The Trump Economy

[Deranged Rhino]

6 minutes ago, meazza said:

 

You're getting scarily into Trump Fan Zone. Remember that at every pointi in his career, Trump has eventually ***** up everything he built.

 

I didn't advocate for his trolling -- I was just relaying it. I'm not worried about the economy. I've been preparing for a downturn for a long time now. It's unavoidable if he's going to truly break the establishment.

(and I'm rooting fully for that -- not Trump. The two agendas have crossover of course) 

Edited August 23, 2019 by Deranged Rhino

[DC Tom]

7 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

The thing with Trump is he has poor impulse control but later comes to his senses.  So, when I see him tweet something as authoritarian as that I treat it as the same way as a three year old telling me he hates me because I won't buy him a sucker.

 

Seriously...it amazes me that people still take him seriously.  

 

I'll tell ya what...I'll go back on my "never voting Democrat again" promise, and vote for whoever the Democratic Presidential candidate is in 2020 if and only if they have the great good sense to tell Trump "Yeah, whatever Donald" when he starts his ***** during the debates.  It's not going to happen - Yang and Tulsi might, but not a single likely candidate in the Democratic lineup can handle him.

[Tiberius]

2 hours ago, DC Tom said:

 

Seriously...it amazes me that people still take him seriously.  

 

I'll tell ya what...I'll go back on my "never voting Democrat again" promise, and vote for whoever the Democratic Presidential candidate is in 2020 if and only if they have the great good sense to tell Trump "Yeah, whatever Donald" when he starts his ***** during the debates.  It's not going to happen - Yang and Tulsi might, but not a single likely candidate in the Democratic lineup can handle him.

Trump won't do the debates, so you get a loop hole for supporting him again ?

[3rdnlng]

31 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

Trump won't do the debates, so you get a loop hole for supporting him again ?

He needs a loop hole like you need another asswhole.

Edited August 23, 2019 by 3rdnlng

[Buffalo_Gal]

12 hours ago, TPS said:

Have you been paying attention to business data and global growth, or just consumption and retail sales?

There is a reason the R word has crept into the business press.  Any objective person would look at all of the signals, and this sector has pointed down since the start of the year.

 

https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/manufacturing-production

 

This may sound odd... my brother works in a steel mill. For the last 10-12 years, I could tell you  what the economy is going to be doing in two quarters based on what they are rolling 180 days out.

They are running three lines and all the OT anyone wants right now.

 

[3rdnlng]

8 hours ago, meazza said:

 

You're getting scarily into Trump Fan Zone. Remember that at every pointi in his career, Trump has eventually ***** up everything he built.

My guess is that he's probably doing much better than all of his critics combined. He's the President, he's a billionaire and Melania is his wife. Not too shabby.

2 hours ago, Buffalo_Gal said:

This may sound odd... my brother works in a steel mill. For the last 10-12 years, I could tell you  what the economy is going to be doing in two quarters based on what they are rolling 180 days out.

They are running three lines and all the OT anyone wants right now.

 

Thumbs up.

[Deranged Rhino]

 

The International Emergency Economic Powers Act (IEEPA), Title II of Pub.L. 95–223, 91 Stat. 1626, enacted October 28, 1977, is a United States federal law authorizing the president to regulate international commerce after declaring a national emergency in response to any unusual and extraordinary threat to the United States which has its source in whole or substantial part outside the United States.^[1]

The H.R. 7738 legislation was passed by the United States 95th congressional session and signed by President Jimmy Carter on December 28, 1977.^[2]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Emergency_Economic_Powers_Act

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/50/1708

[bbb]

16 hours ago, 3rdnlng said:

Don't get your panties in a wad. The USA is in the catbird's seat and just needs to show patience. There is a reason we have a good economy while the rest of the world is struggling. We put tariffs on China and they put tariffs on our farm products and devalue their currency. We compensate our farmers and they sell their product to Canada or elsewhere and they sell it to China. A little inefficient but we can outlast China if we just stick to our guns. China's only hope is if they can outlast Trump and a democrat jellyfish gets elected.

