Can someone PLEASE explain the holding rules to me like I'm 8?

[MAJBobby]

1 minute ago, Billz4ever said:

If my only job was to call things like this and I'm missing calls this obvious, I would get fired.  These were obvious holds that everyone on TV were watching in real time with refs right there and no call.  They can penalize referee squads and the amount of bad calls in this game seriously warrants such action.

Keep crying and posting your SS.  I bet you are also one that thinks playing in the sun was unfair last week.  End of the day if you are down to complaining about the refs in a very even called football game I dont know what else to tell you

[Big Turk]

Just now, MAJBobby said:

 

Completely agree, specially with the fact the league just puts more and more on these guys instead of using technology to take some off them.  Like for example WHY does the back judge STILL have to look at the play clock.  A simple little Buzzer makes it easy.  Why are they still using taped chains to see about 10 yards.  so much stuff could be offloaded from these guys and the NFL refuses to do it 

 

And are constantly changing the rules and telling officials to emphasize and de-emphasize things during the course of the year...they have a LOT more on their plate that most fans realize.

[Billz4ever]

2 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

For both teams.  Meaning then a level playing field.  Yep give me that because then my better team SHOULD win if there is a level playing field.

No, that's not a "level playing field" because not all penalties are the same and when and where they are called and where they are NOT CALLED makes a huge difference. 

 

You seem to want to defend these refs for a terrible game.  This squad should have disciplinary actions taken against them for such a badly called game.

[Ethan in Cleveland]

1 hour ago, Joe in Winslow said:

I mean, really?

 

I can live with this being a no call. OT has arms on his body and then the DE dips. 

As long as it is called evenly for both teams, I am fine with letting them play.

[MAJBobby]

Just now, Big Turk said:

 

And are constantly changing the rules and telling officials to emphasize and de-emphasize things during the course of the year...they have a LOT more on their plate that most fans realize.

Agree and the fact they are so right so often it is amazing.  I stopped complaining about the Refs long ago because the reality is they are in an impossible situation and 99.9% of the time they nail it.

[Matt_In_NH]

59 minutes ago, CountDorkula said:

How about the roughing the Passer call on Josh Allen late in the game?

 

That's about as ticky tack as it gets, though josh sold it well. 

WHile it was ticky tack....would you also say that about the MIlano late hit where Tua banged his head?  For me these were similar in that for both the defender had the ability not NOT initiate contact after the ball was out but chose to anyway.   That is part of what the NFL has put in to protect the QB's, if you can avoid contact you need to.  For me, both were penalties with how the rule is written and intended.

[MAJBobby]

Just now, Billz4ever said:

No, that's not a "level playing field" because not all penalties are the same and when and where they are called and where they are NOT CALLED makes a huge difference. 

 

You seem to want to defend these refs for a terrible game.  This squad should have disciplinary actions taken against them for such a badly called game.

Sure ok are you crying about the terrible OPI that went against the ravens when they were going into score.  Yes or No?

[Billz4ever]

1 minute ago, MAJBobby said:

Keep crying and posting your SS.  I bet you are also one that thinks playing in the sun was unfair last week.  End of the day if you are down to complaining about the refs in a very even called football game I dont know what else to tell you

LMAO, I post a pic of a clearly obvious hold and this dude is defending the zebras like his Dad is the referee.

[Pokebball]

57 minutes ago, CountDorkula said:

How about the roughing the Passer call on Josh Allen late in the game?

 

That's about as ticky tack as it gets, though josh sold it well. 

It was. But if you have the ability to avoid contact with a QB, a defender is required to. I think the defender showed the ref he could have when he paused. His reengagement and then the hit, grayed the situation and the official decided to then make the call. IMO, the pause and reengagement is what cost the defender the call. And Josh did sell it well, but of course, Josh probably saw the pause and reengagement as well. That's what I want Josh doing in those situations.

[MAJBobby]

1 minute ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

I can live with this being a no call. OT has arms on his body and then the DE dips. 

As long as it is called evenly for both teams, I am fine with letting them play.

And it was called evenly all game 

Just now, Billz4ever said:

LMAO, I post a pic of a clearly obvious hold and this dude is defending the zebras like his Dad is the referee.

So tell me Did they blow the OPI should that have been called yes or no.

