Joe Burrow on Joe Brady

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

30 minutes ago, BuffaloBill said:

 

 

Remember that Josh was (maybe is no longer?) a Dorsey supporter.  I think the Dorsey firing may be a message to Josh also.  

 

Hard to say because josh is Josh and no coach will ever take the gunslinger out of him.  The question is goes Brady have the hutzpah and ability to work with this?  Dabol seemed to be able to do so.

 

The other major issue is that Dorsey seemed to have no creativity with the run game.  I would say the same was true with Dabol.  One way to mak Josh better is to give him the threat of a run game.  This will likely mean moving him back under center more and playing RPO less.

 

I know it is a completely different era of football but Jim Kelly does not achieve what he did without Thurman.  In the modern era Josh needs to develop trust with his running backs as does the team.  We will not return to the bell cow RB situation but opposing teams need to perceive there is at least the threat of Buffalo running the ball.

 

a couple nuggets I’ve unearthed in the past few days:

 

1) McDermott in the interview hit on Josh needing more anticipation instead or reacting during the play. This is the offense Josh said he liked in the off-season and as the reason he didn’t over indulge on film. I think Dorsey failure was allowing too much play flexibility wrt to Wr option routes and placating Allen wanting a structured run and shoot type passing game 
 

2) RPO- a telecasted joked that in player interviews one of the lineman said the Bills called it PRO…. Because it was alway a pass read and never run

 

3) yesterday on mcafee, Aaron Rogers said almost the same thing Brady told Allen about his play. The ball needs to come out on schedule. Rodgers critique of Allen was almost identical to Tom. Improvise when you really have to but not every play. Ball has to come out on time. He said on time 15 times when talking about the issue with The bill’s offense. Take the open flat etc. 
 

My guess is Dorsey needed to manage Josh and not be his enabler…. That was his undoing. 
 

Can Brady be a hard ass now and force Allen to do the homework, read presnap and get the ball out on time. That will be the question. 

 

[NoSaint]

1 hour ago, zow2 said:

It’s not like Joe Brady is taking over to work with Tyson Bagent or someone of that caliber. This is Josh Freakin Allen. One of the best QB talents and athletic dudes in the entire league.  So this is an amazing situation for Brady to really shine here.  We’ll see. If he can break Allen out of this slump he will be The Man.

well and he’s still working in someone else’s scheme here so I won’t put 100% on him good or bad - but we can get a feel 

[Allen2Moulds]

1 hour ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Haha, yeah. Now all we need are arguably the top 2 receivers in the nfl, a 1st round rb, and to play against college teams!!!!

 

brady got fired after 4 games in the nfl. Huge difference between the nfl and college. By all accounts, he’s a good and charismatic guy. But you aren’t going to magically have a different offense. You need to call/ encourage Allen to run more, stop constant shotgun, giving up on your best rb early in games, and take shots.

LSU has more offensive talent than most nfl teams had that year.

He got fired during year 2, not 4 games in. Plus, have you seen the dumpster fire that Carolina is? 

The key thing that sticks to me, that Burrow says, is that 1. He's very creative....and 2. He always has something for a defensive look, which leads me to believe, he'll be more of an attack style coach, like Daboll was.

 

Dorsey absolutely needed to be fired. Not sure what more we can do, or what else people want.

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, RyanC883 said:

 

Agreed, but he has a decent amount of talent here, just poorly utilized.  

 

He got 4 HC interviews, and one of the teams said they nearly hired him.  For whatever that's worth.  

 

A good experiment for the rest of the season to see if Brady can do it.  If he can't, is it because McD keeps meddling in the offense? 

 

If he can, we may have our issues solved--perhaps.   

Except McD isn’t meddling in the offense.  Not sure why this narrative persists.  

[NewEra]

18 minutes ago, Livinginthepast said:

Ive wondered all these things but some or most of these could be connected to Dorsey's vanilla offense. If Josh is truly Brett Favre 2.0 then let him loose! Brady now has the reins, so its time to go for broke here. No more conservative, predictable play calls.  This offense needs to be pushed to be better and that was never going to happen with Dorsey. 

Yeah, could be. Just have to remember who’s telling Brady what he wants.  McD. Maybe McD will let him let loose….. I sure hope so

[Allen2Moulds]

1 hour ago, ngbills said:

Sounds more like he is everything Dorsey was before we saw what Dorsey was. Or maybe its what Dorsey became with McD in his ear. 

