Covid-19 discussion and humor thread [Was: CDC says don't touch your face to avoid Covid19...Vets to the rescue!

[Hapless Bills Fan]

50 minutes ago, BillsFan4 said:

That 15 day period he is referring to is the “national pause” he called for a few days ago (that 1/2 the country isn’t even following)

 

I hope he’s not saying that he plans to lift any “stay at home” orders at the end of the 15 days because of what it’s doing to the economy.

 

Not sure what else he means by “we can’t let the cure be worse than the problem itself”. The way I read it is he’s losing patience with what this pause is doing to the economy. Hope I’m wrong on that.

 

Minor correction: to my knowledge, Trump has not issued any "stay at home" orders.  Do you mean he would lift those that states and localities have imposed?

I'm not sure he can do that, but it would be incredibly ironic if he invoked emergency powers he has not used FOR the public health, to cancel public health measures.

 

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

18 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

Oh yeah I get it (on paper). I just see no ability for us to bite off what needs to be done on testing and tracking...followed by a nearly national lockdown of 3 weeks. This current shutdown is a joke. I'll just keep saying it: Boston is STILL mostly open.

 

And yet somehow, smaller nations have managed to put what needs to be done, in place within weeks, on a coordinated national level.
Singapore:

https://www.cnet.com/news/singapores-coronavirus-playbook-how-one-country-fought-back-against-covid19-epidemic/
 

Taiwan:

 

 

 

 

 

[BillsFan4]

19 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Minor correction: to my knowledge, Trump has not issued any "stay at home" orders.  Do you mean he would lift those that states and localities have imposed?

I'm not sure he can do that, but it would be incredibly ironic if he invoked emergency powers he has not used FOR the public health, to cancel public health measures.

 

 

 

No, I meant the “15 day pause” he called for. I don’t think he would lift state and local orders.

 

But if he’s telling people it’s ok to go out and/or back to work, it’s going to be a lot harder to get people to stay home and follow local/state guidelines (though they won’t have a choice if their work isn’t open I guess). 

 

I just look at what happened when he finally started to take this thing serious just over a week ago. You saw a big shift in the national attitude. People finally started taking this thing seriously. You saw a lot less talk about “this is just an average flu”, etc.

The president’s words carry a lot of weight. 

 

 

I think they are gearing up to send people back to work:

 

Quote

The White House has already been showing some signs of loosening its response to the pandemic. On Sunday, Vice President Pence, who leads the coronavirus task force, said the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention will soon issue guidance allowing people exposed to the coronavirus to return to work sooner by wearing a mask for a period of time.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-signals-growing-weariness-with-social-distancing-and-other-steps-advocated-by-health-officials/2020/03/23/0920ea0a-6cfc-11ea-a3ec-70d7479d83f0_story.html

 

even if it’s not an order, just encouraging businesses to open and call employees back is going to have a big impact on the decision a lot of businesses/employees make.

Edited March 23, 2020 by BillsFan4

[Royale with Cheese]

You don’t say.

 

https://fox8.com/news/college-students-in-florida-test-positive-for-coronavirus-after-spring-break-trip/

[Hapless Bills Fan]

[Hapless Bills Fan]

20 minutes ago, BillsFan4 said:

No, I meant the “15 day pause” he called for. I don’t think he would lift state and local orders.

 

But if he’s telling people it’s ok to go out and/or back to work, it’s going to be a lot harder to get people to stay home and follow local/state guidelines (though they won’t have a choice if their work isn’t open I guess). 

 

I just look at what happened when he finally started to take this thing serious just over a week ago. You saw a big shift in the national attitude. People finally started taking this thing seriously. You saw a lot less talk about “this is just an average flu”, etc.

The president’s words carry a lot of weight. 

 

 

I think they are gearing up to send people back to work:

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-signals-growing-weariness-with-social-distancing-and-other-steps-advocated-by-health-officials/2020/03/23/0920ea0a-6cfc-11ea-a3ec-70d7479d83f0_story.html

 

even if it’s not an order, just encouraging businesses to open and call employees back is going to have a big impact on the decision a lot of businesses/employees make.

 

You are absolutely correct about the influence of what national leadership says, both on local/state leadership and on individuals.

 

If you are correct and Trump does this without a coherent testing and contact-tracing plan in place, it seems inevitable it will accelerate the exponential growth of both cases and deaths. 

