GrizzReaper Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 (edited) So I watched our QB get obliterated on the regular this Sunday... I also have seen our running game be nearly non existent this season. Then I watch these press conferences and listen as McDermott and Daboll try their best not to throw their offensive line under the bus... They say things like yeah they had a rough game and Josh took sacks and it's partly his fault for holding the ball too long etc etc... I get it noone wants to just Chuck a guy under the bus. However I think they need to address the offensive line failures asap. Like be for real and stop dancing around it because it's an issue. The way I see it... If the coaches think these lineman have the talent to play at this level that they can be serviceable lineman in the NFL then the obvious culprit for their woes has to be Juan Castillo right? Or if it's the players just not possessing the talent to get it done then they need to try to bring in someone off a practice squad or something right? My worry is that I've watched LeSean McCoy fade away into nothing as a running back trying to run behind these guys. I've watched defenses blow straight past our line on numerous occasions this season. I watched Green Bay run a blitz up the same gap numerous times and watch the LB smash Allen Everytime he did it! So what is the issue? Is it these guys are seriously that bad and just not growing? Or is Castillo just utterly failing them as a coach? Either way I'm hoping something is done to address that aspect of the team. If that line can't protect that rookie QB throughout this season say Allen gets broken.... Boy o boy what a total and frustrating waste of a season will this be then? What happens if Allen gets injured because he gets sacked how 28th time next week and we have Peterman for x amount of games? How pissed will people be about that situation? So I'm just wondering what everyone else out there thinks about the state of our offensive line... The sacks, the lack of a run game, the abuse this rookie is taking behind these guys. Is it the players being that bad or is it the coach failing them? Personally I think it's the coach... I think whatever Castillo is coaching these guys up to do simply isn't working. I see them bumbling and stumbling, getting pushed into their QB/RB, I see defenders just flying through gaps umabated. It's horrible. What's the solution? Can it be fixed or patched up sometime this season if at least for the hopes of keeping Allen healthy for this entire "learning" season. Does anyone know if Castillo is historically bad? Has Shady just lost it as a RB or is it really the line to blame? Is it really just Josh Allen not reading what the defense is going to give him fast enough and holding the ball making them look so bad? Anyways just wondering how the rest of the fanbase feels about the situation and how if any way it can be remedied at this point. This was what I had replied in the Monday press thread... It's my original rant What I'm seeing is a HC try his damndest not to throw his o line under the bus... They are bad. Point blank period. So it's kind of comical to listen to him try to answer these questions in a way where he's trying spread the blame around a bit. I mean yeah I'm sure Allen being a rookie has something to do with the sacks and hitsbhes taken so far... but we can't keep trying to dance around the fact that this line is playing very poorly and inconsistent... Or maybe they're consistently bad idk. So if we do like McDermott says and start in the trenches and winning the line of scrimmage then who does that fall on the o line players and Juan Castillo. So if the coach believes his players are talented enough to at least be a serviceable offensive line then I think obviously the problem can be traced back to the coach. So fire the guy and get someone else... Either find a couple decent lineman in some dumpster out there if he believes it's the lack of player talent OR fire the fricken line coach and get a guy that can get these players to play up to the talent level he believes they possess.... We can't run the ball and the QB is under constant pressure. Something needs to be done sooner than later about the line. Keep messing around trotting either the same players or the line coach out there for the rest of this season and eventually that shiny new QB the GM worked so hard to acquire is going to get broken. You're also wasting the talent of 2 very good RBs in what may be their twilight years of football. Wasting what they could provide behind bad lineman or a bad line coach. Can this be traced to Castillo? This incompetent play is either his failure as a coach or these guys are really just bad players who don't belong as starters on an NFL roster. Personally I think it's more about the way they are being coached... Edited October 1, 2018 by GrizzReaper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CEN-CAL17 Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 One reason is at times they put themselves in very predictable situations. The Oline is being asked to pass block to long and often for a Rookie QB. Castillo has been bad the past 2 seasons. Vlad, Bodine, Miller and Groy.... at times Mills would have a hard time making any roster. FO has never taken it seriously. