Go On Record Now for 2023 Draft:

[eball]

43 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yep. I screwed the pooch on Allen. I still hate his college film. Still even now. I missed on his legs massively and that does stand out on his film... but man I still hate him as a passer at Wyoming. 

 

But again, fair to accuse some of the hindsight game. Not fair to accuse me of it. My opinions are always there for right or for wrong. Don't try to hide them or change them. 

 

I got Josh Allen majorly wrong.

 

You had the rare double whammy that night...in the same thread you wrote "Rosen is gonna be really good." 

 

But I love the accountability.  Perusing that thread is something else.  A lot of the usual suspects saying their usual things.

 

[GunnerBill]

Just now, eball said:

 

You had the rare double whammy that night...in the same thread you wrote "Rosen is gonna be really good." 

 

But I love the accountability.  Perusing that thread is something else.  A lot of the usual suspects saying their usual things.

 

 

Yep. The 2018 QB class was not my finest moment. 

[BigAl2526]

I have no problem with Beane's drafting.  Teams do not hit on every draft pick.  It just doesn't happen.  I don't think Basham is a failed draft pick.  Had the Bills kept Basham and cut or traded someone else, I expect Basham would have had a few sacks and the kind of stats you expect from a rotational player.  The Bills traded him because it was a crowded room and they like what they see from Kingsley Jonathan, who costs them a lot less.  I think Kaiir Elam is going to be fine.  It's just taking him some time to adapt to zone defense.  I think he would have been OK as a starter this year if the Bills had gone that route.  The Bills got really lucky with Christian Benford.  

 

As far as this year's class is concerned, I'm generally not into making predictions.  I expect that Kincaid and Torrence are going to have successful careers.  I'm optimistic about Dorian Williams.  I think Shorter is a coin flip.  I think Broeker and Austin probably have backup potential.  The Bills just happened to be fairly crowded at their positions.  Van Demark and Anderson were better than the Bills expected.  Broeker was never going to beat out McGovern or Edwards.

[Buffalo716]

1 hour ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yep. The 2018 QB class was not my finest moment. 

QB is as much finding the right scheme and coaches as it is talent 

 

Every single scout thought it was the best in 20 years 

 

And it's really not done yet ... Stories to write 

 

The most talented guys... With the most question marks ... Allen , Lamar ... All shut down doubts

 

The talent of guys like darnold, undeniable.... That's why the NFL chews you up and spits you out

 

 

 

 

[Dopey]

Like everyone else here, I don’t have a clue. I’ll wait a couple of years before wanting to cut or trade a player. Makes more sense than wanting to trade Elam after 1 season. No?

[GoBills808]

11 minutes ago, Dopey said:

Like everyone else here, I don’t have a clue. I’ll wait a couple of years before wanting to cut or trade a player. Makes more sense than wanting to trade Elam after 1 season. No?

unless compensation for Elam is ridiculous trade makes no sense to me

[BillsFanForever19]

11 hours ago, boyst said:

It seems we have a lot of people weighing in how they knew Basham was never going to pan out. That we should have got Creed Humphey. That Elam is a bust. Etc.

 

Now is your chance to weigh in for historical accuracy. Weigh in on each of the following so you can brag to the rest of the internet in a few years of your marvelous victory!

 

1) Kincaid

2) Torrence

3) Williams

4) Shorter

7) Broeker

7) Austin

 

Any other hot takes on draft spots that were reasonable that the Bills could have acquired? Or other hot takes?

 

1) Kincaid will be in the league a while. Catch 600 yards on average through his career, and will be a valuable addition rounding out any roster he is on adding a downfield target. He has a 6-8 year career ahead of him.

2) Torrence will be a starter for a few years, middle of the road quality. He has a 4-5 year career ahead of him.

3) Williams will be on the roster for a few years, in the NFL no more than 4-5 years. He will contribute on special teams more than defense. He will be considered a reach and bust.

4) Shorter won't pass the depth chart of 4th WR on any roster worth a damn. He will join Shakir of never making a significant impact on an NFL roster.

7) Broeker will be in the league a few years on the practice squad.

7) Austin will be rostered at times because of his position and special teams.

 

Outside of this I think Joey Porter, Jr. will be tremendously overhyped and allowed to play a physical game and get the same treat Travon Diggs - made more famous than he is.

 

Outside of your takes, which are rather pessimistic when it comes to guys in this Draft outside of Kincaid, I think your forecast of length in the league on guys is too short.

 

A good TE often has a very long career. It's not odd to see guys play into their 30's. Kyle Rudolph was in the league last year at 33. Greg Olsen was playing at 35. Jimmy Graham is playing this year at 36. If Kincaid is what he says he is, he'll be in this league longer than 6-8 years, barring major injury.

 

If Torrence is a starter for a few years, he'll definitely be around longer than 4-5 years. Especially with the middle of the road play league wide at the Offensive Line. Cody Ford, a complete bust, is entering year 5 this year. A guy like Bobby Hart was entering year 9 before he was released.