[BillsFan4]

5 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

You are absolutely correct about the influence of what national leadership says, both on local/state leadership and on individuals.

 

If you are correct and Trump does this without a coherent testing and contact-tracing plan in place, it will propegate the spread of the disease IMO.

Yeah If that’s what does happen I’m hoping that there will be a wide spread testing/tracing/isolation plan in place by then like S. Korea has. 

 

It may not even be an option in 2 weeks (going back to work) if the infection rates keep climbing at the rate they are now. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

19 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

I don't think that's an "O."

 

Well of course it isn't, I'm just doing that trained scientist caveat thing.

Here's a feature piece on the availability of hospital care to rural Americans:
https://www.kansascity.com/news/coronavirus/article241376141.html?fbclid=IwAR0SgCS26B-jfDdrkULloEQlzRbCm_Pqw5n_2xqQYAPdRAAN_h30xACBPu4
 

Key quotes:
"In Johnson County, the most populous and affluent county in Kansas, officials announced testing would be reduced because it had reached the point where the virus was spreading by community transmission. That move was aimed at preserving the limited test kits. The Kansas Department of Health and Environment said Friday that the state’s supply was “precariously low” and could run out over the weekend."

That is just bass-ackwards. When the virus is spreading by community transmission, that's when you MOST need tests and contact tracking and more tests....

 

"After decades of declining population, many parts of Kansas and Missouri are left with few or no hospitals to treat patients suffering from COVID-19.

 

Eleven of Kansas’ 105 counties have no hospital at all, according to a data analysis released Friday by Kaiser Health News. The picture is even more grim in Missouri, where 44 of the state’s 114 counties are without a hospital.

 

And more than half the counties in both states have no ICU beds, the analysis found."

 

It's not just declining population.  It's Insurance availability and Medicaid reimbursement rates that don't come close to covering cost of care, so more and more hospitals in these areas can't accept it - plus of course lack of Medicaid expansion.  The need is there, but the hospitals can't keep their doors open.

 

But anyway, point is ..... if we lift stay-at-home orders without a coherent testing and contact tracing plan in place, the disease will inevitably spread across the country further than it has, into rural counties.  And most of the population of these counties are older, and many have co-morbid conditions (diabetes, high blood pressure, emphysema etc)

 

 

[Foxx]

MA and MI just mandated stay at home orders for their states.

[K-9]

1 hour ago, BillsFan4 said:

No, I meant the “15 day pause” he called for. I don’t think he would lift state and local orders.

 

But if he’s telling people it’s ok to go out and/or back to work, it’s going to be a lot harder to get people to stay home and follow local/state guidelines (though they won’t have a choice if their work isn’t open I guess). 

 

I just look at what happened when he finally started to take this thing serious just over a week ago. You saw a big shift in the national attitude. People finally started taking this thing seriously. You saw a lot less talk about “this is just an average flu”, etc.

The president’s words carry a lot of weight. 

 

 

I think they are gearing up to send people back to work:

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-signals-growing-weariness-with-social-distancing-and-other-steps-advocated-by-health-officials/2020/03/23/0920ea0a-6cfc-11ea-a3ec-70d7479d83f0_story.html

 

even if it’s not an order, just encouraging businesses to open and call employees back is going to have a big impact on the decision a lot of businesses/employees make.

I have to wonder if this directive traveled from the CDC up or from the White House down. Because Redfield, as brilliant an epidemiologist as he is, is also one of the most feckless people in charge of any department involved in the effort to combat the pandemic. I get the impression he doesn’t want to upset his boss, Alex Azar.

[Sundancer]

35 minutes ago, K-9 said:

I have to wonder if this directive traveled from the CDC up or from the White House down. Because Redfield, as brilliant an epidemiologist as he is, is also one of the most feckless people in charge of any department involved in the effort to combat the pandemic. I get the impression he doesn’t want to upset his boss, Alex Azar.

 

Like Hapless mentioned, if we are going to punt on test and track, the least we can do is make sure we don't re-open until docs and nurses have masks, gowns, and more ventilator options, and there's a clear plan for where sick people should report to when they need medical help (CV wards).

 

Re-opening now is saying to millions of Americans who will die, "Oh well" and it's saying to healthcare workers, "Good luck with your underwear masks." Reopening when we are a little more prepared is just about saying the same but at least we can give the healthcare workers a little protection. 

