Giants didn’t even listen to offers

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 minutes ago, Buffalo30 said:

Only reason why I'd be hesitant about drafting the RB is if the offensive line is bad and well, the Giants don't exactly have a great one.  I'm sure it'll still work out for them.  They needed someone to take some weight off of Eli's shoulders.  He's been playing with washed up or scrub running backs for a while now.

 

So the Giants added Solder in FA and now Hernandez at the top of Rnd 2.  They are certainly making serious efforts to beef up their line.

Also Omameh wasn't kept by the Jags, but since he started 13 games for them and Fournette did pretty well, he might have had something to do with that. 

 

If I were a Giants fan, I'd feel pretty hopeful that perhaps the arrow is pointing way up for my team.

 

I'd certainly be feeling way better about the Bills offense with similar OL moves.  That's actually my biggest concern.

 

 

[Shaw66]

5 minutes ago, BadLandsMeanie said:

Im sorry. But this writer saying this is an example of why players didn't like Gettleman is just plain stupid.

 

 

Right.   

 

This is simple.   The GMs know how much they want a particular guy, and they also know how much they're willing to give up to get a guy.  

 

Gettleman didn't listen to offers because (1) he knew he really wanted Barkley and (2) no really obscene offer came in.   The Bills were rumored to have offered their two firsts plus a first next year, and Gettleman said.  No.   What would have happened if the Bills had also offered their two seconds and two thirds.   At some point, Gettleman was going to listen.   But the other GMs know what they're willing to offer, and none wanted to move up as badly as Gettleman wanted to stay where he was.  

[The Now Moment]

1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

So the Giants added Solder in FA and now Hernandez at the top of Rnd 2.  They are certainly making serious efforts to beef up their line.

Also Omameh wasn't kept by the Jags, but since he started 13 games for them and Fournette did pretty well, he might have had something to do with that. 

 

If I were a Giants fan, I'd feel pretty hopeful that perhaps the arrow is pointing way up for my team.

 

I'd certainly be feeling way better about the Bills offense with similar OL moves.  That's actually my biggest concern.

 

 

Oh no doubt.  They still need to throw it together and see if it works.  I like the Barkley pick for them.  Eli needed someone to help him on offense.  

 

The Bills offense is a project.  We all are aware of that.  The defense kept us in almost every game last year and they are beefing that up while Allen will learn this year.  Next year will be mostly about offense I'm sure.  We just need to be patient for when we have more money for free agent.

[Logic]

Early in the draft process, Gettleman had a quote where he said "you want to get a player you believe can be a Hall of Famer at pick 2. You don't want to get too cute". From that moment on, I didn't believe he was going to trade the pick. Why? Because Barkley profiles as a player who could be a Hall of Famer one day. 

I really believe that only an obscene overpay, like both 1sts, both 2nds, both 3rds, and next year's 1st, were going to get the job done. The Bills and Beane must not have felt like Darnold was worth that kind of capital. If it was a "sure thing" like an Andrew Luck coming out, maybe. But then, if it was an Andrew Luck, the Browns would've taken him.

And yes, it DOES make me feel better to know that Mayfield and Darnold (my top two favorite choices for the Bills) weren't even really a realistic option. That means the choice in reality was Allen vs Rosen. And whether I agree or not, I can absolutely see why the Bills preferred Allen. Superior upside, character, personality, work ethic, team fit, you name it.

[NoSaint]

Ultimately, if we weren’t including 22.... what were we offering that was better than what only got us to 7?

 

i wouldn’t trade back to 12 without another 1st 

[PromoTheRobot]

22 minutes ago, downunderbill said:

Because some fans will never be happy.

 

Every fan knows where you should have traded and who would have been available. #StupidGMs

[Ray Finkel]

53 minutes ago, Virgil said:

 

This honestly makes me feel better.  I still don’t like giving up our 2nds in the trade up, but it means Mayfield and Darnold were never options.  And, I trust Beane if he says Allen was better than Rosen. 

He could have moved back to 4 in a three way trade and he still would have picked up Barkley and an extra draft pick.  He knew people would have wanted to move up.  

[Shaw66]

3 minutes ago, Ray Finkel said:

He could have moved back to 4 in a three way trade and he still would have picked up Barkley and an extra draft pick.  He knew people would have wanted to move up.  

