Democratic 2020 Presidential Primary Thread

[B-Man]

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Just Karl‏ @justkarl

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Seriously, the Democrat party is now run by a woke elite that makes people heretics for positions that were just fine a few years / months / days ago -- which makes everyone a Bad Person. That's how you got this debate.

 

 

 

[4merper4mer]

38 minutes ago, billsfan89 said:

 

Then why do other countries whose governments negotiate drug prices (leveraging the buying power of the entire market) get the same exact drugs for cheaper?

 

Big Pharma still reports profits from these markets so clearly the free market financing of healthcare isn't working well in regards to drug prices

 

It's a combination of:

Fixed costs

Variable Costs

Extortion by the other countries

 

These are all very simple things to understand but most prefer outrage.

 

[Ralonzo]

And for our closing statement, we offer you... FEAR!

[/dev/null]

7 hours ago, Ralonzo said:

And for our closing statement, we offer you... FEAR!

 

The Democrats closing statement

 

 

Edited August 1, 2019 by /dev/null

[SoCal Deek]

One thing is clear: these folks have ZERO idea how to improve the cost of healthcare in this country. Obamacare isn’t even ten years old and it’s already being tossed out into the trash. So now they’re left with ‘let’s let the government run it...if it loses money we’ll just pile more debt on the taxpayers” ...brilliant!

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

5 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

One thing is clear: these folks have ZERO idea how to improve the cost of healthcare in this country. Obamacare isn’t even ten years old and it’s already being tossed out into the trash. So now they’re left with ‘let’s let the government run it...if it loses money we’ll just pile more debt on the taxpayers” ...brilliant!

 

...just look at the numerous unfunded promises these clowns are promising...you really think debt matters to them....simply pandering to the "freebee gang" to buy their votes...SMH...

[SoCal Deek]

1 minute ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...just look at the numerous unfunded promises these clowns are promising...you really think debt matters to them....simply pandering to the "freebee gang" to buy their votes...SMH...

The question is whether debt matters to the voters. I’m not sure millennials care anymore. 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

2 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

The question is whether debt matters to the voters. I’m not sure millennials care anymore. 

 

.....therein lies the problem.....shocking to find out the fickle nature of the general electorate and how easily swayed they are......the country's debt is not THEIR problem or worry.....it's Washington's problem....how many of them do not pay taxes now?....

[BeginnersMind]

19 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

One thing is clear: these folks have ZERO idea how to improve the cost of healthcare in this country. Obamacare isn’t even ten years old and it’s already being tossed out into the trash. So now they’re left with ‘let’s let the government run it...if it loses money we’ll just pile more debt on the taxpayers” ...brilliant!

 

No one has offered a palatable solution. I thought the marketplace purchasing would work better and it did at first, but it fixed nothing long term as prices just converged. Trump I did some refs but that hasn’t done dick. I don’t believe in Medicare for all particularly. At this point the left and the right is in a battle of words to point out how wrong the other side is, but neither side can do more than make small tinkering moves for fear of making a runaway train accelerate. 

 

I don't have the answer either. I’m skeptical of anyone who thinks there’s an easy fix (buy drugs from Canada and stop high malpractice awards are not going to solve things). I would think that, like the debt and social security, fixing this will take 20 committed years. It will be a gift to the future if we take it on, but one election cycle won’t fix it. And some of the things we try may need serious adjustment if they don’t work. I just wish we had some bipartisan thinking happening to take some first steps at a long term plan. 

9 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

The question is whether debt matters to the voters. I’m not sure millennials care anymore. 

 

Generalizing a lot here but I think millennials care more than the boomers. The boomers were largely selfish. The millennials care about long term problems because they will live them. 

 

But it in general you’re right. No one gives a crap about the debt. Except Rand Paul. 

Edited August 1, 2019 by BeginnersMind

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

4 minutes ago, BeginnersMind said:

 

No one has offered a palatable solution. I thought the marketplace purchasing would work better and it did, but it fixed nothing. Trump I did some refs but that hasn’t done dick. I don’t believe in Medicare for all particularly. At this point the left and the right is in a battle of words to point out how wrong the other side is, but neither side can do more than make small tinkering moves for fear of making a runaway train accelerate. 

 

I don't have the answer either. I’m skeptical of anyone who thinks there’s an easy fix (buy drugs from Canada and stop high malpractice awards are not going to solve things). I would think that, like the debt and social security, fixing this will take 20 committed years. It will be a gift to the future if we take it on, but one election cycle won’t fix it. And some of the things we try may need serious adjustment if they don’t work. I just wish we had some bipartisan thinking happening to take some first steps at a long term plan. 