 

Edited March 23, 2020 by Sundancer

[K-9]

1 minute ago, Sundancer said:

 

Like Hapless mentioned, if we are going to punt on test and track, the least we can do is make sure we don't re-open until docs and nurses have masks, gowns, and more ventilator options, and there's a clear plan for where sick people should report to when they need medical help (CV wards).

 

Re-opening now is saying to millions of Americans who will die, "Oh well" and it's saying to healthcare workers, "Good luck to you." Reopening when we are a little more prepared is just about saying the same but at least we can give the healthcare workers a little protection. 

 

Which is why I can’t t believe this was conceived and okd at the CDC; it’s counter to their mission. Politics reigns. 

[Sundancer]

My wife works for a local hospital. They are offering $5000 if she can refer someone who will come fill any one of many healthcare positions. That's how freaked out they are over the impact of the bodies coming and the impact on their staff getting sick. 

Edited March 23, 2020 by Sundancer

[Steptide]

25 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

My wife works for a local hospital. They are offering $5000 if she can refer someone who will come fill any one of many healthcare positions. That's how freaked out they are over the impact of the bodies coming and the impact on their staff getting sick. 

There's been some mentions on fox news today of a nation wide shut down. They should've done this 2 weeks ago. Instead they're slowly shutting down state by state, but this, if anything is just prolonging the inevitable. Just shut it all down, get past this thing and get back to life as usual 

Edited March 23, 2020 by Steptide

[Wacka]

My B-I-L is an interstate trucker for one of the freight lines.  He told me Saturday  that  Illinois is locked down like NY but  Indiana and Ohio are still wide open.

[BillsFan4]

Came across this. I have no idea how accurate it is.

 

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30566-3/fulltext

“Clinical course and risk factors for mortality of adult inpatients with COVID-19 in Wuhan, China: a retrospective cohort study”

 

[Foxx]

25 minutes ago, Steptide said:

There's been some mentions on fox news today of a nation wide shut down. They should've done this 2 weeks ago. Instead they're slowly shutting down state by state, but this, if anything is just prolonging the inevitable. Just shut it all down, get past this thing and get back to life as usual 

i believe the incremental shutdown of the nation was done with an eye towards preventing all out chaos (you have to inch people along so they accept certain/most/all things). however, i do think we have now breached the Rubicon to where the anxiety level is manageable enough to just shut it all down now.

 

regarding getting back to, 'life as usual', i am afraid that that is going to take years. and in some respects, we will not be returning to Kansas, ever.

Edited March 23, 2020 by Foxx

[BillsFan4]

 

[Doc Brown]

Remember the good old days when this thing was only in China and it was just funny.

[BillsFan4]

 

[May Day 10]

I have to say, my anxiety level on all this peaked about 3 days ago and has receded to pre-3/11 levels (that Wednesday was when I started to freak out, well before my friends and family).

 

Part of it (maybe a large part) is I know 3-5 people who currently have it.  Only 1 of them counts toward the 30,000 or whoever has it in the US (and Erie County).  They are for the most part very fine and just recuperating at home.  A little bit of familiarity makes it less scary and is a reminder that this is not a doomsday virus.  I feel like the hospitalization and mortality rate are likely a lot lesser than what we have been conditioned to accept.  Other than celebrities and politicians, the people who are getting tested are those with severe symptoms for the most part.  

 

Now I understand everything that goes into a desperate need to flatten the curve and how we need to curb the load on medical facilities.  Also the fact that it is a serious ailment in many patients.  

 

We are going to be under lockdown and things will get weird (and probably a bit crazy/frightening over the next 2 weeks).  But it will pass.  Lots of minds are working towards treatments, testing etc.  The economy will be there for us on the back side of it.  

 

[Foxx]

Oregon has now issued a, 'stay at home' order.

Edited March 23, 2020 by Foxx

[Sundancer]

 

I'll take any ray of sunshine. 

 

Question for you or anyone who might know. What is the mass availability of some of these? 

 

Let's assume just here in the US of A (ignoring the worldwide cases), we are soon at a rate of tens of thousands of people needing treatment a day, over a course of days, is there anything on hand to meet that demand? Assuming the answer is "no" as I assume it will be, do you have insight into when it would be available to keep up with such demand? I've looked online about the malaria meds and those can come fast but not in huge quantities for several weeks. These I imagine would take more time but I am not sure. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

27 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

 

I'll take any ray of sunshine. 

