What if the Bills refuse to play the Patriots?

[SCBills]

Just now, UKBillFan said:

I wish people would stop comparing NFL players to emergency workers or members of the armed forces. Massive credit to all who serve, but it comes with a completely different expectation to what is normal and abnormal. Sitting on backsides saying THEY MUST PLAY is hardly the kind of ‘support’ I expected from the majority of Bills fans considering what happened on Monday night. It feels akin to telling the players and coaching staff to man up and stop grizzling.

NFL players chose the profession they are in and are compensated far better than most emergency workers and armed forces.  
 

What happened was incredibly traumatic, but every other team is going out there and playing.   Dawson Knox had to come back and play after his brother died.  Life doesn’t just stop.  
 

At a certain point, if you don’t push forward, you simply let the event consume you, and that isn’t healthy.  
 

Nor would it be fair to the rest of the league.  ..the rest of the players who were also faced with their own mortality that night, albeit not to the extent of the Bengals and especially Bills. 
 

I won’t criticize anyone who doesn’t play.  But this is their job.  They don’t need to do this job.  They can find another profession if this is no longer what they are willing to risk.  
 

The Bills should 100% be forced to forfeit if they don’t play.  And that’s their decision.   I can tell you that that decision would start to chip away at some of the good will.  People stop feeling sorry for people who come across and being unwilling to not feel sorry for themselves… especially when it affects others who take the same risks. 
 

It sounds callous.. but it’s life.  And I’m supportive of anyone who can’t play and/or wants to find a new line of work.   But this is the job… The right decision was made Monday Night.. but they have to move forward now. 

[Milanos Milano]

2 minutes ago, SCBills said:

NFL players chose the profession they are in and are compensated far better than most emergency workers and armed forces.  
 

What happened was incredibly traumatic, but every other team is going out there and playing.   Dawson Knox had to come back and play after his brother died.  Life doesn’t just stop.  
 

At a certain point, if you don’t push forward, you simply let the event consume you, and that isn’t healthy.  
 

Nor would it be fair to the rest of the league.  ..the rest of the players who were also faced with their own mortality that night, albeit not to the extent of the Bengals and especially Bills. 
 

I won’t criticize anyone who doesn’t play.  But this is their job.  They don’t need to do this job.  They can find another profession if this is no longer what they are willing to risk.  
 

The Bills should 100% be forced to forfeit if they don’t play.  And that’s their decision.   I can tell you that that decision would start to chip away at some of the good will.  People stop feeling sorry for people who come across and being unwilling to not feel sorry for themselves… especially when it affects others who take the same risks. 
 

It sounds callous.. but it’s life.  And I’m supportive of anyone who can’t play and/or wants to find a new line of work.   But this is the job… The right decision was made Monday Night.. but they have to move forward now. 

Exactly. What about Tom, that gets paid based on working at events, and now can’t get paid to feed his family because a game doesn’t get played. This isn’t just about Hamlin. Nobody cares if Tom has food to provide for his family. 

Edited January 5, 2023 by IronMaidenBills

[Buffalo03]

4 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 

Yet you are trying to decide for them by saying "they have to play the game" and "the team is not going to want to throw that away."  How do you know what the players want to do?  You don't.  

I wasn't trying to decide for them. What I said is just fact. They eventually have to move forward. It's not about what I think. It's what needs to happen

[boater]

4 hours ago, HOUSE said:

I would back the Bills decision if Hamlin does not drastically improve.

 

Make sure you open this link before replying...

https://www.boston.com/sports/new-england-patriots/2023/01/04/damar-hamlin-decision-bills-patriots-game-postponed/

 

.

This is silly talk.

 

We are all shocked by MNF. We all need healing. A major step in healing is moving forward.

 

Move forward, play the game this Sunday. Don't get stuck in the Kübler-Ross stage of depression.

[Milanos Milano]

I mean, you have 60% of Americans living paycheck to paycheck, but nobody cares if they are dependent on a game being played for the local economy. 

