Bench Josh Allen

[Fleezoid]

1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said:

I assume this is day drinking guys 

 

Don't be too mean lol

 

Day drinking? I haven't stopped since yesterday afternoon, and I still haven't washed away what I saw yesterday. 

[Matt_In_NH]

11 minutes ago, Chas56 said:

You must remember the idiots back then who wanted to bench Kelly for Frank. (I love Frank, but come on!) This is that same stupidity. Yeah, bench the MVP. 

That is exactly where that came from.  It happened a lot as I am sure you know.  

1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said:

I assume this is day drinking guys 

 

Don't be too mean lol

This is squarely in crack head zone…

[T.E.]

1 hour ago, TheBrownBear said:

As for Josh, he isn't playing well. Part of me wonders whether Brady and McDermott's hyperfocus on limiting turnovers has pushed Josh from cautiously aggressive (last season) over into complete fear and indecisiveness this season.

This is exactly what has happened, and it's completely altered his confidence.

 

This coaching style has ruined lesser QBs' careers because it leads to them second-guessing everything rather than just going out there and playing.

[PonyBoy]

Can you delete  thread once you start one?

Asking for a friendski...

[Tim Tindale]

4 hours ago, 90sBills said:

What is this crap? Let’s bench our best player. That’ll do it. 

There is no way the OP’a post is a real post.  

Edited 2 hours ago by Tim Tindale

[GunnerBill]

44 minutes ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

2018 is a wash. There were periods of 2019 where the 2 all time Safeties we had were still erasers and turnovers covered a lot of issues. The defense cost us the playoff game in 2020 and in 2019. 2017 was the 1 year we were good. After that offseason teams wrote the book on it and it was flat out, if we aren’t turning people over we aren’t stopping them

 

That is NOT true. Demonstrably not true. I am not going to let you just freely repeat mistruths. 

[Goin Breakdown]

39 minutes ago, Einstein said:

This.

I dont know how anyone can watch these games and think Allen is a problem. 

Allen is the only reason we are in most of these games. That 3rd and 17 or whatever was insane work from him.

 

OP, Buffalo716 and other Allen haters should start their own club and leave us out of it.

Everyone wants to point out that Allen looks sad or whatever. Yeah he looks sad. Anyone would look that was if they were disappointed. He may be upset with himself, the scheme, some players or maybe all of the above.  It there's no way he think this team is using him to his potential. You're taking his skills out of the game and naming it everyone eats. Well I'm full and sick of being fed excuses for this coaching staffs mediocrity. 
 

yes that play was awesome. It was like playing tecmo bowl lol 

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

9 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

That is NOT true. Demonstrably not true. I am not going to let you just freely repeat mistruths. 

What part of it isn’t true? You’re becoming extinct out here. In the beginning it was all fun and games. Now almost everyone else can see it for what it is. I have watched every single snap of the McDermott era. You gotta look past the stats sometimes and take the rose colored glasses off. It’s all good. You’re not going to ever come off it. The defense is why we haven’t won a Super Bowl. This is the theme. Split hairs with what years it came off the rails. You don’t think our defense blowing that giant lead in the Texans playoff game or the chiefs running up and down the field on us in 2020 was why we lost? How about 13 seconds? How was that? It’s the same thing every year. This is now somehow even worse. I didn’t think it was possible 

[GunnerBill]

11 minutes ago, Brianmoorman4jesus said:

What part of it isn’t true? You’re becoming extinct out here. In the beginning it was all fun and games. Now almost everyone else can see it for what it is. I have watched every single snap of the McDermott era. You gotta look past the stats sometimes and take the rose colored glasses off. It’s all good. You’re not going to ever come off it. The defense is why we haven’t won a Super Bowl. This is the theme. Split hairs with what years it came off the rails. You don’t think our defense blowing that giant lead in the Texans playoff game or the chiefs running up and down the field on us in 2020 was why we lost? How about 13 seconds? How was that? It’s the same thing every year. This is now somehow even worse. I didn’t think it was possible 

 

I think the defense has underachieved in the playoffs, definitely. Equally in 2019 the offense puking all over itself up 16 and turning the ball over was a big part of the collapse. And neither side of the ball played well in the 2020 AFCCG. 2021 was totally on defense. 2022 both sides of the ball. 2023 and 2024 defense bad but offense had the ball at the end chance to win and couldn't get it done both times.

 

But the regular season defense has, despite your protestations, been good until the last year and a half. If you want to knock the last year and a half be my guest. But if you have watched every snap of the era and say the defense has only had about 5 good games you are lying.

