Could Alabama Crimson Tide beat the Miami Dolphins?

[Royale with Cheese]

2 minutes ago, mannc said:

I've never said any such thing and it really doesn't matter anyway.  The point is, the talent level at a school like Alabama or Clemson is probably higher than on the Dolphins.  The Phins might beat them, but they definitely would not physically overwhelm them, as many here suggest.

 

Just because you’re not saying the specific words does t mean that’s not what you’re arguing.

 

The Alabama players right now, who have a lot of teenagers playing will immediately adjust to the NFL speed, will not be overwhelmed against an NFL playbook, Tua will understand and pick up on any disguises the defense gives them and will physically match up with players in the NFL across the line.  In order for you to believe Alabama could beat Miami, the above I mention you have to believe.  I guess there’s no learning curves anymore....these guys are immediately ready even a few years before they get to the NFL LOL....

[C.Biscuit97]

2 minutes ago, mannc said:

Please.  You're one of my favorite posters here, but that is a pathetic argument.  

How? Those 2 linemen were physically dominant in college and already got hurt.  More players from Bama would get hurt.  It’s guys in nfl weight rooms who are closing in on 30 vs 21 and 22 years olds.  

[GunnerBill]

Just now, C.Biscuit97 said:

This Miami team led Dallas at halftime.  So you think Bama could have the lead against Dallas?

 

and as a big Howard fan, what has he proven in the nfl?  Maybe he’s not as good when he is playing against the men in the nfl instead of college kids.  Man Gunner, I’m normally with you but this is insane.  Boys against men.  And know I want this game to happen. 

 

This Miami team is ***** pathetic. I have picked them to beat the Redskins this week though....

 

Howard has proven to be a big standard NFL starter. That is better than almost every player on the Dolphins. They only have to all be that good to be more talented than this bottom feeding Dolphins team. 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I hate Saban. But if you don't think he is a better coach than Brian Flores I don't know what to tell you. 

 

 

...maybe the Fins could hire him back, but with a "void contract if you pull another I'm leaving" fiasco.......St Nick thought he'd have TOTAL control over NFL team personnel like he does in 'Bama.."I'll cancel your scholarship"...oh wait.......bruised ego in the pro ranks.....

[mannc]

1 minute ago, Buffalo716 said:

As you said pride is very big for these guys

 

And I'm sure some of them believe it...

 

The thing with college kids is they are trotting out 18-19 year olds a good amount

 

Besides Tremaine and a few others the NFL is trotting out 27 year old men... Development is a huge difference

 

Could the OHL champs beat the worst sabres team? Hell no

Look, I doubt that Alabama would beat even a below average NFL team, but I think there is near zero chance that they would be physically overmatched and blown out like many here suggest.  I don't know when you played in the ACC, but teams like Alabama and Clemson didn't really exist 10 or 15 years ago.  They are literally stacked with NFL talent.  Almost every starter will play in the NFL in the next year or two.  They aren't going to be embarrassed by a team like the Dolphins.    

[Royale with Cheese]

5 minutes ago, mannc said:

Fine.  Then how do you account for the many former Tide players in the NFL (such as Marcel Dareus) who say that Alabama would win a lot of games in the NFL?  Are they just wrong?  Who would know better than them?

 

Marcel also thought it was a good idea to speed with weed in his car after already failed multiple drug tests.  When I think of intellectual statements...I think Marcell Dareus.

[Bill from NYC]

44 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Saban had a 15-17 nfl record. Tua might try to throw an out that Xavier Howard easily picks off.  

 

Some college teams have huge advantages because they simply just get the best recruits. Rosen I believe was the number 1 qb as a recruit. Parker was a first rounder. Howard is a pro bowler.  

Saban also asked for Brees and was given Dante Culpepper. And he brought Bellichick's defense from #30 to #2 in Cleveland as DC.

 

That said, Alabama would have no chance against Miami. They have lots of players who will make the NFL, and Miami got rid of their most talented players (including Minkah Fitzpatrick) but they would still beat the Crimson Tide. 

 

I will say this.....if Bama had a professional offensive line, the phish could not cover their receivers imo.

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, GoBills808 said:

The other guy who said it was Reggie Ragland iirc. Maybe Cyrus Kouandijo thinks so too. Haven't heard from Trent Richardson or Dee Milliner yet.

 

So of those only Ragland is from the Bama era where I think this is a question. I am talking specifically about this era of those 4 consecutive Championship games - Clemson, Clemson, Georgia, Clemson. I think this last 5 years of Alabama products is a step up on any kind of NFL production line than I have seen before. 

