TheFunPolice Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 I love anything without a dome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 17 minutes ago, The Dean said: I believe Hammer was talking about digging down in OP at New Era, to expand the lower concourse. That is not happening. It's already been addressed somewhere. Pretty much impossible to do. Cheaper to just build a new stadium. Just now, TheFunPolice said: I love anything without a dome That would be a waste of money. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 Just now, PromoTheRobot said: That is not happening. It's already been addressed somewhere. Pretty much impossible to do. Cheaper to just build a new stadium. You may very well be right. I'm just pointing out what I got from Hammer's post. And just because a plan has been dismissed as impossible/improbable in the past, doesn't mean conditions/technology can't change enough to make revisiting the idea a possibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 hour ago, The Dean said: IMO, this is the worst of all possible options. Come talk to me in December when the stadium is 1/2 - 2/3 full(actual not paid attendance) because the weather is terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 (edited) 3 minutes ago, LabattBlue said: Come talk to me in December when the stadium is 1/2 - 2/3 full(actual not paid attendance) because the weather is terrible. If the Bills are vying for a playoff berth, I'll bet the stadium is mostly full. BTW, were you at the 51-3 blowout of the Raiders in horrendous weather? I was. The stadium was PACKED! Edited October 16, 2019 by The Dean 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 minute ago, The Dean said: If the Bills are vying for a playoff berth, I'll bet the stadium is mostly full. All depends on the weather. Sitting in 40° and rain for 3-4 hours is not happening for me anymore. Build a domed stadium, and I’d consider going to the December games. Just my personal preference. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 minute ago, LabattBlue said: All depends on the weather. Sitting in 40° and rain for 3-4 hours is not happening for me anymore. Build a domed stadium, and I’d consider going to the December games. Just my personal preference. When it's too tough for them, it's just right for us! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seasons1992 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 hour ago, cd1 said: New Era Field only has customer draw eight days a year during home football games. Eight days of pure Christmas joy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teddy KGB Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 5 hours ago, PetermansRedemption said: Hear me out, HMO, the kiss of death to any thought process Unless that person is sharing the cocaine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thenorthremembers Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 hour ago, DrDawkinstein said: They will re-build the Hockey Arena along with the new downtown Football stadium all at the same time. Or at least as one big, long project. Parking and roadways will be re-done. They arent just going to jam a big new stadium into the existing area. The whole section of the city will be re-done. New entrances to the 190, etc. I dont see where downtown Buffalo has the potential for the new infrastructure. The roads are narrow to the buildings now. I guess we will see, but I am not sure why you would force the issues when you have wide roads and acres to build on in Orchard Park. Resettling the neighbors in OP would be a lot easier than re-doing downtown for a football stadium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 3 hours ago, Don Otreply said: I have said pretty much the same thing. New stadium downtown with the Pegula’s other large investments, keeping the Bills training facilities in OP, and remove the vast majority of the old stadiums seating, keeping enough seating so they can still have fans out there for spring training, and of course keeping the playing field as part of the practice facilities. This is what I would like to see happen. I don’t know, but if the Bills own all that parking area, most of it will be sold off, being there will be no need for so much of it. Go Bills!!! Oh yes....I'm sure the owner of that stadium would be overjoyed to be paying the mortgage on the Bills otherwise empty "spring training" home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, The Dean said: If the Bills are vying for a playoff berth, I'll bet the stadium is mostly full. BTW, were you at the 51-3 blowout of the Raiders in horrendous weather? I was. The stadium was PACKED! And I will bet you are wrong. I remember the Super Bowl years very well and even then the team had trouble selling out games, even playoff games. Ralph and Ch.2 (NBC had Sunday games then) had to buy out thousands of remaining seats to beat the blackout. (Remember blackouts?) Of course when going to Super Bowls was still a new experience, Rich Stadium was rocking (like that 51-3 game.) But lose one or two Super Bowls and people start cooling off. Houston comeback playoff game? Blacked out. Fourth AFC Championship? Ralph had to buy the game out just so it got on local TV. And of course you aren't going to be playoff bound every year. So what happens with attendance in that open air stadium then? 1 hour ago, thenorthremembers said: I dont see where downtown Buffalo has the potential for the new infrastructure. The roads are narrow to the buildings now. I guess we will see, but I am not sure why you would force the issues when you have wide roads and acres to build on in Orchard Park. Resettling the neighbors in OP would be a lot easier than re-doing downtown for a football stadium. You'd be surprised how it can get done. There is nothing so unique about Buffalo that hasn't been addressed in every NFL city with an urban stadium site. 2 hours ago, cd1 said: Concourses for who? New Era Field only has customer draw eight days a year during home football games. 