YoloinOhio Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 (edited) The Bills need to acquire a WR who is not only capable of being a #1 but is a complete WR and has some experience in the NFL to help Allen. The Bills should also draft one relatively high with deep speed (2nd - 3rd ideally). I think Gruden is ripe to trade Cooper, who is eligible for the 5th year option and then will want big money. The Raiders have shown they are willing to trade talent they feel can be replaced in the draft or cheaper. I believe the Bills will need to trade for and pay - perhaps overpay in this current climate- to obtain a real WR at this point. I would also look to obtain a FA WR who is more of a #2 guy that another team won’t want to pay - ie Tyler Boyd. May need to overpay a bit there too but this is what bad teams sometimes need to do to get talent (Jacksonville has done this over the last few years). I would go into next year with Cooper, Boyd, Zay and a rookie as the top 4. What would I give up for Cooper? A 3rd in 2020, 4th in 2019, Shaq Lawson. I saw rumblings that a just a 4th or 5th would get it done for the Raiders, maybe I’m overvaluing him but i don’t buy it. Gruden has been whining about fnding a pass rusher, Shaq is someone who he will have the ability to plug in and determine if he’s a guy they want, and has a 5th year option they can use. Bills and Raiders would basically be swapping 2015/2016 1st rd draft picks. The bottom line as I’ve said many times is that drafting a WR in the 1st is a crap shoot. I think they need to take a OT or Pass rusher with their 1st pick. Cooper is a top 10 talent who has been successful, maybe he’s not elite but those guys aren’t going to be available via trade or FA. You won’t get a big time FA WR to come to Buffalo who has options. Going to need to trade for one who has the talent to be a #1 and overpay a bit. We saw they were willing to work the trade for KB, that has not worked out but they saw the need and got who they could. He will be gone at the end of this season. Thoughts? Edited October 14, 2018 by YoloinOhio 10 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 Is he even available? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 1 minute ago, joesixpack said: Is he even available? There have been rumblings, but I don’t know. As i said I think the Bills should make the call and *try* to trade for him. I laid out why I think he could be available and why they should make the call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 1 minute ago, YoloinOhio said: There have been rumblings, but I don’t know. As i said I think the Bills should make the call and *try* to trade for him. I laid out why I think he could be available and why they should make the call. I wouldn't hate it, that's for sure. But I bet Carr would. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 (edited) 3 minutes ago, joesixpack said: I wouldn't hate it, that's for sure. But I bet Carr would. Probably. I don’t think they care though considering he didn’t want Mack traded either. Cooper had a great game vs Cleveland but i know earlier in the season he was not targeted much, that’s when the trade rumblings started. Edited October 3, 2018 by YoloinOhio 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwai San Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 Interesting for sure. Doubt Beane is scouring TBD for trade ideas tho. Sadly......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soda Popinski Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 Lawson and a 5th if we could get it. Hell send em Benji too just for chits and giggles and to get him off the roster. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBuff423 Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 Like anything else, it depends on the cost. Amari Cooper in a Bills uni for a 4th and Shaq is a great idea....but I'm not sure that anything more than that is worth it. I like it for now and the future, but as always cost determines outcome. That said, I'd be surprised to see Gruden trade Cooper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philo Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 I can get on board with this. Not sure exactly what his issue has been for Oakland...inconsistency? I know Carr likes throwing to him. I agree with the idea that all we could hope for in FA is a guy in that Tyler Boyd category and overpay for him too. Also agree that another WR should be added in 2nd-3rd round ideally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clyde Smith Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 I totally agree with this. Another receiver I also hope the Bills make a trade for is Laquon Treadwell from Minn. Underutilized and behind some really good receivers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptnCoke11 Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 Haven’t seen a single report saying Raiders were even exploring a trade Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cle23 Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 I'd trade a 2nd as Cleveland for him. They would get more then a 4th as compensatory for him, so why would they give him away? