MAJBobby Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 25 minutes ago, 1billsfan said: This franchise in general is also paying for the horrible drafts of 2015 and 2016. This year was just not supposed to be a good year for them. They have a very talented group of young players from the last two drafts who aren't ready to take the team over, their veterans are getting very old, and they lost the heart and soul of their offensive line. There's nothing in between because of those poor drafts. IMO this is not a GM or HC issue. It's just a season, with a roster in transition, that this franchise and it's fans unfortunately have to muddle through in the hopes that the young players (Josh Allen especially), the 2019 draftees and the new FA's prove that the process is indeed working with a 2019 season of a young team ready for a decade long run at playoff and Super Bowl contenders. I have faith that the 2019 season will show that the process is working. 2015: Darby - Traded, Miller still here, O’Leary cut. So a draft that has 50% players this regime got rid of two of them. 2016: Lawson Here, Ragland - Traded, Washington - Cut, Jones - Traded, Williams - Cut Listenbee Cut Seymour - Traded so again their choice to move those players off the roster causing this talent gap. Ooo not to mention all on Rookie Contracts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yungmack Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 1 hour ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Nonsense. They created most of the dead cap by choice. 80% of it is on McBeane. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steptide Posted October 21, 2018 Author Share Posted October 21, 2018 How much of the players on the bills roster is on beane vs McDermott? Beane is responsible for the players right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ngbills Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 11 minutes ago, MAJBobby said: 2015: Darby - Traded, Miller still here, O’Leary cut. So a draft that has 50% players this regime got rid of two of them. 2016: Lawson Here, Ragland - Traded, Washington - Cut, Jones - Traded, Williams - Cut Listenbee Cut Seymour - Traded so again their choice to move those players off the roster causing this talent gap. Ooo not to mention all on Rookie Contracts. We have 2 players from 2012-1016 drafts... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orlando Tim Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 I have not watched any game live this year, except for my brothers bday because he asked me to with him, because i knew this team would be frustrating to watch and we would likely be at 5 wins all year. I expect big progressions next but can not spend my emotional capital on a rebuilding year. This team will be better next year- i bet 10 wins- but right now i am expecring poor play overall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ngbills Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 5 minutes ago, ngbills said: We have 2 players from 2012-1016 drafts... 17 minutes ago, MAJBobby said: 2015: Darby - Traded, Miller still here, O’Leary cut. So a draft that has 50% players this regime got rid of two of them. 2016: Lawson Here, Ragland - Traded, Washington - Cut, Jones - Traded, Williams - Cut Listenbee Cut Seymour - Traded so again their choice to move those players off the roster causing this talent gap. Ooo not to mention all on Rookie Contracts. Rams have about 15 guys from 2012-2016 drafts... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 (edited) 9 minutes ago, ngbills said: We have 2 players from 2012-1016 drafts... just went by 2015 and 2016 like the poster said Edited October 21, 2018 by MAJBobby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roundybout Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 1 hour ago, ScottLaw said: Or you can just let those contracts play out like the ones of Dareus, Watkins, Darby, and Glenn instead of trading them for trash/mid to late draft picks because they don't fit your gimmick "process". I will give you Watkins but Dareus wasn't worth the contract anymore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBeaneBandit Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 1 hour ago, Bangarang said: BB created this dead cap problem just so he can create another cap problem when he gives out bloated contracts to mediocre players this offseason. Can’t wait. Yep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Gun Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 This atrocity should never be expected or accepted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackOrton Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 4 minutes ago, MAJBobby said: just went by 2015 and 2016 like the poster said Those players mostly suck though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 2012 - Gilmore not resigned by this regime, Glenn Traded by this regime 2013 - Woods and Goodwin not retained by this regime. Alonso traded for McCoy 2014 - warkins and Brown not retained by this regime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bacchus44 Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 54 minutes ago, 1billsfan said: This franchise in general is also paying for the horrible drafts of 2015 and 2016. This year was just not supposed to be a good year for them. They have a very talented group of young players from the last two drafts who aren't ready to take the team over, their veterans are getting very old, and they lost the heart and soul of their offensive line. There's nothing in between because of those poor drafts. IMO this is not a GM or HC issue. It's just a season, with a roster in transition, that this franchise and it's fans unfortunately have to muddle through in the hopes that the young players (Josh Allen especially), the 2019 draftees and the new FA's prove that the process is indeed working with a 2019 season of a young team ready for a decade long run at playoff and Super Bowl contenders. I have faith that the 2019 season will show that the process is working. I agree...I expected this. Didn't want it, obviously...but it's not surprising. Would have been interesting to see JA with Wood and Incognito with a healthy Shady on O. Those two names right there are the main reasons for why the Bills are where they're at right now. Gotta be good in the trenches and our o-line is a hot mess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 1 minute ago, BringBackOrton said: Those players mostly suck though. Darby worse than who is the other CB? O’Leary worse than Khari Lee? Seymour worse than the other CBs on this team? Williams - a RB so dont care too much 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COTC Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 These apologists threads have got to stop. No one was expecting this disaster. This is a disaster of epic proportions. Assuming we fire these clowns after the season, it will take 5 years to get back to average. Another 2 to compete. We are 7-10 years out before we can even think of