The Walls be Closing

[BillStime]

3 hours ago, Doc Brown said:

He won the election.

And where was that special prosecutor?

 

 

[BillStime]

Just now, Doc said:

 

That's how they rationalize their guy(s) having material they never should have had in the first place, in some instances for decades, with no idea what they did with it.  "They didn't know they had it but they gave it back so it's all good!" 

And you rationalize all of Trumps indictments how?

[Joe Ferguson forever]

4 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

I appreciate the question, but you seem to be starting with the premise that any player in this sordid game can be trusted.  I don't start there, I start with "Question everyone's motives.".   

 

You also start at the premise that 'securing the documents was important', I'll reply that 'securing the documents definitely seems like a major issue and threat to our National Security...this time'.  As near as I can tell, there is no significant attention paid to removal of documents, no one really accountable for the proper handling of said documents, no real concern about unprotected access online, or the sharing of classified information with others, or wasn't until 2023. 

 

It seems to me, Chi, it's a major sh8t show on that level, where the relative aggressiveness of the response is directly related to who the target is. 

 

Trump created this problem, Trump is being steamrolled by this problem, and Trump exposed his throat to his enemies and they attacked.  As I've said before, the dems were willing to tear the country apart to get him, it was reckless and foolish to give them more ammunition to destroy him. 

 

There were other options.  There are always other options. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I feel both are apropos ( today,I learned to spell this)

 

I would have written a shorter letter, but I did not have the time. ... 

The more you say, the less people remember.

Edited July 29, 2023 by redtail hawk

[Kemp]

6 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

I think I was pretty clear on H Clinton and the FBI.  I'm not sure why you're struggling with what I wrote?

 

On the second question, you've positioned the choices as:

• Trump gets to keep the material;
• The FBI has to storm the castle;

That reflects a closed mindset and limitation of thought.  

 

There were additional options, including providing Trump more time to review the material to see if there were personal items intermingled with classified docs, allowing Trump to shred/destroy items he felt were beyond the scope of the government authority, and engaging in civil discourse as to the ultimate resolution of the matter.  

 

I do agree that bustin the door down was an option as well. 

 

Your commentary on RReagan is interesting.  Not to me, per se, but maybe to someone else.  My commentary was limited to the subject at hand. 

 

I think you addressed the Irv and Farley question to yourself, but in case you don't answer, I have no idea.  I do think the @Irv reply to Simon in the thread about the Women's Soccer team is one of the funniest I've seen in a long time.   Kudos to Irv in that regard, and if he is Farley, Kudos to @Chris farley as well.  

 

You don't believe Trump was afforded enough time to return the documents?

Why did he deserve any time at all?

He should have been given time to separate secret documents from his personal documents?

 

What would be the legitimate reason for them to be stored together?

Civil discourse was ignored by Trump.

You believe that not returning the docs after the government subpoenaed them shouldn't have resulted in the government attempting to take them back? 

5 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

I appreciate the question, but you seem to be starting with the premise that any player in this sordid game can be trusted.  I don't start there, I start with "Question everyone's motives.".   

 

You also start at the premise that 'securing the documents was important', I'll reply that 'securing the documents definitely seems like a major issue and threat to our National Security...this time'.  As near as I can tell, there is no significant attention paid to removal of documents, no one really accountable for the proper handling of said documents, no real concern about unprotected access online, or the sharing of classified information with others, or wasn't until 2023. 

 

It seems to me, Chi, it's a major sh8t show on that level, where the relative aggressiveness of the response is directly related to who the target is. 

 

Trump created this problem, Trump is being steamrolled by this problem, and Trump exposed his throat to his enemies and they attacked.  As I've said before, the dems were willing to tear the country apart to get him, it was reckless and foolish to give them more ammunition to destroy him. 

 

There were other options.  There are always other options. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

What were the other options?

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

16 minutes ago, Kemp said:

 

You don't believe Trump was afforded enough time to return the documents?

Why did he deserve any time at all?

He should have been given time to separate secret documents from his personal documents?