[Kiva]

6 minutes ago, Scott7975 said:

 

Yet you are trying to decide for them by saying "they have to play the game" and "the team is not going to want to throw that away."  How do you know what the players want to do?  You don't.  

I guarantee you they want to play the game. They are not the types to curl up in the fetal position and cry until they hear good news.  They will play for their teammate and they will win the one seed.  Super Bowl goes through Buffalo this year. 

[Buffalo03]

1 minute ago, boater said:

This is silly talk.

 

We are all shocked by MNF. We all need healing. A major step in healing is moving forward.

 

Move forward, play the game this Sunday. Don't get stuck in the Kübler-Ross stage of depression.

Shhhh....don't say this. They hate this kinda talk here lol

[UKBillFan]

10 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

NFL players play a violent game, they know the deal. I’ve literally seen accidents as a standard civilian (I’m not medical) where dead bodies are hanging out of a vehicle. It sucks, and I always wish their loved ones the best, but life goes on. You clean up the mess, and you would never know anything every happened. They must play or forfeit. You can’t hold the rest of the league back because you are scared to move forward. There are hundreds of sponsors, hundreds of workers that are dependent on game play (otherwise they can’t support their families). It’s not that we are heartless or we don’t care, many people care, but life doesn’t stop for anyone. 

I think it was Happy Days who made the comment earlier - players are prepared for bad injuries up to the point of paralysis and severe concussion. But a player suffering a cardiac arrest on the field is completely different to any of that, and certainly different from seeing a dead stranger in a RTA.

 

Life does go on and will go on. But it is up to the players and coaching staff to individually decide the pace it will happen and, as a fanbase, the least we can do is support whatever decision they make rather than belittle them if they make the ‘wrong’ one.
 

As I said before, I think the Bills will play the Patriots on Sunday but I doubt every physically available player will turn out.

Edited January 5, 2023 by UKBillFan

[Milanos Milano]

5 minutes ago, UKBillFan said:

I think it was Happy Days who made the comment earlier - players are prepared for bad injuries up to the point of paralysis and severe concussion. But a player suffering a cardiac arrest on the field is completely different to any of that, and certainly different from seeing a dead stranger in a RTA.

 

Life does go on and will go on. But it is up to the players and coaching staff to individually decide the pace it will happen and, as a fanbase, the least we can do is support whatever decision they make rather than belittle them if they make thr ‘wrong’ one.
 

As I said before, I think the Bills will play the Patriots on Sunday but I doubt every physically available player will turn out.

As a player, you should be prepared for everything, including possible death. It comes with the territory of violent contact. If they aren’t , then they should look for a new profession. We have linemen in this country that work with dangerous conditions 24/7 and some get electrocuted. It’s sad, and it’s tragic, but it’s a known risk. Unfortunately we have to deal with the best we can with risk assessments. Nobody is forcing them to suit up, if individual players don’t want to play fine, put in backups and take a loss. There are too many people that are dependent on games being played for the local economy. 60% of Americans live paycheck to paycheck, and need the money to provide for their families. The game must go on, even if we lose 64-0. 

Edited January 5, 2023 by IronMaidenBills

[Dr.Sack]

I’m sure Damar would want his brothers to play. 

[Milanos Milano]

Just now, Dr.Sack said:

I’m sure Damar would want his brothers to play. 

I know I would. In fact, I would be mad if they didn’t. 

[UKBillFan]

1 minute ago, IronMaidenBills said:

As a player, you should be prepared for everything, including possible death. It comes with the territory of violent contact. If they aren’t , then they should look for a new profession. We have linemen in this country that work with dangerous conditions 24/7 and some get electrocuted. It’s sad, and it’s tragic, but it’s a known risk. Unfortunately we have to deal with the best we can with risk assessments. Nobody is forcing them to suit up, if individual players don’t want to play fine, put in backups and take a loss. There are too many people that are dependent on games being played for the local economy. 60% of Americans live paycheck to paycheck, and need the money to provide for their families. The game must go on, even if we lose 64-0. 

I don’t think players go out there thinking “I could die here”. I doubt many even set much stall by the more likelier outcome of paralysis or concussion. Not only are they concerned for a friend, I think it is possible events on Monday woke some up about their own mortality, considering how innocuous the tackle was which led to Damar’s cardiac arrest.