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuckyBoys Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 biggest issue I see is when teams bring delayed pressure , instead of picking up the free runner out guards have a tendency to needlessly double a guy who is under control thus opening up lanes for Allen to get smashed. Allen not helping by some indecision (again out wr core sucks so hard to know if a passing lane is there) and also he's leaving a clean pocket too often mostly to flee to his right He's gotta trust the protection and thus far its not happening Run the football and have the vet center call out the protection till Allen is ready too the problems pre snap 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macaroni Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 (edited) IMHO, I think it's a combination of both. The Bills have made a concerted effort to upgrade the defense while leaving the offensive side of the team as is (hopefully only until next off season). We went into the offseason with an OK line (not good, but OK) however with Wood and Incognito leaving our OK line was downgraded to a urine poor line. Add to that Castillo, who's coaching technique seems to be … "you fat guys on this side of the ball, try and somehow get in the way of those fat guys on the other side of the ball" and you have a recipe for disaster … which is exactly what we have for an O-line. As a side note; Daboll is not without blame, he should know our O line is substandard, he should know a rookie QB needs a beat or two longer to process what is going on, so his game plan should be exclusively quick hitting plays. screens … bubble … screens … quick slants. If a play takes longer than 2 or 3 seconds to develop it's just not going to happen behind this line. Edited October 2, 2018 by macaroni 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seanbillsfan2206 Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 It’s bad because it’s full of a bunch of no talent assclowns 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KD in CA Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 Cause 60% of it left after last season and they didn't have younger guys ready to step in. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gray Beard Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 7 minutes ago, DuckyBoys said: biggest issue I see is when teams bring delayed pressure , instead of picking up the free runner our guards have a tendency to needlessly double a guy who is under control thus opening up lanes for Allen to get smashed. Allen not helping by some indecision (again out wr core sucks so hard to know if a passing lane is there) and also he's leaving a clean pocket too often mostly to flee to his right He's gotta trust the protection and thus far its not happening Run the football and have the vet center call out the protection till Allen is ready too the problems pre snap This Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jr1 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 because they're not being coached by Ted Ginn's dad and eating Stouffer's lasagna 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mead107 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 27 minutes ago, GrizzReaper said: So I watched our QB get obliterated on the regular this Sunday... I also have seen our running game be nearly non existent this season. Then I watch these press conferences and listen as McDermott and Daboll try their best not to throw their offensive line under the bus... They say things like yeah they had a rough game and Josh took sacks and it's partly his fault for holding the ball too long etc etc... I get it noone wants to just Chuck a guy under the bus. However I think they need to address the offensive line failures asap. Like be for real and stop dancing around it because it's an issue. The way I see it... If the coaches think these lineman have the talent to play at this level that they can be serviceable lineman in the NFL then the obvious culprit for their woes has to be Juan Castillo right? Or if it's the players just not possessing the talent to get it done then they need to try to bring in someone off a practice squad or something right? My worry is that I've watched LeSean McCoy fade away into nothing as a running back trying to run behind these guys. I've watched defenses blow straight past our line on numerous occasions this season. I watched Green Bay run a blitz up the same gap numerous times and watch the LB smash Allen Everytime he did it! So what is the issue? Is it these guys are seriously that bad and just not growing? Or is Castillo just utterly failing them as a coach? Either way I'm hoping something is done to address that aspect of the team. If that line can't protect that rookie QB throughout this season say Allen gets broken.... Boy o boy what a total and frustrating waste of a season will this be then? What happens if Allen gets injured because he gets sacked how 28th time next week and we have Peterman for x amount of games? How pissed will people be about that situation? So I'm just wondering what everyone else out there thinks about the state of our offensive line... The sacks, the lack of a run game, the abuse this rookie is taking behind these guys. Is it the players being that bad or is it the coach failing them? Personally I think it's the coach... I think whatever Castillo is coaching these guys up to do simply isn't working. I see them bumbling and stumbling, getting pushed into their QB/RB, I see defenders just flying through gaps umabated. It's horrible. What's the solution? Can it be fixed or patched up sometime this season if at least for the hopes of keeping Allen healthy for this entire "learning" season. Does anyone know if Castillo is historically bad? Has Shady just lost it as a RB or is it really the line to blame? Is it really just Josh Allen not reading what the defense is going to give him fast enough and holding the ball making them look so bad? Anyways just wondering how the rest of the fanbase feels about the situation and how if any way it can be remedied at this point. This was what I had replied in the Monday press thread... It's my original rant What I'm seeing is a HC try his damndest not to throw his o line under the bus... They are bad. Point blank period. So it's kind of comical to listen to him try to answer these questions in a way where he's trying spread the blame around a bit. I mean yeah I'm sure Allen being a rookie has something to do with the sacks and hitsbhes taken so far... but we can't keep trying to dance around the fact that this line is playing very poorly and inconsistent... Or