Josh Allen 177 yards and 2 INTs

[CircleTheWagons99]

 

[CincyBillsFan]

5 hours ago, Low Positive said:

The Bills didn’t lose because of 12 men on a missed FG. We lost because the QB played poorly against a bad defense. I’m not saying to trade the guy, but that’s not good enough. Other franchise QBs don’t have games like that. Burrow threw for over 300 in his loss on Sunday. Mahomes doesn’t have games like this. Even Herbert doesn’t have games like this. He clearly saw a sport’s psychologist this offseason (low positive is right from those people) and it’s messing with his head. But in the end, I’m not sure he cares.

Dude, Mahomes had a game almost exactly like this 2 weeks ago when KC lost to the Broncos.  And Burrow had 2 very bad INT's in the loss to Houston.  And Jackson had 1 TD pass and 2 INT's including a PICK 6 in the Ravens loss to Cleveland.  And did you see Trevor Lawrence's numbers after the 49's game? 

[CincyBillsFan]

4 hours ago, Cheektowaga Chad said:

My biggest fear at the moment is that there will be a group of fans that try to get Allen off the team rather than blame the coaches 

You're seeing them big time on this forum.  

[LabattBlue]

3 plays stand out…

 

- Horrible pass to Harty…intercepted.

 

- Airmail the ball to a wide open Shakir.   Allen could have also easily ran for the 1st down on that play. 

 

- Drop the ball when attempting a handoff. 
 

3 plays all in the same game by the franchise….unacceptable. 
 

Edited November 14, 2023 by LabattBlue

[CincyBillsFan]

4 hours ago, zow2 said:

 

The D balled out,  but like Jax, NE, Cinci and now Denver…just when Allen and the O get their act together, MCDermotts D caves at exactly the wrong time. They caved against the Giants too, to be honest and got lucky. 

This is an under appreciated fact that has plagued McD's defenses for years.

 

Consider that the O was imploding most of the 1st half and then put together a great TD drive near the end of the 2nd quarter.  Then the Bills got the 2 pt conversion and we go from 9 - 0 to 9 - 8.  The stadium is rocking and you expect the D will rise up and put a 3 and out on the Broncos giving the ball back to the O with 2 minutes and a couple of TO's left.  They then go down the field and take the lead with a FG or TD.  That is how the script is supposed to work.

 

But what happens?  The D let's Denver drive to a FG that leaves 45 seconds on the clock and the Bills without a TO.  Allen then presses, makes a dumb throw and gifts Denver a FG right before half.

 

 

 

 

4 minutes ago, LabattBlue said:

3 plays stand out…

 

- Horrible pass to Harty…intercepted.

 

- Airmail the ball to a wide open Shakir.  Allen could have also easily ran for the 1st down on that play. 

 

- Drop the ball when attempting a handoff. 
 

3 plays all in the same game by the franchise….unacceptable. 
 

Allen has been coached NOT to run on that play.  That's what's unacceptable.

 

Bad pass to Harty, it happens.

 

Messed up hand off, it happens.

 

I watched a lot of NFL this weekend and I saw Jackson, Burrow and Lawrence, all elite franchise QB's, make just as many bad plays in their games as Allen did yesterday. It happens and will continue to happen at times.  There is nothing "unacceptable" about it.

 

 

 

[MPT]

1 hour ago, PatsFanNH said:

My point about Herbert is good teams, like the Bills, should destroy teams even when the QB is having a tough day. 

 

Chase hasn’t been getting open like he usually does, I am thinking that’s because without Higgins he is getting all the attention thus making Burrows hold the ball a bit longer..

 

That was also my point. Josh was garbage and the running game was cooking but we abandoned the run for most of the game. Doesn't help when you bench your starting RB because your QB dropped the ball at his feet on a handoff.

 

Defense was more than good enough to win the game as well. They had to defend for 15 more minutes than the Broncos' defense because we kept turning the ball over and going 3 & out. Yet they still held the Broncos to 4.2 yards per play. Baltimore has the best YPP allowed on the season at 4.2

[CincyBillsFan]

Just now, MPT said:

 

That was also my point. Josh was garbage and the running game was cooking but we abandoned the run for most of the game. Doesn't help when you bench your starting RB because your QB dropped the ball at his feet on a handoff.