 

What would be the legitimate reason for them to be stored together?

Civil discourse was ignored by Trump.

You believe that not returning the docs after the government subpoenaed them shouldn't have resulted in the government attempting to take them back? 

 

What were the other options?

1.  I think he should have left the documents at the WH, in spite of the wrongdoing by Biden, Clinton etc.  
2. Because the government allows such things. 
3. Yes, because the government allows such things. 
4.  See #3.

5.  I understand how you feel. 
6.  Addressed previously.

7.  Addresses previously. 

[Joe Ferguson forever]

11 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

addressed previously.

equals asked and answered.  Slightly longer but more definitive.

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

10 hours ago, redtail hawk said:

equals asked and answered.  Slightly longer but more definitive.

 

11 hours ago, redtail hawk said:

I feel both are apropos ( today,I learned to spell this)

 

I would have written a shorter letter, but I did not have the time. ... 

The more you say, the less people remember.

The teacher said you’re sassy! 
There’s a way that things should be.

You’ll paint flowers the way they are, 

So repeat after me:

Flowers are red.

Green leaves are green.

There’s no need to see flowers any other way

Than the way they always have been seen. 

Don’t be the teacher, Red.  

 

[Joe Ferguson forever]

1 hour ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

 

The teacher said you’re sassy! 
There’s a way that things should be.

You’ll paint flowers the way they are, 

So repeat after me:

Flowers are red.

Green leaves are green.

There’s no need to see flowers any other way

Than the way they always have been seen. 

Don’t be the teacher, Red.  

 

good idea.  I was thinking of teaching anatomy and physiology to nurses.

[Tiberius]

LOL 

 

 

[BillsFanNC]

 

[Kemp]

18 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

1.  I think he should have left the documents at the WH, in spite of the wrongdoing by Biden, Clinton etc.  
2. Because the government allows such things. 
3. Yes, because the government allows such things. 
4.  See #3.

5.  I understand how you feel. 
6.  Addressed previously.

7.  Addresses previously. 

 

You: "There were additional options, including providing Trump more time to review the material to see if there were personal items intermingled with classified docs, "

Me: He should have been given time to separate secret documents from his personal documents?

 

What would be the legitimate reason for them to be stored together?

You: Because the government allows such things.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Where did you get the idea that government allows the mixing of classified and personal documents?

Trump was given plenty of time to review the material. He was then subpeonaed. He ignored it. Is that true or not?

 

[Kemp]

33 minutes ago, BillsFanNC said:

 

 

You're quoting someone who is on the record saying that the policeman Michael Fanone, who was beaten unconscious by the rioters at the Capitol, of being a “crisis actor.”

Do you believe that to be true?

Are you a supporter of Qanon?

[The Frankish Reich]

On 7/28/2023 at 9:04 AM, Kemp said:

I don't think you have grasped yet that the Republican Party that we used to think existed ain't coming back soon, if at all.

They are now an openly anti-establishment and anti-democracy Party. More importantly, their supporters would not return to support them if they went back to what they were.

Well said.

I voted for Mitt Romney. I would have voted for Marco Rubio or Jeb Bush or Chris Christie. But now? There's a few mild-mannered candidates making gestures toward normalcy (Tim Scott?), but even if they could get through the primaries, the Republican Party is bereft of ideas at the congressional and think tank level. Trump killed it. It or some other successor will have to be rebuilt from the ground up, like an NFL team tanking and trading their entire starting lineup for draft picks.

[L Ron Burgundy]

39 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said:

Well said.

I voted for Mitt Romney. I would have voted for Marco Rubio or Jeb Bush or Chris Christie. But now? There's a few mild-mannered candidates making gestures toward normalcy (Tim Scott?), but even if they could get through the primaries, the Republican Party is bereft of ideas at the congressional and think tank level. Trump killed it. It or some other successor will have to be rebuilt from the ground up, like an NFL team tanking and trading their entire starting lineup for draft picks.