He could have, but someone had to offer it.   The Bills are probably the only team that had the draft capital to make it happen, and I would be amazed if the Bills didn't at least talk to the Browns about it.  

 

Here's how it likely went:

 

Bills call Giants and ask if they'd swap #2 for#12, #22 and next year's first (that was rumored to have happened).   Giants say no.   Giants say if you can get us #4, we can talk.

 

Bills call Browns.   Browns say we're not moving out of #4; we like it here.   Bills say how about our two firsts for you #4.  (Bills are thinking they can get the Giants to take #4 and next year's first.)   Browns say no, we like being at #4; if you want us to move out of #4 you have to give us more, like maybe next year's first.   That means the Bills have to give the Giants one or both of this year's seconds to move back two spots.   

 

At some point, it just got too expensive to the Bills.   Remember, McDermott said that their plan this week was to find a way to get a QB and get Edmunds, which meant they'd probably have to trade up twice.   Beane maintained his discipline; if he'd put together some kind of three-way deal with the Browns and Giants, he wouldn't have had enough capital left to trade up Edmunds.   So he decided to wait, and if the opportunity arose, to trade up to 5, 6, 7  or 8 for the QB.   That would leave him enough trade bait to Edmunds.   It worked as he planned.   

 

Beane may have gotten his second choice QB - if he'd gotten to #2 he might have taken Darnold, but Edmunds was his consolation prize.  

 

[Ray Finkel]

7 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

He could have, but someone had to offer it.   The Bills are probably the only team that had the draft capital to make it happen, and I would be amazed if the Bills didn't at least talk to the Browns about it.  

 

Here's how it likely went:

 

Bills call Giants and ask if they'd swap #2 for#12, #22 and next year's first (that was rumored to have happened).   Giants say no.   Giants say if you can get us #4, we can talk.

 

Bills call Browns.   Browns say we're not moving out of #4; we like it here.   Bills say how about our two firsts for you #4.  (Bills are thinking they can get the Giants to take #4 and next year's first.)   Browns say no, we like being at #4; if you want us to move out of #4 you have to give us more, like maybe next year's first.   That means the Bills have to give the Giants one or both of this year's seconds to move back two spots.   

 

At some point, it just got too expensive to the Bills.   Remember, McDermott said that their plan this week was to find a way to get a QB and get Edmunds, which meant they'd probably have to trade up twice.   Beane maintained his discipline; if he'd put together some kind of three-way deal with the Browns and Giants, he wouldn't have had enough capital left to trade up Edmunds.   So he decided to wait, and if the opportunity arose, to trade up to 5, 6, 7  or 8 for the QB.   That would leave him enough trade bait to Edmunds.   It worked as he planned.   

 

Beane may have gotten his second choice QB - if he'd gotten to #2 he might have taken Darnold, but Edmunds was his consolation prize.  

 

Moving up to 2 would have been the call if we didn't have so many holes.  So far we are getting some solid players.  I think we stole one with Phillips.

[Shaw66]

8 minutes ago, Ray Finkel said:

Moving up to 2 would have been the call if we didn't have so many holes.  So far we are getting some solid players.  I think we stole one with Phillips.

I don't know about Phillips - I don't study these guys.   But from the little I've read, I think you're right. 

 

I'm finding myself having more and more confidence in McDermott and Beane.   McDermott has a very highly defined sense of what he's doing.   He knows what he can teach, and what he can't.   He's kind of the opposite of Rex - Rex seemed to sit back and say "if you get me the right talent, I can win."   Then he'd whine that he didn't have the right talent, the best players.   

 

Sean isn't looking necessarily for the best talent, although he loves it when he gets it.   He's looking for guys who will work hard every day, commit to the team, and do what they're told.   He's looking for over-achievers.   He's looking for the Chris Hogans and Jim Leonards in the football universe.  

 

That, in turn, makes life easier for Beane.   Beane knows he doesn't have to get the biggest, strongest, fastest, most athletic guy at each position.   Instead, he can choose from any guys who have the minimum requirements for size, strength, speed and athleticism AND who have the right work ethic/team commitment.  Rounds four through seven and the undrafted rookies is where Beane can find a lot of guys who will never be stars but will do what McDermott needs.   