 

Defense was more than good enough to win the game as well. They had to defend for 15 more minutes than the Broncos' defense because we kept turning the ball over and going 3 & out. Yet they still held the Broncos to 4.2 yards per play. Baltimore has the best YPP allowed on the season at 4.2

Cook was benched for fumbling the ball on the opening play of the game not for the missed hand off.  And that benching was unprofessional and contributes to the many reasons why McD should be fired. 

 

 

[MPT]

6 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

I watched a lot of NFL this weekend and I saw Jackson, Burrow and Lawrence, all elite franchise QB's, make just as many bad plays in their games as Allen did yesterday. It happens and will continue to happen at times.  There is nothing "unacceptable" about it.

 

Those QBs all lost this week. The difference is that they don't do it every week.

 

I love Allen but he's been the biggest contributor to our problems for 6 weeks now.

Just now, CincyBillsFan said:

Cook was benched for fumbling the ball on the opening play of the game not for the missed hand off.  And that benching was unprofessional and contributes to the many reasons why McD should be fired. 

 

 

 

He was benched again after the handoff fumble. Just for one drive that time though. A drive that went 3 & out.

[34-78-83]

Putting the Gabe drop INT on Josh should be a fan card suspension at minimum. (JKJK) That was literally perfect. Too fast? my ass. These WR's have worked with him plenty and are expected to catch those. Just like Favre That's how strong QB's fit balls in tight windows that others can't.

 

The other INT though.... that was a very poor decision to place it over there by Josh.

[CincyBillsFan]

Just now, MPT said:

 

Those QBs all lost this week. The difference is that they don't do it every week.

 

I love Allen but he's been the biggest contributor to our problems for 6 weeks now.

No he hasn't.  The D gave up 29 points to Mac Jones and the Patriots that was the reason we lost that game.

 

We beat the Giants with Allen playing great and executing two fantastic and long TD drives in the 2nd half while the D did everything in their power to give that game away.

 

Do you really think Allen was the primary reason we lost to the Jags and Bengal's?  I thought Allen played well against the Bucs, didn't you?

5 minutes ago, MPT said:

 

Those QBs all lost this week. The difference is that they don't do it every week.

 

I love Allen but he's been the biggest contributor to our problems for 6 weeks now.

 

He was benched again after the handoff fumble. Just for one drive that time though. A drive that went 3 & out.

He was?  I didn't notice that.  That makes McD look even worse here.

[BarleyNY]

5 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

It is so alarming to me how many of these INT’s he has thrown just this year.  He cannot figure this out for whatever reason.

We weren't changing QBs so you had to think we’d be changing OCs. It’s something that they had to try. 

[DrPJax]

9 hours ago, Low Positive said:

The Bills didn’t lose because of 12 men on a missed FG. We lost because the QB played poorly against a bad defense. I’m not saying to trade the guy, but that’s not good enough. Other franchise QBs don’t have games like that. Burrow threw for over 300 in his loss on Sunday. Mahomes doesn’t have games like this. Even Herbert doesn’t have games like this. He clearly saw a sport’s psychologist this offseason (low positive is right from those people) and it’s messing with his head. But in the end, I’m not sure he cares.

He just needs new hope , a new vision, and to get away from the indoctrination 0f the PROCESS!   HIS fire can come back. 

[HappyDays]

This is going to sound crazy but I think this is actually the most consistent year of Allen's career. A lot of efficiency and production metrics point in that direction, and he's doing it with the worst group of pass catchers he's had since 2019 and the worst defense/special teams of his career which is putting him in worse positions than usual.

 

I see so many people say "I miss 2021 Josh Allen" but forget that he had some real clunkers that year. The 9-6 Jacksonville debacle. 3 INTs thrown against the hapless Falcons. But all of that is forgotten because of his historic playoff run that year.

 

I think two things are making it look worse than it is this year:

 

1) Awful turnover luck. To wit:

 

Yesterday was the first time this year a defender got his hands on the ball and didn't complete the interception. Literally the first time! That has to be an unprecedented streak in the modern era.

 

2) Less miracle plays. Allen this year has not been elite when throwing on the run as he has been in the past. The miss to Shakir on 4th and 2 is an example of this. For 90% of QBs that is not even an attempt, certainly not with a smurf WR as the intended target, but with Allen we have seen him hit that throw a dozen times and so we expect it. He also, as has been pointed out many many times, is not picking up chunk yardage with his legs like we're used to.