[T master]

2 hours ago, machine gun kelly said:

T, I’m not saying it’s a distraction at times, but I’m a focused guy, and he’s much more focused than me.  He wants to win.  Marriages don’t destroy work ethic if you’re the right guy.  Josh is the right guy.  You can’t use garbage for weapons, and expect to win.  Lastly, the OC has to have a better plan if he wants to win.  Those are the problems.  Not Josh.  Not an indictment on you at all.  You’re a solid poster, and respect your opinion.  I just don’t agree with youre findings on this one position.

Oh I agree Josh is our guy with out a doubt but given what he did last year then the supposed "Upgrade" at the WR position it just seemed as this was going to be a better year and that last year wasn't just a fluke so my thing with him getting married and the other distractions were just a thought .

 

There is also a lot to be said about chemistry between the QB and the WR's & others ! I think Knox has proven that if targeted more he is a weapon, he was before Kincaid got here & Brady seems to forget about him and focus to much on Kincaid a lot use them all to their strengths he has the weapons I think Shavers is under utilized in the Red zone too ! 

 

I also thought that if Cooper had more time to work with Josh that with his experience in route running they could have made a bit of noise, in one season he put a all time Bills classic play on tape with the throw back to Josh can you imagine if the trust factor would have had a chance to grow .

 

I also think if they asked Cooper now to come out of retirement that he would but that too is to little to late and a topic for anther conversation !! 

 

But I now do believe that the players that were suppose to be all that aren't or the chemistry between them and Josh is just wrong or not there like it was with Hollins and others last season . Don't know the answer it's all speculation with me I'm just a fan !! 

 

Sorry for the rant .

 

 

[oldmanfan]

In the past 24 hours we have seen posts claiming that Beane deliberately screwed up getting WRs this season out of spite towards fans, that the coaching staff does not take things seriously, and now this.  Trade Josh Allen.  Trade the current MVP.  Trade the heart and soul of the team.

 

And all this based on one game.  A game in which they sucked to be sure.  But one game.

 

I have asked this before and will ask again:  what the hell is wrong with some folks around here?

[Buffalo716]

Just now, oldmanfan said:

In the past 24 hours we have seen posts claiming that Beane deliberately screwed up getting WRs this season out of spite towards fans, that the coaching staff does not take things seriously, and now this.  Trade Josh Allen.  Trade the current MVP.  Trade the heart and soul of the team.

 

And all this based on one game.  A game in which they sucked to be sure.  But one game.

 

I have asked this before and will ask again:  what the hell is wrong with some folks around here?

Bills fans, a percentage of them.. don't think we should be allowed to have nice things 

 

They have became cynical 

[GoBills808]

1 hour ago, Einstein said:

This.

I dont know how anyone can watch these games and think Allen is a problem. 

I do

 

It's much easier to blame the QB than admit there are fundamental flaws in the way these guys want to play football

[Scott7975]

Yeah it’s too bad the trading deadline has passed. We could have traded Josh and a first for Tua and Waddle. Oh, the OP was serious?

[zow2]

It's just a season where Allen's elite play can no longer bail out the defense.  I mean when they get down 13-0 to Miami and 14-0 to Atlanta it's over.  We are a long way from those games last season like vs San Fran, Rams, Detroit, etc..

 

By the way, did anyone notice the Saints won at Carolina yesterday?  it devalues the Bills win there.  The Saints outgained Carolina 388 to 175, and went 8 for 17 on third downs.  Plus they played the better Carolina QB.  

 

 

[Scott7975]

17 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

In the past 24 hours we have seen posts claiming that Beane deliberately screwed up getting WRs this season out of spite towards fans, that the coaching staff does not take things seriously, and now this.  Trade Josh Allen.  Trade the current MVP.  Trade the heart and soul of the team.

 

And all this based on one game.  A game in which they sucked to be sure.  But one game.

 

I have asked this before and will ask again:  what the hell is wrong with some folks around here?

Josh is far from the problem but it’s been more than one game that the offense has sucked. 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

23 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

I have asked this before and will ask again:  what the hell is wrong with some folks around here?

Not enough fibre in their diets.

[BillytheKid]

4 hours ago, DaVinci said:

When i suggested taking a closer look at Allen's performance I was told I dont know football.

Yes, I told you that because you posted a picture of some guy open in the flat of the Atlanta game. 
 

Have you actually watched all of the film? I have. Sometimes there are goes open for a minute underneath but most of the time there isn’t. Most of the time they start to get open underneath Josh is getting pressured or we are already 3rd and long or something.

