Has Shakir overtaken Davis

[RunTheBall]

Gabe cannot play in the slot

 

He get’s zero separation. He’s not quick twitch, he’s like a train that takes time to get up to speed. That’s exactly the opposite of what you want in the slot

 

I’d guess Brady leaves Gabe where he is, uses him to block and draw coverage downfield, and hope for Playoff Gabe to appear if we make it that far

 

 

[BBFL]

1 hour ago, MarkKelso'sHelmet said:

That's is a pretty sad way to characterize a supposed #2 receiver: "a competent run blocker."

 

Chris Simms said on his podcast multiple times that Gabe is not a legit #2. Said Shakir is a stronger option on the boundary and Davis should be in the slot.  If all Gabe brings to the table is run blocking it's time to move on from him. 

😂

 

Im not saying that’s all he brings, just a definitive reason to have him out there consistently as he has, at times, shown flashes of decency to pair with his run blocking. 
 

But going forward a run game is the absolute necessity for success. Josh’s numbers from play action over the years are otherworldly. 
 

To your last point, there isn’t a moment where I don’t think we need a number 2 option.  We do. As it stands that seems to be Kincaid going forward which I am more than OK with. 
 

The last 5 teams who have won the Lombardi Chiefs, Pats, Rams, Bucs and Eagles all only had one if not 2 top end guys receiving the ball; either two WRs or a TE & WR combo. 
 

An efficient run game and Josh is a meltdown for a coordinator. 

That is how we are going to get anywhere in this season. Be it Josh running or Cook, I don’t care. Focal point has to be Play Action. 

[Sherlock Holmes]

14 hours ago, Motorin' said:

Kincaid has passed Diggs as the #1. And Shakir is making a case for himself to be given #3 level targets.

 

 

FIFY

[BADOLBILZ]

10 hours ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

Look back at those posts. I defended his production as a #2 WR amongst other #2 WR's in the league at the time. I argued that he (at the time) was a #2 WR with decent #2 WR production, by comparison to others. And that what you and others truly wanted was not a productive #2 WR, but two guys who could be #1's on other teams.

 

At no point did I say he was Elite or that he was great. At no point did I say there was zero merit to those who pointed out faults in his game. Just that (again, at the time) the idea that he was completely worthless was a bit much.

 

To the point where saying ANYTHING positive about him was somehow championing him and grounds for having insults slung in your direction.

 

But then the drops returned. And his lack of separation got worse. Then Kincaid's usage grew and as he became more and more comfortable in the offense and the team became more and more comfortable with him, it's clear he's the much better secondary receiver. As he was drafted to be. His time came quicker than expected and I'm thrilled with it.

 

*I've* cut him out of the conversation lately because the TEAM ITSELF has cut him out of the conversation. And the offense HAS been working better with Kincaid being looked at as the #2 option and Shakir as the #3. And if it's working, why go away from it?

 

 

That response is pretty weak and was not your take at all. 

 

You've done a complete 180 on Gabe...........10 days after selling him as a top WR2 you were calling him a "role player". 

 

I can't remember seeing anyone turn on a player so fast that they had so adamantly defended. 

 

Have a take and stick by it or have the courage to own up to the terrible take.

[Arkady Renko]

2 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Shakir is not fast enough to be an outside receiver. He would be awful as a number 2. It would be lkke when we thought Josh Reed (one of my least favorite bills of all time) could be a number 2 and was so awful. 

Remember when Belichick would always mention the one time he burned them in garbage time leading up to each subsequent game against the Bills?

[SWATeam]

49 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Have a take and stick by it or have the courage to own up to the terrible take.

LOL, that's rich!

[WhoTom]

14 hours ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

Yeah, look I've entertained your moronic replies enough. I'm going to enjoy a win. Have a great night. 

 

14 hours ago, RoscoeParrish said:

You fraid?

 

Hey guys, this is a football message board, not a Senate hearing.