10 actually with preseason but that may soon change. Edited October 16, 2019 by PromoTheRobot 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 (edited) Key Bank center is still pretty damn nice for a hockey venue And I will NEVER understand why people want us to be like everyone else... Ooh the colts have a shiny downtown stadium so we need 1 Thankfully the world doesn't work like that and the stadium is fine where it is, even if a new one goes up across the parking lot The last thing the city needs is a downtown stadium 12 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said: And I will bet you are wrong. I remember the Super Bowl years very well and even then the team had trouble selling out games, even playoff games. Ralph and Ch.2 (NBC had Sunday games then) had to buy out thousands of remaining seats to beat the blackout. (Remember blackouts?) Of course when going to Super Bowls were still a new experience, Rich Stadium was rocking (like that 51-3 game.) But lose one or two Super Bowls and people start cooling off. Houston comeback playoff game? Blacked out. Fourth AFC Championship? Ralph had to buy the game out just so it got on local TV. And of course you aren't going to be playoff bound every year. So what happens with attendance in that open air stadium then? You'd be surprised how it can get done. There is nothing so unique about Buffalo that hasn't been addressed in every NFL city with an urban stadium site. 10 actually with preseason but that may soon change. Again I've been saying for years there is .. Buffalos grid pattern is NOT like other American city. It is built in a European style around park systems and a non standard grid Alot would need to be altered to make it's successful. It's really not as simple as it sounds Edited October 16, 2019 by Buffalo716 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 3 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: Key Bank center is still pretty damn nice for a hockey venue And I will NEVER understand why people want us to be like everyone else... Ooh the colts have a shiny downtown stadium so we need 1 Thankfully the world doesn't work like that and the stadium is fine where it is, even if a new one goes up across the parking lot The last thing the city needs is a downtown stadium Again I've been saying for years there is .. Buffalos grid pattern is NOT like other American city. It is built in a European style around park systems and a non standard grid Alot would need to be altered to make it's successful That is not true. Yes, Olmstead built his beautiful ring of parks but they are miles from Downtown. The area where a new stadium is likely to go, Perry Projects, is just your usual grid. Go to Detroit, go to Minneapolis, even Green Bay, Cleveland, Cincinnati or Chicago. It's all the same. And those cities don't collapse on football Sundays. Don't forget there is public transit too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 (edited) 19 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said: That is not true. Yes, Olmstead built his beautiful ring of parks but they are miles from Downtown. The area where a new stadium is likely to go, Perry Projects, is just your usual grid. Go to Detroit, go to Minneapolis, even Green Bay, Cleveland, Cincinnati or Chicago. It's all the same. And those cities don't collapse on football Sundays. Don't forget there is public transit too. The park systems just show how the city is connected with a RADICAL GRID, which you can still see, it was built to maximize walking and bike riding over cars There are only 3 cities in America that share a grid plan with buffalo and Minneapolis and Cleveland and Detroit are not one I don't believe And you CANNOT RELY on public transit. The Bills or sabres cannot use that mindset.. they need to have exitways and spaces for 100,000 people on Bills Sundays downtown, which isn't available yet People come from Toronto and Rochester and Syracuse and the burbs, there needs to be a clean exit from downtown so people aren't backed up for 3-4-5 hours which is totally possible Edited October 16, 2019 by Buffalo716 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 7 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said: The park systems just show how the city is connected with a RADICAL GRID, which you can still see There are only 3 cities in America that share a grid plan with buffalo and Minneapolis and Cleveland and Detroit are not one. And you CANNOT RELY on public transit. The Bills or sabres cannot use that mindset.. they need to have exitways and spaces for 100,000 people on Bills Sundays downtown, which isn't available yet People come from Toronto and Rochester and Syracuse and the burbs, there needs to be a clean exit from downtown so people aren't backed up for 3-4-5 hours which is totally possible Without radical downtown reconstruction, and a MAJOR rapid transit infrastructure improvement process, a downtown stadium in Buffalo is a recipe for disaster, IMO. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 minute ago, The Dean said: Without radical downtown reconstruction, and a MAJOR rapid transit infrastructure improvement process, a downtown stadium in Buffalo is a recipe for disaster, IMO. Agree 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 I don't think there will be any news on the stadium situation until after the new CBA is signed after the 2020 season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Otreply Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 2 hours ago, Mr. WEO said: Oh yes....I'm sure the owner of that stadium would be overjoyed to be paying the mortgage on the Bills otherwise empty "spring training" home. Weirder stuff than that has happened, deals are worked out all the time, big money always talks loudest in America, always been that way. Any ways, old stadiums have been torn down more than once, this would (should it happen)just be another time. Hell, for all we know they may very well build a huge concourse around the existing stadium, with every luxury you or I could imagine, big money talks the loudest... Go Bills!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 minute ago, Don Otreply said: Weirder stuff than that has happened, deals are worked out all the time, big money always talks loudest in America, always been that way. Any ways, old stadiums have been torn down more than once, this would (should it happen)just be another time. Hell, for all we know they may very well build a huge concourse around the existing stadium, with every luxury you or I could imagine, big money talks the loudest... Go Bills!!! Who's "big money"? Erie County owns the stadium now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 9 hours ago, HiddenInLight said: The colts have a pretty cool stadium/convention center combo in the middle of the city. Its pretty nice but parking there sucks. Badly. Actually it doesn't suck. We parked there last year in a parking garage a little bit away and I think we only paid $4 with SpotHero. We didn't mind the walk through downtown. It was a garage that is used for business during the week. I betcha there is even free parking in Indy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said: People come from Toronto and Rochester and Syracuse and the burbs, there needs to be a clean exit from downtown so people aren't backed up for 3-4-5 hours which is totally possible This is just crazy speculation. 3-5 hours just to get out of downtown? Without adding any new infrastructure, by just deploying traffic control at the choke points, traffic would move at a good pace. Getting out of downtown in 20 minutes? No, but you also would not be sitting in traffic for anywhere close to 3-5 hours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 hour ago, The Dean said: Without radical downtown reconstruction, and a MAJOR rapid transit infrastructure improvement process, a downtown stadium in Buffalo is a recipe for disaster, IMO. I'm quite certain the Pegulas will include a traffic study when considering any site. I would be shocked if they came back and said Buffalo would be paralyzed by a stadium. How on earth do we deal with events like the Allentown Arts Festival with this debilitating RADICAL GRID I never heard of? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Otreply Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 8 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: Who's "big money"? Erie County owns the stadium now. The NFL is full of Multi billionaires, making billions of dollars annually, and many counties have torn down their old stadiums, and “written it off” within the deal made with the multi billionaires to put up a bigger and better version. Tax payers come last, and are only given lip service, the true financial manipulations will never see the light of day, you and I both know this to be true. None of us know what the monopoly will do, we only speculate on what might occur. Me, if they are gonna build a new one, make it multi use, domed and put it in the city of Buffalo, were it will have the best odds of being a good thing for the little businesses, restauranteurs, bar owners, etc, and even new hotel owners, it’s good for the tax base of the City, Sleepy bedroom communities (suburbs) don’t need or generally want a bunch of drunk sports fans in there towns anyways, ? yeah, i’m Pro city, won’t deny it... Go Bills!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 hour ago, ColoradoBills said: I don't think there will be any news on the stadium situation until after the new CBA is signed after the 2020 season. I may be missing something, but this makes A LOT of sense to me. Why start such an enormous project before knowing what the future looks like? No rush to get it done before that, right? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 I'm probably in the minority, but I think the arena is kind of a dump and should be priority #1 when it comes to discussing new stadiums/arenas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColoradoBills Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 2 minutes ago, Augie said: I may be missing something, but this makes A LOT of sense to me. Why start such an enormous project before knowing what the future looks like? No rush to get it done before that, right? It was hinted at by some writers (I don't remember who) after one of the owner meetings. I also think the Pegula timetable that they seem to be following also links up to that time. When I seen that I remembered saying that it made sense too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 hour ago, ColoradoBills said: I don't think there will be any news on the stadium situation until after the new CBA is signed after the 2020 season. I think you are likely correct. All this talk about a new stadium and none of it coming from the Pegulas. They don't seem to be in any particular hurry. I remember