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YoloinOhio

Report: Bills working on extension for Jordan Phillips

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3 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

I'm hopeful about Murphy getting better too.......those long arms and narrow frame are perfect for pass rushing and making plays on the football...........Gunner thinks he's going to be released outright though and I won't be surprised.    He was limping around all year it just might not be something that will get better.

 

The UDFA's are obviously part of the draft process(pro personnel/college personnel)............but Beane had a great UDFA class........and you need to do well there........there are something like 560 UDFA's in the NFL and only around 160 players from each individual drafting round so you really can't afford to get nothing from UDFA. 

 

I'm not going to make a list of GM's by their success with UFA's until Beane actually has a "hit"     I can tell you where a .000 batting average ranks him though.:flirt:

I don't care where he's ranked, either. I was genuinely curious as to who has had the most "success" in signing UFAs around the league. I suspect it's pretty even throughout, though. Just like draft success, etc. 

 

I'm hoping Murhpy is healthier this year, too. For the reasons you outlined. He just may be one of those guys who is perpetually hit by the injury bug. 

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48 minutes ago, Saint Doug said:

Don’t forget Anquan Boldin. 

 

I liked that until they traded Watkins.

 

The entire point of bringing him in was to mentor Watkins.

 

Not a popular opinion here but trading Watkins and then turning around and trading a pick less than a round later for KB was dumb as well..........even knowing they didn't pick up Watkins option...........I can't unwatch that 2017 passing game.........and KB 2018 was a net negative.

 

The Dareus trade sucked too..........MD was killing it in run defense for McD.......they dumped him and it fell apart........then negated the financial advantage gained by dumping him by signing Star.:doh:

 

Lotta' questionable work by Beane..........I agree with those who say that McD has done a lot better at his job than Beane(though I think McD......coming from a scouting background and serving as his own GM for offseason 1......has his fingerprints on Beane's personnel work as well).

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1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

I don't like contemplating that Beane might not be a good judge of UFA either,  but:

 

Star Lotulelei.......awful value

Trent Murphy........limped thru season

Vontae Davis.........quit

AJ McCarron..........Beane even admitted that misjudgment....which lead to Peterman starting the opener and Allen forced into lineup

Chris Ivory...........far below league average production

Russ Bodine........sadly...easily their best value:sick:

Marshall Newhouse.....impressively terrible in preseason

Jeremy Kerley...........starting slot WR?........pffft

 

0 for 8

 

Keep in mind that McD and Whaley hauled in bargain stars in Hyde and Poyer.........and the year before Whaley signed two pro bargain pro bowlers in Lorax and Zach Brown.

 

Classes like Beane put together last year are abnormally bad even by Billsy standards.

 

 

You're failing to mention how limited his resources were because he intentionally took on all that dead money. Buffalo had the Lowest active salary cap by over 15 mil to the next team. Very underwhelming group of players but considering the assets he had to work with , it's understandable. 

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1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

I don't like contemplating that Beane might not be a good judge of UFA either,  but:

 

Star Lotulelei.......awful value

Trent Murphy........limped thru season

Vontae Davis.........quit

AJ McCarron..........Beane even admitted that misjudgment....which lead to Peterman starting the opener and Allen forced into lineup

Chris Ivory...........far below league average production

Russ Bodine........sadly...easily their best value:sick:

Marshall Newhouse.....impressively terrible in preseason

Jeremy Kerley...........starting slot WR?........pffft

 

0 for 8

 

Keep in mind that McD and Whaley hauled in bargain stars in Hyde and Poyer.........and the year before Whaley signed two pro bargain pro bowlers in Lorax and Zach Brown.

 

Classes like Beane put together last year are abnormally bad even by Billsy standards.

 

 

Not to pile on but you forgot 3 mil guaranteed to Corey Coleman for hanging out in Buffalo a week and a half, not even making the team. Left Buffalo with a large bag of cash, never playing a down.

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1 hour ago, JerseyBills said:

You're failing to mention how limited his resources were because he intentionally took on all that dead money. Buffalo had the Lowest active salary cap by over 15 mil to the next team. Very underwhelming group of players but considering the assets he had to work with , it's understandable. 

not sure i can agree with this.

 there are more players to add that list did not work out at all.
and self induced Talent vacuum does not forgive Bills FO in trying to reset.