 

 

[BuffaloBillyG]

5 minutes ago, WhoTom said:

 

 

Hey guys, this is a football message board, not a Senate hearing.

 

 

Hey, Tom. Thanks for the message. Why you choose to comment on a 16 hour old conversation that has nothing to do with you is beyond me. But hey, you do you.

[WhoTom]

49 minutes ago, BuffaloBillyG said:

Hey, Tom. Thanks for the message. Why you choose to comment on a 16 hour old conversation that has nothing to do with you is beyond me. But hey, you do you.

 

It was just a joke. I was making fun of the Senate, actually.

 

 

[BADOLBILZ]

1 hour ago, SWATeam said:

LOL, that's rich!

 

No, that's just me telling it like it is.

 

"Rich" would be something like you going out of your way in August to find me and mock the Yankees 30 year streak of winning records because you were certain it was coming to an end.............a topic you'd never mentioned prior..........and then never owning up to that stupidity after the Yanks played well the rest of the season and finished with a winning record once again  leaving you with a totally unnecessary face full of self-inflicted sticky stuff.  😂

 

You are the very definition of a poster of no account on TSW.  

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

3 hours ago, WhoTom said:

I think Beane will draft a WR early.

"Surprise!  I got us an edge rusher!"

[SWATeam]

6 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

No, that's just me telling it like it is.

 

"Rich" would be something like you going out of your way in August to find me and mock the Yankees 30 year streak of winning records because you were certain it was coming to an end.............a topic you'd never mentioned prior..........and then never owning up to that stupidity after the Yanks played well the rest of the season and finished with a winning record once again  leaving you with a totally unnecessary face full of self-inflicted sticky stuff.  😂

 

You are the very definition of a poster of no account on TSW.  

LOL, not that I care, but I was mocking your banner waving for the INCREDIBLE FEAT of the most financially advantaged franchise of all time actually having a...  winning record...  LOL.  I did not predict that AMAZING accomplishment was not going to be achieved.  Congrats on the special season!!!  😂

 

In this case I was mocking YOU telling another poster to own up to their terrible take.  LOL.  Not exactly your strong suit!  🤣

 

 

[RobbRiddick]

I'm no fan of Davis but he's definitely due one of his monster games. I hope it comes against the Eagles. Maybe Brady was being super smart, no Davis targets this week so the Eagles have to spend more time planning for Shakir and Kincaid and forget about Gabe. Then big game Gabe turns it on in Philly with Nantz doing his patented "It's Davis!" call.

[Scott7975]

At the very least, I think Shakir has shown that he is our best slot option since Beasley and can remain a good one going forward.  I still would like better than Davis on the outside.  Can't have star players all over though.  I am happy that we have good options in Diggs, Cook, Kincaid, and Shakir.  Hopefully Josh keeps getting them the ball and we get a better option than Davis next year.  I really don't think Davis will be on this team next year.  The rest of the guys will.

 

One thing to add... that TD last night where Shakir got all that YAC to get it is something this offense sorely lacked that all other top offenses have had for years.  It was amazing to see that one.

Edited November 20, 2023 by Scott7975

[nedboy7]

Isn’t there someone on the PS who can do just as good as gabe? 

[BADOLBILZ]

54 minutes ago, SWATeam said:

LOL, not that I care, but I was mocking your banner waving for the INCREDIBLE FEAT of the most financially advantaged franchise of all time actually having a...  winning record...  LOL.  I did not predict that AMAZING accomplishment was not going to be achieved.  Congrats on the special season!!!  😂

 

In this case I was mocking YOU telling another poster to own up to their terrible take.  LOL.  Not exactly your strong suit!  🤣

 

 

 

 

This is why I say you are a no account poster...........you just make sh!t up and don't show your work.  

 

Have I been proven wrong all along about Gabe Davis?   Or Edmunds?   When I said Rasul Douglas was a "great fit" when he was acquired......has that been proven wrong?    The reality is that there isn't anything remotely recent to take a mea culpa for. 