some saying, right when they bought the team, there was already a new stadium plan in place. According to those people construction would already be well under way, now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 2 hours ago, Buffalo716 said: The park systems just show how the city is connected with a RADICAL GRID, which you can still see, it was built to maximize walking and bike riding over cars There are only 3 cities in America that share a grid plan with buffalo and Minneapolis and Cleveland and Detroit are not one I don't believe And you CANNOT RELY on public transit. The Bills or sabres cannot use that mindset.. they need to have exitways and spaces for 100,000 people on Bills Sundays downtown, which isn't available yet People come from Toronto and Rochester and Syracuse and the burbs, there needs to be a clean exit from downtown so people aren't backed up for 3-4-5 hours which is totally possible BFLo is a radial city. I agree with you, the last thing Buffalo needs is the Bills downtown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seasons1992 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 35 minutes ago, stony said: I'm probably in the minority, but I think the arena is kind of a dump and should be priority #1 when it comes to discussing new stadiums/arenas. It's sterile. I agree with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RochesterRob Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 1 hour ago, LabattBlue said: This is just crazy speculation. 3-5 hours just to get out of downtown? Without adding any new infrastructure, by just deploying traffic control at the choke points, traffic would move at a good pace. Getting out of downtown in 20 minutes? No, but you also would not be sitting in traffic for anywhere close to 3-5 hours. A better description would be adding 2-3 hours or more cumulatively for the drive time for many going to the north or east of downtown. It would be far more than just deploying a couple dozen cops to the nearest blocks of the stadium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 28 minutes ago, Seasons1992 said: It's sterile. I agree with you. The Indianapolis experience is the ultimate in sterile. It's quite disturbing! Hope that never happens to BFLo! Nothing compares to BFLo in Orchard Park, maybe Green Bay around Lambeau. Kansas City... All old buisness models. Chicago is a joke. Be prepared to drop a grand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RochesterRob Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 5 hours ago, DrDawkinstein said: They will re-build the Hockey Arena along with the new downtown Football stadium all at the same time. Or at least as one big, long project. Parking and roadways will be re-done. They arent just going to jam a big new stadium into the existing area. The whole section of the city will be re-done. New entrances to the 190, etc. Parking and roadways being redone will cost tens of millions of dollars. I know somebody connected with the state Thruway Authority and it cost millions just to double lane existing exits and entrances at exit 41 for Del Lago Casino. Fire fighting, law enforcement, and utilities have been right sized for Orchard Park in terms of when New Era is hosting a NFL game. All that will have to be replicated if placed elsewhere. How much more property tax do Erie County residents want to pay for the bragging rights of having a new stadium within the Buffalo city limits. Not many I would guess and don't look for Albany Andy to help with state dollars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 3 minutes ago, RochesterRob said: Parking and roadways being redone will cost tens of millions of dollars. I know somebody connected with the state Thruway Authority and it cost millions just to double lane existing exits and entrances at exit 41 for Del Lago Casino. Fire fighting, law enforcement, and utilities have been right sized for Orchard Park in terms of when New Era is hosting a NFL game. All that will have to be replicated if placed elsewhere. How much more property tax do Erie County residents want to pay for the bragging rights of having a new stadium within the Buffalo city limits. Not many I would guess and don't look for Albany Andy to help with state dollars. Not to mention the Sky Way route will be closed down and repurposed. Of course one can come in and leave other ways... But it's an traffic artery that is being shut down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Otreply Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 2 hours ago, Buffalo716 said: The park systems just show how the city is connected with a RADICAL GRID, which you can still see, it was built to maximize walking and bike riding over cars There are only 3 cities in America that share a grid plan with buffalo and Minneapolis and Cleveland and Detroit are not one I don't believe And you CANNOT RELY on public transit. The Bills or sabres cannot use that mindset.. they need to have exitways and spaces for 100,000 people on Bills Sundays downtown, which isn't available yet People come from Toronto and Rochester and Syracuse and the burbs, there needs to be a clean exit from downtown so people aren't backed up for 3-4-5 hours which is totally possible Ever been to a Yankees home game? that’s a sports stadium packed into a very densely populated area, and people have no problem going to and from games via walking, car, train, and buses, while surrounded by a million other people going about there day, it is not some insurmountable issue you seem to make it. That, and there aren’t going to be more than a hundred and twenty-five thousand People plus or minus in the area at entry and exit times, and only about seventy thousand ish will be attending a game so traffic clearing would average two ish to three hours before the majority of people are well on their road home. Even at the Cap it takes one to three hours just to to be on the highway after a game, and many people are willing wait an hour before they even start their engines, and that’s with seventy thousand ish people at the stadium for a game surrounded by the local population going about their day. Moving people ain’t that hard to do. You just make select two lane roads both outbound after a game for a couple hours, cities have been doing this sort of stuff for decades it ain’t no big thing. That and infrastructure will have been modified as part of the construction plan from the get go, so again it’s no big deal. Go Bills!