playoffs again. This sabotage is not only unnecessary it should also be criminal. We need to bring these clowns up on fraud charges and send them away. It’s like we are targeted by con-men. This is not the 1st time this has happened and our naive owners are just fools. Future is bleak at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 2 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Nonsense. They created most of the dead cap by choice. You are exactly right that they by design created the gargantuan cap space. They made a decision to take a major cap hit all at once instead of stretching it out. That's the point that Steptide was making. Go back and look at what all the pro prognosticators/analysts were making about the Bills prior to the season. There was an overwhelming consensus that at best the Bills were a six win team, and most were saying the record would be worse. The obvious reason was that the organization was shedding talent and contracts and bringing in short term contracts for this year. And if you factor in our flimsy qb situation that included the least ready rookie prospect then the carnage you are seeing so far was predictable and should have been expected. Again, that's the point that Steptide was clearly making. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 1 minute ago, JohnC said: You are exactly right that they by design created the gargantuan cap space. They made a decision to take a major cap hit all at once instead of stretching it out. That's the point that Steptide was making. Go back and look at what all the pro prognosticators/analysts were making about the Bills prior to the season. There was an overwhelming consensus that at best the Bills were a six win team, and most were saying the record would be worse. The obvious reason was that the organization was shedding talent and contracts and bringing in short term contracts for this year. And if you factor in our flimsy qb situation that included the least ready rookie prospect then the carnage you are seeing so far was predictable and should have been expected. Again, that's the point that Steptide was clearly making. No. He made a point that they have been hamstrung. Nonsense again. They created dead cap themselves. They have a greater goal in mind, but no one should try to pretend they were dealt a bad hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blacklabel Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 2 hours ago, Steptide said: I post something similar every week after these losses. This season was never gonna be good. Last year was very fun making the playoffs, but it was also very flukey (the fumble by Matt Ryan against Atlanta, the Colts game, the Dalton pass etc) While I don't agree with every decision McBean have made since they were hired, they've also been a bit handcuffed by the dead cap money. I'll say it again, if we're sitting here a year from now in the same boat, then yes, fire McDermott, but this season was truly a "hit the reset button' year. McDermott and beane knew this, hence beane not wanting to give up a single draft pick in 19 to move up in the draft in 18. Don't fool yourselves, McDermott absolutely knew how bad we'd be this year. That doesn't mean they're not trying to win though. We have 9 games left and I expect alot more of what we've seen so far. Hopefully we can pull out a few wins and have a few good weeks, but don't hold.your breath Great post. I expected it to be a tough season. The blowout losses are the main concern, though. Young team or not, gotta compete week in and week out otherwise these blowouts start to pile up and can quickly demoralize an entire team and crush whatever culture was being built. They may have overestimated themselves in certain areas but this is what happens when you finally rip off all the band-aids and truly start over. For over a decade we've been told "this team is close" and they were just one or two players away from making it over the hump. Year after year of quick-fixes, short-term planning, poor cap management, etc. So for years fans have called for the full rebuild. Now that they're getting it, most of them can't handle it and think swapping out another coaching staff and front office is the answer. What do you think a new staff would wanna do? Build the team in their vision. So it would be back to square one all over again. It's not a lot of fun to watch but just let these dudes keep working. Either way it's gonna be alright, because it's just a f*ckin' game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 3 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: No. He made a point that they have been hamstrung. Nonsense again. They created dead cap themselves. They have a greater goal in mind, but no one should try to pretend they were dealt a bad hand. Exactly. The hand they were dealt was pretty close to the NFL average. Setting records for offensive futility isn’t OK, regardless of your greater plan. It’s a flawed plan if it requires being the worst in the league by a mile . 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 3 minutes ago, 26CornerBlitz said: No. He made a point that they have been hamstrung. Nonsense again. They created dead cap themselves. They have a greater goal in mind, but no one should try to pretend they were dealt a bad hand. What you are say is essentially what he is saying. They by design took the hit in bulk for a payoff not in the next season but in the not too distant future past this year. You are not disagreeing with him so much as agreeing with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LSHMEAB Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 McDermott damn near looked like he was going to cry in the first half. I certainly don't think he's on board with his first and possibly only shot at a head coaching gig failing so miserably. This level of ineptitude is not part of any process that has a happy ending. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy1 Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 Losses don't really matter without Allen playing. At some point, I'm sure the players on the team realize that too. We are just moving towards higher draft position next year. I just wish they were more competitive in their loss. This is the rebuild year we all expected last year to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 1 minute ago, JohnC said: What you are say is essentially what he is saying. They by design took the hit in bulk for a payoff not in the next season but in the not too distant future past this year. You are not disagreeing with him so much as agreeing with him. I know the goal, but the being hamstrung part of his post I cannot buy. We'll see if they properly execute the plan with the offense having crying needs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackOrton Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 21 minutes ago, MAJBobby said: Darby worse than who is the other CB? O’Leary worse than Khari Lee? Seymour worse than the other CBs on this team? Williams - a RB so dont care too much Darby