 

It would never happen but I wonder what would be the next step if every single Bills player decoded to retire tomorrow? They have every right to do so but it’d be difficult to play the game which must go on.

[Milanos Milano]

Just now, UKBillFan said:

I don’t think players go out there thinking “I could die here”. I doubt many even set much stall by the more likelier outcome of paralysis or concussion. Not only are they concerned for a friend, I think it is possible events on Monday woke some up about their own mortality, considering how innocuous the tackle was which led to Damar’s cardiac arrest.

 

It would never happen but I wonder what would be the next step if every single Bills player decoded to retire tomorrow? They have every right to do so but it’d be difficult to play the game which must go on.

It’s foolish if they don’t. If they don’t think that, they need to re-evaluate their life decisions. Maybe the NFL isn’t for people after this incident, which is fine, everyone is free to make life choices. Nobody is forcing these players to play a violent game, they choose to play on their own accords. 

Nearly every job comes with a risk of death, which is exactly why a lot of employers or self employed people take out ADD policies. 

[Mango]

1 hour ago, SageAgainstTheMachine said:

 

I mean, they don't.  I think they should and will but the players are grown adults who don't have to do anything they don't want to.

They all also have the financial means to “not move on”. If I watched my coworker lose an arm in a machine, I’d like to take a week or more off but I couldn’t afford it. 
 

NFL players can. 
 

These aren’t first responders, they didn’t sign up to watch their friend lie their dead die 9 minutes. If they want to take 7 days off they have the means to do so. 

[UKBillFan]

3 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

It’s foolish if they don’t. If they don’t think that, they need to re-evaluate their life decisions. Maybe the NFL isn’t for people after this incident, which is fine, everyone is free to make life choices. Nobody is forcing these players to play a violent game, they choose to play on their own accords. 

Nearly every job comes with a risk of death, which is exactly why a lot of employers or self employed people take out ADD policies. 

Personally I think the majority of people who take on violent or dangerous jobs get into a position where they don’t consider their own mortality - otherwise they would change paths. 

[Milanos Milano]

7 minutes ago, Mango said:

They all also have the financial means to “not move on”. If I watched my coworker lose an arm in a machine, I’d like to take a week or more off but I couldn’t afford it. 
 

NFL players can. 
 

These aren’t first responders, they didn’t sign up to watch their friend lie their dead die 9 minutes. If they want to take 7 days off they have the means to do so. 

It’s foolish if they don’t think they could watch a teammate die. Why would anyone think otherwise? You are talking about violent contact. You could die from internal bleeding if hit just right. Just because it hasn’t happened doesn’t mean the probability is low. Perfectly fit soccer players have died on the pitch from heart attacks, etc. 

If they want to take personal time off from the game, that’s fine, but the game must go on, even if it’s played by practice squad players. Even if we lose 64-0. Nobody cares about the poor family that needs these games for the local economic benefit. Nobody cares that 60% of Americans are living paycheck to paycheck and having a hard time affording rent/mortgage or buying food. The game must be played for that simple fact alone. 

2 minutes ago, UKBillFan said:

Personally I think the majority of people who take on violent or dangerous jobs get into a position where they don’t consider their own mortality - otherwise they would change paths. 

Well, I have wise words for everyone here. You might want to do personal risk assessments at your place of employment, because something as simple as a frayed computer monitor cable could kill you. The players might want to do some deep thinking if they didn’t think they could die playing a violent game. 

Edited January 5, 2023 by IronMaidenBills

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

18 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

As a player, you should be prepared for everything, including possible death. It comes with the territory of violent contact. If they are, then they should look for a new profession. We have linemen in this country that work with dangerous conditions 24/7 and some get electrocuted. It’s sad, and it’s tragic, but it’s a known risk. Unfortunately we have to deal with the best we can with risk assessments. Nobody is forcing them to suit up, if individual players don’t want to play fine, put in backups and take a loss. There are too many people that are dependent on games being played for the local economy. 60% of Americans live paycheck to paycheck, and need the money to provide for their families. The game must go on, even if we lose 64-0. 

