Eagles released Evan Mathis

[eball]

Ok so now I don't have to check this thread every ten minutes.

 

Unless you want to amuse yourself listening to the crusade about how signing Mathis would have meant "all the difference" for this team...

[Wayne Cubed]

A 3rd round rookie OG vs a seasoned vet who graded an amazing (+46.7) back in 2013 is a no brainer, and last season was on pace to be an all pro first teamer until an injury sidelined him a few games. McCoy had 1607 yards rushing in 2013, and Evans had a lot to do with that. By the same token when he was out with injuries last year is when McCoy was doing his "skittering" behind the line to find a hole. That "skittering" is a big reason why Kelly stated he wanted McCoy gone. (Spiller anyone?)

 

I have little to no faith in a 3rd round rookie at OG considering the results of last years three linemen drafted.

 

Whaley should find a way to make some cap room to sign this player, and in doing do would give the Bills a solid shot at the division title / playoff spot. I know I'd be much more enthused about the up coming season, and not just for the ability to run the ball effectively but to also protect the QB, and give them real time to make all the throws. JMHO

Oh the hilarity of this post.

 

Evan Mathis, a 3rd round pick himself.

[John from Riverside]

 

Yep. Not gonna write a story on it, so just going to report it on Twitter, but my sourcing is AP-worthy.

 

jw

Im totally ok with this......I like Mathis but anything that affects the Marcel contract extension needs to be taken into account

 

This would take reps from John Miller anyway.......

A 3rd round rookie OG vs a seasoned vet who graded an amazing (+46.7) back in 2013 is a no brainer, and last season was on pace to be an all pro first teamer until an injury sidelined him a few games. McCoy had 1607 yards rushing in 2013, and Evans had a lot to do with that. By the same token when he was out with injuries last year is when McCoy was doing his "skittering" behind the line to find a hole. That "skittering" is a big reason why Kelly stated he wanted McCoy gone. (Spiller anyone?)

 

We gotta look big picture here.......which is the Marcel D. extension. I get this feeling that the team...in order to do what they want to do.....needs to pan out on draft picks at certain positions and not pay there so that they CAN pay their proven talent and keep it.....which probably means....NO MATHIS....YES MARCEL D.

 

and Im ok with that

 

I have little to no faith in a 3rd round rookie at OG considering the results of last years three linemen drafted.

 

Care to take a stab on where Mathis was drafted? The fact of the matter is in the 2nd and 3rd rounds that is WHERE u find your solid offensive linemen.

 

Whaley should find a way to make some cap room to sign this player, and in doing do would give the Bills a solid shot at the division title / playoff spot. I know I'd be much more enthused about the up coming season, and not just for the ability to run the ball effectively but to also protect the QB, and give them real time to make all the throws. JMHO

 

Maybe he should go out and pick it off the money tree? If only it was that easy. The problem is not actually money available.....our owner HAS THAT AND HAS SHOWN THE WILLINGNESS TO SPEND IT....no its about cap.......Marcel D., Glenn, Gilmore, Bradham these guys are all going to need extensions.

 

How do you do that? By drafting well and finding players at the other spots......Miller....Darby.....O'Leary.....Karlos Williams.....look for ALL of these players to contributers.

[The Dean]

 

Yep. Not gonna write a story on it, so just going to report it on Twitter, but my sourcing is AP-worthy.

 

jw

 

 

Well, I think that ends the speculation. No more trustworthy source than JW, IMO.

 

Do you know if the Bills made an inquiry about Mathis (I would be shocked if they didn't) and discovered he was simply going for the biggest payday---or one they knew they couldn't afford?

[thewildrabbit]

Dammit. Really wish they found a way to make this happen.

 

When there are issues at QB, the equation for the front office should be simple: Having a great o-line > having great receivers.

Sad news indeed for me if JW is correct.

 

Building a great O line should be the very first thing each new regime should look at, and yet all most of them have done is continually band-aid the situation year after year.

[dezertbill]

I'm sure it had to do with the convo that Bills Brass had with Mathis agent during inquiring phase?

 

Money or role he wanted probably turned them off.

[YoloinOhio]

I'm sure it had to do with the convo that Bills Brass had with Mathis agent during inquiring phase?