 

What is the end game of this whole thing? 

[plenzmd1]

15 hours ago, Deranged Rhino said:

 

I didn't advocate for his trolling -- I was just relaying it. I'm not worried about the economy. I've been preparing for a downturn for a long time now. It's unavoidable if he's going to truly break the establishment.

(and I'm rooting fully for that -- not Trump. The two agendas have crossover of course) 

Sooo, let me get this straight

 

on Thursday, this was you stance

 

Quote

That's not what I'm saying. What I'm saying is you're witnessing (yet another) influence campaign designed to sow fear, division, and to "get Trump".

 

 

so, the economy was great, the media was just yapping about a "downturn" to get Trump. And i was told by you and and @Buffalo_Gal that consumer confidence was key to good economy.

 

Today, suddenly, in the midst of the "greatest economy ever"  you have been preparing for a downturn for a long  time now and state it is unavoidable as Trump shatters consumer confidence across the globe. And, yet,according to you, the media is running an influence campaign in reporting the very same facts that you claim to have been preparing for a long time. Good to have it both way I spose!

 

You realize you are Trumps wet dream and are a witness to the 5th avenue shooting no?

 

Edited August 24, 2019 by plenzmd1

[Foxx]

 

 

Bitcoin

 

 

 

Edited August 24, 2019 by Foxx

[Buffalo_Gal]

2 hours ago, plenzmd1 said:

Sooo, let me get this straight

 

on Thursday, this was you stance

 

so, the economy was great, the media was just yapping about a "downturn" to get Trump. And i was told by you and and @Buffalo_Gal that consumer confidence was key to good economy.

 

Today, suddenly, in the midst of the "greatest economy ever"  you have been preparing for a downturn for a long  time now and state it is unavoidable as Trump shatters consumer confidence across the globe. And, yet,according to you, the media is running an influence campaign in reporting the very same facts that you claim to have been preparing for a long time. Good to have it both way I spose!

 

You realize you are Trumps wet dream and are a witness to the 5th avenue shooting no?

 

I think you need to read a little closer. What goes up, must come down, has been said (or inferred) a lot in  this thread. The question is when, and by what method. 

If I, or anyone, could predict what the economy is going to do, I'd know when exactly to invest in property, gold, new business (and what business!), etc.  That would be some skill to have!

You seem to think because people disagree with you, and find the MSM disingenuous, that somehow means "Trump is right in all things!" People have explained to you that is not correct, but for some reason you are stuck on that thought.

I do think he is correct on China. Something should have been done long ago. If there is short-term pain for long-term gain,  so be it. As I said in this thread before: how many TVs does anyone really need? And Nikes are no cheaper made in China than a sneaker made in the United States (some New Balance still are). And do we really want China to continue to spy on us? And steal US intellectual property? And dump fentanyl on our streets?  If you believe those are good things, again, we will disagree. 






 

Edited August 24, 2019 by Buffalo_Gal

[TH3]

^ What gives you the slightest inkling that DT is capable of pulling anything together? He has shown literally no results in anything...anything......and no....not counting the GOP unfounded tax cuts as a result.....

 

[plenzmd1]

15 minutes ago, Buffalo_Gal said:

I think you need to read a little closer. What goes up, must come down, has been said (or inferred) a lot in  this thread. The question is when, and by what method. 

If I, or anyone, could predict what the economy is going to do, I'd know when exactly to invest in property, gold, new business (and what business!), etc.  That would be some skill to have!

You seem to think because people disagree with you, and find the MSM disingenuous, that somehow means "Trump is right in all things!" People have explained to you that is not correct, but for some reason you are stuck on that thought.

I do think he is correct on China. Something should have been done long ago. If there is short-term pain for long-term gain,  so be it. As I said in this thread before: how many TVs does anyone really need? And Nikes are no cheaper made in China than a sneaker made in the United States (some New Balance still are). And do we really want China to continue to spy on us? And steal US intellectual proWhat perty? And dump fentanyl on our streets?  If you believe those are good things, again, we will disagree. 






