What's wrong with Josh?

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

12 hours ago, Brand J said:

...the long ball to Robert Foster against the Jags...

THERE'S THE PROBLEM!!!

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If Beane had any sense, Robert 'HoF' Foster would be in house now, filling out the roster with another former and future Buffalo Bills sure handed WR.

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😉

[dorquemada]

What Beane and McD have done to allen is criminal malpractice.   They've taken a generational talent and tried to turn him into Brock Milquetoast Purdy.  Why would you trade draft picks and make him the face of the franchise just to forge an identity of dink & dunk. Strait up boring football.  If Beane had built even a C+ defense, it would be one thing but he consistently wastes draft picks on guys like Elam and Basham.  

[frostbitmic]

30 minutes ago, HOUSE said:

1st down, run Cook, 2 yards

2nd down, nobody is open. Josh scramble 2 yards

3rd down, what the hell nobody is open, 5 yards pass to Shaiker..

4th down punt.

Where's the Offensive Holding penalty, we're playing the Chiefs ?

[dorquemada]

56 minutes ago, HOUSE said:

1st down, run Cook, 2 yards

2nd down, nobody is open. Josh scramble 2 yards

3rd down, what the hell nobody is open, 5 yards pass to Shaiker..

4th down punt.

 

only quibble would be that this season, the Shakir pass is 3 yards behind the LOS and he gets hit and still somehow gets positive yards, alas, not enough for the 1st

 

this is a brilliant offensive scheme

[dave mcbride]

14 hours ago, EmotionallyUnstable said:

He certainly makes his point verbally but the two clips he showed were terrible examples to represent what he’s getting at. 
 

The first is a reception where the DB is playing well off coverage on a slant. This doesn’t highlight anything he’s discussing (separation, awareness, etc.)

 

The second is a terribly constructed route combination of 2 on 3 in a zone that spanned about 5 yards of the football field. He can argue lazy route and loafing on this but again there is just so much at play here. 
 

If anything was lazy it’s that Smith didn’t take the 10 minutes he could have to find actual examples that reflect his more valid criticisms. He did that in his review last year. 
 

Again I’m not disagreeing with his analysis but he film review was weak. There are 3 plays alone in the first half that Keon was open later, or could have been targeted and Allen got off him quickly. I don’t know why he wouldn’t use these examples. 

That's not true regarding awareness on the first play. Smith argues and shows that Coleman never looks at where the DB is, and the way he catches it illuminates this. This is a play that arguably could have gone for more yards if he catches it with his hands and turns upfield immediately rather than hugging it and slowing down. Maybe he's gunshy because of the fumble vs NE, but that's not elite (or even good) receiver-level play. As for the other one, it was a piss poor effort. I don't think that's debatable. During the game thread, commenters thought so too. He doesn't come back for the ball at all but just stands there. Maybe it wasn't a great route combination, but you gotta do better than that.

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

It’s insane to me that he has over 70 rushing TDs. Who would’ve thought this about Josh Allen coming out of college that he would be such a force on ground and specifically red zone. I can’t wait until he breaks Cam Newtons record 

[LabattBlue]

Does Josh still work with his QB whisperer?  Enquiring minds want to know! 🤔

[jethro_tull]

Has it been noted in this thread that JA has not been practicing (Tuesday and Wednesday?) 

[zow2]

11 minutes ago, jethro_tull said:

Has it been noted in this thread that JA has not been practicing (Tuesday and Wednesday?) 

 

The first injury report of the week was for Wednesday 10/29 and JA17 was not listed on there.  Not even for vet rest.

[jethro_tull]

18 minutes ago, zow2 said:

 

The first injury report of the week was for Wednesday 10/29 and JA17 was not listed on there.  Not even for vet rest.

I heard it on One Bills Live yesterday and found the search today that said he was taking a mental reset.   Dam AI maybe? 

[HappyDays]

With the caveat that QBR can be wonky, but this matches the eye test. When Allen gets out of the pocket he isn't finding anybody working open for him downfield, or the intended receiver isn't making a clean catch along the sideline. This alone might explain the difference between the passing game numbers last year versus this year. Most of our explosive pass plays last year were off schedule. This year those plays just aren't happening.

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

With the caveat that QBR can be wonky, but this matches the eye test. When Allen gets out of the pocket he isn't finding anybody working open for him downfield, or the intended receiver isn't making a clean catch along the sideline. This alone might explain the difference between the passing game numbers last year versus this year. Most of our explosive pass plays last year were off schedule. This year those plays just aren't happening.

 

I agree with this (and we discussed in the offseason too) but I think Josh is also leaving the pocket too early more often this year, it's like he thinks "can't see a big play, let me extend and get outside and something might happen." He needs to trust what is happening a bit more, but the receivers need to get open for him much more often.