 

Money or role he wanted probably turned them off.

im sure they didn't want to pay him given the fact their like their 2 guards. Chip didn't think he's worth it either so since he's a genius...

[FLFan]

https://twitter.com/john_wawrow/status/609456278419714048

 

From JW:

 

Fine with this at this point. He is a good player, but at the backside of his career and not the right investment at this time.

[BillsFanM.D.]

Doug Whaley is a pretty good GM in my view. Not perfect... but pretty darn good. If we aren't pursuing Mathis, it's probably the right decision.

[thewildrabbit]

Im totally ok with this......I like Mathis but anything that affects the Marcel contract extension needs to be taken into account

 

This would take reps from John Miller anyway.......

I have no idea why most Bills fans think John Miller (a player with a 3-5th round draft grade) is the second coming of Evan Mathis? Take away reps from a 3rd rounder really? A guy who may not even see the field like the 2nd rounder last year, or even see the field and prove he isn't very good like the fifth rounder from last years draft.

 

I just don't get why some fans think a Bills 3rd round pick is going to step on the field and instantly become one of the most dominate players at his position. In fact show me one third round draft pick the Buffalo Bills have made in the last ten years, or even under the current GM that have made the impact of a top starting player... much less an all pro.

 

The simple fact is that Mathis is a eleven year vet who wasn't all that good in his first six seasons, and it wasn't until he got into the Andy Reid coaching system that he really developed into a great NFL player. Comparing the two players is just silly.

The fact of the matter is in the 2nd and 3rd rounds that is WHERE u find your solid offensive linemen.

Tell that to the Dallas Cowboys who drafted OG Zack Martin in the first round last year. Martin went on to become an all pro, and an offensive rookie of the year candidate while helping solidify last years best graded O line.

 

The Bills drafted Eric Wood with a first round pick, and he has been a solid player at that position.

 

If that statement is so true then WTF happened to the Bills 2nd rounder in OT Cyrus Kouandjio last year who never even saw the field on the leagues near worst O line? My belief is that if you want the best at any position you should look to the first round.

 

(I also get that not every player can be a first round pick. The Bills just put a higher priority on the defensive side it seems, and seem to prefer to draft for the O line in the draft after the first rounds. Yet with this philosophy the Bills been at or near the bottom of the division) 2012, 9 of 11 players on defense drafted in the 1st or 2nd round, and were 26th under Dave Wannstedt. A Top ten defense equaled 6-10 in 2013. Last year a top 4 defense equaled 9-7 with the Patriots sitting Brady in their last game

 

The really sad fact for me is the current FO regime agrees with you John.

[Big C]

Teams never wins championships because they have the best O-line. The teams that have drafted OL high without a good QB still don't get much better.

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

I think they must feel like they made a sufficient upgrade at guard with Incognito to let it ride.

[BillsFanForever19]

Looking at the depth chart - i'd think they'd be more interested in acquiring a Tackle than a Guard at this point.

[John from Riverside]

I have no idea why most Bills fans think John Miller (a player with a 3-5th round draft grade) is the second coming of Evan Mathis? Take away reps from a 3rd rounder really? A guy who may not even see the field like the 2nd rounder last year, or even see the field and prove he isn't very good like the fifth rounder from last years draft.

 

Actually Miller is probably not the second coming of Mathis......Mathis is a zone blocking OG which isnt what the bills are doing anyway. Miller is all about power and you can see it both in his film and his build. Rex, Roman, and Kromer like him and thats good enough for me at this point. You either trust the coaching staff that has been brought in or you dont. and they LOVE Miller.

 

I just don't get why some fans think a Bills 3rd round pick is going to step on the field and instantly become one of the most dominate players at his position. In fact show me one third round draft pick the Buffalo Bills have made in the last ten years, or even under the current GM that have made the impact of a top starting player... much less an all pro.

 

Because with O linemen it DOES happen....a LOT.....and lets keep in mind that Mathis HAS been an very good player.....on a different team....and is pretty long in the tooth. If we signed him he would be the SECOND OLDEST player on the team....do you really want to give a big contract to a player like that when we have the other big contracts looming?

 

The simple fact is that Mathis is a eleven year vet who wasn't all that good in his first six seasons, and it wasn't until he got into the Andy Reid coaching system that he really developed into a great NFL player. Comparing the two players is just silly.