 

no, what has been said in this thread lately is two fold

1) the media is somehow concotting or distorting economic numbers in an effort to "get Trump"

2)  that effort being taken to erode consumer confidence..when there is one and only one person who is doing that right now..and its trump.

 

And unlike the majority of Trump supporters, we said the economy based on the numbers was rolling last year, even though we loathed Trump.. but the question was could the short term effects of the tax cut hold out long term. Just like the majority of us are saying now we are not in a recession, but if Trump keeps on this silly trade path he may just take us there. 

 

And not to pick bones..but damn a couple pages back you stated consumer confidence and spending is a key to our economy, and here you seem to say " eh..who needs more stuff, we all got enough"..and lets leave the 1.4 billion consumers in China out of the plans for growth.

 

And you want to stop doing business with countries who spy on us or we spy against? Take Israel and the UK out your trading network.

 

Or places where illegal drugs come from?  Take Canada and Mexico out of the trading network.   

 

Thats 3 out of the top 4 and 4 out of top 6 trading partners...

 

Again, you want it both ways

[Buffalo_Gal]

5 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

no, what has been said in this thread lately is two fold

1) the media is somehow concotting or distorting economic numbers in an effort to "get Trump"

2)  that effort being taken to erode consumer confidence..when there is one and only one person who is doing that right now..and its trump.

 

And unlike the majority of Trump supporters, we said the economy based on the numbers was rolling last year, even though we loathed Trump.. but the question was could the short term effects of the tax cut hold out long term. Just like the majority of us are saying now we are not in a recession, but if Trump keeps on this silly trade path he may just take us there. 

 

And not to pick bones..but damn a couple pages back you stated consumer confidence and spending is a key to our economy, and here you seem to say " eh..who needs more stuff, we all got enough"..and lets leave the 1.4 billion consumers in China out of the plans for growth.

 

And you want to stop doing business with countries who spy on us or we spy against? Take Israel and the UK out your trading network.

 

Or places where illegal drugs come from?  Take Canada and Mexico out of the trading network.   

 

Thats 3 out of the top 4 and 4 out of top 6 trading partners...

 

Again, you want it both ways

Not mutually exclusive.  (italicized)  editing to add: If US consumers are going to buy a lot of useless crap, I'd prefer they bought useless crap made in the USA. (which I have also stated before)

You are correct about other countries spying on us. Just as we spy on other countries.  However, read up on Huawei.

So, you feel that our trading partners should not try and reduce illegal drugs that come into the United States? I'm not sure you really mean that.

 

Edited August 24, 2019 by Buffalo_Gal

[LB3]

8 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

no, what has been said in this thread lately is two fold

1) the media is somehow concotting or distorting economic numbers in an effort to "get Trump"

2)  that effort being taken to erode consumer confidence..when there is one and only one person who is doing that right now..and its trump.

 

And unlike the majority of Trump supporters, we said the economy based on the numbers was rolling last year, even though we loathed Trump.. but the question was could the short term effects of the tax cut hold out long term. Just like the majority of us are saying now we are not in a recession, but if Trump keeps on this silly trade path he may just take us there. 

 

And not to pick bones..but damn a couple pages back you stated consumer confidence and spending is a key to our economy, and here you seem to say " eh..who needs more stuff, we all got enough"..and lets leave the 1.4 billion consumers in China out of the plans for growth.

 

And you want to stop doing business with countries who spy on us or we spy against? Take Israel and the UK out your trading network.

 

Or places where illegal drugs come from?  Take Canada and Mexico out of the trading network.   

 

Thats 3 out of the top 4 and 4 out of top 6 trading partners...

 

Again, you want it both ways

Both things can be true. The media is reporting actual numbers and there is absolutely a cause for concern. The media is also gleefully screaming that the sky is falling in hopes of turning that legitimate concern into full blown panic. You just can't see the latter because of your hatred of Trump.

Edited August 24, 2019 by LBSeeBallLBGetBall

[GG]

19 minutes ago, LBSeeBallLBGetBall said:

Both things can be true. The media is reporting actual numbers and there is absolutely a cause for concern. The media is also gleefully screaming that the sky is falling in hopes of turning that legitimate concern into full blown panic. You just can't see the latter because of your hatred of Trump.