 

But overall on a down to down basis I genuinely think Allen is mostly playing the best football of his career. Bad luck, zero help from his pass catchers, and incohesive offensive play calling have let him down more than he's let the team down.

 

JMO.

 

P.S. The whole obsession with checking the ball down needs to stop. You know what else moves the ball against defenses that drop everyone back? Just keep running it at them. You punish defenses on the ground until they're forced to commit to stopping it. Something Daboll and now Dorsey for some reason never understood.

 

11 play short pass drives are cute in theory, until the 7th play features your WR2 letting a ball pop into the air and into the arms of a waiting safety. Until an offensive lineman gets beat off the snap which leads to a sack and suddenly you're behind the sticks. Until you make it all the way to the goalline and call shotgun runs for negative yardage. You need explosive plays somewhere along the way.

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

Can we get Jordan Palmer back into the mix here. Dafuk happened to this guy? He was like all fire and excited and energetic. Now he just moped around looking like he isn’t even having fun playing football anymore. I said it a month ago and got ripped apart. Something is absolutely different or off with him. From the bengals playoff game on he’s never looked the same. I’m very concerned at this point.

[FireChans]

51 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

This is going to sound crazy but I think this is actually the most consistent year of Allen's career. A lot of efficiency and production metrics point in that direction, and he's doing it with the worst group of pass catchers he's had since 2019 and the worst defense/special teams of his career which is putting him in worse positions than usual.

 

I see so many people say "I miss 2021 Josh Allen" but forget that he had some real clunkers that year. The 9-6 Jacksonville debacle. 3 INTs thrown against the hapless Falcons. But all of that is forgotten because of his historic playoff run that year.

 

I think two things are making it look worse than it is this year:

 

1) Awful turnover luck. To wit:

 

Yesterday was the first time this year a defender got his hands on the ball and didn't complete the interception. Literally the first time! That has to be an unprecedented streak in the modern era.

 

2) Less miracle plays. Allen this year has not been elite when throwing on the run as he has been in the past. The miss to Shakir on 4th and 2 is an example of this. For 90% of QBs that is not even an attempt, certainly not with a smurf WR as the intended target, but with Allen we have seen him hit that throw a dozen times and so we expect it. He also, as has been pointed out many many times, is not picking up chunk yardage with his legs like we're used to.

 

But overall on a down to down basis I genuinely think Allen is mostly playing the best football of his career. Bad luck, zero help from his pass catchers, and incohesive offensive play calling have let him down more than he's let the team down.

 

JMO.

 

P.S. The whole obsession with checking the ball down needs to stop. You know what else moves the ball against defenses that drop everyone back? Just keep running it at them. You punish defenses on the ground until they're forced to commit to stopping it. Something Daboll and now Dorsey for some reason never understood.

 

11 play short pass drives are cute in theory, until the 7th play features your WR2 letting a ball pop into the air and into the arms of a waiting safety. Until an offensive lineman gets beat off the snap which leads to a sack and suddenly you're behind the sticks. Until you make it all the way to the goalline and call shotgun runs for negative yardage. You need explosive plays somewhere along the way.

Less miracle plays basically means a worse offense.

 

What makes Josh special IS the miracle plays. It’s how he went toe to toe with Mahomes two years ago.

 

A Josh Allen without the miracles is just a fine QB. Not a QB who can be the best in the league. That’s JMO.

[Scott7975]

17 hours ago, Low Positive said:

The Bills didn’t lose because of 12 men on a missed FG. We lost because the QB played poorly against a bad defense. I’m not saying to trade the guy, but that’s not good enough. Other franchise QBs don’t have games like that. Burrow threw for over 300 in his loss on Sunday. Mahomes doesn’t have games like this. Even Herbert doesn’t have games like this. He clearly saw a sport’s psychologist this offseason (low positive is right from those people) and it’s messing with his head. But in the end, I’m not sure he cares.

we lost because the offense played poorly, not just Josh. Some of it is Josh but the entire offense had miss ques. Except maybe the o line oddly. One of those ints is on Josh. The other is on Davis. Some of the yardage is because Cook fumble first play and drops from everyone on good passes. Some of it is a bad play call. Some on Josh and some on everyone else. 
 

Mahomes does have games like that. Can’t speak for Herbert as I haven’t seen him enough. Burrow has games like that too. 