 

Generalizing a lot here but I think millennials care more than the boomers. The boomers were largely selfish. The millennials care about long term problems because they will live them. 

 

But it in general you’re right. No one gives a crap about the debt. Except Rand Paul. 

 

...seriously?.....no, seriously?.....millennials have been cultivated due to the UNSELFISH handouts of boomers.....

[BeginnersMind]

7 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...seriously?.....no, seriously?.....millennials have been cultivated due to the UNSELFISH handouts of boomers.....

 

Drugs. Government bloat. Divorce. Lack of moral values passed on.  The boomer generation was more entitled than any before it since. America will pay for their sins for generations. 

 

But they are are the loudest generation to take credit for everything. That they are good at. 

 

Tip of the hat to good music. 

Edited August 1, 2019 by BeginnersMind

[B-Man]

 

 

WELL, TO BE FAIR, LEFTISTS HAVE TO LIE ABOUT THEIR POLICIES OR NOBODY WOULD SUPPORT THEM: 

 

Taking a cue from Obama, Elizabeth Warren’s single-payer strategy involves not telling voters the truth.

 

 

 

 

 

 

JAMES FREEMAN: Do Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders Like You? Beyond the radical agenda, they also share a contempt for many of their fellow citizens.

 

The sight of Sen. Warren happily rubbing her hands together at the prospect of illegally seizing wealth from rival John Delaney was worth more than a thousand words about her unconstitutional tax scheme. But Sen. Warren and the author of her health care plan, Sen. Sanders, made it clear that highly successful entrepreneurs aren’t the only targets of their ire. . . .

Yes, the white lawyer who claimed to be “American Indian” and then snagged an Ivy League professorship is now complaining about the impact of a “corrupt, rigged system” on Native Americans.

 

 

Hypocrisy and hate: What powers the left.

 

 

 

 

 

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Edited August 1, 2019 by B-Man

[B-Man]

 

Good God................

 

 

 

That's the point of a debate...............'SENATOR"

 

 

 

Everyone didn’t get a trophy and ice cream and now Cory is sad.

 

Although, I get Cory's confusion, CNN is usually busy pitting Americans against each other.

 

 

.

[SoCal Deek]

2 hours ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...seriously?.....no, seriously?.....millennials have been cultivated due to the UNSELFISH handouts of boomers.....

I wasn’t trying to demonize millennials. I believe they’ve just given up. If you’ve been taught that the planet is going to end before you turn 40 then long term debt means nothing. You can blame the public education system for preaching this nonsense. 

[B-Man]

 

 

Goodbye 2020 nomination...................................

 

 

[reddogblitz]

6 hours ago, BeginnersMind said:

 

I don’t believe in Medicare for all particularly.

 

I think the Ds have done a horrible job on defining what Medicare for All is.  Bernie says it's comprehensive health care, all free.  Others say it is pretty much anyone can buy into Medicare at a younger age. 

 

Most people under 55 have no idea how Medicare even works or really what it is.  For example, like Medicare Advantage which is private insurance with deductibles and co pays.  Or a Medicare supplement which is private insurance.  It doesn't cover everything.  Maybe that's what they want.  Confuse the electorate.  Wouldn't be the first time.

 

Roll your own Medicare for All.

 

6 hours ago, BeginnersMind said:

The millennials care about long term problems because they will live them. 

 

Millennials are like young Baby Boomers.  Idealistic.  Once they get a little older and have kids and mortgages and stuff, it'll change.

 

And no, I don't feel sorry for the ones with large student loan debt.  I know Baby Boomers with student loan debt.  Mayor Pete has a big student loan.  He's not a millennial either.

 

And lets not forget Baby Boomers were raised by "The Greatest Generation" and Millennials were raised by Baby Boomers.  So maybe it's the Greatest Generation's fault ultimately?

 

Every generation thinks the generation before royally screwed up and they are going to fix it.  Good luck.

 

"Don't Trust Anyone over 25." -- Baby Boomers.  Sound familiar?

Edited August 1, 2019 by reddogblitz

[Hedge]

 

 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

8 hours ago, BeginnersMind said:

 

Drugs. Government bloat. Divorce. Lack of moral values passed on.  The boomer generation was more entitled than any before it since. America will pay for their sins for generations. 

 

But they are are the loudest generation to take credit for everything. That they are good at. 

 

Tip of the hat to good music. 

