CA said: Matt Schaub is still in the NFL? p.s. insert standard rants about Bills being disrespected below. That was my first thought, backup QB really is the best position in sports. As far as Barkley eh, he is what he is a decent but uninspiring backup QB. I think Barkley is a positive locker room guy so I can see him hanging around for this season and 2021 while Fromm gets a couple of years with the team to get his feet wet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted May 9, 2020 Share Posted May 9, 2020 20 hours ago, GunnerBill said: My conclusion.... the standard of NFL backups is awful. There are guys out of the league more talented than that list. Yep. And backups are backups for a reason. If they were any good, they'd be starters. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brennan Huff Posted May 9, 2020 Share Posted May 9, 2020 16 hours ago, thurst44 said: That's the point though. Playing for the Bills, he... has... not... sucked. But I'll just believe my eyes. He was really good the first half of the Jets game a couple years ago. Hasn’t been good since. But if we’re ranking the hotness of players wives then he’s in the top 10 all day Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mountain Man Posted May 9, 2020 Share Posted May 9, 2020 (edited) Anyone who doesnt rate Matt Schaub 32 hasn't watched Matt Schaub in the last 5 years. That list is a joke. AJ McCarron above Barkley? 22 hours ago, papazoid said: The importance of the backup quarterback position in the NFL shouldn't be understated. https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/nfl-backup-qb-power-rankings-from-1-32-andy-dalton-gives-cowboys-elite-option-behind-dak-prescott/ The importance of knowing something about football if you are creating power rankings shouldn't be understated. You would get a better list if the names had been selected at random Edited May 9, 2020 by Mountain Man Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMF2006 Posted May 9, 2020 Share Posted May 9, 2020 21 hours ago, RyanC883 said: wow, didn't realize Schaub is still playing. I think ranking the rookies at all is a bit misleading, given that they have never played a down. That said, I agree with the importance of having a good backup, esp. with a mobile QB like Allen. I'd go after Cam and/or try to upgrade from anyone who is cut. His arm is still strong enough...…….to hold a clipboard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted May 9, 2020 Share Posted May 9, 2020 18 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said: That’s such a weak argument. We don’t know what will happen with Chase Young until he plays a game technically. He is WAY more likely to have double digit sacks than he is to have less than 5. I don’t need him to play a season to realize that. I can look at the skill set and project. It’s the EXACT same with the QBs. Again, we aren’t projecting them to be Patrick Mahomes. We are projecting them to be better than Chad Henne!! It’s not that the young guys can’t handle it on their own. They just want to make sure that they don’t ruin such a big investment by throwing him into a bad situation like the Bills did with EJ. I don’t think that he was ever going to be good but they did him no favors. If Rodgers went down tomorrow for 1 year the Packers would be way better off with Love than those teams with the scrub vets. It’s the opposite of what you’re saying in a lot of ways. I’ve seen enough of Matt Schaub to know that, at 39, he’s not dangerous. The rookies are all potentially dangerous. They will ABSOLUTELY make more plays than the scrub vets because they have more talent. In a scoring league, you need need your number 2 to be able to generate points still. The playmakers can do that. Hennes been in the league for like over a decade. I can see love not playing in the league that long If you've made it 10 years you did alot right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted May 9, 2020 Share Posted May 9, 2020 6 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: Hennes been in the league for like over a decade. I can see love not playing in the league that long If you've made it 10 years you did alot right Yeah, it means you’re white, non threatening to the starting qb, and is friends with coaches. and I’m kinda tongue in cheek about the white comment but it does seem like terrible white qbs last a long time as backups than other races don’t. 17 hours ago, Bangarang said: There’s no hate, just the harsh reality that he sucks. Sorry. Yeah, I always preface my Barkley sucks comments with he’s a really nice guy. If you have played in 10+games and Have a 65 QBs rating, you’re awful. 19 hours ago, MJS said: You never know until you see them play. So the rookie backups shouldn't even be ranked, in my opinion. Plenty of high drafted players have turned out to be bad. The list is too long to write here. And many of them won't even be backups because they'll get the chance to start right away or later in the season. And what do most teams do when they have a young QB? They bring in a veteran because they know the young guys can't handle it on their own. Your argument is that you would rather have the terrible veteran qb over the young guy with a lot of upside who just hasn’t played? I would take the chance than Love will end up with better than a 65 qb rating. I would bet everything on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted May 9, 2020 Share Posted May 9, 2020 (edited) 10 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said: Yeah, it means you’re white, non threatening to the starting qb, and is friends with coaches. and I’m kinda tongue in cheek about the white comment but it does seem like terrible white qbs last a long time as backups than other races don’t. Yeah, I always preface my Barkley sucks comments with he’s a really nice guy. If you have played in 10+games and Have a 65 QBs rating, you’re awful. Your argument is that you would rather have the terrible veteran qb over the young guy with a lot of upside who just hasn’t played? I would take the chance than Love will end up with better than a 65 qb rating. I would bet everything on that. I would probably delete that comment because it is very far off base NFL coaching is a fraternity with 32 in the world they aren't jeopardizing their career because of a race issue and they think a white backup is less threatening Love can easily be a bust Edited May 9, 2020 by Buffalo716 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted May 9, 2020 Share Posted May 9, 2020 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: I would probably delete that comment because it is very far off base NFL coaching is a fraternity with 32 in the world they aren't jeopardizing their career because of a race issue and they think a white backup is less threatening Love can easily be a bust It was tongue in cheek but I do think there is truth in it. How many black backups qbs are there? Why did Trubisky go ahead of Watson and Mahomes? I think EJ was really good case for this. Look at his numbers. Had over 100 QB rating the preseason he got cut and no one signed him. He is superior to a lot of backup QBs (dominates Barkley, better numbers than Gabbert and Henne). Why do those guys get the jobs with worse production in a meritocracy business? Jameis Winston signed for a $1 million. Newton is unsigned (though I understand that more). Even after his MVP season, people still question Jackson long term as a qb. I truly believe if Allen has that season, there would zero of those posts. do I think the nfl is racist? No but I do think there are subconscious attitudes towards some things. Especially qb. And save the nfl coaching fraternity thing. It’s one of the biggest joke organizations in all of sports. Terrible coaches get recycled while young guys struggle to get their break. The NFL coaching fraternity is a joke. Andy Reid’s Ed crack head son is now a nfl coach. I’m sure he really paid his dues. and of course Love can be a bust. He’d still be better than Barkley, who is a nice guy but terrible. Edited May 9, 2020 by C.Biscuit97 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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