Thanks for saving me typing time.  

[row_33]

1 hour ago, LBSeeBallLBGetBall said:

Both things can be true. The media is reporting actual numbers and there is absolutely a cause for concern. The media is also gleefully screaming that the sky is falling in hopes of turning that legitimate concern into full blown panic. You just can't see the latter because of your hatred of Trump.

 

Tis not the numbers, it’s how you bend them into TDS narrative 

 

 

[plenzmd1]

1 hour ago, Buffalo_Gal said:

Not mutually exclusive.  (italicized)  editing to add: If US consumers are going to buy a lot of useless crap, I'd prefer they bought useless crap made in the USA. (which I have also stated before)

You are correct about other countries spying on us. Just as we spy on other countries.  However, read up on Huawei.

So, you feel that our trading partners should not try and reduce illegal drugs that come into the United States? I'm not sure you really mean that.

 

I understand your points, but no way is that ship turning around in a dime in terms where we buy things from. And let’s not forget, whole lots of folks be screaming bloody hell in their Target shorts went from$23 to $45 if they were made in the US..chief amongst them me! BTW, and not for nothing, the Goodfella brand of men’s clothes is freaking awesome value!!!!the undies are great! ( see what I did there? Made ya picture me in my undies,, try and get rid of that image !!

1 hour ago, LBSeeBallLBGetBall said:

Both things can be true. The media is reporting actual numbers and there is absolutely a cause for concern. The media is also gleefully screaming that the sky is falling in hopes of turning that legitimate concern into full blown panic. You just can't see the latter because of your hatred of Trump.

Umm, if you want to say the media is whipping people into a panic , think Trump is doing that all by himself. Have some friends in CA this weekend, big MAGA , his commnet yesterday was jeez, does Trump want $2000 iPhones? And this guy thinks Fox Business is too liberal. 

[Buffalo_Gal]

34 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

I understand your points, but no way is that ship turning around in a dime in terms where we buy things from. And let’s not forget, whole lots of folks be screaming bloody hell in their Target shorts went from$23 to $45 if they were made in the US..chief amongst them me! BTW, and not for nothing, the Goodfella brand of men’s clothes is freaking awesome value!!!!the undies are great! ( see what I did there? Made ya picture me in my undies,, try and get rid of that image !!

 

[3rdnlng]

27 minutes ago, Buffalo_Gal said:

Don't worry, any guy who calls them "undies" is harmless. Besides I think you could have outrun him if needed.

[DC Tom]

12 hours ago, Deranged Rhino said:

 

The International Emergency Economic Powers Act (IEEPA), Title II of Pub.L. 95–223, 91 Stat. 1626, enacted October 28, 1977, is a United States federal law authorizing the president to regulate international commerce after declaring a national emergency in response to any unusual and extraordinary threat to the United States which has its source in whole or substantial part outside the United States.^[1]

The H.R. 7738 legislation was passed by the United States 95th congressional session and signed by President Jimmy Carter on December 28, 1977.^[2]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Emergency_Economic_Powers_Act

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/50/1708

 

But you can't do it with a tweet. 

[TPS]

4 hours ago, LBSeeBallLBGetBall said:

Both things can be true. The media is reporting actual numbers and there is absolutely a cause for concern. The media is also gleefully screaming that the sky is falling in hopes of turning that legitimate concern into full blown panic. You just can't see the latter because of your hatred of Trump.

This is the pot calling the kettle black. 

As I stated a couple of pages ago, both are probably true.  Unfortunately, some can't see the "former" because of their religious belief in Trump...

[Doc Brown]

2 hours ago, DC Tom said:

 

But you can't do it with a tweet. 

I'm sure yesterday before his carefully measured tweets that tanked the markets he carefully studied the Emergency Economic Powers Act of 1977 to be on the safe side.

[Deranged Rhino]

9 hours ago, plenzmd1 said:

Sooo, let me get this straight

 

on Thursday, this was you stance

 

so, the economy was great, the media was just yapping about a "downturn" to get Trump. And i was told by you and and @Buffalo_Gal that consumer confidence was key to good economy.