 

...and this would be the typical "truth twist"........now they are the VICTIMS?.......it is society's fault?......BEGINNERS MIND so noted....go figure.......

[BeginnersMind]

33 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...and this would be the typical "truth twist"........now they are the VICTIMS?.......it is society's fault?......BEGINNERS MIND so noted....go figure.......

 

Baby boomers should be called the ME generation. Even still to this day. The “greatest generation” didn’t seek an identity. They just did it. Same as generations after the boomers. But the boomers are all about praising themselves. The “narcissistic generation” would be a less catchy but more accurate moniker. No boomers can get together and not blow each other about how great their generation is. 

 

Those of of us that follow your mess disagree. Except psychotherapists. You all made them rich. More time to talk about yourself. 

 

3 hours ago, reddogblitz said:

 

 

Millennials are like young Baby Boomers.  Idealistic.  Once they get a little older and have kids and mortgages and stuff, it'll change.

 

And no, I don't feel sorry for the ones with large student loan debt.  I know Baby Boomers with student loan debt.  Mayor Pete has a big student loan.  He's not a millennial either.

 

And lets not forget Baby Boomers were raised by "The Greatest Generation" and Millennials were raised by Baby Boomers.  So maybe it's the Greatest Generation's fault ultimately?

 

The boomers were a generation that said happily “f—- our parents we can do this on our own.” And proceeded to enter adulthood without a family tether. 

 

The millenials get a lot of crap for staying home longer but that is actually how most humans have lived forever. 

 

Quote

 

Every generation thinks the generation before royally screwed up and they are going to fix it.  Good luck.

 

I don’t know who can fix what. But right now the boomers are still massively screwing things up. Pelosi, Trump, and Mitch are eagerly unable to get anything done except pass on more debt to those of us unlucky enough to be in the wake of the boomers. 

 

The only people who think the boomers are a great generation are...wait for it...the boomers. They should do another special about themselves. 

 

Edited August 1, 2019 by BeginnersMind

[reddogblitz]

23 minutes ago, BeginnersMind said:

I don’t know who can fix what. But right now the boomers are still massively screwing things up. Pelosi, Trump, and Mitch are eagerly unable to get anything done except pass on more debt to those of us unlucky enough to be in the wake of the boomers

 

Each generation is handed problems from the generation before.  Greatest Generation handed redlining, Jim Crowe, and Separate but Equal to the Baby Boomers.  The Greatest Generation was handed Prohibition and woman couldn't vote by their parents' generation. 

 

And I take it you're not old enough to remember when Baby Boomers were younger.  A lot of them were idealistic and socialistic too. Remember communes?   And while a lot of them did idealistic things others went to college, got degrees, and went to work making money.  Just as the millennials in my town known affectionately as Amazonians are doing.

 

One thing I can promise you, in 30 years the XYZ generation or whatever it's called will say the millennials ruined everything.  The truth is, we live in an imperfect world.  Grow up and deal with it like Baby Boomers and the Greatest Generation before them and one before them did.  Pick the football up and carry it down the field as far as you can.  You won't score a TD, but maybe a long FG.

Edited August 1, 2019 by reddogblitz

[BeginnersMind]

 

 

2 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

...you have woefully failed in your baby boomer assessment to the point where Agway would NOT buy your excuse laden fertilizer....I AM a baby boomer at age 66 who came from NOTHING.....my now deceased parents had nothing so any inheritance BS is non-sequitur....and I have become modestly successful on my own, STILL work my 50+ hours per week, and enjoy what I do, running a $60+ million dollar company, making our President (15 years younger) megabucks who lets me "do my thing"...and bet your sorry azz I WILL keep going......save your thoughts and do not display your ignorance.....

 

You proved me wrong by telling me how great you are and how hard your life was. 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 hour ago, BeginnersMind said:

 

 

 

You proved me wrong by telling me how great you are and how hard your life was. 

....sorry I'm a long, long way from great...just know my humble position in life is to prod along....shameful, right?...SMH........

Edited August 2, 2019 by OldTimeAFLGuy

[BeginnersMind]

1 hour ago, reddogblitz said:

.

 

One thing I can promise you, in 30 years the XYZ generation or whatever it's called will say the millennials ruined everything.  The truth is, we live in an imperfect world.  Grow up and deal with it like Baby Boomers and the Greatest Generation before them and one before them did.  

 

“The world is going to hell in a hand basket” is the refrain of every generation. I pay it no heed. It creates an urgency and excitement that excuses the speaker’s own generation. 

