JerseyBills Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Defenses under Wanny from 99-04 ranked...... 99 - #5 00 - #6 01 - #5 02 - #3 03 - #10 04 - #8 Lets go! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estelle Getty Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Defenses under Wanny from 99-04 ranked...... 99 - #5 00 - #6 01 - #5 02 - #3 03 - #10 04 - #8 Lets go! Under this theory our bad defense lies on Gaileys shoulders. Not sure I buy this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpberr Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I wonder if the common thread to all those years is that he had prolific defensive ends in the 4-3 system that generated a constant pass rush. Outside of Zach Thomas at MLB, I don't think their linebackers were anything wonderful. In one of those years, Ogunleye off the end was virtually unstoppable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Under this theory our bad defense lies on Gaileys shoulders. Not sure I buy this. Not at all. Wanny was and is known as a defensive coach. He controlled the defenses in Miami when he was head coach the same way that Gailey controls the offenses for the Bills as Head Coach because he is an offensive coach. Ultimately head coaches are responsible for both because they are the boss. Gailey doesn't mess with the Bills defense much because he hired someone to do it. He gets all the credit and all the blame for the offensive side of the ball, and only the credit or the blame for hiring who was in charge of the defensive side of the ball. So he gets blame here for hiring Edwards but not the defensive play. Some HC, like Marv, are just managers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Estelle Getty Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Not at all. Wanny was and is known as a defensive coach. He controlled the defenses in Miami when he was head coach the same way that Gailey controls the offenses for the Bills as Head Coach because he is an offensive coach. Ultimately head coaches are responsible for both because they are the boss. Gailey doesn't mess with the Bills defense much because he hired someone to do it. He gets all the credit and all the blame for the offensive side of the ball, and only the credit or the blame for hiring who was in charge of the defensive side of the ball. So he gets blame here for hiring Edwards but not the defensive play. Some HC, like Marv, are just managers. On second thought since it is his side of the ball I agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Under this theory our bad defense lies on Gaileys shoulders. Not sure I buy this. Or the defensive cordinator we just fired... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toshiero Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I wonder if the common thread to all those years is that he had prolific defensive ends in the 4-3 system that generated a constant pass rush. Outside of Zach Thomas at MLB, I don't think their linebackers were anything wonderful. In one of those years, Ogunleye off the end was virtually unstoppable. We will have one of the top, if not THE top, DT tandem in the NFL that can not only stop the run but get in the passers face. You stop great passers not by edge rushing but by getting straight in their faces. Now RDE in the draft or Free agency needs to be our #1 priority and get us back to the 4-3 ASAP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Wei 44 Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Defenses under Wanny from 99-04 ranked...... 99 - #5 00 - #6 01 - #5 02 - #3 03 - #10 04 - #8 Lets go! Great info and certainly reason for optimism - And I thought I saw someone post somewhere that he's never made it to the playoffs - That is completely wrong; he has been to the playoffs many times on more than one team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Barbarian Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I think the key to a good 43 is TWO big DTs, that small Tampa2 was the reason are 43 D stunk. Miami had Bowens and Gardner back then and they took up all the double teams allowing linbackers to make plays. 85 bears had Fridge and McMichael (who wasn'huge but was good sized for that time). 2000 Ravens had Siragusa and Sam adams and we had Pat Williams and Adams, which was the last time we had a good defense. With Dareus and the emergence of Heard we will have two 340+ DTs to clog the lanes and finally we can stop the run to which in turn will allow us to rush the passer. Kyle is great and will be used as disrupter but he's never been that run stuffing DT that we have always needed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOBILLS78 Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 I'd be more interested in the ranks when he was defensive coordinator (Dallas, Miami) instead of head coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan in Chicago Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Defenses under Wanny from 99-04 ranked...... 99 - #5 00 - #6 01 - #5 02 - #3 03 - #10 04 - #8 Lets go! If I am not mistaken, the 1992 Cowboys had the #1 D under Wanny. They ofcourse also has Jim Jeffcoat, Charles Haley etc but so many years of top 10 Ds cannot be merely coincidences or simply the result of having superior players only. I am sure he will provide input during the free agency and draft. I feel better about the D's prospects already. I was getting tired of these 'promising coordinators' who cannot deliver in Buffalo. A proven DC is a breath of fresh air Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 Wanny knows D. Can't wait to start hearing about changes. I think he'd make the personnel the bills have now better. They better give him the latitude he needs to succeed. Long overdue. How he managed to wait around so long is beyond me. They need to make sure he is grooming his own replacement. If he turns this lousy d around he will be Back in circulation for a hc job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2003Contenders Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 (edited) I'd be more interested in the ranks when he was defensive coordinator (Dallas, Miami) instead of head coach. That list includes 1999, the year he was DC for Jimmy's Dolphins. He also built some good defenses in Chicago as head coach -- and, of course, in Dallas. Wanny has always been a good game-day strategist but was a questionable talent evaluator when working as a head coach. If Nix/Whaley/Gailey can find him some good players, I have no doubt that he will coach them up. In fact, having an established coach like this may just attract some decent free agents on the defensive side of the ball. Edited January 3, 2012 by 2003Contenders Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 That list includes 1999, the year he was DC for Jimmy's Dolphins. He also built some good defenses in Chicago as head coach -- and, of course, in Dallas. Wanny has always been a good game-day strategist but was a questionable talent evaluator when working as a head coach. If Nix/Whaley/Gailey can find him some good players, I have no doubt that he will coach them up. In fact, having an established coach like this may just attract some decent free agents on the defensive side of the ball. This Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Best Player Available Posted January 3, 2012 Share Posted January 3, 2012 How he