At this point that they have to build from the ground up is a good thing perhaps.  Excise the poison.   Get rid of other less important, problematic BS.  Myself and a lot of other like minded people won't vote Republican while they are so closely aligned with a religion.   

[TH3]

36 minutes ago, L Ron Burgundy said:

At this point that they have to build from the ground up is a good thing perhaps.  Excise the poison.   Get rid of other less important, problematic BS.  Myself and a lot of other like minded people won't vote Republican while they are so closely aligned with a religion.   

It ain’t the party….it’s the GOP Voters….plenty of quality republicans….they have no shot to get elected. The cancer of white victim hood has to run its course…look no farther than this forum.

Edited July 29, 2023 by TH3

[BillsFanNC]

Who are four useful idiots who are very likely attacking the messenger here?

 

You've chosen to ignore content by Kemp. Options 

You've chosen to ignore content by The Frankish Reich. Options 

You've chosen to ignore content by L Ron Burgundy. Options 

You've chosen to ignore content by TH3. Options

[The Frankish Reich]

2 hours ago, BillsFanNC said:

Who are four useful idiots who are very likely attacking the messenger here?

 

You've chosen to ignore content by Kemp. Options 

You've chosen to ignore content by The Frankish Reich. Options 

You've chosen to ignore content by L Ron Burgundy. Options 

You've chosen to ignore content by TH3. Options

Just go away already. 
someone please quote this so he can’t deny he’s reading it. 
what an obnoxious poster. 

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

16 hours ago, Kemp said:

 

You: "There were additional options, including providing Trump more time to review the material to see if there were personal items intermingled with classified docs, "

Me: He should have been given time to separate secret documents from his personal documents?

 

What would be the legitimate reason for them to be stored together?

You: Because the government allows such things.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Where did you get the idea that government allows the mixing of classified and personal documents?

Trump was given plenty of time to review the material. He was then subpeonaed. He ignored it. Is that true or not?

 

Hillary Clinton, Secretary of State and Democrat nominee for President, co-mingled classified and personal documents.  Joe Biden, former senator, VP, and current President has acknowledged possessing and maintaining classified material in a variety of places, including the garage of his personal residence.   Mike Pence, classified material, personal residence.  
 

Is it your contention that these three, high ranking government individuals had no personal documents within the 4 square walls of their personal residence(s).  No tax documents, medical bills, cell phone bills, children’s artwork, Corvette owner’s manuals etc?  

It seems fairly obvious that while frowned upon, it’s common knowledge that it happens, often, and there are apparently precious few safeguards to prevent the unauthorized removal of documents.   
 

I’ll go so far as to state that upon resolution of the SC Biden investigation, there will be no commentary, nor legal jeopardy, for Biden, nor the individuals who mishandled the classified documents on his behalf on a problem so vast and far reaching that our very nation is in peril.    When you factor in the Biden problem spans decades and multiple positions at the highest level of government, it seems clear to me that the stated rules are really more soft guidelines.
 

As for your second question, I’ve answered that multiple times.  I urge you to review the transcript if confusion lingers.  
 

 

 

 

 

[Tiberius]

 

[BillsFanNC]

Belongs here. 

 

Because hypocrisy of PPP useful idiots knows no bounds....

 

 

[Joe Ferguson forever]

how dumb are trump donors?  paying the legal bills of a billionaire.  pretty f'in dumb.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/trump-legal-fees-balloon-as-prosecutors-ask-about-possible-conflicts/ar-AA1ex8Of

https://dnyuz.com/2023/07/29/60-million-refund-request-shows-financial-pressure-on-trump-from-legal-fees/

Edited July 30, 2023 by redtail hawk

[BillStime]

 

[Kemp]

On 7/28/2023 at 10:30 PM, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

1.  I think he should have left the documents at the WH, in spite of the wrongdoing by Biden, Clinton etc.  
2. Because the government allows such things. 
3. Yes, because the government allows such things. 
4.  See #3.

5.  I understand how you feel. 
6.  Addressed previously.

7.  Addresses previously. 

 

The government allowed him an enormous amount of time. He said F you to the government, so it's difficult to take you seriously on this.