 

But only the boomers, not the generations before or after, lecture you about how their generation was so amazing. I don’t blame xyz, millennials, or the greatest generation for anything. I don’t particularly think in generations. The Boomers love it though. It’s the narcissistic generation. They sit around regaling you with how great they are as if anyone cares what they think of how great their generation is outside of their psychotherapy shrinks who they pay to listen to them talk about themselves. 

 

I see no distinction between other generations except the eras through which they travel. 

7 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

....sorry I'm a long, long way from great...just know my humble position in life is to prod along....shameful, right?...SMH........

 

“I’m humble enough to brag about my humility after bragging about my greatness.”

 

I’d recommend you stop now but most boomers can’t stop when the subject is themselves. Carry on. 

[snafu]

Summary of latest polling numbers. Biden stays in a comfortable lead. Warren moves up. Harris down a bit. 

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2020/president/us/2020_democratic_presidential_nomination-6730.html

 

[B-Man]

CAMPUS REFORM ASKS DEMOCRATS TO NAME JOE BIDEN’S ACCOMPLISHMENTS:

Campus Reform went to the theater where the Democratic debate took place and asked a bunch of Democrats what they would consider Joe Biden’s major accomplishments. “I don’t know of a specific accomplishment of his,” one woman respondent tells Cabot Phillips early on, and it doesn’t get much better from there.

 

 

 

 

[snafu]

^^^^

Thats my all time favorite scene from Police Squad!

 

[Boatdrinks]

8 minutes ago, snafu said:

Summary of latest polling numbers. Biden stays in a comfortable lead. Warren moves up. Harris down a bit. 

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2020/president/us/2020_democratic_presidential_nomination-6730.html

 

As flawed as Biden is, he’s really  the only one that has a prayer to win a general election for the Dems imo. 

[snafu]

11 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

As flawed as Biden is, he’s really  the only one that has a prayer to win a general election for the Dems imo. 

 

IMO its Warren. She’s the only one who can respond coherently when attacked. Problem is that she’s planted her flag too far to the left. 

[Boatdrinks]

Just now, snafu said:

 

IMO its Warren. She’s the only one who can respond coherently when attacked. Problem is that she’s planted her flag too far to the left. 

That’s the trouble with most of them, though she has other issues. I believe President Trump will serve a second term, barring some unforeseen Democratic candidate emerging with moderate ideas ( which seems almost certain not to happen). 

[BeginnersMind]

10 minutes ago, snafu said:

 

IMO its Warren. She’s the only one who can respond coherently when attacked. Problem is that she’s planted her flag too far to the left. 

 

She can’t win where it matters. Biden might be able to. Whoever wins PA likely wins it all and Biden could win PA. 

 

But barring a big economic downturn, Trump should win. America rarely votes out incumbents. 

[Buffalo_Gal]

5 minutes ago, BeginnersMind said:

 

She can’t win where it matters. Biden might be able to. Whoever wins PA likely wins it all and Biden could win PA. 

 

But barring a big economic downturn, Trump should win. America rarely votes out incumbents. 

You think Biden stating he'd shut down all coal and fracking last night endears him to the people of PA (outside of Philly)?

[snafu]

23 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

That’s the trouble with most of them, though she has other issues. I believe President Trump will serve a second term, barring some unforeseen Democratic candidate emerging with moderate ideas ( which seems almost certain not to happen). 

 

I agree. If progressives were smart and patient they’d quietly step aside and let Biden take the nomination (though Sanders and Warren won’t let that happen — this is their only chance). If he wins that’s okay for the party.  If he loses, they can claim that the middle-road Dem platform is dead. It would free the far left up to take the mantle going forward from 2020. 

 

To me, that’s the interesting thing about the Democrats this cycle. Which pole of the party is going to declare primacy in November 2020. 

 

 

Edited August 2, 2019 by snafu

[4merper4mer]

2 hours ago, BeginnersMind said:

 

“The world is going to hell in a hand basket” is the refrain of every generation. I pay it no heed. It creates an urgency and excitement that excuses the speaker’s own generation. 

 

But only the boomers, not the generations before or after, lecture you about how their generation was so amazing. I don’t blame xyz, millennials, or the greatest generation for anything. I don’t particularly think in generations. The Boomers love it though. It’s the narcissistic generation. They sit around regaling you with how great they are as if anyone cares what they think of how great their generation is outside of their psychotherapy shrinks who they pay to listen to them talk about themselves. 

 

I see no distinction between other generations except the eras through which they travel. 

 

“I’m humble enough to brag about my humility after bragging about my greatness.”