 

Because, unlike you, I don't go out of my way to have takes on things I don't have a well formed, reasonable opinion about.

 

"Not that you care" about looking ignorant or idiotic........but it doesn't advance discussion to be those things.   What is the end game of suggesting that the second longest winning season streak in pro spots isn't an  "incredible feat"?    What's the bar over such a long period of time?   Having the LONGEST such streak?   Which they ALSO have(39 years).  Winning the most titles of any pro sports teams? Which they do.   Having the most WS titles in that current 30 year span?  Which they do.    It's just an example of a dumb hill to kill yourself on.

 

Edited November 20, 2023 by BADOLBILZ

[BobbyC81]

Davis sure isn’t boosting his value for his upcoming free agency.

[Beck Water]

16 hours ago, RichRiderBills said:

Yes

 

FTR, Davis played 93%, 99%, 98% and 88% of the snaps the last for games.

Shakir played 65%, 71%, 76%, 74%.

I don't THINK that points to Davis being superceded as the #2.

 

I think for this game, anyway, it points to Josh being smarter with taking what the defense offered and being patient.

 

17 hours ago, Roundybout said:

It's no surprise that something like six of Josh's interceptions this season have come targeting Davis. 

 

I think it's 4.  3 targeting Harty, 2 Diggs, 2 Knox, 1 Kincaid

 

I think the INT to Kincaid was that deflection that came nowhere near him.  Pretty sure at least 2 of the 3 INT to Hardy were deep shots, like the end-of-half this past game.

[LABILLBACKER]

4 hours ago, BBFL said:

😂

 

Im not saying that’s all he brings, just a definitive reason to have him out there consistently as he has, at times, shown flashes of decency to pair with his run blocking. 
 

But going forward a run game is the absolute necessity for success. Josh’s numbers from play action over the years are otherworldly. 
 

To your last point, there isn’t a moment where I don’t think we need a number 2 option.  We do. As it stands that seems to be Kincaid going forward which I am more than OK with. 
 

The last 5 teams who have won the Lombardi Chiefs, Pats, Rams, Bucs and Eagles all only had one if not 2 top end guys receiving the ball; either two WRs or a TE & WR combo. 
 

An efficient run game and Josh is a meltdown for a coordinator. 

That is how we are going to get anywhere in this season. Be it Josh running or Cook, I don’t care. Focal point has to be Play Action. 

This team's numbers when we're in play action are through the roof.  How Dorsey couldn't see this is incomprehensible?  Joe immediately scrubs the ridiculous shotgun draws.  Oh Sean, if you had only made this "Peterman type" change earlier. 

[bigK14094]

No, but he has closed the gap considerably.  Shikir now looking lilke a pro receiver.  He needed those couple of years to develope.  He and Josh smoked the Jets and that was exactly what the Bills needed to do to rebuild confidence.

[Virgil]

I sure hope so.  

Offseason needs to be a WR with #1 potential.  He can be our number #2 and learn from Diggs for the first 2 years and then transition to our #1.  Diggs, Rookie, Shakir, Kincaid would be a perfectly fine offense

[Magox]

Gabe has played more so as a boundary receiver and Shakir more so in the slot. 

 

I like Shakir a lot, the Bills don't need to look to upgrade at the Slot any longer, Shakir is the guy and is great after the catch.   Gabe is now the weak link, is having troubles separating and truthfully I think Josh is losing confidence in him and isn't looking his way on many matchups pre snap.

 

Next year the Bills should draft a WR with their #1 pick.

[Chicken Boo]

18 hours ago, BruceVilanch said:

Keep Shakir in the slot and go after a legit #2 in the draft, we need to think about another #1 too, I have to imagine we'll have another diggs off season saga.

 

The Bills should be targeting an eventual replacement for Diggs, not a #2 guy.  

[Beck Water]

5 hours ago, MarkKelso'sHelmet said:

That's is a pretty sad way to characterize a supposed #2 receiver: "a competent run blocker."