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 2 minutes ago, CaptnCoke11 said: Haven’t seen a single report saying Raiders were even exploring a trade I didn’t say there was a “report” they are exploring a trade. The Bills would make the call to initiate a trade. Teams do this daily. Many players are “available” at the right price. Some are not. He’s not an untouchable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CamboBill Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 21 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: The Bills need to acquire a WR who is not only capable of being a #1 but is a complete WR and has some experience in the NFL to help Allen. The Bills should also draft one relatively high with deep speed (2nd - 3rd ideally). I think Gruden is ripe to trade Cooper, who is eligible for the 5th year option and then will want big money. The Raiders have shown they are willing to trade talent they feel can be replaced in the draft or cheaper. I believe the Bills will need to trade for and pay - perhaps overpay in this current climate- to obtain a real WR at this point. I would also look to obtain a FA WR who is more of a #2 guy that another team won’t want to pay - ie Tyler Boyd. May need to overpay a bit there too but this is what bad teams sometimes need to do to get talent (Jacksonville has done this over the last few years). I would go into next year with Cooper, Boyd, Zay and a rookie as the top 4. What would I give up for Cooper? A 3rd in 2020, 4th in 2019, Shaq Lawson. I saw rumblings that a just a 4th or 5th would get it done for the Raiders, maybe I’m overvaluing him but i don’t buy it. Gruden has been whining about fnding a pass rusher, Shaq is someone who he will have the ability to plug in and determine if he’s a guy they want, and has a 5th year option they can use since they won’t have Cooper’s. Bills and Raiders would basically be swapping 2015 draft picks. The bottom line as I’ve said many times is that drafting a WR in the 1st is a crap shoot. I think they need to take a OT or Pass rusher with their 1st pick. Cooper is a top 10 talent who has been successful, maybe he’s not elite but those guys aren’t going to be available via trade or FA. You won’t get a big time FA WR to come to Buffalo who has options. Going to need to trade for one who has the talent to be a #1 and overpay a bit. We saw they were willing to work the trade for KB, that has not worked out but they saw the need and got who they could. He will be gone at the end of this season. Thoughts? Not a bad idea. Cooper to me is sort of a watkins 2.0 -- and I don't mean that in a good way. Worth a roll of the dice though if we could get him for Lawson or Bejamin + a mid rounder. He has the speed and size but seems like a poor route runner to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 (edited) 3 minutes ago, cle23 said: I'd trade a 2nd as Cleveland for him. They would get more then a 4th as compensatory for him, so why would they give him away? You can’t plan on a comp pick because there are variables that go into that based on other signings made. Also that comp pick would be 2020. I’m giving a 4th this year and a 3rd in 2020 plus a player at a position of need Edited October 3, 2018 by YoloinOhio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 Just what we need to do - give up more draft picks. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 His salary jumps to 13 million next year which is easily navigated under the salary cap - especially considering benjamin will be 100% released. I'd be on board with it if the price were right. I assume they would want to get out of the 5th year option if they are considering moving him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 24 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: The Bills need to acquire a WR who is not only capable of being a #1 but is a complete WR and has some experience in the NFL to help Allen. The Bills should also draft one relatively high with deep speed (2nd - 3rd ideally). I think Gruden is ripe to trade Cooper, who is eligible for the 5th year option and then will want big money. The Raiders have shown they are willing to trade talent they feel can be replaced in the draft or cheaper. I believe the Bills will need to trade for and pay - perhaps overpay in this current climate- to obtain a real WR at this point. I would also look to obtain a FA WR who is more of a #2 guy that another team won’t want to pay - ie Tyler Boyd. May need to overpay a bit there too but this is what bad teams sometimes need to do to get talent (Jacksonville has done this over the last few years). I would go into next year with Cooper, Boyd, Zay and a rookie as the top 4. What would I give up for Cooper? A 3rd in 2020, 4th in 2019, Shaq Lawson. I saw rumblings that a just a 4th or 5th would get it done for the Raiders, maybe I’m overvaluing him but i don’t buy it. Gruden has been whining about fnding a pass rusher, Shaq is someone who he will have the ability to plug in and determine if he’s a guy they want, and has a 5th year option they can use since they won’t have Cooper’s. Bills and Raiders would basically be swapping 2015 draft picks. The bottom line as I’ve said many times is that drafting a WR in the 1st is a crap shoot. I think they need to take a OT or Pass rusher with