Tell that to the Dallas Cowboys who drafted OG Zack Martin in the first round last year. Martin went on to become an all pro, and an offensive rookie of the year candidate while helping solidify last years best graded O line.

 

ELEVEN YEAR VET.......that pretty much says it all. We had no first round pick this year to draft a OL, Zach Martin was a good player....that is also not to say that Miller will ALSO not go on to be a good player.

 

 

 

The Bills drafted Eric Wood with a first round pick, and he has been a solid player at that position.

 

Yes he is.....and was a good pick......and has absolutely nothing to do with this conversation.

 

If that statement is so true then WTF happened to the Bills 2nd rounder in OT Cyrus Kouandjio last year who never even saw the field on the leagues near worst O line? My belief is that if you want the best at any position you should look to the first round.

 

Kujo was a first round projection....and we dont know how that is gonna turn out yet.

 

(I also get that not every player can be a first round pick. The Bills just put a higher priority on the defensive side it seems, and seem to prefer to draft for the O line in the draft after the first rounds. Yet with this philosophy the Bills been at or near the bottom of the division) 2012, 9 of 11 players on defense drafted in the 1st or 2nd round, and were 26th under Dave Wannstedt. A Top ten defense equaled 6-10 in 2013. Last year a top 4 defense equaled 9-7 with the Patriots sitting Brady in their last game

 

Perhaps drafting D players is Whaley's strength....is there something wrong with that? There were D players out of that game against the Patriots.

 

The really sad fact for me is the current FO regime agrees with you John.

 

I dont know that they have been proven wrong yet.......a lot of factors going on here.

[3rdand12]

I would agree with the spirit of your post.

 

Has the emergency of Miller and Kouandjio along with the solid play of Incognito changed the Bills offense line outlook a bit since FA began? Sure it has. I think it was a best case scenario that the Bills would find a OG in the draft who had the smarts and could possibly come in day one and start, along with Kouandjio finally having the light bulb go on (or rather having a coaching staff have confidence in him, depending on how you look at it) and have Incognito become the player that they had hoped he could be when they signed him off the scrap heap. All have come to fruition thus far.

 

But again, similar to the QB battle, this is all against air. Miller, Kouandjio, and Incognito haven't blocked anyone yet. When the real bullets fly is when we are going to see what these player are made of.

 

Unfortunately for Buffalo, their last chance to seriously upgrade their OL may be off the market by then. My thoughts are if the Bills had the cap space to sign Harvin (who I agree is a great talent but yet has to be seen as a luxury addition) then they have to find the cap space to bring in a player like Mathis. As late as April, Ryan was speaking of his concern for the OL. He's been in coaching long enough to know as Bill Parcells once said "Potential can get a coach fired'. You need someone proven on the OL that you know can deliver this year, and not have growing pains.

 

I believe Mathis was a gift that was dropped out of the sky at a time when Santa has his sleigh parked for the summer. The Bills had (and still have) a glaring need at guard, and for a team that needs to win now and make the playoffs, there can be nothing perceived as negative by adding him to our roster.

 

Will it take away from Miller's reps and learning the system? Possibly. But if in the end Mathis outplays Miller regardless of how many reps Miller gets that's the whole point of why we added him.

 

Granted, Buffalo is trying to get Dareus signed, but they can franchise him worse case scenario. You have a lineman (Williams) that's on the books for about $2.5 mil that is sitting at home not participating (injury or no injury) and a huge cap number with Mario that can be turned into signing bonus to save some $$ there. Add that to the $7 plus mill we have to play with and room can be made.

 

The Bills need to solidify their OL with dependable players who can be counted on at a position where we are putting all of our eggs in one basket & will be the catalyst of our offense game plan (the running game).

 

I don't look at Mathis as a luxury. I look at a Pro Bowl offensive guard on a front 5 that is young and inexperienced as a necessity.

may i piggy back this post in a professional manner , and agree with all the above.

 

 

C Williams will not be playing. let Miller develop a year. which is smart with Cogs one year contract.

it cant be that hard to find some money for Mathis to start. as long as he comes back down to the financial reality after a couple weesk when no one reaches for him

 

I mean he WAS released by CKelly, who knows NFL players as well or better than anyone /

 

but honestly If Mister Warrow say that where the Bills stand right now there may be no in between

Edited June 13, 2015 by 3rdand12

[Reed83HOF]

Teams never wins championships because they have the best O-line. The teams that have drafted OL high without a good QB still don't get much better.