isn't good. O'Leary is no better than Croom. Seymour would be CB#3 on this team. Williams is out of the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 Just now, 26CornerBlitz said: I know the goal, but the being hamstrung part of his post I cannot buy. We'll see if they properly execute the plan with the offense having crying needs. I don't want to into a wasteful semantic argument over the word hamstrung. But it is a fact that when you take a major cap hit in one year instead of stretching it out you are limiting your options in acquiring talent in the near term. That was his point. I'm sure this regime knew the implication of absorbing the cap hit because it would be an obvious outcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, JohnC said: I don't want to into a wasteful semantic argument over the word hamstrung. But it is a fact that when you take a major cap hit in one year instead of stretching it out you are limiting your options in acquiring talent in the near term. That was his point. I'm sure this regime knew the implication of absorbing the cap hit because it would be an obvious outcome. I know his point. Not sure why you keep trying to explain it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roundybout Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 I'm riding with McD until he leaves, one way or the other. That's about my bottom line. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 1 minute ago, 26CornerBlitz said: I know his point. Not sure why you keep trying to explain it. Because your response to him didn't make sense. But that's okay. Don't bother responding because I'm off to watch the hockey game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bring it Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 2 hours ago, 26CornerBlitz said: Nonsense. They created most of the dead cap by choice. They did create a lot of it themselves. Mainly Dareus! But his jettison along with Watkins was coming sooner or later! Watkins admitted later that he wasn’t totally committed to the game and we all know what a sad state that Dareus had become. Why keep them to avoid dead money and have their influence on the team? Mcd. knew what this season would be like, I guess I thought so too, just didn’t want to believe it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 1 minute ago, JohnC said: Because your response to him didn't make sense. But that's okay. Don't bother responding because I'm off to watch the hockey game. Maybe not to you, but plenty of others got it the 1st time. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bring it Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, BillsEnthusiast said: I'm riding with McD until he leaves, one way or the other. That's about my bottom line. Yeah I’m in! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twoandfourteen Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 33 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said: Exactly. The hand they were dealt was pretty close to the NFL average. Setting records for offensive futility isn’t OK, regardless of your greater plan. It’s a flawed plan if it requires being the worst in the league by a mile . Exactly. I'd like to see the guy they identified as the "franchise" QB at least execute a real NFL passing play once or twice every game. Our standards aren't exactly high around here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DallasBillsFan1 Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 2 hours ago, Green Lightning said: I'm not buying this dead cap argument. The game was lost in the first half with a pathetic defense. That's supposed to be a top-notch squad and it was exposed by a 1 - 5 team. 6 penalties this year for illegal formations. All of it's unacceptable. Something wrong with this coaching staff. We seem to win close or get blown out. This. Penalties killing us BIG TIME. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 39 minutes ago, BringBackOrton said: Darby isn't good. O'Leary is no better than Croom. Seymour would be CB#3 on this team. Williams is out of the league. Darby better than every CB but White O’Leary would be better than Lee where is he again? Seymour as I said better than every CB not named Johnson or White now add Glenn, Gilmore, Watkins, Woods, Goodwin wow alot of players from the drafts people are so quick to dimiss playing around this league that this regime said wasnt Process enough. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackOrton Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 (edited) 5 minutes ago, MAJBobby said: Darby better than every CB but White O’Leary would be better than Lee where is he again? Seymour as I said better than every CB not named Johnson or White now add Glenn, Gilmore, Watkins, Woods, Goodwin wow alot of players from the drafts people are so quick to dimiss playing around this league that this regime said wasnt Process enough. Lee doesn't play. You don't have to twist the facts to support your point. There's enough real problems, don't make ones up. There was nothing wrong with letting Woods or Goodwin walk at their price points at the time. Edited October 22, 2018 by BringBackOrton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 (edited) 1 minute ago, BringBackOrton said: Lee doesn't play. You don't have to twist the facts to support your point. There's enough real problems, don't make ones up. Lee MADE the team over O’Leary. Nothing twisting about it. I could also use Logan Thomas here to prove that point Edited October 22, 2018 by MAJBobby 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackOrton Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 Just now, MAJBobby said: Lee MADE the team over O’Leary. Nothing twisting about it You are the aping the Brandon Reilly people. Crying over TE4 is petty and takes away from your message. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spartan19 Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 What bothers me is that the defense has been molded by McBeane with free agent signings and high draft picks across the board at the expense of the o-line and wr's. Despite this, the D has been putrid in 4 out 7 games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAJBobby Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 Just now, BringBackOrton said: You are the aping the Brandon Reilly people. Crying over TE4 is petty and takes away from your message. Again people want to Cry about the limited players from the 2012-2016 draft. Look no further than McD and Beane as the Reason Why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nedboy7 Posted October 22, 2018 Share Posted October 22, 2018 2 minutes ago, BringBackOrton said: Lee doesn't play. You don't have to twist the facts to support your point. There's enough real problems, don't make ones up. There was nothing wrong with letting Woods or Goodwin walk at their price points at the time. Who needs those guys. We got KB and Zay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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