their 1st pick. Cooper is a top 10 talent who has been successful, maybe he’s not elite but those guys aren’t going to be available via trade or FA. You won’t get a big time FA WR to come to Buffalo who has options. Going to need to trade for one who has the talent to be a #1 and overpay a bit. We saw they were willing to work the trade for KB, that has not worked out but they saw the need and got who they could. He will be gone at the end of this season. Thoughts? I agree. It’s the one position that’s going to be tough to find a #1. There are plenty of OL available in free agency and in the draft. But look at the WRs that may become available....none are potential #1s. We’d have to use our top pick on WR and get lucky that he’s a #1. Cooper has it all minus he case of the drops. I believe he’s better than that and I’m all for trading for him. We need guys that can get open. Cooper does that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 1 minute ago, YoloinOhio said: You can’t plan on a comp pick because there are variables that go into that based on other signings made. Also that comp pick would be 2020. He's on the roster next year so the comp pick would be 2021 as he wouldn't hit free agency until 2020. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 Just now, Wayne Arnold said: Just what we need to do - give up more draft picks. That's one incredibly negative way of looking at it. Or you could look at it like it's an opportunity to pick up a player who's proven for a low-round pick. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 1 minute ago, Wayne Arnold said: Just what we need to do - give up more draft picks. Yeah - for a 1 year rental in 2019. His value here this year doesn't matter because we aren't good. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McBean Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 28 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: The Bills need to acquire a WR who is not only capable of being a #1 but is a complete WR and has some experience in the NFL to help Allen. The Bills should also draft one relatively high with deep speed (2nd - 3rd ideally). I think Gruden is ripe to trade Cooper, who is eligible for the 5th year option and then will want big money. The Raiders have shown they are willing to trade talent they feel can be replaced in the draft or cheaper. I believe the Bills will need to trade for and pay - perhaps overpay in this current climate- to obtain a real WR at this point. I would also look to obtain a FA WR who is more of a #2 guy that another team won’t want to pay - ie Tyler Boyd. May need to overpay a bit there too but this is what bad teams sometimes need to do to get talent (Jacksonville has done this over the last few years). I would go into next year with Cooper, Boyd, Zay and a rookie as the top 4. What would I give up for Cooper? A 3rd in 2020, 4th in 2019, Shaq Lawson. I saw rumblings that a just a 4th or 5th would get it done for the Raiders, maybe I’m overvaluing him but i don’t buy it. Gruden has been whining about fnding a pass rusher, Shaq is someone who he will have the ability to plug in and determine if he’s a guy they want, and has a 5th year option they can use since they won’t have Cooper’s. Bills and Raiders would basically be swapping 2015 draft picks. The bottom line as I’ve said many times is that drafting a WR in the 1st is a crap shoot. I think they need to take a OT or Pass rusher with their 1st pick. Cooper is a top 10 talent who has been successful, maybe he’s not elite but those guys aren’t going to be available via trade or FA. You won’t get a big time FA WR to come to Buffalo who has options. Going to need to trade for one who has the talent to be a #1 and overpay a bit. We saw they were willing to work the trade for KB, that has not worked out but they saw the need and got who they could. He will be gone at the end of this season. Thoughts? I thought about this last week. good post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 Just now, joesixpack said: That's one incredibly negative way of looking at it. Or you could look at it like it's an opportunity to pick up a player who's proven for a low-round pick. Why would the Raiders trade him for a low round pick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HappyDays Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 He drops the ball a lot. https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/Coopers-Drop-Rate-Ranks-Among-NFLs-Worst-479158283.html Over the past three seasons, Cooper has had a drop rate of 13.62 percent, which ranks fourth-worst in the NFL (among qualifying receivers) behind Torrey Smith (16.82), J.J. Nelson (15.91) and Raiders teammate Seth Roberts (14.39). Wrote Scott Barrett of PFF: “Cooper led the league in drops (18) and drop rate (20.0 percent) in his rookie season (2015), but then seemed to get past the issue in 2016, dropping only four passes. In 2017, Cooper again led the league in drop rate (17.2 percent). Not only are these numbers bad, but they’re historically bad. Since 2007, there have only been three players to see at least 100 targets and post a drop rate of 17 percent or worse: Braylon Edwards (2007 and 2008), Greg Little (2011) and Cooper (2015 and 2017).” Personally I wouldn't