[VaMilBill]

1 hour ago, Billz4ever said:

and this

 

 

The crazy thing about this no call is it wasn’t lost in the sauce. It was a one-on-one in open field, near the QB, with Lamar holding the ball. That’s a layup holding call that they missed

Edited October 3, 2022 by VaMilBill

[Big Turk]

1 hour ago, CountDorkula said:

How about the roughing the Passer call on Josh Allen late in the game?

 

That's about as ticky tack as it gets, though josh sold it well. 

 

Made up for the non-call for a hit on a defenseless receiver on McKenzie when Ja'Quan Johnson gets flagged for it last week on a play where he clearly is attempting to pull up, turns his body to minimize contact and doesn't hit him in the head, all while Edmonds is moving forward while falling down meaning the contact was pretty much unavoidable. If Ja'Quan gets called for that, how does the hit on McKenzie not qualify?

[Billz4ever]

1 minute ago, MAJBobby said:

And it was called evenly all game 

So tell me Did they blow the OPI should that have been called yes or no.

Sorry, but pointing to another call is not a valid defense of an obvious hold not called.

[Big Turk]

5 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

Agree and the fact they are so right so often it is amazing.  I stopped complaining about the Refs long ago because the reality is they are in an impossible situation and 99.9% of the time they nail it.

 

The only thing I would like to see a little bit better is more consistency between crews.  Like some will call DPI and defensive holding more than other crews while those crews will call offensive holding more than them...

 

It's kind of like almost learning the official crews and their tendencies going into the games to let you know what you can get away with and what you will get flagged for.  

 

But I guess it's no different than umpire strike zones and how they al are somewhat different and pitchers and hitters have to know what is going to get called and what won't.

 

The game that really irritated me with that was the KC-Buffalo AFCG where KC defenders basically were committing a defensive penalty almost every play against our WR's and nothing was being called. Kinda like they pulled that out from the Legion of Boom days in Seattle where they used to do the same thing because they knew eventually the refs would stop calling them.

Edited October 3, 2022 by Big Turk

[MAJBobby]

2 minutes ago, Billz4ever said:

Sorry, but pointing to another call is not a valid defense of an obvious hold not called.

So did the Refs make the correct call on that OPI yes or no.  That is the question why wont you answer it?

[Teddy KGB]

8 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

Keep crying and posting your SS.  I bet you are also one that thinks playing in the sun was unfair last week.  End of the day if you are down to complaining about the refs in a very even called football game I dont know what else to tell you

don you have any photo links to share or are you going to keep telling stories ? 

[Jauronimo]

5 minutes ago, Pokebball said:

It was. But if you have the ability to avoid contact with a QB, a defender is required to. I think the defender showed the ref he could have when he paused. His reengagement and then the hit, grayed the situation and the official decided to then make the call. IMO, the pause and reengagement is what cost the defender the call. And Josh did sell it well, but of course, Josh probably saw the pause and reengagement as well. That's what I want Josh doing in those situations.

Josh took a number of hits which were 50/50 calls on being late.  I think the entire second half was a makeup call campaign that screwed the Ravens.  

[MAJBobby]

1 minute ago, Big Turk said:

 

The only thing I would like to see a little bit better is more consistency between crews.  Like some will call DPI and defensive holding more than other crews while those crews will call offensive holding more than them...

 

It's kind of like almost learning the official crews and their tendencies going into the games to let you know what you can get away with and what you will get flagged for.  

 

But I guess it's no different than umpire strike zones and how they al are somewhat different and pitchers and hitters have to know what is going to get called and what won't.

Yep as long as humans are involved to get total consistency is hard.  Also you ever notice the amount of missed holds during games has gone up the more the NFL puts on the Head Ref in terms of QB Safety?  Maybe it is time to add to crews as well.  Hard to have the one guy that is responsible for the line play also be the sole guy responsible for all the QB safety and QB penalty stuff.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

1 minute ago, Jauronimo said:

Josh took a number of hits which were 50/50 calls on being late.  I think the entire second half was a makeup call campaign that screwed the Ravens.  

Which is equally sucky. Don't know why it's so hard to call the easy ones and so easy to call the bad ones

 

[MAJBobby]

2 minutes ago, Teddy KGB said:

don you have any photo links to share or are you going to keep telling stories ? 