 

Sure we can just throw screen plays out on the flat all day if you want and get 2 yards a pass then punt. 
 

Most of the people that post videos about this on YouTube have no clue what they are talking about so I wouldn’t reference them. Plenty of people who actually know football have said plenty of times these receivers aren’t getting open when they are supposed to and they aren’t. There has also been plenty of times when Allen has given them chances and they drop balls or don’t adjust or go where they need to so Allen doesn’t trust them anymore. 
 

jaybeezee doesn’t seem to understand it either. 
 

Allen hasn’t been awesome this year but MOST of it is because of the receivers and Brady. 
 

The problem is the receivers suck on the outside, end of story. 
 

Edited 1 hour ago by BillytheKid

[CincyBillsFan]

38 minutes ago, T master said:

Oh I agree Josh is our guy with out a doubt but given what he did last year then the supposed "Upgrade" at the WR position it just seemed as this was going to be a better year and that last year wasn't just a fluke so my thing with him getting married and the other distractions were just a thought .

 

There is also a lot to be said about chemistry between the QB and the WR's & others ! I think Knox has proven that if targeted more he is a weapon, he was before Kincaid got here & Brady seems to forget about him and focus to much on Kincaid a lot use them all to their strengths he has the weapons I think Shavers is under utilized in the Red zone too ! 

 

I also thought that if Cooper had more time to work with Josh that with his experience in route running they could have made a bit of noise, in one season he put a all time Bills classic play on tape with the throw back to Josh can you imagine if the trust factor would have had a chance to grow .

 

I also think if they asked Cooper now to come out of retirement that he would but that too is to little to late and a topic for anther conversation !! 

 

But I now do believe that the players that were suppose to be all that aren't or the chemistry between them and Josh is just wrong or not there like it was with Hollins and others last season . Don't know the answer it's all speculation with me I'm just a fan !! 

 

Sorry for the rant .

 

 

I also thought we would see an improved passing game but it relied on the following things happening:  1) Coleman improving, 2) Kincaid improving & 3) Palmer/Moore being an upgrade over Hollins/Cooper.  Unfortunately only one of those three happened (Kincaid improved).

 

It is painfully obvious that the current WR room is significantly worse then last years rather mediocre group.  In fact the current group has dropped below what would be considered a minimally talented NFL WR unit.

 

Your Cooper point is interesting.  While Allen never developed a highly productive relationship with Cooper they did connect on some great pass plays while Cooper was in the game.  Some of those long sideline completions were works of art that the current ctrop of WR's can not duplicate.

 

 

 

 

[CincyBillsFan]

3 hours ago, TheBrownBear said:

First off, the roster just isn't good enough in many areas, which is why you're seeing us get our teeth kicked in by mediocre teams.

 

As for Josh, he isn't playing well. Part of me wonders whether Brady and McDermott's hyperfocus on limiting turnovers has pushed Josh from cautiously aggressive (last season) over into complete fear and indecisiveness this season. In the second half when desperation mode took over, the Bills racked up nearly 300 yards of offense. So they are capable of throwing the ball and moving it downfield when the shackles are off.  I know the receivers suck too, but they sucked last year and we were mostly able to produce a consistent offense. 

The WR group is much worse this year then last year and as you noted last years group did not exactly wow anyone. 

 

Another thing that has happened is last year was the beginning of the offensive transformation from a high risk/high reward design to the low risk, short passing, run heavy unit we see today.  Remember how the Bills turned it loose and went back to that old Dorsey/DaBoll offense in games against the Rams and Lions?  They would not and likely could not do that this season.   They should have abandoned their stodgy offense mid way through the 2nd quarter against Miami when it became apparent that the Dolphins were committed 100% to shutting down the Brady bulldozer offense.  Just like they turned it off against LA & Detroit last season.

 

To me last season was great because it showed that they could be flexible on offense.  This season with the exception of the 4th quarter against Baltimore they are showing no flexibility and are almost insanely being stubborn about what they're doing on offense.  And given that you have one of the most uniquely flexible QB's to ever play the game, it borders on lunacy how they have employed Allen.

 

One final note.  IMO and I don't think this should be controversial, in fact it's a Captain Obvious statement, the primary goal of the offense is to score points.  It's not to chew up time, except in specific situations like at the end of the half or game.  And while you want to minimize TO's you can't make an offense so timid and afraid to turn the ball over that they don't take the risks needed to create explosive plays.  This would be like asking the D to not blitz because occasionally a team can exploit the blitz to make a big play. 

 

The bottom line is that asking an offense to balance what it does so that not only must it score points but do it in such a way that protects your defense is a recipe for problems.