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RochesterRob Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 8 minutes ago, Don Otreply said: Ever been to a Yankees home game? that’s a sports stadium packed into a very densely populated area, and people have no problem going to and from games via walking, car, train, and buses, while surrounded by a million other people going about there day, it is not some insurmountable issue you seem to make it. That, and there aren’t going to be more than a hundred and twenty-five thousand People plus or minus in the area at entry and exit times, and only about seventy thousand ish will be attending a game so traffic clearing would average two ish to three hours before the majority of people are well on their road home. Even at the Cap it takes one to three hours just to to be on the highway after a game, and many people are willing wait an hour before they even start their engines, and that’s with seventy thousand ish people at the stadium for a game surrounded by the local population going about their day. Moving people ain’t that hard to do. You just make select two lane roads both outbound after a game for a couple hours, cities have been doing this sort of stuff for decades it ain’t no big thing. That and infrastructure will have been modified as part of the construction plan from the get go, so again it’s no big deal. Go Bills!!! Unless you are accustomed to public transportation a person is not going to readily adapt to it. That is the difference between Yankee stadium which is in a metropolitan area that makes great use of public transportation and Western New York where most people drive their own vehicle to get to where they want to go. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo716 Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 10 minutes ago, Don Otreply said: Ever been to a Yankees home game? that’s a sports stadium packed into a very densely populated area, and people have no problem going to and from games via walking, car, train, and buses, while surrounded by a million other people going about there day, it is not some insurmountable issue you seem to make it. That, and there aren’t going to be more than a hundred and twenty-five thousand People plus or minus in the area at entry and exit times, and only about seventy thousand ish will be attending a game so traffic clearing would average two ish to three hours before the majority of people are well on their road home. Even at the Cap it takes one to three hours just to to be on the highway after a game, and many people are willing wait an hour before they even start their engines, and that’s with seventy thousand ish people at the stadium for a game surrounded by the local population going about their day. Moving people ain’t that hard to do. You just make select two lane roads both outbound after a game for a couple hours, cities have been doing this sort of stuff for decades it ain’t no big thing. That and infrastructure will have been modified as part of the construction plan from the get go, so again it’s no big deal. Go Bills!!! The infrastructure needs to be alot more than modified to make it super accessible I'm not the only one saying that People act like it's a guarente it's going downtown and that is far from a fact It takes 1-3 hours to get of OP as you even said, Downtown would be WAY worse 1 minute ago, RochesterRob said: Unless you are accustomed to public transportation a person is not going to readily adapt to it. That is the difference between Yankee stadium which is in a metropolitan area that makes great use of public transportation and Western New York where most people drive their own vehicle to get to where they want to go. Truth Buffalo is nothing like NYC transportation wise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 18 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said: Not to mention the Sky Way route will be closed down and repurposed. Of course one can come in and leave other ways... But it's an traffic artery that is being shut down. The Skyway is going nowhere. It will still be there and cars going across it for decades. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 11 hours ago, HOUSE said: You used the dreaded " Hear me out" OMG Although I didn't call him an idiot, I gave serious consideration to doing so for those three words alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 2 minutes ago, LabattBlue said: The Skyway is going nowhere. It will still be there and cars going across it for decades. I thought the winning design calls for this: How are cars going to go down that thing. Can't wait till it snows... Be like the toboggan chutes @ Chestnut Ridge Park? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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