I will keep having conversations.  Try it sometime.

My Biggest complaint with the Refs will remain blowing the call not ONCE but doing it again in REPLAY.  

 

Lamar easily had that 1st down, now it didnt matter they got it on 4th and 1.  But when you have two looks at something and STILL get it wrong that is the problem.  And why anytime anyone mentions challenging the SPOT I scream NO.  They NEVER change spots in review even it is clearly should be.

[Billz4ever]

12 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

Sure ok are you crying about the terrible OPI that went against the ravens when they were going into score.  Yes or No?

Why are you defending such a badly called game?  Which zebra is your relative?

[MAJBobby]

Just now, Billz4ever said:

Why are you defending such a badly called game?  Which zebra is your relative?

Yes or No.

 

Was the an OPI when ravens were driving for a score?

[Billz4ever]

Just now, MAJBobby said:

Yes or No.

 

Was the an OPI when ravens were driving for a score?

I've said at least 3 times now it was a horribly called game.  You seem to not be wanting to take yes for an answer for some reason and just keep defending the zebras.

[Teddy KGB]

4 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

I will keep having conversations.  Try it sometime.

My Biggest complaint with the Refs will remain blowing the call not ONCE but doing it again in REPLAY.  

 

Lamar easily had that 1st down, now it didnt matter they got it on 4th and 1.  But when you have two looks at something and STILL get it wrong that is the problem.  And why anytime anyone mentions challenging the SPOT I scream NO.  They NEVER change spots in review even it is clearly should be.

Not a fan of pointless conversations.    People show you evidence of holding and your answer is basically so what (dawkins might have held someone)   
 

Those are holds and the flag should be thrown period.  
 

 

[MAJBobby]

Just now, Billz4ever said:

I've said at least 3 times now it was a horribly called game.  You seem to not be wanting to take yes for an answer for some reason and just keep defending the zebras.

Ok so it was a blown call thank you.

 

Now I think that blown call offsets your hold complaint.  So again blown calls occur that is normal in this league that refuses to really help their officials.  

 

Bottomline the game was called consistently and rules were applied consistently to both teams.  

 

1 minute ago, Teddy KGB said:

Not a fan of pointless conversations.    People show you evidence of holding and your answer is basically so what (dawkins might have held someone)   
 

Those are holds and the flag should be thrown period.  
 

 

So you want 30 penalties a game again?  You want EVERY HOLD called?  

 

I dont get people.  These refs applied the rules consistently to both teams and yet here they are complaining yet again, then again probably the same people that complained about having to play in the sun Sunday.

[Billsatlastin2018]

For sure, there was a hold on the left side on the 4th. Down INT! I believe that was in the first pic. Seen the play many times- obvious out in the middle of the field play.

[Pokebball]

8 minutes ago, Jauronimo said:

Josh took a number of hits which were 50/50 calls on being late.  I think the entire second half was a makeup call campaign that screwed the Ravens.  

Ravens were playing physical and aggressive all game. They could have had more calls against them, for sure.

[Billz4ever]

Just now, MAJBobby said:

Ok so it was a blown call thank you.

 

Now I think that blown call offsets your hold complaint.  So again blown calls occur that is normal in this league that refuses to really help their officials.  

 

Bottomline the game was called consistently and rules were applied consistently to both teams.  

 

There's no such thing as "offsets".  Offsetting penalties are only when penalties occur by both teams on the same play.  Penalties, depending on when called, can have much greater impact on the game then others.

 

According to you apparently, they are all the same.  They are not.

 

You've backed yourself into a corner now defending a horribly called game and your only response is to now say they just "offset" each other, when nothing could be further from the truth.

 

I expect better from NFL-level officiating.

[MAJBobby]

Just now, Pokebball said:

Ravens were playing physical and aggressive all game. They could have had more calls against them, for sure.

What i did notice on the Josh Slides the Ravens still where able to get to make contact with Josh with their knees.  If you look at every slide there was a drive by knee near the head area like it has been practiced over there.

[Teddy KGB]

4 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

Ok so it was a blown call thank you.

 

Now I think that blown call offsets your hold complaint.  So again blown calls occur that is normal in this league that refuses to really help their officials.  