 

 I will support the team in either direction they choose. They are the ones that know him, played with him and witnessed what happened to him. It's up to them and no one else.

 

 For me if they didn't want to play it would be more about the trauma they went through seeing everything unfold, not the fear of a once in several million time injury in the NFL. That maybe there, but they are also aware that what happened to Damar was equivalent to having a winning lottery ticket, just the wrong kind of lottery.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 5, 2023 by LOVEMESOMEBILLS

[BillsPride12]

4 hours ago, Kyle and freddy said:

Jason McCourty on GMFB made a point that many of these guys have dealt with adversity their whole lives and sports/football have been an outlet /escape from friends getting killed, poverty, broken families , parental drug abuse, crime ridden neighborhoods…they reached the top of their profession through hard work , having supportive teammates … I think it will be positive to get back to doing what they do best and where they thrive 

I get this point of view and have seen a lot of people comparing this and that but the thing that makes this situation unique is one of their teammates almost just DIED on the field the other night.  It's gotta be awfully tough to get yourself in the right state of mind to play a football game at 100% after just witnessing that.  I'm not saying I think they are going to forfeit the NE game but I just feel so bad for these guys right now.  This isn't your typical let's rally and use this as motivation scenario that just occured, they have gotta be in a weird state of mind still.

[UKBillFan]

1 minute ago, IronMaidenBills said:

It’s foolish if they don’t think they could watch a teammate die. Why would anyone think otherwise? You are talking about violent contact. You could die from internal bleeding if hit just right. Just because it hasn’t happened doesn’t mean the probability is low. Perfectly fit soccer players have died on the pitch from heart attacks, etc. 

If they want to take personal time off from the game, that’s fine, but the game must go own, even if it’s played by practice squad players. Even if we lose 64-0. Nobody cares about the poor family that needs these games for the local economic benefit. Nobody cares that 60% of Americans are living paycheck to paycheck and having a hard time affording rent/mortgage or buying food. The game must be played for that simple fact alone. 

We’re talking about one game. The Bills will have at least one game in the play offs which, in August, was not guaranteed. And no one seemed to bring up the issues of family members on the breadline losing out when the Browns game was switched to Detroit.

[Milanos Milano]

2 minutes ago, UKBillFan said:

We’re talking about one game. The Bills will have at least one game in the play offs which, in August, was not guaranteed. And no one seemed to bring up the issues of family members on the breadline losing out when the Browns game was switched to Detroit.

Because it was physically impossible to play the game. Come on. It’s not physically impossible to play the game this weekend, it’s a mentality thing. 

[UKBillFan]

11 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Because it was physically impossible to play the game. Come on. It’s not physically impossible to play the game this weekend, it’s a mentality thing. 

How about losing out on the Pats game not going to have an overall impact, as it will just be replaced by a play off game anyway - one which is not guaranteed at the start of the season?

Edited January 5, 2023 by UKBillFan

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

1 minute ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Because it was physically impossible to play the game. Come on. It’s not physically impossible to play the game this weekend, it’s a mentality thing. 

 

 You'd be a terrific spokesman for mental health awareness.👍

 

 

 

[SCBills]

20 minutes ago, Dr.Sack said:

I’m sure Damar would want his brothers to play. 

Bulldog took issue with someone saying this as we shouldn’t assume what someone would want… but anyone who’s ever played team sports at a competitive level knows EXACTLY how they’d want their teammates to respond..

[Buffalo ill]

I highly doubt the game vs NE won't be played.  If the mill I work at doesn't shut down for a severe injury or fatality, I highly doubt the nfl will put the Bills/NE game on hold.

[WotAGuy]

2 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Because it was physically impossible to play the game. Come on. It’s not physically impossible to play the game this weekend, it’s a mentality thing. 

If you really cared about the breadline people you wouldn’t say that.  

[ngbills]

1 hour ago, ArtVandalay said:

So Josh Allen plays the day after his grandmother died.

