Record with and without [insert player here]

[Einstein]

WGR was playing a similar version this game and I would like to see your opinion as well.

Bills won 13 games in 2024.

1. How many would they have won without Josh Allen?
 

2. How many would they have won without James Cook?

 

3. How many would they have won without Dion Dawkins? Spencer Brown?

 

4. How many would they have won without Ed Oliver?

5. How many would they have won without Rousseau?

and any other you would like to do...



 

[sven233]

1. How many would they have won without Josh Allen?  5
 

2. How many would they have won without James Cook? 12

 

3. How many would they have won without Dion Dawkins? Spencer Brown? 11 (If missing both.  If only missing 1....12)

 

4. How many would they have won without Ed Oliver? 12

5. How many would they have won without Rousseau? 12

Edited yesterday at 03:30 AM by sven233

[julian]

Allen is the only player who would effect win lose record beyond one game either way imho.

 

maybe one less win without Dawkins or Brown.

Edited yesterday at 01:09 AM by julian

[Kirby Jackson]

31 minutes ago, Einstein said:

WGR was playing a similar version this game and I would like to see your opinion as well.

Bills won 13 games in 2024.

1. How many would they have won without Josh Allen? 6
 

2. How many would they have won without James Cook? 12

 

3. How many would they have won without Dion Dawkins? Spencer Brown? 11/11

 

4. How many would they have won without Ed Oliver? 13

5. How many would they have won without Rousseau? 13

and any other you would like to do...



 

 

[Bills!Win!]

1 hour ago, julian said:

Allen is the only player who would effect win lose record beyond one game either way imho.

 

maybe one less win without Dawkins or Brown.

Good point. This was just a topic on the wgr morning show last week. 

[julian]

1 hour ago, Bills!Win! said:

Good point. This was just a topic on the wgr morning show last week. 

Beyond Allen, any one player won’t move the needle but if there were a rash of simultaneous significant injuries to starters then that’s a different story.

[FireChans]

2 hours ago, Einstein said:

WGR was playing a similar version this game and I would like to see your opinion as well.

Bills won 13 games in 2024.

1. How many would they have won without Josh Allen?
 

2. How many would they have won without James Cook?

 

3. How many would they have won without Dion Dawkins? Spencer Brown?

 

4. How many would they have won without Ed Oliver?

5. How many would they have won without Rousseau?

and any other you would like to do...

4

12

11

13

13

2 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said:

 

great minds lol

[MJS]

It's the accumulation of injuries that really makes a difference. The record would be the same regardless of losing a single player (outside of Josh Allen, of course). But once you have 3, 4, 5 starters down, that starts to have ripple effects.

 

I will say that the Houston game last year showed me how much they missed Shakir, but I think the offense evolved past that glaring weakness afterward.

 

So, only Josh Allen makes sense to do this with. I think they would have won 7 or 8 games without him.

[GunnerBill]

5 hours ago, Einstein said:

WGR was playing a similar version this game and I would like to see your opinion as well.

Bills won 13 games in 2024.

1. How many would they have won without Josh Allen?
 

2. How many would they have won without James Cook?

 

3. How many would they have won without Dion Dawkins? Spencer Brown?

 

4. How many would they have won without Ed Oliver?

5. How many would they have won without Rousseau?

and any other you would like to do...
 

 

1. I count 7 (although I can take an argument on the Colts game)

 

2. 11 - I don't think they beat Detroit without him or the first New England game.

 

3. If both missed the whole season? 10 - and if I didn't have confidence in Grable and Van Demark that would be lower. Bad tackle play sinks seasons. We see it around the league. 

 

4. In 2024 - 13 - although I am not sure we beat Baltimore without him in the playoffs.

 

5. 13.

[Doc Brown]

Without looking at any of the responses that would easily sway me.  I'm not counting the last game so it's how many we'd win out of 16.

 

1.) We'd win 8 without Josh Allen

2.)  We'd win 11 without James Cook (Lions and home Pats game) which goes against every anti pay Cook I made this off-season.

3.)  We'd win 10 without both tackles.  That would definitely hurt the worst besides Allen.

4.)  We'd win 13 without Ed Oliver.  Wouldn't be as big of a Buffalo blow out in some games though.

5.)  We'd win 12 without Rousseau.  Arizona game.

6.)  We'd win 14 without Ferguson as much as I like him.  The Rams punt block cost us that game.

[JerseyBills]

They make a SB WITH Benford 

[machine gun kelly]

9 hours ago, Einstein said:

WGR was playing a similar version this game and I would like to see your opinion as well.