managed to wait around so long is beyond me. They need to make sure he is grooming his own replacement. If he turns this lousy d around he will be Back in circulation for a hc job. Lets not get ahead of ourselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsVet Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Not at all. Wanny was and is known as a defensive coach. He controlled the defenses in Miami when he was head coach the same way that Gailey controls the offenses for the Bills as Head Coach because he is an offensive coach. Ultimately head coaches are responsible for both because they are the boss. Gailey doesn't mess with the Bills defense much because he hired someone to do it. He gets all the credit and all the blame for the offensive side of the ball, and only the credit or the blame for hiring who was in charge of the defensive side of the ball. So he gets blame here for hiring Edwards but not the defensive play. Some HC, like Marv, are just managers. The league's changed a lot since his resignation in 2004. He is a known commodity, but it's not a slam dunk he'll get the team in the top half of the league without better talent. And if they convert to a 43, it'll be difficult because they lack a RDE, SLB, and WLB, not to mention some players will be learning a new system for the third time in 4 seasons. It's not impossible that they'll improve. It's just a very tall order. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcbillsfan Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Great info and certainly reason for optimism - And I thought I saw someone post somewhere that he's never made it to the playoffs - That is completely wrong; he has been to the playoffs many times on more than one team. The guy won three div titles with miami and was almost 20 games over 500 before the last seaso when the wheels came off . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8-8 Forever? Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Defenses under Wanny from 99-04 ranked...... 99 - #5 00 - #6 01 - #5 02 - #3 03 - #10 04 - #8 Lets go! Plus he was the DC in Dallas that beat the Bills twice in the Super Bowl with the "4-3 Over" defense. Look for it to be reborn with the Bills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offyourocker Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 If I am not mistaken, the 1992 Cowboys had the #1 D under Wanny. They ofcourse also has Jim Jeffcoat, Charles Haley etc but so many years of top 10 Ds cannot be merely coincidences or simply the result of having superior players only. I am sure he will provide input during the free agency and draft. I feel better about the D's prospects already. I was getting tired of these 'promising coordinators' who cannot deliver in Buffalo. A proven DC is a breath of fresh air Could not agree more. I think coaching is a huge factor. I would be really surprised if our D is not at a minimum in the top 15 next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yungmack Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 The best D coordinator the Bills had in the last 20 years was Wade Phillips...who seemed to flop as a head coach. I think that The Stache is a similar case, and I expect the D will be much better from the get-go next year and, if he sticks around for two or three years after that, it will be one of the best in the league. Here's hoping he's realized that his best position is D coordinator, not HC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Best Player Available Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 (edited) Plus he was the DC in Dallas that beat the Bills twice in the Super Bowl with the "4-3 Over" defense. Look for it to be reborn with the Bills. I believe he was there for one of them. Not 2 Edited January 4, 2012 by Best Player Available Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Under this theory our bad defense lies on Gaileys shoulders. Not sure I buy this. Gailey pretty much said the Defense was 100% one voice the past two years...And that voice was Edwards...Chan has already been quite honest that he is not hands on with the Defense...In fact I was a bit surprised an NFL HC would admit he was that removed from one side of the ball the way Gailey did...So...If you believe Chan...It was Edwards... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 The league's changed a lot since his resignation in 2004. He is a known commodity, but it's not a slam dunk he'll get the team in the top half of the league without better talent. And if they convert to a 43, it'll be difficult because they lack a RDE, SLB, and WLB, not to mention some players will be learning a new system for the third time in 4 seasons. It's not impossible that they'll improve. It's just a very tall order. Agree on all of that. Then again, not only could they do a lot worse, and already did repeatedly, but very few if any DC in the league right now taking over the Bills job is a slam dunk. Perhaps none is a slam dunk. Bellichick, probably the best defensive mind and coach in the league, presided over one of the worst defenses in league history. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcbillsfan Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Plus he was the DC in Dallas that beat the Bills twice in the Super Bowl with the "4-3 Over" defense. Look for it to be reborn with the Bills. seems like zach brown would be a great first round pick . and a star in that defense set Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Something to consider.....we already play an aweful lot of 4-3 now because everytime we go to a 3-4 we stink do to LACK OF LINEBACKERS and now we need LINEBACKERS to make the 4-3 work as well So what is the common denominator WE NEED LINEBACKERS (and a pass rushing defensive end) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andre Speed Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 I'd be more interested in the ranks when he was defensive coordinator (Dallas, Miami) instead of head coach. Apparently, Dave was never DC in miami, but HC in Chicago (93-98), HC in Miami (99-04). As HC, his defenses were in the top half of the league 11 of 12 yrs, and top 10 half the time. As DC, figures follow. League ranks (defense) with Dallas Cowboys: Yr......Yds.....Pts.....Run....Pass.....W-L '89......20......24.......18........20.......1-15 (!) '90......10......15.......18.........2.........7-9 '91......17......17........8........23.......11-5.....<- playoffs, lost in 2nd rnd. '92........1.......5........1..........5.......13-3.....<- superbowl, 52-17 over Buffalo Looks to me as though this guy tends to have a marked positive effect upon defenses. Let's hire 'im! I don't mind having the guy that kicked our ass in the superbowl back here to repent. ~AS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marv's Neighbor Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Defenses under Wanny from 99-04 ranked...... 99 - #5 00 - #6 01 - #5 02 - #3 03 - #10 04 - #8 Lets go! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell no! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bladiebla Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell no! Japan bombed PH... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Japan bombed PH... Nope. Pretty sure it was Germany. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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