 

Question for you or anyone who might know. What is the mass availability of some of these? 

 

Let's assume just here in the US of A (ignoring the worldwide cases), we are soon at a rate of tens of thousands of people needing treatment a day, over a course of days, is there anything on hand to meet that demand? Assuming the answer is "no" as I assume it will be, do you have insight into when it would be available to keep up with such demand? I've looked online about the malaria meds and those can come fast but not in huge quantities for several weeks. These I imagine would take more time but I am not sure. 

 

Chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine are common antimalarials.  Hydroxychloroquine is also used to treat inflammatory diseases such as Lupus.  These are relatively inexpensive drugs, manufactured by several companies in multiple locations - more abroad than in US but 2 plants here (I think).  Production could ramp up fairly quickly, but in "drug terms" fairly quickly means ~ a month.  Assuming the supply chain is good (ie that raw materials are available - unknown)

 

If it turns out to be part of the magic bullet, azythromycin is also a generic antibiotic now, and production (given supply chain) could be ramped up fairly quickly.

 

Tens of thousands?  That will be a stretch, even for these common drugs - it could be done, but it would require basically a coordinated National effort to repurpose drug manufacturing lines, open up shuttered plants, etc etc etc. - for drug companies, it would mean shuttering high-profit lines to turn out critical, low-profit drugs.  We've done things like this before with polio vaccine, penicillin etc but it requires careful planning and direction at the national level to ensure other needed drugs don't go short.

 

Some of the other drugs being looked at (Remdesivir) are experimental - there's a Phase III manufacturing process for it, which means it could be transferred to a number of appropriate plants if there isn't someone currently producing it.  But that would take longer, purely from the get equipment-install equipment-validate equipment- etc dance that safe pharmaceutical manufacture requires.

 

There are a couple drugs being looked at in Chinese clinical trials I just don't know much about - Favipirovir (or Favilavir) - it's an influenza drug manufactured in Japan, and has undergone Phase III trials here, but I don't think it was ever approved because of unacceptable incidence of birth defects.  It's an approved medicine in China and Japan, and it's a small molecule, so manufacture should transfer but this would take longer - it's not just red tape, it's a matter of making sure the right equipment is in the right sequence and performing up to spec.  I believe there's a petition underway to make it available on a "compassionate use" basis in the US. 

 

 

 

[Gray Beard]

1 minute ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine are common antimalarials.  Hydroxychloroquine is also used to treat inflammatory diseases such as Lupus.  These are relatively inexpensive drugs, manufactured by several companies in multiple locations - more abroad than in US but 2 plants here (I think).  Production could ramp up fairly quickly, but in "drug terms" fairly quickly means ~ a month.  Assuming the supply chain is good (ie that raw materials are available - unknown)

 

If it turns out to be part of the magic bullet, azythromycin is also a generic antibiotic now, and production (given supply chain) could be ramped up fairly quickly.

 

Tens of thousands?  That will be a stretch, even for these common drugs - it could be done, but it would require basically a coordinated National effort to repurpose drug manufacturing lines, open up shuttered plants, etc etc etc. - for drug companies, it would mean shuttering high-profit lines to turn out critical, low-profit drugs.  We've done things like this before with polio vaccine, penicillin etc but it requires careful planning and direction at the national level to ensure other needed drugs don't go short.

 

Some of the other drugs being looked at (Remdesivir) are experimental - there's a Phase III manufacturing process for it, which means it could be transferred to a number of appropriate plants if there isn't someone currently producing it.

 

There are a couple drugs being looked at in Chinese clinical trials I just don't know much about - Favipirovir (or Favilavir) - it's an influenza drug manufactured in Japan, and has undergone Phase III trials here, but I don't think it was ever approved because of unacceptable incidence of birth defects.  It's an approved medicine in China and Japan, and it's a small molecule, so manufacture should transfer but this would take longer - it's not just red tape, it's a matter of making sure the right equipment is in the right sequence and performing up to spec.  I believe there's a petition underway to make it available on a "compassionate use" basis in the US. 

 

 

 

Thank you for all you are doing.  
 