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14 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

I don't like contemplating that Beane might not be a good judge of UFA either,  but:

 

Star Lotulelei.......awful value

Trent Murphy........limped thru season

Vontae Davis.........quit

AJ McCarron..........Beane even admitted that misjudgment....which lead to Peterman starting the opener and Allen forced into lineup

Chris Ivory...........far below league average production

Russ Bodine........sadly...easily their best value:sick:

Marshall Newhouse.....impressively terrible in preseason

Jeremy Kerley...........starting slot WR?........pffft

 

0 for 8

 

Keep in mind that McD and Whaley hauled in bargain stars in Hyde and Poyer.........and the year before Whaley signed two pro bargain pro bowlers in Lorax and Zach Brown.

 

Classes like Beane put together last year are abnormally bad even by Billsy standards.

 

 

 

I agree it's an ugly list.........but last year was 100% about securing a QB.

Beane and McDermott were very aggressive in changing the roster to fit what they want to do.

The legacy of Beane is tied to Josh Allen and what he does this year in FA and the Draft.

Personally, I will judge him after this offseason.  I hope he hits many more than he misses!

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14 hours ago, JerseyBills said:

You're failing to mention how limited his resources were because he intentionally took on all that dead money. Buffalo had the Lowest active salary cap by over 15 mil to the next team. Very underwhelming group of players but considering the assets he had to work with , it's understandable. 

 

It's not part of the equation.......what you are talking about wasn't their ability to spend in FA........it's just accounting.

 

They could have shopped for ANY player(s) who they intended to sign to a contract of 2 years or more.......even Kirk Cousins.

 

That's because they projected to have $80M in available cap space the next offseason and well over $100M in the 2020 offseason.

 

There are a number of ways to move cap dollars around but primarily.........signing bonuses.....which are amortized evenly over the length of a deal..........or, like Kirk Cousins......giving actual guaranteed base salaries.  

 

The latter is a GREAT way for a team with a shortage of cap space one year and a surplus the following to swing a big FA contract without enduring dead money if that player is cut several years down the road.

 

It's important for any fan who wants to be informed to understand how the salary cap works because front offices are notoriously disingenuine about it.

 

The reality is that the Bills were a repulsive FA option last year...........in great part due to McBeane's decision to rid the roster of "leverage players"..........the young vets that are generally the engine of the teams success but also have leverage on the team/coaching staff because of pending free agencies or other contract matters.

 

They had an ugly roster mix of very old players and very young players and no defined QB situation.   That is a hard sell in FA.   But it's a lot easier and sounds a lot better to Joe sixpack to just say "we don't have the money" and point to the accounting.  

 

That doesn't excuse overpaying to secure services and then missing on every target though..........you gotta' snag some value in FA.

 

 

Edited by BADOLBILZ
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16 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

I don't like contemplating that Beane might not be a good judge of UFA either,  but:

 

Star Lotulelei.......awful value

Trent Murphy........limped thru season

Vontae Davis.........quit

AJ McCarron..........Beane even admitted that misjudgment....which lead to Peterman starting the opener and Allen forced into lineup

Chris Ivory...........far below league average production

Russ Bodine........sadly...easily their best value:sick:

Marshall Newhouse.....impressively terrible in preseason

Jeremy Kerley...........starting slot WR?........pffft

 

0 for 8

 

Keep in mind that McD and Whaley hauled in bargain stars in Hyde and Poyer.........and the year before Whaley signed two pro bargain pro bowlers in Lorax and Zach Brown.

 

Classes like Beane put together last year are abnormally bad even by Billsy standards.

 

 

I wouldn't say 0 for 8 as we got 2 draft picks from those 8 (Mccaron and Newhouse) and Star helped this defense as we were horrible against the run in 2018 and that improved in 2019. Murphy struggled with injuries but showed good things at times. Ivory was good in spots, I think he's an average backup. Bodine was our best signing. 

Edited by The Jokeman

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15 minutes ago, The Jokeman said:

I wouldn't say 0 for 8 as we got 2 draft picks from those 8 (Mccaron and Newhouse) and Star helped this defense as we were horrible against the run in 2018 and that improved in 2019. Murphy struggled with injuries but showed good things at times. Ivory was good in spots, I think he's an average backup. Bodine was our best signing. 

 

 

The Bills were excellent against the run in 2017........until they traded Dareus.

 

People who don't understand how good Dareus was playing just need to go see the work Cover 1 did on him.........he wasn't the All Pro/pass rusher version of Dareus anymore but he was stacking double teams and shedding and making impressive plays.    The decision to trade him was not performance based and it blew up in their face and left them desperate for help in the offseason.

 

The 2018 Bills were just "meh" against the run.

 

Edmunds was a huge factor there because he struggled mightily with the kind of basic plays that Preston Brown made aplenty(which is why Preston lead the NFL in tackles in this defense in 2017).