That's not what some on here believe...

[thewildrabbit]

I would agree with the spirit of your post.

 

Has the emergency of Miller and Kouandjio along with the solid play of Incognito changed the Bills offense line outlook a bit since FA began? Sure it has. I think it was a best case scenario that the Bills would find a OG in the draft who had the smarts and could possibly come in day one and start, along with Kouandjio finally having the light bulb go on (or rather having a coaching staff have confidence in him, depending on how you look at it) and have Incognito become the player that they had hoped he could be when they signed him off the scrap heap. All have come to fruition thus far.

 

But again, similar to the QB battle, this is all against air. Miller, Kouandjio, and Incognito haven't blocked anyone yet. When the real bullets fly is when we are going to see what these player are made of.

 

Unfortunately for Buffalo, their last chance to seriously upgrade their OL may be off the market by then. My thoughts are if the Bills had the cap space to sign Harvin (who I agree is a great talent but yet has to be seen as a luxury addition) then they have to find the cap space to bring in a player like Mathis. As late as April, Ryan was speaking of his concern for the OL. He's been in coaching long enough to know as Bill Parcells once said "Potential can get a coach fired'. You need someone proven on the OL that you know can deliver this year, and not have growing pains.

 

I believe Mathis was a gift that was dropped out of the sky at a time when Santa has his sleigh parked for the summer. The Bills had (and still have) a glaring need at guard, and for a team that needs to win now and make the playoffs, there can be nothing perceived as negative by adding him to our roster.

 

Will it take away from Miller's reps and learning the system? Possibly. But if in the end Mathis outplays Miller regardless of how many reps Miller gets that's the whole point of why we added him.

 

Granted, Buffalo is trying to get Dareus signed, but they can franchise him worse case scenario. You have a lineman (Williams) that's on the books for about $2.5 mil that is sitting at home not participating (injury or no injury) and a huge cap number with Mario that can be turned into signing bonus to save some $$ there. Add that to the $7 plus mill we have to play with and room can be made.

 

The Bills need to solidify their OL with dependable players who can be counted on at a position where we are putting all of our eggs in one basket & will be the catalyst of our offense game plan (the running game).

 

I don't look at Mathis as a luxury. I look at a Pro Bowl offensive guard on a front 5 that is young and inexperienced as a necessity.

My feeling exactly, and its just a darn shame the current FO doesn't share this opinion. Gonna be difficult for any QB to play well this year under the current circumstances IMO.

 

Teams never wins championships because they have the best O-line. The teams that have drafted OL high without a good QB still don't get much better.

The simple truth is the Bills haven't had a top line since the Jim Kelly days when they had three all pros on their line, or the AFL days of championships when every O linemen was an all pro.

 

Its a big reason as to why no Bills QB has been able to elevate himself beyond the "he sucks" title the last 15 years. JMO

[Nanker]

Ok so now I don't have to check this thread every ten minutes.

Thank the Lord above, or wherever.

Time to get to drinking folks.

[thebandit27]

That's not what some on here believe...

We're at the point where the OL is somehow responsible for no Bills' QB since Kelly being good enough (despite Bledsoe breaking Kelly's single season yards and TD record in 2002).

 

I think Mathis is good and would be thrilled to get him; it wouldn't come within 1,000 figurative miles of bringing in an even mediocre starting QB.

[The Dean]

We're at the point where the OL is somehow responsible for no Bills' QB since Kelly being good enough (despite Bledsoe breaking Kelly's single season yards and TD record in 2002).

 

I think Mathis is good and would be thrilled to get him; it wouldn't come within 1,000 figurative miles of bringing in an even mediocre starting QB.

 

 

Bottom line, you got that right.

 

Bledsoe's real undoing, IMO, was he was more susceptible to being taken out of the game early, but a good solid hit or two. He was that guy with the Pats* and the Bills. Nearly all QBs can be rattled by extreme pressure (especially up the middle) but Bledsoe fell apart to a degree I simply don't expect from a quality QB. That, and of course, he was a fumbling statue.