I’m about to turn 63 and I really, really, really don’t want to get this.  I tried to slog through your references, and I found the discussions of ACE Inhibitors fascinating. I take lisinopril for blood pressure, which wasn’t specifically mentioned, but if I get sick it may be of interest.  They keep saying hypertension is a big risk factor for negative outcomes.  My hypertension is controlled pretty well with medication.  I wonder how that affects hypertension as a risk factor.

[Steptide]

I have to vent a little. I just found out that I have to work next week. Right now is a slow time of year and we don't really do much, but as soon as April hits, it's all out chaos. I cannot believe they're making us work and not sure how they got around this mandate, as we are absolutely not essential. It angers me because all they care about is money, they couldnt care less about employee safety 

[ALF]

2020 Tokyo Olympics Will Be Postponed Due to Coronavirus, Says IOC's Dick Pound

 

The 2020 Summer Olympics in Tokyo will be postponed because of the coronavirus pandemic, likely until 2021, International Olympic Committee member Dick Pound told Christine Brennan of USA Today.

 

"On the basis of the information the IOC has, postponement has been decided," Pound said. "The parameters going forward have not been determined, but the Games are not going to start on July 24, that much I know."

 

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2881956-2020-tokyo-olympics-will-be-postponed-due-to-coronavirus-says-iocs-dick-pound?utm_source=cnn.com&utm_campaign=editorial&utm_medium=referral

[Sundancer]

 

30 minutes ago, Steptide said:

I have to vent a little. I just found out that I have to work next week. Right now is a slow time of year and we don't really do much, but as soon as April hits, it's all out chaos. I cannot believe they're making us work and not sure how they got around this mandate, as we are absolutely not essential. It angers me because all they care about is money, they couldnt care less about employee safety 

 

Lots of people would be pretty happy to be working right now (unless they are doctors or nurses). What do you do? 

[Steptide]

3 minutes ago, Sundancer said:

 

 

Lots of people would be pretty happy to be working right now (unless they are doctors or nurses). What do you do? 

Landscaping/lawncare. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind working and getting a paycheck. I actually worry more about going from place to place. I'm still relatively young (39) but my mom is in her 70s with cancer and that makes a little nervous. It is what it is, but this is purely greed on my employers part 

[BillsFan4]

@Hapless Bills Fan re:our conversation before.

 

 

from the Associated Press. reliable source IMO.

 

Edited to insert link to actual story:
https://apnews.com/5dd6b30e03542b435e2716e3e3a483e4

 

[Edit: From discussion with AP sportswriter John Wawrow, AP's standard is that something must be verified by two primary sources before publication (primary meaning "I heard it said", not "I heard a guy who knows a guy who heard it"]

[BillsFan4]

 

?‍♂️

 

Edit - interview with the woman who took the drug:

 

https://twitter.com/vaughnhillyard/status/1242253997005664257?s=21

 

Edited March 24, 2020 by BillsFan4

[K-9]

1 minute ago, BillsFan4 said:

 

?‍♂️

People are F ing crazy. Not that we didn’t know that, but Christ!

 

On another note, I get the distinct impression that administration and its advisers have determined that the virus has done enough damage to the economy as the “cure has become worse than the problem.” I don’t think the virus agrees, but whatever. We are in deep crap, regardless. 

[Augie]

1 hour ago, Steptide said:

I have to vent a little. I just found out that I have to work next week. Right now is a slow time of year and we don't really do much, but as soon as April hits, it's all out chaos. I cannot believe they're making us work and not sure how they got around this mandate, as we are absolutely not essential. It angers me because all they care about is money, they couldnt care less about employee safety 

 

I totally get it and I feel for you. Glad you are outdoors and, at least where I am, it’s pretty quiet out there.  We are basically in hide at home mode other than groceries, and even that I’ve cut way back on trips. 

 

We have a landscape company that does our entire HOA. I never get close to the crews, we all just nod and smile. My small front yard had some stuff die on us. Tomorrow a designer is coming by to talk about some changes to front and rear yards. It is completely understood that we will NOT be even remotely close to each other. I’d maybe more concerned with the people you work with, if any, touching stuff, coughing, etc. 

 

Good luck to you and your mom!  Hope this is behind us all soon! 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

12 minutes ago, K-9 said:

People are F ing crazy. Not that we didn’t know that, but Christ!

