Rumor: Bills trying aggressively to move up for a WR in round one

[Thrivefourfive]

24 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Our best is josh allen, and he left the field with under 2 minutes to go and his kicker in position to make a kick that is usually made that would equal Mahomes’s output. He had no control over the fact that our kicker — who is stilll weirdly on the team after going 2 for 5 in the postseason — had the yips.

If Allen could ball one-on-one with Mahomes, that’s be something. Our best lineman got moved an inch by their best lineman. Chiefs win. Our best DBs and then our best LB get beat my Hill and Kelce. Chiefs win. Our coach gets smacked down against Reid.. HUGE mismatch our coordinators vs theirs. I hear what your saying.. Allen,,, but we lose to the Chiefs because of what I’m pointing out, not because Allen is the second best QB in the league (to Mahomes 😂). 

[DJB]

14 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

There are zero trades in Jeremiah’s draft, which is ridiculous and an indicator to me that a person doesn’t have the courage of his own convictions. It is a day before the draft — project trades, which ALWAYS happen.

There’s like 5 trades 

[3rdand12]

8 minutes ago, ControllerOfPlanetX said:

 

New craze to hit the NFL, offenses going from 3 WR sets to predominantly 3 TE sets.

Didn't the Ravens try that with Lamar early own to some success ?

[Maynard]

Make it happen Beane! 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

12 minutes ago, DJB said:

There’s like 5 trades 

2 trades. Eagles and Broncos. Rams and Commanders.

[Dr. Who]

1 minute ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

2 trades. Eagles and Broncos. Rams and Commanders.

I'm really disappointed that basic math is such a problem for this board.

[HappyDays]

4 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

I think, in fact, that receivers are becoming a dime a dozen, just like running backs.   Successful teams don't need a top-five running back, and I think the passing game already has evolved to the point that they don't need a top-five receiver.  I mean, they'll have a guy who is top-five in the stats, but he'll get there by being a scheme fit rather than being a great receiver.   I think that's exactly what we've seen in Kansas City.  And it's what we've seen in LA and Detroit and SF.  

 

At the end there you named the 4 best offensive coaches in the NFL. Another team I would point to with your philosophy is the Packers. Not so coincidentally that would round out the top 5 offensive coaches in the NFL.

 

We aren't at that caliber of offensive coaching, not even close IMO. I like Brady overall but let's be realistic. With a coach of his caliber you need top tier offensive talent to have a top tier offense.

 

And in general we should really stop using the Chiefs as any kind of measuring stick. They got shutout in the 2nd half of the AFCCG and the 1st half of the Super Bowl. Think about that - they got shut out in consecutive halfs in their final two games and they won the freaking Super Bowl doing it. They did this a few years after drafting a RB in the 1st round, a couple years after trading away the best WR in the NFL, in a season where they had a below average LT. No team should be trying to replicate their strategy. Their coaching staff is in another stratosphere compared to everybody else which means they can get away with things that no other franchise can.

 

We don't need to be like any other team. We need to be the best possible version of the Bills, and the best possible version of the Bills absolutely has a top tier pass catcher to make up for its lack of top tier coaching.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

Why do we do this as fans? I saw TJ Graham, Marquis Goodwin, and Roscoe Parrish brought up as reasons to pass on Worthy.

 

Nothing I dislike more during the draft is people bringing up past draft picks as a reason why we shouldn’t draft someone in the current draft.

[stuvian]

We need to get out of the mindset that we have to replace Diggs with a WR of equal caliber. We need to improve the roster. We need a pass rush and back 7 defenders who can tackle. 

[Reed83HOF]

14 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

At the end there you named the 4 best offensive coaches in the NFL. Another team I would point to with your philosophy is the Packers. Not so coincidentally that would round out the top 5 offensive coaches in the NFL.

 

We aren't at that caliber of offensive coaching, not even close IMO. I like Brady overall but let's be realistic. With a coach of his caliber you need top tier offensive talent to have a top tier offense.