maybe they're consistently bad idk. So if we do like McDermott says and start in the trenches and winning the line of scrimmage then who does that fall on the o line players and Juan Castillo. So if the coach believes his players are talented enough to at least be a serviceable offensive line then I think obviously the problem can be traced back to the coach. So fire the guy and get someone else... Either find a couple decent lineman in some dumpster out there if he believes it's the lack of player talent OR fire the fricken line coach and get a guy that can get these players to play up to the talent level he believes they possess.... We can't run the ball and the QB is under constant pressure. Something needs to be done sooner than later about the line. Keep messing around trotting either the same players or the line coach out there for the rest of this season and eventually that shiny new QB the GM worked so hard to acquire is going to get broken. You're also wasting the talent of 2 very good RBs in what may be their twilight years of football. Wasting what they could provide behind bad lineman or a bad line coach. Can this be traced to Castillo? This incompetent play is either his failure as a coach or these guys are really just bad players who don't belong as starters on an NFL roster. Personally I think it's more about the way they are being coached... Lot of other o line suck threads to give you the answer. KD above explains it well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helpmenow Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 Lions gave up on mills, jets and ravens gave up Vlad and bengals gave up on bodine 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptnCoke11 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 You’re wondering why the OL is bad..? no talent.. pretty simple Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan_34 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 The Oline is bad Receivers dont get seperation and run poor routes The QB is raw and holds onto the ball too long All this makes the O line look worse than bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepthefaith Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Helpmenow said: Lions gave up on mills, jets and ravens gave up Vlad and bengals gave up on bodine Bills scouts must have determined that with some new coaching these guys could be good or they were only expected to be depth players. Personally I don't think the line is as bad as it may seem. When a defense doesn't respect your passing game, they can throw the kitchen sink at stopping the run and rushing the passer and that may be a contributing factor here. The packers brought pressure and the Bills didn't make them pay. Somehow it didn't seem to be in the game plan to run the ball much as the Bills passed the ball a good majority of the time even before the game was out of reach. You have to run the ball unless your passing game is superior. The Bills' passing game is anything but superior and when you can't run effectively everything gets harder offensively. Edited October 2, 2018 by keepthefaith 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrober38 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 1. QB holds the ball too long. 2. QB doesn't recognize pressure pre snap and adjust the protection properly. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 There are times that he doesn’t step up into the pocket when he can and instead runs into trouble. 1 minute ago, jrober38 said: 1. QB holds the ball too long. 2. QB doesn't recognize pressure pre snap and adjust the protection properly. Good reasons as well 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiskibreth Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 4 minutes ago, billsfan_34 said: The Oline is bad Receivers dont get seperation and run poor routes The QB is raw and holds onto the ball too long All this makes the O line look worse than bad This^^ Plain and simple. The lack of talent on this offense overall is astounding. I pray Allen doesn't get hurt, and actually learns valuable lessons for every lump he's going to take this season and gets better. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atlbillsfan1975 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 They need to draft 1 interior lineman and 1 right tackle in rounds 2-5. Pick up another starter in FA and a swing tackle in FA. Groy needs to be a backup C/G. Dawkins I think could be a good LT with adequate guard play next to him. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuckyBoys Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 Dawkins is fine Mills has always been horrible. Rest might play better with a few more games playing together. Allen needs quicker throws and the receivers need to be able to create some separation right away 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 One thing I remember from previous seasons' all-22 is how one clueless lineman can !@#$ up the entire blocking scheme, because everyone has to somehow try to support that hole. It might be the position on the field most dependent on teamwork. This line, for whatever reason, not only isn't on the same page, they're not even reading from the same book. They're not the most talented group, but when you've got guys double-teaming rushers and letting other rushers run free to the QB, it's not a talent issue. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan_34 Posted October 2, 2018 Share Posted October 2, 2018 9 minutes ago, DuckyBoys said: Dawkins is fine Mills has always been horrible. Rest might play better with a few more games playing together. Allen needs quicker throws and the receivers need to be able to create some separation right away Sad thing is, the receivers cant get speratiion because they aren’t good enough. As for our line, woukd any of them start elsewhere? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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