go higher than a 4th and maybe Lawson. At the very least he gets separation and is dangerous with the ball in his hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 1 minute ago, Wayne Arnold said: Just what we need to do - give up more draft picks. We need to acquire a potential number 1. I doubt we get lucky and find one in the 3rd round. We have the worst WRs in football history and the free agent class is bleh. How else would you like to get these WRs? Like yolo said, drafting them in the first is a total crapshoot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 Just now, Wayne Arnold said: Why would the Raiders trade him for a low round pick? Throw in the bust Shaq lawson, too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 (edited) 1 minute ago, dneveu said: Yeah - for a 1 year rental in 2019. His value here this year doesn't matter because we aren't good. I would actually be looking to sign him long term. That’s the “overpay” I mentioned. going to have to give up something to get anything of value at some point. More mid round rookie WRs aren’t going to help Edited October 3, 2018 by YoloinOhio Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 1 minute ago, dneveu said: Yeah - for a 1 year rental in 2019. His value here this year doesn't matter because we aren't good. Exactly. How does adding Amari Cooper help our rookie QB recognize blitzes and throw to hot reads? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Wayne Arnold said: Exactly. How does adding Amari Cooper help our rookie QB recognize blitzes and throw to hot reads? Having said that - I'd move a late round pick for him but only if they took benjamin. They have to pay benjamin the rest of the year, we get more cap room this year to carry over into 2019. And when i say late i mean maybe give back the 5th we got from them. Edited October 3, 2018 by dneveu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uticaclub Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 Beane is not interested in adding talent to this team. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 Just now, uticaclub said: Beane is not interested in adding talent to this team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted October 3, 2018 Author Share Posted October 3, 2018 12 minutes ago, dneveu said: He's on the roster next year so the comp pick would be 2021 as he wouldn't hit free agency until 2020. I guess it depends on whether the raiders pick up his option but you’re right if they don’t trade him they probably would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJB Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 Stone hands and soft as butter. No thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uticaclub Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 1 minute ago, joesixpack said: Every free agent he brought is terrible. Star is fine, but I'd rather have Dareus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 2 minutes ago, YoloinOhio said: I guess it depends on whether the raiders pick up his option but you’re right if they don’t trade him they probably would. I believe they already did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 1 minute ago, uticaclub said: Every free agent he brought is terrible. Star is fine, but I'd rather have Dareus. Mhm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 1 minute ago, uticaclub said: Every free agent he brought is terrible. Star is fine, but I'd rather have Dareus. i was a little sick of the drama dareus brought with him. If he wasn't getting in trouble with the law, he was coming into camp out of shape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Arnold Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 9 minutes ago, NewEra said: We need to acquire a potential number 1. I doubt we get lucky and find one in the 3rd round. We have the worst WRs in football history and the free agent class is bleh. How else would you like to get these WRs? Like yolo said, drafting them in the first is a total crapshoot. “The worst WR’s in Football history” Welp, at least no one is overreacting. ? Receivers were running wide open underneath all day on Sunday. No one is denying that the unit could use some upgrades but a shiny new WR1 isn’t going to miraculously give our rookie QB the gift of pocket presence and defense literacy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uticaclub Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 3 minutes ago, dneveu said: i was a little sick of the drama dareus brought with him. If he wasn't getting in trouble with the law, he was coming into camp out of shape. He was an elite DT and you put up with that with that caliber player. He's a pain in the ass and you deal with it and there's no way in hell you can say weren't a better team without him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted October 3, 2018 Share Posted October 3, 2018 Just now, uticaclub said: He was an elite DT and you put up with that with that caliber player. He's a pain in the ass and you deal with it and there's no way in hell you can say weren't a better team without him Elite? He's nothing more than a rotational DT at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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