 

And in general we should really stop using the Chiefs as any kind of measuring stick. They got shutout in the 2nd half of the AFCCG and the 1st half of the Super Bowl. Think about that - they got shut out in consecutive halfs in their final two games and they won the freaking Super Bowl doing it. They did this a few years after drafting a RB in the 1st round, a couple years after trading away the best WR in the NFL, in a season where they had a below average LT. No team should be trying to replicate their strategy. Their coaching staff is in another stratosphere compared to everybody else which means they can get away with things that no other franchise can.

 

We don't need to be like any other team. We need to be the best possible version of the Bills, and the best possible version of the Bills absolutely has a top tier pass catcher to make up for its lack of top tier coaching.

You said this perfectly....

 

I'm prepared to be disappointed tomorrow, I hope I'm wrong tho

[Chaos]

9 minutes ago, stuvian said:

We need to get out of the mindset that we have to replace Diggs with a WR of equal caliber. We need to improve the roster. We need a pass rush and back 7 defenders who can tackle. 

why is that more important? please explain in terms of expectd point differential. 

[Shaw66]

3 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

At the end there you named the 4 best offensive coaches in the NFL. Another team I would point to with your philosophy is the Packers. Not so coincidentally that would round out the top 5 offensive coaches in the NFL.

 

We aren't at that caliber of offensive coaching, not even close IMO. I like Brady overall but let's be realistic. With a coach of his caliber you need top tier offensive talent to have a top tier offense.

 

And in general we should really stop using the Chiefs as any kind of measuring stick. They got shutout in the 2nd half of the AFCCG and the 1st half of the Super Bowl. Think about that - they got shut out in consecutive halfs in their final two games and they won the freaking Super Bowl doing it. They did this a few years after drafting a RB in the 1st round, a couple years after trading away the best WR in the NFL, in a season where they had a below average LT. No team should be trying to replicate their strategy. Their coaching staff is in another stratosphere compared to everybody else which means they can get away with things that no other franchise can.

 

We don't need to be like any other team. We need to be the best possible version of the Bills, and the best possible version of the Bills absolutely has a top tier pass catcher to make up for its lack of top tier coaching.

I hear you, but I don't think you're correct about this.   The commonly used phrase is "It's a copy cat league."   It is, and there's a reason for that.  The reason is it's very hard to win in the league, and it's very hard to be good at offense, because the good defenses know how to stop all but the best offenses.  It's natural, therefore, that teams will try to mimic what the good teams are doing.   Nobody's mimicking the Cardinals.  

 

We've seen the same thing on defense, with everyone going to one and two high safeties all the time to take away the deep ball.   McDermott was one of the early proponents, and that's what made the Bills D so tough beginning a few years ago.  The defense that everyone has copied is one of the reasons we've seen this move to a different style of passing attack.  

 

I keep saying that the signal was that the Bills went after Samuel.  He's one of the best players in the league playing the style that the good offenses have (other than the very best, who are on those good teams we're talking about).   Getting Samuel when they already had Shakir and Kincaid tells something about what the Bills intend to do. 

 

Now, I hear you about Brady.  It's one thing to be able to copy the style that others are playing, it's another thing to be able copy it and then innovate from week to week so that your receivers are attacking different defenses in different ways.  I don't know if Brady is that guy.  We'll find out. 

 

Going your own way, what you suggest the Bills should do, isn't a good strategy.  If you don't have good coaching, which is your premise, then you can't expect your coaches to create a passing offense that works as well as the best passing games.   In addition, the reason it's a copy cat league is that the innovators are finding the only way to succeed, and it works only until the defenses adjust, at which point it's up to the offensive innovators again.   The Bills can't get a top-tier receiver without spending an enormous amount of draft capital, but even if they could, top-tier talent won't save mediocre coaching.   