 

But Star suffered a massive drop in production himself.........he couldn't get off a block to save his life after an otherwise pretty steady/unspectacular career in the same D in Carolina where he made more than twice as many plays.   17 tackles is a mind blowingly low number for a starting 4/3 DT and a precipitous drop from his past years.   It's possible that he's pretty much done at this point.   I mean........if he weren't uncuttable with the huge dead money figure......with that $11.5M cap figure this year they'd definitely have to consider it.   As Gunner said......Harrison Phillips was better last year and nobody thinks Phillips was any world beater.

 

It was a terrible FA class.  

 

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24 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

The Bills were excellent against the run in 2017........until they traded Dareus.

 

People who don't understand how good Dareus was playing just need to go see the work Cover 1 did on him.........he wasn't the All Pro/pass rusher version of Dareus anymore but he was stacking double teams and shedding and making impressive plays.    The decision to trade him was not performance based and it blew up in their face and left them desperate for help in the offseason.

 

The 2018 Bills were just "meh" against the run.

 

Edmunds was a huge factor there because he struggled mightily with the kind of basic plays that Preston Brown made aplenty(which is why Preston lead the NFL in tackles in this defense in 2017).

 

But Star suffered a massive drop in production himself.........he couldn't get off a block to save his life after an otherwise pretty steady/unspectacular career in the same D in Carolina where he made more than twice as many plays.   17 tackles is a mind blowingly low number for a starting 4/3 DT and a precipitous drop from his past years.   It's possible that he's pretty much done at this point.   I mean........if he weren't uncuttable with the huge dead money figure......with that $11.5M cap figure this year they'd definitely have to consider it.   As Gunner said......Harrison Phillips was better last year and nobody thinks Phillips was any world beater.

 

It was a terrible FA class.  

 

yeah ok.

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Star did have some bad games . However problems with the run d were more do to Edmund's and Milano taking bad angles and/or getting pushed around. 

 

Also I'm a big fan of Harrison but he was not better than Star. 

 

I beleive its 8 million in savings a year going from Dareus to Star. MD is overrated and lazy and one infraction away from losing a half of season. Star all day over MD

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11 minutes ago, noacls said:

Star did have some bad games . However problems with the run d were more do to Edmund's and Milano taking bad angles and/or getting pushed around. 

 

Also I'm a big fan of Harrison but he was not better than Star. 

 

I beleive its 8 million in savings a year going from Dareus to Star. MD is overrated and lazy and one infraction away from losing a half of season. Star all day over MD

 

 

You couldn't be more wrong.

 

Dareus had a cap figure of $5.7M in 2018 and $9M this year..........but the Jags can cut him with zero dead money because that's all base salary. 

 

Star has an $11.5M cap figure in 2019...........and if the Bills tried to cut him they would have to eat $12.5M in dead money because they guaranteed him $25M at signing.😂

 

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8 minutes ago, noacls said:

Thank you for correcting me. Should have went to spotrac first. However I would take Star and 54 million in savings any day over MD. 

http://www.espn.com/blog/buffalo-bills/post/_/id/29701/bills-save-54-million-in-cap-space-in-dumping-marcell-dareus-contract

 

 

You are going to have to thank me for correcting you again.

 

All that the Bills saved trading Dareus was half of his base salary in 2017 and all of his base salary in 2018.

 

So a total of about $12.5M.

 

None of the rest of it was guaranteed......it's all base salary sans guarantees.

 

Star's SIGNING BONUS ALONE was $13M.

 

They hadn't even collected their modest savings before throwing it away.

 

Nothing saved.  

 

The numbers only get worse from there.........Star also received another $5.5M in non-signing bonus guarantees at signing.

 

And he's got another wad of guarantees hitting on 3/17/19 this year that gets him close to that $25M before he ever plays a down in 2019.

 

 

 

 

 

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On 2/13/2019 at 6:21 PM, Logic said:

LOL.

Talk about a subjective opinion being presented as objective fact.

At least Star's signing helped contribute to the 2nd ranked defense in the NFL.

You must have slept through the signings of Derrick Dockery, Langston Walker, Larry Triplett, Kirk Morrison, Vontae Davis, Peerless Price (second edition), Andra Davis, Andre Davis, Melvin Fowler, Mark Anderson, and Philip Gaines.

 

Didn't you forget the RB who wore a wedding gown and got negative yards?

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15 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

It's not part of the equation.......what you are talking about wasn't their ability to spend in FA........it's just accounting.

 

They could have shopped for ANY player(s) who they intended to sign to a contract of 2 years or more.......even Kirk Cousins.

 

That's because they projected to have $80M in available cap space the next offseason and well over $100M in the 2020 offseason.