[BigDingus]

As much as it pains me to admit this, Josh has become the joke of the NFL this week.

 

You can't go anywhere sports-related online without memes about Allen, NFL fans discrediting his entire career as "overrated," terrible stat lines like Josh having 33 turnovers just since the start of last season (6 more than #2), and just how abysmal he is at taking care of the football.

 

You even have Diggs' brother pointing out how Josh only blew up after Stefon arrived, with fans going on to point out that Diggs even made Case Keenum look good...

 

Just think about how insane 33 turnovers in a little over 1.5 seasons is. Nobody thinks Josh is "elite" anymore. I don't care about the "miracle" plays or how athletic he is... He makes so many bad choices, and it absolutely destroys our chances at winning games.

 

He could've had another INT last night too, throwing to the most covered WR possible with 3 defenders surrounding him... the EXACT same throw he made against the Bengals that got picked off. He's not learning from his mistakes. And after he makes 1 mistake, he lets it get to him & becomes even more reckless. 

 

I'm sorry, but Josh needs the offseason again. Maybe get Jordan Palmer back on the phone or trade away assets for more WRs that can help mitigate Allen's mistakes.

[GoBills808]

24 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Less miracle plays basically means a worse offense.

 

What makes Josh special IS the miracle plays. It’s how he went toe to toe with Mahomes two years ago.

 

A Josh Allen without the miracles is just a fine QB. Not a QB who can be the best in the league. That’s JMO.

Dunno if miracle or not but the no look Kincaid TD was filthy

[HappyDays]

22 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Less miracle plays basically means a worse offense.

 

What makes Josh special IS the miracle plays. It’s how he went toe to toe with Mahomes two years ago.

 

I agree. The miracle plays are still there, just not as frequent. So Allen's top end play this year has not been as good as we've seen before. But on the other hand he has by far his career best completion percentage which means he is playing "normal" QB better than he ever has before. That's what I mean when I say it's been his most consistent year yet. And it's not like he has an elite group of weapons or an elite offensive coach making it easy for him.

 

The bad plays unfortunately really stick out this year because all of them are turning into the worst case scenarios of themselves and our team as a whole has zero margin for error so every mistake looks worse.

 

He's also come up clutch in the 4th quarter while trailing this year more times than I can ever remember, but his defense has let him down every time (or tried their damndest to in the Giants game).

[GoBills808]

1 hour ago, HappyDays said:

This is going to sound crazy but I think this is actually the most consistent year of Allen's career. A lot of efficiency and production metrics point in that direction, and he's doing it with the worst group of pass catchers he's had since 2019 and the worst defense/special teams of his career which is putting him in worse positions than usual.

 

I see so many people say "I miss 2021 Josh Allen" but forget that he had some real clunkers that year. The 9-6 Jacksonville debacle. 3 INTs thrown against the hapless Falcons. But all of that is forgotten because of his historic playoff run that year.

 

I think two things are making it look worse than it is this year:

 

1) Awful turnover luck. To wit:

 

Yesterday was the first time this year a defender got his hands on the ball and didn't complete the interception. Literally the first time! That has to be an unprecedented streak in the modern era.

 

2) Less miracle plays. Allen this year has not been elite when throwing on the run as he has been in the past. The miss to Shakir on 4th and 2 is an example of this. For 90% of QBs that is not even an attempt, certainly not with a smurf WR as the intended target, but with Allen we have seen him hit that throw a dozen times and so we expect it. He also, as has been pointed out many many times, is not picking up chunk yardage with his legs like we're used to.

 

But overall on a down to down basis I genuinely think Allen is mostly playing the best football of his career. Bad luck, zero help from his pass catchers, and incohesive offensive play calling have let him down more than he's let the team down.

 

JMO.

 

P.S. The whole obsession with checking the ball down needs to stop. You know what else moves the ball against defenses that drop everyone back? Just keep running it at them. You punish defenses on the ground until they're forced to commit to stopping it. Something Daboll and now Dorsey for some reason never understood.

 

11 play short pass drives are cute in theory, until the 7th play features your WR2 letting a ball pop into the air and into the arms of a waiting safety. Until an offensive lineman gets beat off the snap which leads to a sack and suddenly you're behind the sticks. Until you make it all the way to the goalline and call shotgun runs for negative yardage. You need explosive plays somewhere along the way.

There are a lot of metrics that would agree w you