Edited August 31, 2023 by BillsFanForever19

[PBF81]

10 hours ago, WhitewalkerInPhilly said:

1) I think that Kincaid will effectively settle into a niche that Cole Beasley managed for about a decade: a reliable 3rd down chain mover, but with the added benefit of being a big body to let him be a red zone threat and get 4-6 TD a year.

2) Torrance will be a solid starter for 4-5 years until he gets too expensive and we let him walk. 

 

Kincaid is definitely going to be interesting to watch.  I can see him being as good as Kelce, which is obviously why they drafted him, or I can see him being patently average.  Some of that will obviously depend upon Dorsey, Allen, and even McD.  

 

This is going to be a very interesting season.  The talent is there on offense to be able to take this team to the Conference Championship and win it, particularly with KC having a serious dearth of receiving talent over there this season.  If McD cannot do that, I suspect that there are going to be cracks in the support for "Trust the Process" era.  

 

 

[HOUSE]

I never go on record

[HappyDays]

Kincaid - He will lead all rookies in receiving yards this year (I have a +1400 bet riding on this outcome). By next year he will be a regular 1,000 yard pass catcher. When Kelce retires he will be widely known as the best TE in the NFL. The only thing he may struggle with as a rookie is separating from physical LBs and DBs that get their hands on him off the line. Once he figures that out he will be the most annoying player to deal with like Kelce has been.

 

Torrence - He will struggle a bit as a pass blocker as a rookie but immediately be a people mover in the run game. He will always be a better run blocker than pass blocker. He won't ever be regarded as an All-Pro type player but he will be the answer at guard here or elsewhere for the next 10+ years.

 

Williams - He will have a roster spot somewhere for the next decade because of his tackling abilities but he'll never get a long term contract. I think he will have a career similar to Christian Kirksey. He will be a guy you can live with as a WLB.

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

29 minutes ago, PBF81 said:

 

Kincaid is definitely going to be interesting to watch.  I can see him being as good as Kelce, which is obviously why they drafted him, or I can see him being patently average.  Some of that will obviously depend upon Dorsey, Allen, and even McD.  

 

This is going to be a very interesting season.  The talent is there on offense to be able to take this team to the Conference Championship and win it, particularly with KC having a serious dearth of receiving talent over there this season.  If McD cannot do that, I suspect that there are going to be cracks in the support for "Trust the Process" era.  

 

 

Part of me wants to set reasonable expectations. A lot of promising 1st round tight end prospects haven't really exploded over the last few years. Hockenson and Pitts haven't set the world on fire and it's unreasonable to expect Kincaid being better right out of the gate but I am really liking the move to 2 TE sets.

 

Obviously I want him to be Kelce 2.0

Edited August 31, 2023 by WhitewalkerInPhilly

[NeverOutNick]

Fun stuff!

 

1) Kincaid - I’m bullish on this kid. If healthy he will be Kelce 2.0 and have a HOF career as a Buffalo Bill retiring the same year as Josh  (12+ years from now) so they can be inducted at the same time

 

2) Torrence - solid plug and play starting right guard for the next 5-10 years

 

3) Williams - Solid backup LB who spot starts here and there throughout his career

 

4) Shorter - bust. Dude body catches everything. Should’ve taken a chance on a WR with higher upside guy like the Princeton kid, Andrei Iosivas who we could’ve got a round later. Hope I’m wrong but there were at least 20 WRs I would’ve taken over Shorter

 

7) Broeker - not on the team anymore and honestly didn’t pay alot of attention to him

 

7) Austin - he actually looks like he could develop into a good corner and stay around the league for 4-6 years but I’m glad we kept Ingram I like his potential more

 

 

a couple others:

 

Zay Flowers will go down as the best WR from this class. Even in Baltimore with their lackluster pass offense he is going to be a big time game changing playmaker.

Devon Witherspoon will be the best corner in this class and has potential to be a top 10 corner for the next 5-10 years

And a future bills player prediction:

 

Ryan Van Demark will be the starting LT for the Buffalo Bills in 2024 

Edited August 31, 2023 by NeverOutNick

[BarleyNY]

11 hours ago, boyst said:

It seems we have a lot of people weighing in how they knew Basham was never going to pan out. That we should have got Creed Humphey. That Elam is a bust. Etc.

 

Now is your chance to weigh in for historical accuracy. Weigh in on each of the following so you can brag to the rest of the internet in a few years of your marvelous victory!

 

1) Kincaid

2) Torrence

3) Williams

4) Shorter

7) Broeker

7) Austin

 

Any other hot takes on draft spots that were reasonable that the Bills could have acquired? Or other hot takes?

 

1) Kincaid will be in the league a while. Catch 600 yards on average through his career, and will be a valuable addition rounding out any roster he is on adding a downfield target. He has a 6-8 year career ahead of him.