 

Today, suddenly, in the midst of the "greatest economy ever"  you have been preparing for a downturn for a long  time now and state it is unavoidable as Trump shatters consumer confidence across the globe. And, yet,according to you, the media is running an influence campaign in reporting the very same facts that you claim to have been preparing for a long time. Good to have it both way I spose!

 

You realize you are Trumps wet dream and are a witness to the 5th avenue shooting no?

 

 

Preparing for a downturn — from record highs. Not a recession. There’s a difference   

 

[plenzmd1]

18 hours ago, Deranged Rhino said:

 

Preparing for a downturn — from record highs. Not a recession. There’s a difference   

 

well, semantics !!!

 

If you been preparing for a downturn based off record highs..you been preparing for like the last 6 years!!!!

 

Talking with my friend last night and he was thinking shifting some assets to bonds..i was all no way can i time the market...if the market poops the bed nd we get a 20% correction, so be it..but i ain't missing the next upturn

[Tiberius]

Has he pulled all our businesses out of China yet? 

 

Republicans have elected a low information person president who Believes the self serving propaganda that is vomited up by right wing nuts. He can still make things a lot worse. Would not surprise me if he just tanks the world economy somehow out of spite. 

 

Hold on, we a temper tantrum or two away from him really f-Ning things up more. Putin must be laughing 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

21 hours ago, 3rdnlng said:

Don't worry, any guy who calls them "undies" is harmless. Besides I think you could have outrun him if needed.

 

...Tibs...room to dump his numerous "loads"............mega Depends........

[Tiberius]

40 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...Tibs...room to dump his numerous "loads"............mega Depends........

Looks like someone already dumped a ton in Trumps head

-----

 

Wall Street Journal is fed up with Trump's complete incoherence and incompetence: 

 

The Wall Street Journal gave President Donald Trump a stiff word-lashing Friday for ratcheting up his no-win trade war with China.

“The trouble with trade wars, like shooting wars, is that once they start you never know how they’re going to end,” the Journal noted in an editorial scorching Trump. “The enemy gets a vote, and sometimes events escalate in ugly fashion. Take Friday, which saw China retaliate for Donald Trump’s recent tariffs, Mr. Trump blow a gasket, markets tank, and Mr. Trump impose even more tariffs.”

 

The newspaper said Trump then “began tweeting like a bull in a china shop,” and scoffed at his “order” that American companies no longer have anything to do with the world’s second-largest economy.

“Order? Somebody should tell Chairman Trump this isn’t the People’s Republic of America,” the editorial added. U.S. businesses have been trying to shift production out of China to avoid tariffs, “but supply chains that have been developed over decades can’t be uprooted overnight. And no other country has China’s huge relatively skilled workforce, infrastructure and network of suppliers,” the newspaper noted.

The editorial mocked Trump’s “trade-war general” Peter Navarro, and his laughable advice to the stock market that “we’re cool here.” The editors scoffed: “Got that, markets? Just chill, baby.”

 

Instead, the newspaper warned, “markets are wondering if we’re heading toward mutual assured economic destruction.”

In a final dig, the editorial asked: “What was that again about trade wars being easy to win?”

[Buffalo_Gal]

U.S., Japan agree in principle on trade deal worth 'billions and billions'

Trump highlights benefits for American farmers
 

The U.S. and Japan have agreed in principle on a trade deal worth “billions and billions of dollars,” President Trump said Sunday.
 

Mr. Trump said parties will likely sign the deal around the U.N. General Assembly in September.
 

Japan will buy up America’s corn surplus as part of the deal. Some tariffs on Japanese goods will be removed, though existing levies on autos will remain.
 

“It’s a very big transaction, and we’ve agreed in principle. It’s billions and billions of dollars. Tremendous for the farmers,” Mr. Trump said in an impromptu session with Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe at the Group of Seven summit in France.
 