[Royale with Cheese]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I agree with this (and we discussed in the offseason too) but I think Josh is also leaving the pocket too early more often this year, it's like he thinks "can't see a big play, let me extend and get outside and something might happen." He needs to trust what is happening a bit more, but the receivers need to get open for him much more often.

 

I was sitting in the endzone and there was a particular play on 3rd down where Allen left the pocket early....like real early without any pressure and of course went to his right.

On the left, Elijah Moore was wide, wide open coming at me.  It was one of those "ugghhh" moments.  

[HappyDays]

11 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I agree with this (and we discussed in the offseason too) but I think Josh is also leaving the pocket too early more often this year, it's like he thinks "can't see a big play, let me extend and get outside and something might happen." He needs to trust what is happening a bit more, but the receivers need to get open for him much more often.

 

I think that's fair. Rolling to his right has been almost an automatic big play for him throughout his career so it's a habit that's been positively reinforced and that makes it hard to break. This is the first year where those plays are hurting us more than they're helping us. Since a bunch of new WR talent isn't walking through the door Allen might need to adjust his approach.

[GoBills808]

14 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

I think that's fair. Rolling to his right has been almost an automatic big play for him throughout his career so it's a habit that's been positively reinforced and that makes it hard to break. This is the first year where those plays are hurting us more than they're helping us. Since a bunch of new WR talent isn't walking through the door Allen might need to adjust his approach.

I'm not so sure 

Pass pro has not been great this yr

 

I don't think asking him to sit in a muddy pocket and try to throw a bunch of marginal wideouts open is a good idea

[HappyDays]

2 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

I'm not so sure 

Pass pro has not been great this yr

 

I don't think asking him to sit in a muddy pocket and try to throw a bunch of marginal wideouts open is a good idea

 

Unfortunately with this passing offense there are no good ideas, just new ideas. Allen has already taken as many sacks this year as he did through the entire season last year. So yeah I also don't know if trying to hang in the pocket is the solution. Every solution fans are trying to come up with is talking around the real problem which is the personnel. Since that problem isn't likely to be fixed we have to live through the run game and Allen playing like Mac Jones. I hate the architecture but it's all we can do.

[zow2]

41 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

With the caveat that QBR can be wonky, but this matches the eye test. When Allen gets out of the pocket he isn't finding anybody working open for him downfield, or the intended receiver isn't making a clean catch along the sideline. This alone might explain the difference between the passing game numbers last year versus this year. Most of our explosive pass plays last year were off schedule. This year those plays just aren't happening.

 

Curious if the 66.5 and 32.5 includes success rushing the ball or is it only measuring passing?  Some of his huge plays over the past 5 years rolling out are running as we all know.  This year seems like he cannot get to the edge.

[Toyo321]

They showed the highlights again on ESPN today of the Panthers game.  When Josh got sacked twice and a few more clips.

 

Each over head shot showed zero receiver separation from the Panthers DB's.

 

This overhead shot was for almost 8 seconds and our WR's had not gotten any separation.

 

If you cant get open how the hell do you expect Josh to throw the ball to a completely covered receiver.

 

Just heave it up there and throw an INT.....  That is all he is left with for options at that point.  

 

These overhead  shots are damning on how bad our receivers are on this team this year and what he is forced to work with.

 

They can not get open fast enough before the O-Line coverage breaks down.

 

The single biggest problem with Josh is not Josh its WR1 & WR2 and WR3!!!

 

Beane should be taken out to the wood shed and given the business for this WR room disaster.

 

We are not beating KC this weekend with the god awful receivers that are on this team.

 

 Shakir cant get open either, so he in not exempt from this criticism either.

 

 

 

 

Edited 3 hours ago by Toyo321

[HappyDays]

3 minutes ago, zow2 said:

 

Curious if the 66.5 and 32.5 includes success rushing the ball or is it only measuring passing?  Some of his huge plays over the past 5 years rolling out are running as we all know.  This year seems like he cannot get to the edge.

 

QBR supposedly accounts for rushing too. ESPN doesn't make the formula public so it's hard to say for sure.

[2003Contenders]

Defenses have adjusted to what the offense did last year. Now, with no deep threat, let alone a single receiver that can beat one-on-one coverage, opponents are content to crowd the line of scrimmage to focus on stopping the run (including Josh's scrambles) and get immediate stops on those bubbles and near-the-line of scrimmage pass plays. 

 

It reminds me of what happened during Flutie's tenure. Once defenses realized that he wasn't going deep with the ball, they played everything up in the box, which limited his ability to make big plays with his legs. The difference was that Flutie had marginal arm strength -- whereas, Josh may have the strongest arm of any QB in the league.

 

I do think the game plan against the Falcons was to have Palmer heavily involved -- and he was certainly a big factor early on. When he went down on that second series, the team really did not have a Plan B.

 

The team really needs someone who can stretch the field in the worst possible way.

Edited 3 hours ago by 2003Contenders