 

Many other athletes, like Brett Favre played a day after his dad died. 

 

Redskins played 2 days after Sean Taylor died. 

 

The league pushed pause for 1 weekend then resumed after 9/11 attacks.

 

The Bruins played 2 days after the marathon bombing.

 

...but the Bills need 2 weeks off for a teammate that suffered a medical emergency and is alive recovering in the hospital??

 

This is going too far.

 

Feel terrible for Hamlin and wish him a full recovery but spending weeks wallowing in self-pity is not healthy nor appropriate. Awful things happen in the course of life, things we wish never came upon us but that is not for us to decide, all we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us.

It does feel like all the media attention and hours of footage impacted things. 

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

1 hour ago, ArtVandalay said:

So Josh Allen plays the day after his grandmother died.

 

Many other athletes, like Brett Favre played a day after his dad died. 

 

Redskins played 2 days after Sean Taylor died. 

 

The league pushed pause for 1 weekend then resumed after 9/11 attacks.

 

The Bruins played 2 days after the marathon bombing.

 

...but the Bills need 2 weeks off for a teammate that suffered a medical emergency and is alive recovering in the hospital??

 

This is going too far.

 

Feel terrible for Hamlin and wish him a full recovery but spending weeks wallowing in self-pity is not healthy nor appropriate. Awful things happen in the course of life, things we wish never came upon us but that is not for us to decide, all we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to us.

 

 None of those things were witnessed first hand. It's far worse to witness something tragic, than to be told something tragic happened. That's a fact.

 

 

 

[SCBills]

2 minutes ago, LOVEMESOMEBILLS said:

 

 You'd be a terrific spokesman for mental health awareness.👍

 

 

 

Speaking of that .. if they don't play Sunday, .. and this is just my personal view .. I’d really start to get worried about their mental health as a collective and how they’re choosing to respond to this tragedy. 

[WotAGuy]

1 minute ago, SCBills said:

Speaking of that .. if they don't play Sunday, .. and this is just my personal view .. I’d really start to get worried about their mental health as a collective and how they’re choosing to respond to this tragedy. 

If everyone could choose how they respond to tragedy there would be no sadness, no tears, no mourning.

 

Glad you’re able to do that. 

[Mango]

10 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Bulldog took issue with someone saying this as we shouldn’t assume what someone would want… but anyone who’s ever played team sports at a competitive level knows EXACTLY how they’d want their teammates to respond..

So I can speak to this a little bit. I had a teammate almost die at practice. He had a heart attack rowing, his boat flipped when it happened, he was alone and under water. Another teammate jumped out and swam to him.

 

We had some selection to do for the World Cup season. We pushed it off. A few weeks. 
 

That didn’t bother Aaron. 
 

Of course he, and I am sure Damar, would be upset if they forfeited the season. But we’re talking a game that in the grand scheme of things isn’t all that meaningful since they stopped the KC game. 
 

If only a guy on the USNT knew what it was like to be on a competitive team. 
 

Edit: I have 6 national championships. I don’t have any issue giving the Bills the space and freedom that they need to make the best decision for themselves. 

Edited January 5, 2023 by Mango

[UKBillFan]

I really need to sleep, so just to answer the thread title, I think the Bills would forfeit but the Patriots wouldn’t necessarily be given a win. They would stay on 16 games and the play off positions would be worked out on a tiebreak basis.

[Milanos Milano]

3 minutes ago, UKBillFan said:

How about losing out on the Pats game not going to have an overall impact, as it will just be replaced by a play off game anyway - one which would is not guaranteed at the start of the season?

How dare you speak so arrogantly from a level of security. Just because you don’t need the income, doesn’t mean thousands don’t. I’d love to see anyone here live a week in some of these peoples shoes. Maybe you can go a week without a paycheck, but not everyone has that privilege. This is the problem with the world, not everything revolves around elite people when you guys pee on everyone else. The world is more than just 1 person. 

[SCBills]

1 minute ago, WotAGuy said:

If everyone could choose how they respond to tragedy there would be no sadness, no tears, no mourning.

 

Glad you’re able to do that. 