</snip>
 

U.S. Trade Representative Robert Lighthizer said Japan is the U.S.’s third-largest agriculture market. He said the deal will open up markets for $7 billion more in U.S. beef, pork, wheat, dairy, wine, ethanol and other products.
 

</snip>

Edited August 25, 2019 by Buffalo_Gal

[B-Man]

 

 

The What They Actually Said Rule

by Don Surber 

 

Original Article

Posted by earlybird — 8/26/2019 9:34:15 AM Post Reply

The Associated Press today engaged in a clickbait that predates the Internet. In it, the reporter makes a statement in the form of a question, then attributes the statement to the interviewed person.

 

The question of President Donald John Trump was, "Mister President, any second thoughts on escalating the trade war with China? The president replied, "Yeah, sure. Why not?"

The reporter asked again, "Second thoughts? Yes?" The president replied, "Might as well, might as well."

Finally, the reporter asked, "You have second thoughts on escalating the trade war with China?" President Trump replied, "I have second thoughts about everything.”

 

(Snip)

 

The Associated Press headline read, "Trump signals some regret on China trade war.

 

 

.

[Deranged Rhino]

https://mobile.twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1165919483191599104

 

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/china-announces-it-seeks-end-to-trade-war-as-markets-tank-and-currency-hits-11-year-flatline.amp?__twitter_impression=true

[B-Man]

 

 

 The Atlantic: Every American Should Hope Trump Prevails Against China. 

 

 

“China’s response to U.S. trade actions appears to reflect a cynicism about the efficacy of democracy. Beijing’s strategy appears calibrated to exploit the fact that the American people elect the head of their government, by attempting to influence how the American people will vote. In effect, it seems to be gambling on its ability to turn American democracy against itself.”

 

 

 

.

[TPS]

This is a very interesting graph....Food for thought for those who think Obama's deficits are like Trump's...

 

 

[row_33]

all of this is trial balloons and negotiating

 

one topic on Fox on the weekend was how this President speaks his mind

 

so we KNOW what he is thinking

 

almost unheard of

 

gives the media a chance to have a hairy spaz over everything he says

 

despite the Depression predicted on Friday, the Dow has been up 200 and bouncing around a bit this morning

 

[B-Man]

 

 

 

.

[B-Man]

 

 

LOL.

 

 

 

 

.

[transplantbillsfan]

 

[plenzmd1]

41 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

cough cough..calling @Buffalo_Gal

[Buffalo_Gal]

1 minute ago, plenzmd1 said:

cough cough..calling @Buffalo_Gal

Here ya go:

</snip>

Each year, the Current Employment Statistics (CES) survey employment estimates are benchmarked to comprehensive counts of employment for the month of March. These counts are derived from state unemployment insurance (UI) tax records that nearly all employers are required to file. For national CES employment series, the annual benchmark revisions over the last 10 years have averaged plus or minus two-tenths of one percent of total nonfarm employment. The preliminary estimate of the benchmark revision indicates a downward adjustment to March 2019 total nonfarm employment of -501,000 (-0.3 percent).

</snip>

Not sure where the 20% in that article came from. That Bureau of Labor Statics graph the story linked to showed that the  government adjusted data showed some of the benchmark revisions were up, some were down.  (I could be reading it wrong, but that was why I quoted that 0.3%.)

 

[plenzmd1]

18 minutes ago, Buffalo_Gal said:

Here ya go:

</snip>

Each year, the Current Employment Statistics (CES) survey employment estimates are benchmarked to comprehensive counts of employment for the month of March. These counts are derived from state unemployment insurance (UI) tax records that nearly all employers are required to file. For national CES employment series, the annual benchmark revisions over the last 10 years have averaged plus or minus two-tenths of one percent of total nonfarm employment. The preliminary estimate of the benchmark revision indicates a downward adjustment to March 2019 total nonfarm employment of -501,000 (-0.3 percent).

</snip>

Not sure where the 20% in that article came from. That Bureau of Labor Statics graph the story linked to showed that the  government adjusted data showed some of the benchmark revisions were up, some were down.  (I could be reading it wrong, but that was why I quoted that 0.3%.)

 

was just busting on your "number are always revised up under Trump"..?