 

Bottomline the game was called consistently and rules were applied consistently to both teams.  

 

So you want 30 penalties a game again?  You want EVERY HOLD called?  

 

I dont get people.  These refs applied the rules consistently to both teams and yet here they are complaining yet again, then again probably the same people that complained about having to play in the sun Sunday.

yes, if there’s a blatant hold it should be called 

 

idk about this every play there’s holding story 🤷🏼‍♂️

[MAJBobby]

Just now, Billz4ever said:

There's no such thing as "offsets".  Offsetting penalties are only when penalties occur by both teams on the same play.  Penalties, depending on when called, can have much greater impact on the game then others.

 

According to you apparently, they are all the same.  They are not.

 

You've backed yourself into a corner now defending a horribly called game and your only response is to now say they just "offset" each other, when nothing could be further from the truth.

 

I expect better from NFL-level officiating.

I am sorry are you new to the NFL.

 

Did you also cry for a week about the heat in Miami?

Just now, Teddy KGB said:

yes, if there’s a blatant hold it should be called 

 

idk about this every play there’s holding story 🤷🏼‍♂️

Fingers closed on pads inside or outside frame is a Hold (by the rule so yep EVERY PLAY)

[Billz4ever]

5 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

Ok so it was a blown call thank you.

 

Now I think that blown call offsets your hold complaint.  So again blown calls occur that is normal in this league that refuses to really help their officials.  

 

Bottomline the game was called consistently and rules were applied consistently to both teams.  

 

LMAO, you've been provided undisputable evidence of holding and you're claiming rules were applied consistently.  

 

The only thing you've managed to accomplish here is to defend zebras for a horrible called game.

 

I'm still waiting for you to admit who your relative is on that squad.

[LABILLBACKER]

Booger and his crew have been fools for years. That blatant hold before Poyers pick was egregious. There are Angel Hernandez's scattered all over the NFL.

[MAJBobby]

Just now, Billz4ever said:

LMAO, you've been provided undisputable evidence of holding and you're claiming rules were applied consistently.  

 

The only thing you've managed to accomplish here is to defend zebras for a horrible called game.

 

I'm still waiting for you to admit who your relative is on that squad.

I personally dont need too.  So again back to crying about the refs, it is just like you crying about the sun last week.  

 

Guess what will happen tonight (missed calls) guess what will happen every game this yar (missed calls) 

[Scott7975]

1 hour ago, Joe in Winslow said:

Bob, really.

 

That's BLATANT, it's a chokehold!

 

 

I dont know either but I see those arm bars  go uncalled all the time and more egregious ones than that.  It happens in like every game across the league.

 

I never really care about the refs as long as they are calling/not calling things the same both ways.

Edited October 3, 2022 by Scott7975

[Billz4ever]

2 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

I am sorry are you new to the NFL.

 

Did you also cry for a week about the heat in Miami?

Fingers closed on pads inside or outside frame is a Hold (by the rule so yep EVERY PLAY)

I never said a word about the heat in Miami, and better yet, defended it as a case of one team being acclimatized better than the other.

 

Now, it's quite obvious you're willing to just make crap up as you go.

 

You're now doubling down on a horribly called game. Hilarious.

[TheFunPolice]

IMO, there's holding on every play and the refs will generally not call it if it's a key moment in the game.

 

 

[Billz4ever]

1 minute ago, MAJBobby said:

I personally dont need too.  So again back to crying about the refs, it is just like you crying about the sun last week.  

 

Guess what will happen tonight (missed calls) guess what will happen every game this yar (missed calls) 

I love getting to mute people who decide to double down on their own stupidity.

 

When you're defending the zebras for a terrible game of officiating, time to do a little self-reflection.

[LABILLBACKER]

1 hour ago, MAJBobby said:

Sure. 
 

holding can be called on every NFL play. Is that the type Of football you want to watch?  

Yes....the more a team gets called (punished) for it, the less they'll do it.  I want a fair and equitable game. I don't give a rats ass how long it takes to get fixed.  Or eliminate the rule altogether and let everyone hold.

[Robert Paulson]

39 minutes ago, MAJBobby said:

Penalties 

 

Bills 4 (31 yards)

Ravens 9 (70 yards).

 

 

and the ravens could have been called for at least 6 more