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

 

...maybe the Fins could hire him back, but with a "void contract if you pull another I'm leaving" fiasco.......St Nick thought he'd have TOTAL control over NFL team personnel like he does in 'Bama.."I'll cancel your scholarship"...oh wait.......bruised ego in the pro ranks.....

 

Sometimes I think people really don't understand the difference between college and professional football...in any respect

[Mike in Horseheads]

Maybe they should beat Clemson first.

[Buffalo716]

Just now, mannc said:

Look, I doubt that Alabama would beat even a below average NFL team, but I think there is near zero chance that they would be physically overmatched and blown out like many here suggest.  I don't know when you played in the ACC, but teams like Alabama and Clemson didn't really exist 10 or 15 years ago.  They are literally stacked with NFL talent.  Almost every starter will play in the NFL in the next year or two.  They aren't going to be embarrassed by a team like the Dolphins.    

I don't think I disagreed that many Bama players will go to the league

 

Where I disagree is that alot of them won't pan out... Sure they might send 17 to the league, but probably only half will stick

 

How many become all pros or impact players? 1-2 , maybe 3...

 

Everybody on the Phins has made an NFL roster

[Big Turk]

No. This is ridiculous. Alabama at most has 6 or 7 real NFL players. The Dophins have 53. Alabama would get mauled.

Edited October 9, 2019 by matter2003

[C.Biscuit97]

2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

This Miami team is ***** pathetic. I have picked them to beat the Redskins this week though....

 

Howard has proven to be a big standard NFL starter. That is better than almost every player on the Dolphins. They only have to all be that good to be more talented than this bottom feeding Dolphins team. 

Howard has 141 yards this year and go hurt last year. Again, I loved him but he hasn’t proven anything.  At this point, Ryan Fitzpatrick has had the better nfl career.  And that’s the whole point Gunner. You’re just assuming stuff. 

 

There is a very real possible that Tua won’t put up stats close to Fitz.  And it’s silly to assume that. 

[GunnerBill]

3 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

 

...maybe the Fins could hire him back, but with a "void contract if you pull another I'm leaving" fiasco.......St Nick thought he'd have TOTAL control over NFL team personnel like he does in 'Bama.."I'll cancel your scholarship"...oh wait.......bruised ego in the pro ranks.....

 

I agree with that. Saban won't come back to the NFL because I think he knows it found him out. He was "just a guy" at that level. But again.... there are people who year in year out coach NFL bottom feeders who aren't even that good. Whether it is Steve Wilks or Freddie Kitchens or Brian Flores. 

[Royale with Cheese]

1 minute ago, mannc said:

Look, I doubt that Alabama would beat even a below average NFL team, but I think there is near zero chance that they would be physically overmatched and blown out like many here suggest.  I don't know when you played in the ACC, but teams like Alabama and Clemson didn't really exist 10 or 15 years ago.  They are literally stacked with NFL talent.  Almost every starter will play in the NFL in the next year or two.  They aren't going to be embarrassed by a team like the Dolphins.    

 

A 18-20 year old freshman/sophomore who starts at Alabama won’t be physically overmatched by NFL players in their mid to upper 20’s?  Really?  

 

[C.Biscuit97]

2 minutes ago, Bill from NYC said:

Saban also asked for Brees and was given Dante Culpepper. And he brought Bellichick's defense from #30 to #2 in Cleveland as DC.

 

That said, Alabama would have no chance against Miami. They have lots of players who will make the NFL, and Miami got rid of their most talented players (including Minkah Fitzpatrick) but they would still beat the Crimson Tide. 

 

I will say this.....if Bama had a professional offensive line, the phish could not cover their receivers imo.

You know it’s a million times easier to win in college.  Alabama recruits itself now.  I do think Saban is a good coach but it is so much easier in college. 

 

And I think Xavier Howard, a pro bowler last year, could cover their receivers. 

[Bill from NYC]

Just now, C.Biscuit97 said:

You know it’s a million times easier to win in college.  Alabama recruits itself now.  I do think Saban is a good coach but it is so much easier in college. 

 

And I think Xavier Howard, a pro bowler last year, could cover their receivers. 

All 4 of them?

[C.Biscuit97]

3 minutes ago, Mike in Horseheads said:

Maybe they should beat Clemson first.