Hoping Brady is an actual interim and we finally hire a real OC. Dorsey was not ready and I dont think Brady is either. But maybe he will surprise me. He was essentially Dorsey right hand man and Allen coach the past two years and we have seen a steady decline. Fresh blood seems like what is needed. 

Allen has regressed this year, because we run the most predictable offense in the league. Haven't you noticed how often defenders sit down on our routes. That has lead to Allen trying to thread the needle too often, and at times when nothing is there.

[Giuseppe Tognarelli]

1 hour ago, dma0034 said:

Has Allen still been working woth Jordan Palmer?

No.

[ngbills]

3 minutes ago, Allen2Moulds said:

Allen has regressed this year, because we run the most predictable offense in the league. Haven't you noticed how often defenders sit down on our routes. That has lead to Allen trying to thread the needle too often, and at times when nothing is there.

Oh yes I have noticed. I am hopeful it is more of a scheme issue than an Allen issue. That is a much easier problem to fix...the alternative I would rather not think about.

[Giuseppe Tognarelli]

1 hour ago, 34-78-83 said:

Sorry for so many posters here... McD and his best ever Bills winning % will not be gone after one poor season. That would be such a drought era move. That will only happen if he loses his team in the locker room, which contrary to unfounded assumptions, there is no evidence of at this juncture. 

 

A "playoffs or bust" demand would mean we need to go 5-2/ 6-1 against the remaining schedule which includes PHI, DAL, KC, MIA, LAC. Not realistic at all to expect considering the team as is. Is it possible? Sure.

I will keep banging my head against this wall until someone notices:

[Captain Hindsight]

2 hours ago, FilthyBeast said:

I'm still skeptical of Brady because pretty sure most posters on this board could have been the OC at LSU and had similar success with the absurd amount of talent they had there when Brady coached.

 

He wasn't impressive at all when he was OC at Carolina either, but big difference between what he was working with (specifically at QB) compared to current situation in Buffalo.

His first year as OC he had 4 guys go over 1000 scrimmage yards with Teddy Bridgewater at QB. He’s a smart dude 

[Low Positive]

4 minutes ago, Giuseppe Tognarelli said:

No.

He did. Just differently. Jordan Palmer talks about it here: 

 

[C.Biscuit97]

8 minutes ago, Allen2Moulds said:

Allen has regressed this year, because we run the most predictable offense in the league. Haven't you noticed how often defenders sit down on our routes. That has lead to Allen trying to thread the needle too often, and at times when nothing is there.

Just curious: do you give Allen any blame for this? 
 

I’m a big point the finger at yourself before you point at other people. Allen is a legit star. But he was awful Monday and that wasn’t on Dorsey. 

16 minutes ago, Allen2Moulds said:

He got fired during year 2, not 4 games in. Plus, have you seen the dumpster fire that Carolina is? 

The key thing that sticks to me, that Burrow says, is that 1. He's very creative....and 2. He always has something for a defensive look, which leads me to believe, he'll be more of an attack style coach, like Daboll was.

 

Dorsey absolutely needed to be fired. Not sure what more we can do, or what else people want.

You are right. I heard he got fired about 4 games but saw it was his second year, which feels better (also Dorsey like). 

[Giuseppe Tognarelli]

28 minutes ago, colin said:

 

that's a good point.

 

joe brady has aspirations of being the best oc alive (they all do) and he's young and has had success.  being the guy to get allen back to form or beyond is how you make yourself known.

 

gase and hacket have made tens of millions off of very good qbs looking good under their coaching.  brady might just mess around and get the bills HC job!

I was thoroughly reading through the thread to see if anyone suggested this, because I was going to. If the rumors around discontent with McDermott are true, and if Brady can show that he specifically has the answers to unlock Allen and this offense, it would be a wise long term move for Pegula to lock in the offensive mind at HC; otherwise, we'll get 1-2 years max with Brady and then have to start over again.

[C.Biscuit97]

6 minutes ago, Captain Hindsight said:

His first year as OC he had 4 guys go over 1000 scrimmage yards with Teddy Bridgewater at QB. He’s a smart dude 

Carolina might have had better overall weapons (McCaffery, Moore, Samuel -1st round pick, and crazy Robbie Anderson who has 2 900 + yard seasons). 

