Midwest1981 Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 (edited) Even a lot of "little draft"- like NDT Scouting- has surpassed McShay & Kiper in my mind in terms of quality of scouting/evaluation and draft prognostication. So I don't take what either say with a tremendous amount of credence or credibility. But I just thought I'd share that McShay said on Mike Greenberg's new show "Get Up" this morning that based on conversations he's had with league executives the expectation is that ultimately Beane gets a deal done with Gettleman to move up to pick #2. His exact characterization: "high probability." EDIT: 20 minutes after this post "Get Up" added the McShay/Kiper interview from this morning to its podcast: http://www.espn.com/espnradio/podcast/archive/_/id/22943353 On McShay and Kiper's last Podcast around the 20:35 mark Todd says what he also said today: http://www.espn.com/espnradio/play?id=22956078 It isn't the trading up part that's so troubling, though I personally think the cost is astronomical and prohibitive (I'd rather move up to 6 for Baker than 2 for Allen/Rosen and sacrifice half of the draft capital we've amassed; trading up to #2 will nearly wipe us clean). It's that Allen is allegedly the target, someone who clearly and notoriously needs major refinement and might be a full two years from capably playing at this level, if it ever occurs. Edited April 4, 2018 by Midwest1981 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stank_Nasty Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 i'm 200% more on board with only trading up to 5 or 6 and nabbing Mayfield. but if the scenario above ultimately happens i'll......... "trust the process" 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrDawkinstein Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 (edited) 43 minutes ago, Midwest1981 said: It isn't the trading up part that's so troubling, though I personally think the cost is astronomical and prohibitive (I'd rather move up to 6 for Baker than 2 for Allen/Rosen and sacrifice half of the draft capital we've amassed; trading up to #2 will nearly wipe us clean). It's that Allen is allegedly the target, someone who clearly and notoriously needs major refinement and might be a full two years from capably playing at this level, if it ever occurs. I sure hope McShay is right. WRT the bold... You just recreated moving up for Losman and letting Rothlisberger slip through your hands, AGAIN. This is the same loser attitude towards QB that has kept the Bills irrelevant for decades. The sole reason we've amassed said capital is so we CAN move up. That was the whole point this entire time. Gather these assets so we can use them to maneuver. Backing out now would be a huge failure. And trading away "half" our picks doesnt wipe us clean. We have the capital to move up to #2 and still keep a full regular draft. Edited April 4, 2018 by DrDawkinstein 5 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hondo in seattle Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 Good information. But do we really need another thread speculating about which QB we're going after? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Success Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 I’m fine with that if it happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 (edited) Spent a lot of time watching Allen the last week. The best comparison I came up with was Cam Newton. I wonder if the Bills see the same thing. If so it's easy to understand their love for Allen with the history of the people making the pick. Edited April 4, 2018 by TheTruthHurts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan4 Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 I can't see the Bills trading up to #2 for Allen. If theyre trading to #2, IMO it has to be for Rosen/Darnold. Maybe Mafield. Allen just seems like too big of a project to trade up to #2 for. But ivd bee weong before, so who knows. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFanForever19 Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 I love how most GM's and Talent Evaluators have Josh Allen as the #1 or #2 QB in this Draft. Yet, people on this board think he's EJ Manuel. I'll trust the one's doing this for a living. If they desire Allen - stop being a whiny brat and get behind the positives in his game. They ARE there. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheElectricCompany Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 2 minutes ago, TheTruthHurts said: Spent a lot of time watching Allen the last week. The best comparison I came up with was Cam Newton. I wonder if the Bills see the same thing. If so it's easy to understand their love for Allen with the history of the people making the pick. Old read from 6 months ago, but a good one. Talks about the differences between what the general public and NFL teams see in Allen... http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2737050-matt-millers-scouting-notebook-josh-allen-the-nfl-and-the-huge-twitter-debate 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wayne Cubed Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 7 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said: The sole reason we've amassed said capital is so we CAN move up. That was the whole point this entire time. Gather these assets so we can use them to maneuver. Backing out now would be a huge failure. Are you sure?!?!?! I mean the Bills could get a load of quality players with all the draft capital, who then eventually walk in FA. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billieve420 Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 Not in love with trading to #2 for Allen. If he falls out of the top# 5 fine but I don't think he is going to be ready to play for a few years. Rather risk those picks on Rosen instead who I expect the Jets to end up drafting. I could see Mayfield dropping out of the # 10 unless another team trades up. I would rather go with Mayfield over Allen as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Midwest1981 Posted April 4, 2018 Author Share Posted April 4, 2018 (edited) 8 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said: I sure hope McShay is right. WRT the bold... You just recreated moving up for Losman and letting Rothlisberger slip through your hands, AGAIN. This is the same lower attitude towards QB that has kept the Bills irrelevant for decades. The sole reason we've amassed said capital is so we CAN move up. That was the whole point this entire time. Gather these assets so we can use them to maneuver. Backing out now would be a huge failure. And trading away "half" our picks doesnt wipe us clean. We have the capital to move up to #2 and still keep a full regular draft. Then why didn't we just draft Mahomes when he was there last year, instead of trading down with the Chiefs to let them take him, if the ultimate goal was to acquire that extra pick and then trade that and so much else (two 2nd's, two 3rd's, our 2019 1st seems in play) to move up the next year? It makes little sense to have demanded that the Chiefs pay appreciably less for their trade-up then we're being forced to pay now. And for a prospect- if the target is in fact Allen- who if he fails had a glaringly obvious red flag in his (in)accuracy. For the record, Watson was also available at 10 when we traded down. Edited April 4, 2018 by Midwest1981 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsFan17 Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 If buffalo has a path to the second overall pick they absolutely have to pull the trigger. As far as what QB will be the choice, I can't envision the Bills meeting with Rosen/Mayfield as often as they have to go a different direction. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 1 minute ago, TheElectricCompany said: Old read from 6 months ago, but a good one. Talks about the differences between what the general public and NFL teams see in Allen... http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2737050-matt-millers-scouting-notebook-josh-allen-the-nfl-and-the-huge-twitter-debate The big difference between Newton and Allen is the offenses they played in. Allen is more prepared to play in the NFL than Newton was. Put Allen in Malzahn's offense and he could run for 1,000 yards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 I’m OK if they go up to #2. If it’s for Allen, maybe not so much. He scares the heck out of me! Is he Big Ben? Or is he EJ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Midwest1981 said: Even a lot of "little draft"- like NDT Scouting- has surpassed McShay & Kiper in my mind in terms of quality of scouting/evaluation and draft prognostication. So I don't take what either say with a tremendous amount of credence or credibility. But I just thought I'd share that McShay said on Mike Greenberg's new show "Get Up" this morning that based on conversations he's had with league executives the expectation is that ultimately Beane gets a deal done with Gettleman to move up to pick #2. His exact characterization: "high probability." On McShay and Kiper's last Podcast around the 20:35 mark Todd says what he also said today: http://www.espn.com/espnradio/play?id=22956078 It isn't the trading up part that's so troubling, though I personally think the cost is astronomical and prohibitive (I'd rather move up to 6 for Baker than 2 for Allen/Rosen and sacrifice half of the draft capital we've amassed; trading up to #2 will nearly wipe us clean). It's that Allen is allegedly the target, someone who clearly and notoriously needs major refinement and might be a full two years from capably playing at this level, if it ever occurs. I personally wouldn't mind getting Mayfield at #6 either, but there's a very decent chance he's gone in the top five. QBs could easily go 1-2-3-4 or 1-2-3-5, especially after teams that want QBs start throwing picks to trade up. Edited April 4, 2018 by Thurman#1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roundybout Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 If he's a Bill, then I will cheer for him. I still would not be happy if we gave up a lot for him, though. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo_Stampede Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 1 minute ago, BillsFan17 said: If buffalo has a path to the second overall pick they absolutely have to pull the trigger. As far as what QB will be the choice, I can't envision the Bills meeting with Rosen/Mayfield as often as they have to go a different direction. I've said this before but meeting with players often could mean they have a lot of questions about the player. That is most likely the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N.Y. Orangeman Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 Good find, Midwest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloHokie13 Posted April 4, 2018 Share Posted April 4, 2018 Right move, wrong QB. 4 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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