 

For all his trials and tribulations on defense, I think the worst decision McDermott has made was investing in Dorsey.   He truly was mediocre or worse, and that hurt the Bills for the past two seasons. 

 

The shortest route to an championship caliber offense is to copy the passing schemes of the best teams and then let the most physically gifted QB in the league execute it.  

[stuvian]

Just now, Chaos said:

why is that more important? please explain in terms of expectd point differential. 

you're asking me to explain how defense helps teams win with an exact number of points? A Vegas bookie couldn't do that

[Shaw66]

5 minutes ago, Reed83HOF said:

 

I'm prepared to be disappointed tomorrow, I hope I'm wrong tho

Well, I don't agree with you or Happy about what the Bills need, but I am not going to be disappointed tomorrow.  Beane and McDermott know what they want, and they have a plan.  They will have a receiver by Friday night, and that receiver will be a success.  He will be a success because the Bills will need him to get only 600-800 yards, and there apparently are a lot of guys in the draft who will be able to do that.  They'll do it because they won't be asked to do too much, just run the routes and catch the ball when you're open.  Someone else - Kincaid, Shakir, or Samuel - will go over 1000.  Or maybe it'll be the rookie.  It might even be two guys going over 1000.   

 

I'm confident it will work, assuming Brady can deliver the kind of offense that's expected. 

[NoSaint]

2 minutes ago, stuvian said:

you're asking me to explain how defense helps teams win with an exact number of points? A Vegas bookie couldn't do that

I think he’s implying the pass rusher at 28 probably takes essentially zero points off the opposing totals while the wr may add 50 or so to ours if we get the right guy 

[stuvian]

1 minute ago, NoSaint said:

I think he’s implying the pass rusher at 28 probably takes essentially zero points off the opposing totals while the wr may add 50 or so to ours if we get the right guy 

we're not going to get an impact player at 28 on either side of the ball so why not bolster the trenches and our secondary? A smashmouth OL can make Cook a 1500 yard rusher

[Chaos]

6 minutes ago, stuvian said:

you're asking me to explain how defense helps teams win with an exact number of points? A Vegas bookie couldn't do that

That is not what I am asking. I am asking to explain how the best available pass rusher/tackler at 28 helps the Bills in point differential more than the best available WR. 

[stuvian]

Just now, Chaos said:

That is not what I am asking. I am asking to explain how the best available pass rusher/tackler at 28 helps the Bills in point differential more than the best available WR. 

without going full math geek we've lost two starters in the secondary who were on the back half of their careers. Our back 7 tackling was pretty abysmal all year. I think having DBs and LBs who can make stops can force some 3 and outs in key games.

Save for unearthing a Maxx Crosby like gem I don't see us finding a pass rusher unless we trade up. Maybe Rousseau will blossom but we can't rely on that materializing.

We found out the hard way that Miller needs a Chubb. he's ineffective by himself. I'd rather have a platoon of 9 sack guys we can rotate on fresh legs than one guy who can get 20 sacks but gets double teamed. 

[Aussie Joe]

30 minutes ago, stuvian said:

We need to get out of the mindset that we have to replace Diggs with a WR of equal caliber. We need to improve the roster. We need a pass rush and back 7 defenders who can tackle. 

 

What’s your plan to improve the pass rush ? This draft is very skinny at edge  after the Top 3 who will be long gone at 28
 

[MrEpsYtown]

38 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Why do we do this as fans? I saw TJ Graham, Marquis Goodwin, and Roscoe Parrish brought up as reasons to pass on Worthy.

 

Nothing I dislike more during the draft is people bringing up past draft picks as a reason why we shouldn’t draft someone in the current draft.

I like the DeSean Jackson comp for Worthy. He’s that type of talent and I like the fit. Do I like the bigger guys like Thomas and Mitchell more? Yes. But those other guys are not comparable to Worthy imo. I think as fans we  just kinda come up with excuses to prove our guy is the guy.