 

There are a number of ways to move cap dollars around but primarily.........signing bonuses.....which are amortized evenly over the length of a deal..........or, like Kirk Cousins......giving actual guaranteed base salaries.  

 

The latter is a GREAT way for a team with a shortage of cap space one year and a surplus the following to swing a big FA contract without enduring dead money if that player is cut several years down the road.

 

It's important for any fan who wants to be informed to understand how the salary cap works because front offices are notoriously disingenuine about it.

 

The reality is that the Bills were a repulsive FA option last year...........in great part due to McBeane's decision to rid the roster of "leverage players"..........the young vets that are generally the engine of the teams success but also have leverage on the team/coaching staff because of pending free agencies or other contract matters.

 

They had an ugly roster mix of very old players and very young players and no defined QB situation.   That is a hard sell in FA.   But it's a lot easier and sounds a lot better to Joe sixpack to just say "we don't have the money" and point to the accounting.  

 

That doesn't excuse overpaying to secure services and then missing on every target though..........you gotta' snag some value in FA.

 

 

Not sure how you see Cousins deal as great way to beat cap shortage.  As each year is guaranteed don't they face cap hit of balance due?   $60mm  dead cap hit if he is cut now 

Edited by freddyjj

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So nobody bats a thousand and the jury's still out in a few if those signings. Most of those  FA signings we're done as low-cost stop gap measures while they got rid of dead money.  In the bigger picture, Beane's UFA, waiver pick-ups and draft picks have been outstanding. 

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8 hours ago, freddyjj said:

Not sure how you see Cousins deal as great way to beat cap shortage.  As each year is guaranteed don't they face cap hit of balance due?   $60mm  dead cap hit if he is cut now 

 

Example: you can have a guaranteed base salary of $3M one year and a guaranteed base salary of $27M the next year and sign a player to a 2 year $30M deal while only sustaining a $3M cap hit in year one. 

 

That's an extreme example...........the Bills had like $30M in cap room so they were hardly that broke..........but the point being that limited cap space in year one is irrelevant if there is TONS of it available in the following year(s). 

 

The Cousins deal was a 3 year deal with all base salaries guaranteed..........expensive for sure........but not likely to ever result in any dead money..........they are committed for 3 years and then it's over with zero dead money.

 

When you have RIDICULOUS amounts of cap space like the Bills have this year and next........with almost no free agents of their own to re-sign........you can do things like that.  

 

It would have been stupid for the Bills to pass on a free agent they really needed last year...............and I don't think they did...........they just got turned down by guys like John Brown.......like I said.......for reasons partly their own doing it wasn't an attractive FA option.............but again, it sounds better to cry poor.

Edited by BADOLBILZ
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42 minutes ago, Jpsredemption said:

I’ll remind everyone this time of year we should consider the source and not take every report at face value.

The source was Jordan Phillips

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1 hour ago, Green Lightning said:

So nobody bats a thousand and the jury's still out in a few if those signings. Most of those  FA signings we're done as low-cost stop gap measures while they got rid of dead money.  In the bigger picture, Beane's UFA, waiver pick-ups and draft picks have been outstanding. 

 

...damn good assessment bud.....Star has quietly gone about his job....he was probably paid extra because they knew the type of guy they were getting (stat quiet as expected)...whose crystal bawls predicted Vontae quitting?.......Murphy, dinged and PED baggage was a crap shoot gap filler with limited resources.....Coleman was a fleece job as was Anquan BolDONE earlier.....Newhouse was a whiff and probably Jethro Bodine (shoulda signed Ellie Mae).......BUT....look at rounds 3 through 7 and tell me McBeane & Company suck.....add in UDFA's Wallace & Foster for good measure.....no matter what, you'll "never please the predominating poster" who cites how bad this gang is 24/7/365.......pfffft.......

 

Round 3, Pick 32 (No. 96 overall): Harrison Phillips, DT, Stanford

Andy Benoit's grade: B+

The estimable Kyle Williams is probably playing his last season, and the Bills likely hope Phillips can be the run defender to replace him. To replace Williams’s pass rushing, however, they may have to look elsewhere.

 

Round 4, Pick 21 (No, 121 overall): Taron Johnson, CB, Weber State

Round 5, Pick 17 (No. 154 overall) [via Baltimore]: Siran Neal, CB, Jacksonville State

Round 5, Pick 29 (No. 166 overall): Wyatt Teller, G, Virginia Tech

Round 6, Pick 13 (No. 187 overall): Ray-Ray McCloud, WR, Clemson

Round 7, Pick 37 (No. 255 overall): Austin Proehl, WR, North Carolina(only one no longer on roster)

 

 

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