 

Chris Simms said on his podcast multiple times that Gabe is not a legit #2. Said Shakir is a stronger option on the boundary and Davis should be in the slot.  If all Gabe brings to the table is run blocking it's time to move on from him. 

 

Did Simms provide any information to back up his statment that "Shakir is a stronger option on the boundary"?

 

People say a lot of stuff - for example, that Shakir isn't fast enough for a boundary receiver; he ran a 4.43 40 vs. Davis 4.56 and Diggs 4.46.  My perception about Shakir on the boundary is that he doesn't have the release to gain separation, especially against press man - he's better this year than last but still - and that he doesn't have the arm length to win against hand fighting (29" arms which is 2-3" shorter than Diggs or Davis.)

 

I think Simms knows something, but I'm not exactly sure what Simms is seeing when he says that.

[Donuts and Doritos]

It's a small sample size, but Shakir seems more consistent than Davis.

[FilthyBeast]

At this point I would say yes if anything because Gabe Davis is all but gone from Buffalo after the season ends.

[JMM]

6 hours ago, MarkKelso'sHelmet said:

Are we sure? Chris Simms said on his podcast that they should try Davis in the slot and put Shakir on the boundary. Why can't Shakir play on the outside? I'm honestly asking. 

You could it's just not his natural position. He's not the take the top off type of wr. He excelled in college over the middle as well. He is just a better fit in the slot.

[LABILLBACKER]

1 hour ago, Chicken Boo said:

 

The Bills should be targeting an eventual replacement for Diggs, not a #2 guy.  

We may need to draft wrs in back to back years... early picks.  Gabe's gone for sure and Stef's clock is ticking.  Love to get Odunze but if we win 10, we're probably too far away.

[coloradobillsfan]

52 minutes ago, FilthyBeast said:

At this point I would say yes if anything because Gabe Davis is all but gone from Buffalo after the season ends.

I really thought he would perform so much better in his contract year and we'd be sorry to see him go.  That hasn't materialized in the slightest! 

[WideNine]

2 hours ago, Virgil said:

I sure hope so.  

Offseason needs to be a WR with #1 potential.  He can be our number #2 and learn from Diggs for the first 2 years and then transition to our #1.  Diggs, Rookie, Shakir, Kincaid would be a perfectly fine offense

 

Agree.

 

One of the deeper drafts for WR so it would make very little sense to pay any kind of a premium to retain Davis, when we could land a WR with a good shot of having more upside that we would have on an affordable rookie deal.

 

I think that WR2 position he occupies is upgradeable and they need to be willing to let Gabe walk.

 

I like our drafted players to go on and have decent NFL careers, but much like Edmunds, you can't sign everybody, nor should you.

 

 

 

[MiracleAtRich1393]

1 hour ago, LABILLBACKER said:

We may need to draft wrs in back to back years... early picks.  Gabe's gone for sure and Stef's clock is ticking.  Love to get Odunze but if we win 10, we're probably too far away.

 

Trade up! We'll have 10 picks and like last year not many day 3 guys will likely be making the roster and they'll just get picked off onto other active rosters so what's the point. You know Brandon loves using his 4th rounders to trade up... if a guy that can be elite on a controlled contract for 5 years is sitting there, I would think Beane pulls the trigger. Doesn't have to be Odunze necessarily, there are a bunch of high quality boundary options this year. But agreed he'd be a great fit

[Draconator]

Brady sees it differently. 

 

 

[Bob in STL]

21 hours ago, Whkfc said:

 

But...but Gabe blocks...... /that was sarcasm

Look at the all 22.  He threw a great block on a TD play, he also rubbed out a defender on another touchdown.  
 

He does block well. It’s part of the game.  

[Whkfc]

2 hours ago, Bob in STL said:

Look at the all 22.  He threw a great block on a TD play, he also rubbed out a defender on another touchdown.  
 

He does block well. It’s part of the game.  

That's fine I'd rather have a wide receiver that can catch and move the ball down the field. Trent Sherfield blocks too how much did he command in the open market this offseason?