 

I’d recommend you stop now but most boomers can’t stop when the subject is themselves. Carry on. 

Your overall take on Boomers is dead on which is surprising because that generation is full of commies.  I'd think they would be your favorite.

 

Applying the general rule to individuals you know little about isn't really fair.

[B-Man]

 Report: Marianne Williamson’s guest felt the knocking on her dressing room door was ‘too aggressive.’

[row_33]

1 hour ago, Buffalo_Gal said:

You think Biden stating he'd shut down all coal and fracking last night endears him to the people of PA (outside of Philly)?

 

He was just tossing out anything that became coherent in his mind at the time.

[Foxx]

omg. this is just too ***** funny.

 

https://twitter.com/Jamesmasen1/status/1157112864961785856

 

[BeginnersMind]

8 hours ago, Buffalo_Gal said:

You think Biden stating he'd shut down all coal and fracking last night endears him to the people of PA (outside of Philly)?

 

PA was close enough that he could win It. He has deeper ties there than anywhere. And he has a folksy way with people. You may find it inauthentic but it works for many. And will he win the middle of PA? No. But he only needs to win enough of it as well as move the population centers to show up in big numbers. 

 

My point is more that Warren cannot win PA. Also winning a debate does not win elections. The important thing to do in debates is not to lose them. 

[/dev/null]

6 minutes ago, BeginnersMind said:

 

PA was close enough that he could win It. He has deeper ties there than anywhere.

 

Biden might pick up a handful of votes around Scranton, but do you really think people Pittsburgh, Erie, Allentown, Altoona, Harrisburg, or the Philly suburbs give two schitts about somebody that moved out of the state in the 1950s?

 

I've got stronger ties to PA and at least lived there during this millennium.  Maybe the Democrats should nominate me

 

[BeginnersMind]

18 minutes ago, /dev/null said:

 

Biden might pick up a handful of votes around Scranton, but do you really think people Pittsburgh, Erie, Allentown, Altoona, Harrisburg, or the Philly suburbs give two schitts about somebody that moved out of the state in the 1950s?

 

I've got stronger ties to PA and at least lived there during this millennium.  Maybe the Democrats should nominate me

 

 

Its not because he lived there. His PA ties run deep. Tell me another candidate who has a better shot at PA. Who has more ties in PA politics. Who can be folksy with people. 

 

The fumbling stumbling Uncle Joe persona goes further than you want to give him credit for. People don’t get moved by Harvard policy wonks and big city elites in central PA. And despite his civility, Mayor Pete ain’t getting a lot of votes there either. But Biden will. 

 

My analysis is not my support of Biden. Just my political thought. Winning PA is vital to the Dems. I’m not convinced any other candidate gives them a better shot than Biden. Though Obama showed what you can do with a massive turnout in the cities so perhaps a massive city-appeal candidate (yet to emerge) could win it too—but that was against a candidate who didn’t move central PA like Trump. 

 

2020 goes the way of PA. If Trump wins it, he will win another electoral race. If he loses it, he’s got a hard road to 270. 

Edited August 2, 2019 by BeginnersMind

[/dev/null]

22 minutes ago, BeginnersMind said:

 

Its not because he lived there. His PA ties run deep. Tell me another candidate who has a better shot at PA. Who has more ties in PA politics. Who can be folksy with people. 

 

The fumbling stumbling Uncle Joe persona goes further than you want to give him credit for. People don’t get moved by Harvard policy wonks and big city elites in central PA. And despite his civility, Mayor Pete ain’t getting a lot of votes there either. But Biden will. 

 

My analysis is not my support of Biden. Just my political thought. Winning PA is vital to the Dems. I’m not convinced any other candidate gives them a better shot than Biden. Though Obama showed what you can do with a massive turnout in the cities so perhaps a massive city-appeal candidate (yet to emerge) could win it too—but that was against a candidate who didn’t move central PA like Trump. 

 

2020 goes the way of PA. If Trump wins it, he will win another electoral race. If he loses it, he’s got a hard road to 270. 

 

Tim Ryan has a better shot at picking up votes in Western PA.  Steve Bullock isn't bat schitt crazy (or at least hasn't gone BSC yet), which plays well in the rust belt.

 

Biden's "political ties" to PA could haunt him as it paints him as a career politician

 

Gotta remember that PA isn't a single political culture.  Philly is an East Coast city.  Pittsburgh and Erie are midwest.  Pennsyltucky is, well Pennsyltucky. 

 

Agree that as goes PA, so goes the Electoral College