2) Torrence will be a starter for a few years, middle of the road quality. He has a 4-5 year career ahead of him.

3) Williams will be on the roster for a few years, in the NFL no more than 4-5 years. He will contribute on special teams more than defense. He will be considered a reach and bust.

4) Shorter won't pass the depth chart of 4th WR on any roster worth a damn. He will join Shakir of never making a significant impact on an NFL roster.

7) Broeker will be in the league a few years on the practice squad.

7) Austin will be rostered at times because of his position and special teams.

 

Outside of this I think Joey Porter, Jr. will be tremendously overhyped and allowed to play a physical game and get the same treat Travon Diggs - made more famous than he is.

 

1. Kincaid: Will be a very good and productive big slot receiver, but will be a liability as a blocker. This will limit him as a true TE as he will have little value as a Y (inline) and will have to be aligned as an F (slot). Whether he develops as a blocker will determine whether that changes and will impact his ceiling as a player.

 

2. Torrence: He is a good prospect for power/gap blocking schemes. He may be able to adjust to a zone scheme, but will likely perform better in the run game when power/gap concepts are used. His feet seem good enough for pass pro so I don’t see the issues some scouts feared. Still, it’s something worth watching. Power and strength will not be an issue for him. 

 

I haven’t watched film of any of the others so I won’t offer an opinion until I see them play. The only thing worth mentioning about Williams a that his scouting profile read like a smaller version of Edmunds’. That’s why I think he was drafted to play MLB.

[Bobby Hooks]

11 hours ago, WhitewalkerInPhilly said:

1) I think that Kincaid will effectively settle into a niche that Cole Beasley managed for about a decade: a reliable 3rd down chain mover, but with the added benefit of being a big body to let him be a red zone threat and get 4-6 TD a year.

2) Torrance will be a solid starter for 4-5 years until he gets too expensive and we let him walk. 

That was the old Bills. Beane signs the good ones now. He’ll do it a year earlier than he should to get a good deal. 

Edited August 31, 2023 by Bobby Hooks

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

3 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Yep. The 2018 QB class was not my finest moment. 

I'll happily eat my crow on that one too

[PBF81]

58 minutes ago, WhitewalkerInPhilly said:

Part of me wants to set reasonable expectations. A lot of promising 1st round tight end prospects haven't really exploded over the last few years. Hockenson and Pitts haven't set the world on fire and it's unreasonable to expect Kincaid being better right out of the gate but I am really liking the move to 2 TE sets.

 

Obviously I want him to be Kelce 2.0

 

All I know is that unless McD needs 3 all-pro WRs, an all-pro TE, an all-pro RB, and several all-pro OL-men, he has more than enough to out compete any team in the league this season on offense if he and Dorsey can put it all together, part of which includes ensuring that Allen uses his high-percentage short-game much more than he did last season and more like he did with Beasley here.  

 

I suspect that will happen, for that very reason, that he did it when Beasley was here but simply didn't have a "Beasley" around last season.  

 

We'll see, we first find out in 12 days.  

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

 

[Roundybout]

Sure, I'll play along. 

 

1) Kincaid - kid's gonna be a stud. I genuinely think he will reach Jason Whitten/Greg Olson levels of success. He just looks so smooth and has such sure hands. Seems to have the moxie too. 

 

2) Torrence - mayobe not an all-pro, but a rock-solid starter for years to come. Thinking Richie Incognito but without the insanity. 

 

3) Williams - I don't know what to think. He seems awfully light, but he was a stud at Tulane and I think he can be a good defensive weapon. I'll say he hangs around for his rookie deal then goes somewhere else. 

 

4) Shorter - WR3 that hangs around in the league for a while like Golden Tate.

 

7) Broeker - Backup at best. 

 

7) Austin - long-term special teamer like Taiwan Jones. 

[HappyDays]

7 hours ago, RyanC883 said:

Putting him on waivers was a huge error as he was picked up by the Texans.

 

Who do you let go instead to get Broeker on the roster though? McGovern, Bates, Edwards, Torrence, and Morse were all locks. That left Anderson and Broeker competing for the last IOL spot on the roster. By all accounts Anderson had a better camp and preseason. This was unfortunately just a numbers decision, and Anderson unlike Broeker appears to be able to play center too.

 

Edited September 1, 2023 by HappyDays

[BruceSlayne]

First 4 picks HOF

[HappyDays]

5 hours ago, boyst said:

This will forever be a gem

 

 

@GunnerBill

Posted April 26, 2018

This is a mistake. It will bring down this regime. You can mark this post and you can quote it back to me any time you like in the future if I am wrong. 

 

 

 

I won't be. 

 

As usual I nailed it.

 

Quote

HappyDays

Posted April 26, 2018

This is literally my nightmare. Don't care about the rest of the draft anymore