[Allen2Moulds]

1 minute ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Just curious: do you give Allen any blame for this? 
 

I’m a big point the finger at yourself before you point at other people. Allen is a legit star. But he was awful Monday and that wasn’t on Dorsey. 

There's enough blame to go around, but I like to look at the big picture. Cook fumbles on the first play of the game. Gabe drop robs us of an opportunity of 7, or the very least 3. Allen drops the ball for apparently no reason, and his 2nd pick of the half gives Denver 3 more pts.  Dorsey's offense has been failing for at least 6 weeks, maybe longer. For that reason, everyone was either uptight, or just trying to force it. In my opinion, this was leading to a lot of these miscues.

[Giuseppe Tognarelli]

9 minutes ago, Low Positive said:

He did. Just differently. Jordan Palmer talks about it here: 

 

He talks around it. Every time it was brought up this year, everyone talked around it. They didn't actually work together like they have in the past.

[34-78-83]

so many BS assumptions here by posters thinking they know facts

[Mango]

The offense was better last year. Dorsey called some lights out games this year. 

After a bad outing or two McD said he was going to be more involved. I get the sense everybody is gripping too tight and McD is probably to blame for that.

If the offense is absolutely lights out after the bye, I coulda kinda-sorta, maybe, after a few drinks get behind a youth movement at coach. Double down on the young offensive coordinator like LAR and MIA, and give Brady the reigns in 2024. (ducks and covers)

We could really make it dangerous, and after naming a totally inexperienced 34 year old HC, we could make Bobby Babich our 40 year old DC. 

 

Edit: But honestly, it would help maybe provide some continuity for Allen and the young guys we have coming up while shifting the priority to taking care of Josh long term. 

 

Edit 2: I am doubling down on youth here. Time to get Caleb Pressley to unretire and get this guy into the fold as the Supervisor of Morale"

For those unfamiliar, he is now a barstool guy, but he was recruited to play QB at UNC. He basically both stunk and didn't take it too seriously and he donned himself the Supervisor of Morale. They kept him on the team in his made up role. 

https://www.thescore.com/ncaaf/news/588506

Edited November 15, 2023 by Mango

[Blackbeard]

26 minutes ago, Allen2Moulds said:

Allen has regressed this year, because we run the most predictable offense in the league.

Wow.   WGR talked about the same thing last night!

[John from Riverside]

34 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

a couple nuggets I’ve unearthed in the past few days:

 

1) McDermott in the interview hit on Josh needing more anticipation instead or reacting during the play. This is the offense Josh said he liked in the off-season and as the reason he didn’t over indulge on film. I think Dorsey failure was allowing too much play flexibility wrt to Wr option routes and placating Allen wanting a structured run and shoot type passing game 
 

2) RPO- a telecasted joked that in player interviews one of the lineman said the Bills called it PRO…. Because it was alway a pass read and never run

 

3) yesterday on mcafee, Aaron Rogers said almost the same thing Brady told Allen about his play. The ball needs to come out on schedule. Rodgers critique of Allen was almost identical to Tom. Improvise when you really have to but not every play. Ball has to come out on time. He said on time 15 times when talking about the issue with The bill’s offense. Take the open flat etc. 
 

My guess is Dorsey needed to manage Josh and not be his enabler…. That was his undoing. 
 

Can Brady be a hard ass now and force Allen to do the homework, read presnap and get the ball out on time. That will be the question. 

 

So my question
 

If they were enabling Josh so much, why isn’t he running with the ball like he used to?

3 minutes ago, Mango said:

The offense was better last year. Dorsey called some lights out games this year. 

After a bad outing or two McD said he was going to be more involved. I get the sense everybody is gripping too tight and McD is probably to blame for that.

If the offense is absolutely lights out after the bye, I coulda kinda-sorta, maybe, after a few drinks get behind a youth movement at coach. Double down on the young offensive coordinator like LAR and MIA, and give Brady the reigns in 2024. (ducks and covers)

We could really make it dangerous, and after naming a totally inexperienced 34 year old HC, we could make Bobby Babich our 40 year old DC. 

I realized McDermott is getting it done on defense, but I would really like to see Bobby get his shot with this defense