[Kemp]

23 hours ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

Hillary Clinton, Secretary of State and Democrat nominee for President, co-mingled classified and personal documents.  Joe Biden, former senator, VP, and current President has acknowledged possessing and maintaining classified material in a variety of places, including the garage of his personal residence.   Mike Pence, classified material, personal residence.  
 

Is it your contention that these three, high ranking government individuals had no personal documents within the 4 square walls of their personal residence(s).  No tax documents, medical bills, cell phone bills, children’s artwork, Corvette owner’s manuals etc?  

It seems fairly obvious that while frowned upon, it’s common knowledge that it happens, often, and there are apparently precious few safeguards to prevent the unauthorized removal of documents.   
 

I’ll go so far as to state that upon resolution of the SC Biden investigation, there will be no commentary, nor legal jeopardy, for Biden, nor the individuals who mishandled the classified documents on his behalf on a problem so vast and far reaching that our very nation is in peril.    When you factor in the Biden problem spans decades and multiple positions at the highest level of government, it seems clear to me that the stated rules are really more soft guidelines.
 

As for your second question, I’ve answered that multiple times.  I urge you to review the transcript if confusion lingers.  
 

 

 

 

 

 

You keep ignoring the central difference.

Trump refused to return the documents.

You can't acknowledge or dispute that, so all you're left with is blathering on.

[SoCal Deek]

1 minute ago, Kemp said:

 

You keep ignoring the central difference.

Trump refused to return the documents.

You can't acknowledge or dispute that, so all you're left with is blathering on.

That is NOT the central difference. 
 

But if you believe that it is, can you tell us why “Trump refused to return them”? 

[Kemp]

On 7/29/2023 at 6:40 PM, TH3 said:

It ain’t the party….it’s the GOP Voters….plenty of quality republicans….they have no shot to get elected. The cancer of white victim hood has to run its course…look no farther than this forum.

 

And they called us snowflakes.

Has there ever been a person in American politics with thinner skin than Trump?

On 7/29/2023 at 7:58 PM, BillsFanNC said:

Who are four useful idiots who are very likely attacking the messenger here?

 

You've chosen to ignore content by Kemp. Options 

You've chosen to ignore content by The Frankish Reich. Options 

You've chosen to ignore content by L Ron Burgundy. Options 

You've chosen to ignore content by TH3. Options

 

Thank you.

1 minute ago, SoCal Deek said:

That is NOT the central difference. 
 

But if you believe that it is, can you tell us why “Trump refused to return them”? 

 

Because he's a moron who chose to put himself in greater legal jeopardy.

What's the Qanon reasoning on this?

[SoCal Deek]

9 minutes ago, Kemp said:

 

And they called us snowflakes.

Has there ever been a person in American politics with thinner skin than Trump?

 

Thank you.

 

Because he's a moron who chose to put himself in greater legal jeopardy.

What's the Qanon reasoning on this?

Okay….thanks. Just as I suspected you’d say. Blah, blah, blah Qanon, MAGA, hoax etc. 🙄

[Kemp]

4 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Okay….thanks. Just as I suspected you’d say. Blah, blah, blah Qanon, MAGA, hoax etc. 🙄

 

I directly answered your question.

You didn't answer your own question.

Did you mistake one of my posts for another?

That's what it seems like.

Don't be ashamed of your mistake.

[BillsFanNC]

 

[Kemp]

20 minutes ago, BillsFanNC said:

 

 

Except this all started before he even declared himself a candidate and the new charges are in regard to alleged crimes that were discovered during the existing investigation, but since you have blocked me - thanks again -, you won't see this.

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

1 hour ago, Kemp said:

 

You keep ignoring the central difference.

Trump refused to return the documents.

You can't acknowledge or dispute that, so all you're left with is blathering on.

You've already said that multiple times, Kemp.  Have you forgotten (again)?

 

You asked 7 hard-hitting, well-researched, punch-in-the-gut questions, abandoned 5 upon my initial response, then the other two when it became apparent you hadn't really contemplated the answers to the questions that you prepared.  

