SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 https://www.yahoo.com/sports/a-better-onside-kick-expanded-reviews-a-look-at-nf-ls-proposed-rule-changes-for-2020-204453957.html A better onside kick? Expanded reviews? A look at NFL's proposed rule changes for 2020 Of those proposals, the most extreme is the Eagles’ suggestion of an alternative to the onside kick. The Eagles would like a second option for teams looking to retain the ball while trailing late in the game. That alternative could include a team having to convert on “4th-and-15 from the kicking team’s 25-yard line.” If the team converts, they would get the ball on the 40-yard line. The team would still have to drive 60 yards downfield to score a touchdown in that scenario, which is similar to where a team would recover an onside kick. ummmm if you convert the 4th-and-15 one has to assume the ball gets past the 40. So... you get penalized however many yards extra you make? What if they actually score a TD? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProcessYaDigg Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 Yeah, I don't agree with this at all. It's so bad in so many ways. I do see your point about them potentially gaining more than 15 yards. And then on the flip side, if they don't convert, then the returning team will get the ball on their opponents 25 yard line. Typically, whether an onside kick is successful or not, the team who recovers the ball generally has it near the 40-yard line to mid-field. If they're going to go away from the onside kick, then they need to come up with another scenario for this. Either way, just keep the onside kick. It's pretty uncommon to see an injury happen during an onside kick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2020 Our Year For Sure Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Circlethewagon8404 said: Yeah, I don't agree with this at all. It's so bad in so many ways. I do see your point about them potentially gaining more than 15 yards. And then on the flip side, if they don't convert, then the returning team will get the ball on their opponents 25 yard line. Typically, whether an onside kick is successful or not, the team who recovers the ball generally has it near the 40-yard line to mid-field. If they're going to go away from the onside kick, then they need to come up with another scenario for this. Either way, just keep the onside kick. It's pretty uncommon to see an injury happen during an onside kick. The onside kick conversion percentage has gotten too low because of the safety rules, I'm sure that's why the Eagles want an alternative. How do you convert an onside kick with your guys evenly spaced out across the field and with them not moving until the ball is kicked? The only chance is for the opponent to badly misplay the ball, it's too rare. Edited March 11, 2020 by 2020 Our Year For Sure 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 9 minutes ago, 2020 Our Year For Sure said: The only chance is for the opponent to badly misplay the ball, it's too rare. Have they figured out a way to clone Leodis? ? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCOrange Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 34 minutes ago, Circlethewagon8404 said: Yeah, I don't agree with this at all. It's so bad in so many ways. I do see your point about them potentially gaining more than 15 yards. And then on the flip side, if they don't convert, then the returning team will get the ball on their opponents 25 yard line. Typically, whether an onside kick is successful or not, the team who recovers the ball generally has it near the 40-yard line to mid-field. If they're going to go away from the onside kick, then they need to come up with another scenario for this. Either way, just keep the onside kick. It's pretty uncommon to see an injury happen during an onside kick. As someone else mentioned, this proposal has nothing to do with the safety of onside kicks. It's about giving teams a chance to come back since onside kicks basically don't work anymore. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rc2catch Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 I would support a change to onside kicks at the end of the game. I think the trick is a scenario with pre determined ball spot. Maybe instead of an onside kick just do a 4th and goal from the 15. Score you get the ball on the 40, don’t score and the defending team gets the ball. Or how about some real fun? Instead of a kickoff how about a punt with no return? Have to coffin corner it between the goal line and 10 yard line? Defending team can rush everyone since there’s no return possible. Bring some significance to the punter position. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve O Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 (edited) Another problem with the 4th and 15 is PI and really any other penalties. An inadvertent touching more than 5 yards down the field and a 5 yard penalty becomes and automatic first down. As to minimizing the effect of the coin flip in overtime, I'd replace it with a scrum? Edited March 11, 2020 by Steve O Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Joshin' Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 (edited) Not a fan of 4th and 15. The folks here have pointed out some issues and there are most likely many unintended consequences. Just make the kicking team declare an onside kick and revert to old rules. Minimizes risk but keeps the opportunity. Edited March 11, 2020 by Just Joshin' 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Never NEVER Give-up Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 That's it?!?!?! The Chargers, Ravens, Fish & Eagles have the only recommendations? How about clarify the rules around fielding kick-offs. The more I thought about it, the more I think the Bills were screwed out of a TD against Houston in the playoff game. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg S Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 The one kicking rule I could see the NFL going to is the way the XFL does kickoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CountDorkula Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 1 hour ago, Steve O said: Another problem with the 4th and 15 is PI and really any other penalties. An inadvertent touching more than 5 yards down the field and a 5 yard penalty becomes and automatic first down. As to minimizing the effect of the coin flip in overtime, I'd replace it with a scrum? Make DPI 15 yards only instead of a spot foul. Get rid of all automatic first down penalties. If its 3rd and 10 and you get a defensive hold it becomes 3rd and 5 and a retry of down not an auto first down. this ***** seems pretty easy IMO. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewEra Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 Are the ravens and chargers the only coherent FO in the league? They propose that another official be added to the booth as an “eye in the sky” utilizing the technology that we have. This is what I’ve been saying on this board since HD became relevant. Get an official in front of a tv with multiple camera angle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CountDorkula Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 2 minutes ago, NewEra said: Are the ravens and chargers the only coherent FO in the league? They propose that another official be added to the booth as an “eye in the sky” utilizing the technology that we have. This is what I’ve been saying on this board since HD became relevant. Get an official in front of a tv with multiple camera angle The XFL did it first so teh NFL wont do it. The NFL has to have it be their idea or they wont even consider it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted March 11, 2020 Author Share Posted March 11, 2020 2 hours ago, Circlethewagon8404 said: Yeah, I don't agree with this at all. It's so bad in so many ways. I do see your point about them potentially gaining more than 15 yards. And then on the flip side, if they don't convert, then the returning team will get the ball on their opponents 25 yard line. Typically, whether an onside kick is successful or not, the team who recovers the ball generally has it near the 40-yard line to mid-field. If they're going to go away from the onside kick, then they need to come up with another scenario for this. Either way, just keep the onside kick. It's pretty uncommon to see an injury happen during an onside kick. The receiving team is "punished" like you said because they usually recover the ball at their 40 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaryPinC Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 WRT 4th and 15 from 25 yard line, would the kickoff-receiving team EVER agree to allow the team that just scored to keep it for this? Unfair in that regard, making it a nonstarter IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyanC883 Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 (edited) I like the rule changes. Sure, the onside alternative needs a few tweaks (give the offense the ball wherever the play ends if they convert); give the D the ball at the 40 if the offense fails. But otherwise, most of the rule changes appear positive. I'd love to see this. Perhaps 4th and 20 is better. They could take the conversation rate for a 3rd and whatever distance and match it to the historical onside kick recovery rate to find the proper distance. Edited March 11, 2020 by RyanC883 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted March 11, 2020 Author Share Posted March 11, 2020 IIRC they wanted to allow this in the Pro Bowl? Did either team try it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted March 11, 2020 Author Share Posted March 11, 2020 1 hour ago, NewEra said: Are the ravens and chargers the only coherent FO in the league? They propose that another official be added to the booth as an “eye in the sky” utilizing the technology that we have. This is what I’ve been saying on this board since HD became relevant. Get an official in front of a tv with multiple camera angle 1 hour ago, CountDorkula said: The XFL did it first so teh NFL wont do it. The NFL has to have it be their idea or they wont even consider it. idea of a booth umpire, sometimes referred to as a "sky judge," has circulated in the NFL for years. Discussion intensified in 2019, when all 32 head coaches asked owners to consider adding it as a backstop to inaccurate calls on the fields. League leaders, however, did not think they could identify and hire 17 qualified sky judges in short notice last year. Instead, owners voted to add pass interference calls and non-calls to their list of reviewable plays. https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/28878759/two-nfl-teams-propose-adding-sky-judge-officiating-crews 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo03 Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 5 hours ago, SlimShady'sGhost said: https://www.yahoo.com/sports/a-better-onside-kick-expanded-reviews-a-look-at-nf-ls-proposed-rule-changes-for-2020-204453957.html A better onside kick? Expanded reviews? A look at NFL's proposed rule changes for 2020 Of those proposals, the most extreme is the Eagles’ suggestion of an alternative to the onside kick. The Eagles would like a second option for teams looking to retain the ball while trailing late in the game. That alternative could include a team having to convert on “4th-and-15 from the kicking team’s 25-yard line.” If the team converts, they would get the ball on the 40-yard line. The team would still have to drive 60 yards downfield to score a touchdown in that scenario, which is similar to where a team would recover an onside kick. ummmm if you convert the 4th-and-15 one has to assume the ball gets past the 40. So... you get penalized however many yards extra you make? What if they actually score a TD? I love this rule but yeah, I agree if the team converts they should get the ball from wherever the play ended and if they score a TD, it should count 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wagon127 Posted March 11, 2020 Share Posted March 11, 2020 For overtime, the team who is receiving it should be determined at the start of the game. That would change how teams play the 4th quarter, and decide if they want to play for overtime, or play to win in regulation. I say whoever receives the opening 1st half kickoff, gets the ball in OT to start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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