Or Johnny Manziel or Chad Kelly

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, C.Biscuit97 said:

Howard has 141 yards this year and go hurt last year. Again, I loved him but he hasn’t proven anything.  At this point, Ryan Fitzpatrick has had the better nfl career.  And that’s the whole point Gunner. You’re just assuming stuff. 

 

There is a very real possible that Tua won’t put up stats close to Fitz.  And it’s silly to assume that. 

 

I am not assuming anything. It is ridiculous comparing Howard to Fitz. How does Howard look compared to anyone the Fins have at tight end? Xavien Howard is a vert good football player. I will take Marlon Humphrey all day though. 

 

If you think I am arguing the Crimson Tide has produced a bona fide NFL QB I am not. 

[C.Biscuit97]

Just now, Bill from NYC said:

All 4 of them?

He’s really good.  

[mannc]

1 minute ago, Buffalo716 said:

I don't think I disagreed that many Bama players will go to the league

 

Where I disagree is that alot of them won't pan out... Sure they might send 17 to the league, but probably only half will stick

 

How many become all pros or impact players? 1-2 , maybe 3...

 

Everybody on the Phins has made an NFL roster

I believ you're wrong about how many Tide players will make it in the league and/or become stars.  GunnerBill has crunched the numbers and I think you would be surprised.  This year's team probably has 10 starters who will be first or second round picks.  The vast majority will stick in the league for a good while and there are probably multiple future stars there, as well.    

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

2 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

 

Sometimes I think people really don't understand the difference between college and professional football...in any respect

 

...think you're "dead on" bud.......people includes fans, posters as well as collegiate HC's wanting to dip their "big toe in the NFL".......collegiate HC's have complete and total control over personnel.......imagine if Saban was an NFL HC having to deal with the likes of Antonio Brown?......

[Bill from NYC]

1 hour ago, YoloinOhio said:

No their defense just gave up 31 to ole miss

Well, Ohio State gave up about 700 points to Iowa and lost, but they were still pretty good.

[auburnbillsbacker]

I hate this topic.  Everyone on here needs to remember that the national media was discussing if Alabama could beat the Bills after week 2 last year.  It was embarrassing and was a stupid debate.  The Dolohins would beat Alabama easily. 

[mannc]

2 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

A 18-20 year old freshman/sophomore who starts at Alabama won’t be physically overmatched by NFL players in their mid to upper 20’s?  Really?  

 

Alabama has very few true freshmen or sophomores who start and the ones who do are absolute freaks, like Jalen Waddle.  

[GoBills808]

2 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

So of those only Ragland is from the Bama era where I think this is a question. I am talking specifically about this era of those 4 consecutive Championship games - Clemson, Clemson, Georgia, Clemson. I think this last 5 years of Alabama products is a step up on any kind of NFL production line than I have seen before. 

Um Miami 99-'02?

[GunnerBill]

Just now, GoBills808 said:

Um Miami 99-'02?

 

Before my time. 

[mannc]

1 minute ago, GoBills808 said:

Um Miami 99-'02?

Yep.  That was an NFL factory that might very well have been capable of competing with actual NFL teams. 

[C.Biscuit97]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I am not assuming anything. It is ridiculous comparing Howard to Fitz. How does Howard look compared to anyone the Fins have at tight end? Xavien Howard is a vert good football player. I will take Marlon Humphrey all day though. 

 

If you think I am arguing the Crimson Tide has produced a bona fide NFL QB I am not. 

The point is that no one would have said when they were in college that Fitz would have a better career than 85% of guys from Bama.  But he did. Howard, who was an animal in college and I wanted the Bills to get (and I’d still take him), hardly looks like anything special right now.  So all these guys on Bama, are just projections.  And the reality is most wont become anything special at the NFL level.  

 

But ill out. Agree to disagree and you’re normally right on most things. Enjoy your night (or whatever time it is there). ?

[GoBills808]

Just now, GunnerBill said:

 

Before my time. 

 

Check em out. Then get back to me on the Alabama->NFL pipeline, you'll have some context. 

 

And I don't think 2001 U hangs with an NFL team even. 

[Augie]

29 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Except the Dolphins don't. They have at least a dozen starters who are barely NFL backup level talents. And there is a bottom feeder team or two in that situation every year. 

 

If you are only an NFL player by virtue of being in the NFL then sure.... the Dolphins have 100% NFL players. There are a dozen starters on that team who would not make another lineup and would struggle to make another roster.