 

A friendly word--don't just focus on the question, consider the answer you might receive based on information readily available.   

 

I appreciate you. 

Edited July 31, 2023 by leh-nerd skin-erd

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

1 hour ago, SoCal Deek said:

Okay….thanks. Just as I suspected you’d say. Blah, blah, blah Qanon, MAGA, hoax etc. 🙄

Kemp currently is arguing with me because I suggested that Trump never should have taken the files to begin with.  I think he actually may be a MAGAnon. 

[Big Blitz]

 

Everyone gets a ballot!

[SoCal Deek]

1 hour ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

Kemp currently is arguing with me because I suggested that Trump never should have taken the files to begin with.  I think he actually may be a MAGAnon. 

As I said earlier all any of this is going to do is set into motion the practice that Presidents will stand over their office on their final day and declare EVERYTHING in it to be unclassified, lest they get caught in this administrative process nonsense. Done! 

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

3 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

As I said earlier all any of this is going to do is set into motion the practice that Presidents will stand over their office on their final day and declare EVERYTHING in it to be unclassified, lest they get caught in this administrative process nonsense. Done! 

Our current system seems to have been fashioned using the Thunderdome model, where pretty much everything goes, no one gives a $&&$, and we can pretend nobody knew nothing about nothing for decades at a clip because of, uh, SLIPPAGE! 
 

Your suggestion actually makes sense. 

[SoCal Deek]

Just now, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

Our current system seems to have been fashioned using the Thunderdome model, where pretty much everything goes, no one gives a $&&$, and we can pretend nobody knew nothing about nothing for decades at a clip because of, uh, SLIPPAGE! 
 

Your suggestion actually makes sense. 

Of course it makes sense! All of my suggestions do. 😉 The problem is that making sense is as far as the east is from the west in the administrative state. They pass law after law and install regulation after regulation but what they’ve yet to figure out is that people who want to break the law and ignore regulations are going to do just that. Trump isn’t being accused of espionage. He’s being accused of not following the administrative rules….which in Washington is the highest crime you can commit. And apparently far higher than extortion, bribery and corruption! 

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

21 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Of course it makes sense! All of my suggestions do. 😉 The problem is that making sense is as far as the east is from the west in the administrative state. They pass law after law and install regulation after regulation but what they’ve yet to figure out is that people who want to break the law and ignore regulations are going to do just that. Trump isn’t being accused of espionage. He’s being accused of not following the administrative rules….which in Washington is the highest crime you can commit. And apparently far higher than extortion, bribery and corruption! 

And fabricating intelligence to force a war that leads to the death of a million people, including thousands of our finest, and horrific injuries to tens of thousands more. 
 

For that, you get a cushy gig in Texas and an everlasting friendship with Barrack and ‘Shell, Bill n Hill.
 

🤷🏼‍♂️

[SoCal Deek]

Just now, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

And fabricating intelligence to force a war that leads to the death of a million people, including thousands of our finest, and horrific injuries to tens of thousands more. 
 

For that, you get a cushy gig in Texas and an everlasting friendship with Barrack and ‘Shell, Bill n Hill.
 

🤷🏼‍♂️

It’s ALL good as long as you’re doing the bidding from inside the beltway. But don’t dare try and shine a flashlight into the abyss! This is not Left against Right as so many on here and elsewhere naively believe. It’s Inside against Outside and getting worse all the time. 

[Kemp]

https://www.nytimes.com/2023/07/31/us/trump-georgia-prosecutor-election.html

How many cases in a row can he lose?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2023/07/31/georgia-2020-election-investigation-trump/

Next indictment a coming.

A bunch of Republicans jockeying for VP spot under Trump.

Guess they're figuring when he goes down, they'll inherit the nomination.

Not a bad strategy. 

Edited July 31, 2023 by Kemp

[Tommy Callahan]

All Wa-Po and NYT.  

 

pushing more blue anon stories for the mob.

 

Some things don't change.

Edited August 1, 2023 by Chris farley