 

On another note, I get the distinct impression that administration and its advisers have determined that the virus has done enough damage to the economy as the “cure has become worse than the problem.” I don’t think the virus agrees, but whatever. We are in deep crap, regardless. 

 

I would just to say once again: We are NOT in "deep crap", regardless. 

 

In this country, we have an uncontained outbreak of an epidemic disease.  We know how to contain this.  There are books on how to contain this.  Scientists who worked at the US CDC wrote many of those books.

 

With regard to this specific disease, we have have the example of other countries in front of us - democracies - on how they contained this.

 

We are not in deep crap, regardless.  But if we fail to take known, proven successful, public health measures to contain this - if we continue to take half measures, don't develop, announce, and execute a coherent national plan, THEN indeed, we will be in deep crap.

 

6 hours ago, Foxx said:

MA and MI just mandated stay at home orders for their states.

 

Finally.

 

[Foxx]

26 minutes ago, BillsFan4 said:

 

?‍♂️

[K-9]

8 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I would just to say once again: We are NOT in "deep crap", regardless. 

 

In this country, we have an uncontained outbreak of an epidemic disease.  We know how to contain this.  There are books on how to contain this.  Scientists who worked at the US CDC wrote many of those books.

 

With regard to this specific disease, we have have the example of other countries in front of us - democracies - on how they contained this.

 

We are not in deep crap, regardless.  But if we fail to take known, proven successful, public health measures to contain this - if we continue to take half measures, don't develop, announce, and execute a coherent national plan, THEN indeed, we will be in deep crap.

 

 

Finally.

 

You misinterpret my source of the crap. So on that note, if the feds determine that the “cure has become worse than the problem” as they’ve flat out said and decide that people need to get back to work sooner than is deemed safe, I’d say we are in deep crap because that means that the public health measures will no longer be the priority. 
 

Making the cure less of the problem doesn’t even meet a half measure. 

[May Day 10]

possible glimmer of hope in Italy?

 

https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/public-global-health/489062-new-coronavirus-cases-drop-in-italy-for-second-day

 

[Lurker]

47 minutes ago, K-9 said:

On another note, I get the distinct impression that administration and its advisers have determined that the virus has done enough damage to the economy as the “cure has become worse than the problem.” I don’t think the virus agrees, but whatever. We are in deep crap, regardless. 

 

I tend to agree with you.   

 

The Fed has finally done what Trump wanted--open the liquidity spigot full blast--and fiscal stimulus is just a few days away.   Both should be good for the financial markets, especially the risk backstops being put in place for major corporations and industries.

 

 So, risk on, baby...drive the MF stock market back up!      So what if a few million old people won't get to see it...

[Hapless Bills Fan]

29 minutes ago, Lurker said:

 

I tend to agree with you.   

 

The Fed has finally done what Trump wanted--open the liquidity spigot full blast--and fiscal stimulus is just a few days away.   Both should be good for the financial markets, especially the risk backstops being put in place for major corporations and industries.

 

 So, risk on, baby...drive the MF stock market back up!      So what if a few million old people won't get to see it...

 

I would just like to note that reportedly 40% of those hospitalized with severe covid-19 disease and even critical, are age 20-49

And if the hospital systems collapse because they are overloaded, and because inadequately protected HCW are too sick to work, that 40% won't live either

 

And if inadequately protected doctors and nurses die of covid-19, it will cripple our health care system for a generation

 

Carry on...

 

I personally don't think that the markets will respond to anything until there is a coherent national plan to contain the pandemic.  But I am not a financial analyst, and that is entirely an unqualified personal opinion.

 

 

 

54 minutes ago, K-9 said:

You misinterpret my source of the crap. So on that note, if the feds determine that the “cure has become worse than the problem” as they’ve flat out said and decide that people need to get back to work sooner than is deemed safe, I’d say we are in deep crap because that means that the public health measures will no longer be the priority. 
 

Making the cure less of the problem doesn’t even meet a half measure. 

 

Thank you for explaining, you're right, I did misinterpret

[John in Jax]

I saw the 70+ year old Lt Governor of Texas (Dan Patrick....no, not the sports radio talk guy) tonight on TV, and he made a real good case for not having "the cure be more devastating than the disease." He feels that if we let the mass "shelter in place" orders remain in effect for too long, the American way of life as we all know it, may be forever changed in a very negative way.