Bills won 13 games in 2024.

1. How many would they have won without Josh Allen?
 

2. How many would they have won without James Cook?

 

3. How many would they have won without Dion Dawkins? Spencer Brown?

 

4. How many would they have won without Ed Oliver?

5. How many would they have won without Rousseau?

and any other you would like to do...



 

As was on WGR, the one that would hurt is Josh.  He’s by far the most imoortant player on the team.  Second for me would be Dion, amd 3rd  is Spencer Brown.

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

Where's Edmunds?! 😠

Where's Ertz?! 😡

[Kirby Jackson]

You’ll be able to tell who overrates the Bills roster the most by applying “wins without Allen.” This isn’t a very good football team, lacking playmakers, without Allen. 
 

I have this metric that I apply to teams to determine quality of roster outside of QB. It’s the Geno Smith scale. Basically, you pull off the starting QB of each team and replace him with Geno Smith. I think Geno is about the most average QB in football. That’s not meant as in insult. It means that he’s right around the middle. If you replaced Lamar, for example, with Geno, I think that the Ravens still win 10ish games. He might win 11 or 12 on Philly. The Bills would win maybe 7. 

Edited 23 hours ago by Kirby Jackson

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, Kirby Jackson said:

You’ll be able to tell who overrates the Bills roster the most by applying “wins without Allen.” This isn’t a very good football team, lacking playmakers, without Allen. 
 

I have this metric that I apply to teams to determine quality of roster outside of QB. It’s the Geno Smith scale. Basically, you pull off the starting QB of each team and replace him with Geno Amith. I think Geno is about the most average QB in football. That’s not meant as in insult. It means that he’s right around the middle. If you replaced Lamar, for example, with Geno, I think that the Ravens still win 10ish games. He might win 11 or 12 on Philly. The Bills would win maybe 7. 

 

There's also a difference between saying how many might they win as an abstract concept and looking back at how many they would have won when you have actual games to look back at. The Ravens were 12-5 last year. There is no way they'd have been 10-7 without Lamar. Their defense really struggled the first half of the year and they won some shoot outs - the two Cincy games spring immediately to mind but there were a couple of others too - that they don't win with a Geno Smith. I think Lamar was probably worth at least 4 wins over Geno in 2024. Post-Thanksgiving when the Ravens defense clicked, possibly different story. But that wasn't the truth for a lot of last year. 

[Kirby Jackson]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

 

There's also a difference between saying how many might they win as an abstract concept and looking back at how many they would have won when you have actual games to look back at. The Ravens were 12-5 last year. There is no way they'd have been 10-7 without Lamar. Their defense really struggled the first half of the year and they won some shoot outs - the two Cincy games spring immediately to mind but there were a couple of others too - that they don't win with a Geno Smith. I think Lamar was probably worth at least 4 wins over Geno in 2024. Post-Thanksgiving when the Ravens defense clicked, possibly different story. But that wasn't the truth for a lot of last year. 

That’s fair. I do it simply through the quality of the roster. It’s a hypothetical. If you were to go through each game, it would look different. I don’t have the bandwidth to look at every NFL game and decide what the outcome would have been for each team if Geno played. The Chiefs were 12-0 in one score games last year. I think that their roster, outside of OL, is better than the Bills. They wouldn’t have won many games last year, despite Mahomes not being himself, with Geno instead. 

[nuklz2594]

if not for josh allen and his success....doubt new stadium happens

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

11 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

That’s fair. I do it simply through the quality of the roster. It’s a hypothetical. If you were to go through each game, it would look different. I don’t have the bandwidth to look at every NFL game and decide what the outcome would have been for each team if Geno played. The Chiefs were 12-0 in one score games last year. I think that their roster, outside of OL, is better than the Bills. They wouldn’t have won many games last year, despite Mahomes not being himself, with Geno instead. 

Move over, Jesus!  It's time for

HWGD!

Huh-wug-id.

How Would Geno Do?  A new metric!  I like it! 

47 minutes ago, Ridgewaycynic2013 said:

Where's Edmunds?! 😠

Where's Ertz?! 😡

And let's not forget, where's Rosen! 🤐

[njbuff]

If the Bills lose for Josh Allen for a long stretch (or the season early on), the Bills are picking in the top 4 of the next draft.

 

It doesn’t matter who else they at that point.

[Gregg]

Like others have said, Allen is the only player that moves the needle record wise if he were to sustain a long-term injury. The Bills could probably survive if he missed a game or two, but a long-term injury forget it. Up to this point, the Bills have had an above average or good roster (NOT GREAT) with an elite level QB.