Of course there can be … but you can’t let it consume you. 

[Mango]

1 minute ago, IronMaidenBills said:

How dare you speak so arrogantly from a level of security. Just because you don’t need the income, doesn’t mean thousands don’t. I’d love to see anyone here live a week in some of these peoples shoes. Maybe you can go a week without a paycheck, but not everyone has that privilege. This is the problem with the world, not everything revolves around elite people when you guys pee on everyone else. The world is more than just 1 person. 

So if they don’t play, but Pegula pays them for the game, we cool here? 
 

Or was this really not about the people working at the stadium for you?
 

[UKBillFan]

4 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

How dare you speak so arrogantly from a level of security. Just because you don’t need the income, doesn’t mean thousands don’t. I’d love to see anyone here live a week in some of these peoples shoes. Maybe you can go a week without a paycheck, but not everyone has that privilege. This is the problem with the world, not everything revolves around elite people when you guys pee on everyone else. The world is more than just 1 person. 

If only I was an elite person. 
 

You failed to answer the question.

 

ETA - In fairness, Mango’s response is far better than mine.

Edited January 5, 2023 by UKBillFan

[Milanos Milano]

Just now, Mango said:

So if they don’t play, but Pegula pays them for the game, we cool here? 
 

Or was this really not about the people working at the stadium for you?
 

Sure, if Peg pays for the direct workforce, that would help. What about the indirect workforce? Those that prepare food, those that depend on restaurant tips from the added traffic? 

[Mango]

1 minute ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Sure, if Peg pays for the direct workforce, that would help. What about the indirect workforce? Those that prepare food, those that depend on restaurant tips from the added traffic? 

The Bills need to play because of the economic impact on Erie county. That’s the hill you’re gonna die on?

 

If it gets you to stop rambling about how when men were men, and athletes should be prepared for death, I fully support this conversation. 

[UKBillFan]

1 minute ago, IronMaidenBills said:

Sure, if Peg pays for the direct workforce, that would help. What about the indirect workforce? Those that prepare food, those that depend on restaurant tips from the added traffic? 

That is sadly a risk for companies which rely on a NFL team to such an extent. For example, what must have happened in Oakland when the Raiders moved to Vegas, or what happened in San Diego when the Chargers moved (back) to LA?

[LOVEMESOMEBILLS]

1 minute ago, SCBills said:

Speaking of that .. if they don't play Sunday, .. and this is just my personal view .. I’d really start to get worried about their mental health as a collective and how they’re choosing to respond to this tragedy. 

 

 Every single person responds differently to a traumatic event. Some will he fine, some will not. But to sit here and say this is the correct way and that way it's not, that's not for us to say. And this is just my personal view.....It's nobody's business what the players mental health is, except the team and the people they are close with, you need not worry.

 

 

 

 

 

12 minutes ago, IronMaidenBills said:

How dare you speak so arrogantly from a level of security. Just because you don’t need the income, doesn’t mean thousands don’t. I’d love to see anyone here live a week in some of these peoples shoes. Maybe you can go a week without a paycheck, but not everyone has that privilege. This is the problem with the world, not everything revolves around elite people when you guys pee on everyone else. The world is more than just 1 person. 

 

 Then why are you watching the "elite" play a kids game? And spending time on a forum talking about the "elites"?

 

 

[Milanos Milano]

1 minute ago, UKBillFan said:

That is sadly a risk for companies which rely on a NFL team to such an extent. For example, what must have happened in Oakland when the Raiders moved to Vegas, or what happened in San Diego when the Chargers moved (back) to LA?

It’s not about the companies. It’s about American’s living paycheck to paycheck that have no other options but to work for these companies that rely on a NFL to such an extent. You guys don’t get it, it’s why our country is the way it is. People don’t care about the poor mans situation. Just keep watching more tents pop up, and then wonder why. The world can’t just shutdown. It didn’t shutdown for 9/11 and it isn’t going to shutdown now. Maybe if the economic security was different in this country, I’d be more inclined to say let’s all grieve for a week or 2, but that’s not the reality for most Americans, or most people living on this planet.