 

I think Phillips is one of those guys.  I think he has the brains and the heart to do what McD wants, and is physical limitations, the fact that he might be a bit of a tweener, won't be so important.   

 

And I think Beane will get more of those guys today.  

 

What I'm expecting is that the fans will be surprised in October and November how well holes have been plugged with rookies and guys who've spent the last two years on practice squads, getting called up for a game or two here or there.   Then next year, some of the weaker guys who plugged holes will be replaced by first and second round picks and by some free agents.   

 

2018 is pretty clearly year one of a two-year process.   This year in idle moments McD will be wishing he had someone at this position and that position; next year he'll have his guys everywhere.   

 

That's what makes this year a test of McD's coaching ability.  Talent-wise, he could have a 5-11 team.   If he's a good coach (and if the QB position works out at least okay), he could be sniffing the playoffs.   If he can do that, the 2019 Bills will be in position to make serious noise.  

[gjv001]

Beane and the Bills lucked out. With both the Giants and Denver unwilling to trade, the Bills were able to keep the 22nd pick. I want to thank them for giving us the opportunity to draft Tremaine Edmunds. 

[mannc]

Thank god the Bills didn’t hire this moron.  He should have been fired before the draft even started if that story is true.

2 hours ago, Happy Gilmore said:

I thought that if the Giants take a RB with the second pick, I'd consider firing Gettleman if I was the Mara's.  I believe his days as GM are numbered; when they have no plan to succeed Eli and Barkley isn't making as much of a difference as they hoped he would, Gettleman should start to sweat.

Yep.  It shows a complete lack of understanding of modern NFL football.  There are just so many reasons not to draft a RB at 2 (esp. in a QB draft like this one) that i don’t even know where to start.  Doesn’t matter how good Barkley turns out to be.

[njbuff]

3 hours ago, BadLandsMeanie said:

Im sorry. But this writer saying this is an example of why players didn't like Gettleman is just plain stupid.

 

 

 

Well, it's DA. He isn't the sharpest knife In the drawer.

[HappyDays]

I would hate this if I was a Giants fan. Taking a RB anywhere in the 1st round is dumb, let alone the top 5. Refusing to trade down for something like 3 1st round picks just to take a RB is as insane as it gets. Wow Gettleman is an idiot.

[Domdab99]

LOL Giants. Choosing a RB at #2 is so, so bad, especially when they so obviously could've traded back and Darnold, Rosen, and Allen were available. This just makes it worse. Gettleman will be gone in three years.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

3 hours ago, Virgil said:

 

This honestly makes me feel better.  I still don’t like giving up our 2nds in the trade up, but it means Mayfield and Darnold were never options.  And, I trust Beane if he says Allen was better than Rosen. 

 

...huh?...absolutely impossible......the all knowing urinalists told us that a deal "was in place with NYG" for #2.......they're NEVER wrong.....

[nbbillsfan]

Looks to me like the jets Checkmated the bills on getting mayfield or darnold. However, I guess there is a chance that if they really wanted darnold the bills could have tried to trade for 4 and then 2, allowing giants to still get sequan (seems unlikely on draft day though).

 

oh well, we will likely never know how the bills had the qbs rated.

[jimmy10]

3 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

I said as far back as January..... Gettleman was absolutely zeroed in on Saquon Barkley. I don't think he was ever interested in Darnold.... they let that be out there because they thought he would be gone #1 and they could say "we were never in a position to get him." They were going Barkley every single day of this process. 

 

I knew from talking to Giants fans in NYC over the last few months. After the PR debacle of Eli’s benching and unbenching last season, there was no way they were going to take a QB high in the draft this year, not with all the other holes they needed to fill. 

[GunnerBill]

Just now, jimmy10 said:

 

I knew from talking to Giants fans in NYC over the last few months. After the PR debacle of Eli’s benching and unbenching last season, there was no way they were going to take a QB high in the draft this year, not with all the other holes they needed to fill. 

 

I got slated for saying that on here a few months back Jimmy. The way they messed up the Eli situation last year played into this massively. 

[JinxedBill1]

I think the Bills would have traded up for Darnold.  Oh well, moving on.