 

Just like I said in this thread last year... Kelvin Benjamin wouldn't make another roster in the NFL. I was castigated at the time. And look now. Out of the league. Done. Not an NFL player. There are multiple Kelvin Benjamin cases on the Fins.   

Not by 40, but my money is still on the Dolphins. I understand the KB argument, but I still like a 28 year old man over a raw but more talented 19 year old kid. 

[C.Biscuit97]

4 minutes ago, mannc said:

I believ you're wrong about how many Tide players will make it in the league and/or become stars.  GunnerBill has crunched the numbers and I think you would be surprised.  This year's team probably has 10 starters who will be first or second round picks.  The vast majority will stick in the league for a good while and there are probably multiple future stars there, as well.    

But we have no idea on this. Plenty of sure fire players bust all the time. 

 

[njbuff]

I think the better question is.............

 

Can the Redskins beat the Dolphins?

 

They play each other this week and the Redskins are also a special kind of bad this year too.

[GunnerBill]

1 minute ago, GoBills808 said:

 

Check em out. Then get back to me on the Alabama->NFL pipeline, you'll have some context. 

 

And I don't think 2001 U hangs with an NFL team even. 

 

Checking names out doesn't mean much without seeing them play. I know they had some studs on that team - Portis, Wayne, Reed etc... 

[mannc]

Just now, Augie said:

Not by 40, but my money is still on the Dolphins. I understand the KB argument, but I still like a 28 year old man over a raw but more talented 19 year old kid. 

That’s a straw man argument.  Most Alabama  starters are at least 21 years old.  The ones who aren’t are truly exceptional.

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

6 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I agree with that. Saban won't come back to the NFL because I think he knows it found him out. He was "just a guy" at that level. But again.... there are people who year in year out coach NFL bottom feeders who aren't even that good. Whether it is Steve Wilks or Freddie Kitchens or Brian Flores. 

 

...he would NEVER return to the NFL HC ranks IMO.....his ego would prohibit it.......he has 1000% control over 'Bama players with no NFLPA or CBA to deal with......and gets paid MORE than most NFL HC's anyway besides what "boosters boost him with" to stick around......can you imagine him dealing with the likes of Antonio Brown?....NOT A CHANCE....

[BillsFan17]

No, they couldnt. 

[Buffalo716]

13 minutes ago, mannc said:

I believ you're wrong about how many Tide players will make it in the league and/or become stars.  GunnerBill has crunched the numbers and I think you would be surprised.  This year's team probably has 10 starters who will be first or second round picks.  The vast majority will stick in the league for a good while and there are probably multiple future stars there, as well.    

The draft is too much of a crapshoot. Every player is talented despite the narrative..  all a player needs to do is get into the right scheme and coaching

 

UNFORTUNATELY the draft doesn't work like that. And most players are not put into the ideal situation to succeed

 

Bama may have 10 players drafted as starter's, but I CAN GUARENTEE that they don't all pan out that way

 

Alabama gave up 31 to ole Miss

 

Fitz would score 50. He is a 14 year vet who is absolutely better than Tua RN IF HE got to play against a college defense... Tua , Who I scouted at the US army all American bowl and was one of my favorite QB prospects of ALL TIME and still is would get outplayed going against a NFL defense and defensive coordinator

 

Fitz wouldn't lose the game , it's that simple

 

Edited October 9, 2019 by Buffalo716

[Bill from NYC]

8 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said:

 

...think you're "dead on" bud.......people includes fans, posters as well as collegiate HC's wanting to dip their "big toe in the NFL".......collegiate HC's have complete and total control over personnel.......imagine if Saban was an NFL HC having to deal with the likes of Antonio Brown?......

This is true. Saban has an easier time keeping players in line because if they don't listen to him they will lose HUGE money. Saban can toss a player off the team, any player, and not get fired. If he WAS fired, he would have another offer in 10 seconds.

 

Other parts of being a college coach are difficult nonetheless. I heard a Bama player say he was the best at his high school, if not his  entire state, and when he got to Alabama, so was everyone else.

 

In any event, I think that the phish would beat the Tide. Pros are too tough and experienced for college teams.

Edited October 9, 2019 by Bill from NYC

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

1 minute ago, njbuff said:

I think the better question is.............

 

Can the Redskins beat the Dolphins?

 

They play each other this week and the Redskins are also a special kind of bad this year too.

...THAT could rival the Bills '87 strike game snooze fest.....a 6-3 OT barn burner if I remember correctly.....I'd watch a can of Sherwin Williams dry in my rocking chair FIRST.....