teef Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 7 minutes ago, nedboy7 said: It seems the last 15 years have created a weird dynamic about the QB for Bills fans. And people seem to think having an above avg QB means playoffs every year which clearly is not the case in the NFL. Fans didn’t seem to enjoy last year cause the QB wasn’t “franchise”. Allen is far from a top QB. It’s possible he gets there. having an above average qb doesn't mean the playoffs every year, but without one the chances of going are next to none. i think all of us as bills fans should realize this. i like tyrod too, but anyone could see that an improvement was needed at the qb position, hence josh allen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsGospel Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 1 hour ago, BarleyNY said: The Cards are last in the NFL in total rushing yards and YPC. Larry Fitzgerald is 35. The Cards have had a ton of injuries on their OL as well. Seems like your research wasn’t quite complete either. I’m not getting into the Josh v. Josh thing right now because I haven’t watched Rosen and it’s pointless anyway. Allen has impressed me with his athleticism and running ability as well as occasionally as a passer. He’s been lacking as a pocket QB and passer too often though. He’s young and very raw so that’s not a surprise. The potential certainly is there but he’s going to have to prove himself before I anoint him a FQB. That’s going to take time (if it happens at all) so I’m not getting ahead of that process. Also I’m not going to compare the two Joshs unless we’re talking about the Bills’ decision making. Rosen really doesn’t matter at all where rating Allen is concerned except in that context. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2018/ I don't care what the Cards total rushing is or YPC, he clearly stated David Johnson couldn't run behind the ***** Cards OL, he's almost at 1,000 yards, 9 total TD behind that OL, now look at shady McCoy who has been in and out of lineup with injury but also pretty ineffective other than the Jets game when he is in, saying "you're not getting into the Josh vs Josh thing"then commenting on it makes no sense so you obviously have your opinion . Allen is doing the same thing here that he did at Wyoming, he is putting the team on his back and making the most out of what he has to work with, he is making a guy like Robert Foster (Who was not even elite at the almighty Alabama program) look good, along with guys like Isiah Mckenzie (Isiah who?) and Ray Ray McLeoud. Yes he has plenty to go on his passing but when the entire offense had 11 dropped passes coming into the Detroit game and I recall at least 1 more drop in that game (Deonte Thompson) and working behind a pretty bad OL from ourselves, I just can't believe there is even a comparison from fans at this point. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WideNine Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 Since this string has so many QB draft confessions, figured I would add mine. I really did not favor Allen in the draft, in fact I was pretty pessimistic about all the 1st round QB's and could think of ways they could all fail miserably wearing a Bills uniform. Years of watching the Bills being mediocre at this position did not leave much hope in the tank. Keep in mind, these were just my impressions of the projected 1st round QBs. Mayfield - you had this cocky attitude and off field antics that I thought could be a sign he would go down the Johnny football route and would not play well with the Western NY crowd. A little less accurate on throws, but a baller and competitor. A bit shorter, but can hit all those short and intermediate routes, sees the field, and extends plays so perhaps that is why he reminded me a bit of a Brees/Flutie hybrid. Rosen - I saw this laid-back California attitude in interviews that made one question his fire and passion for the game (not saying it was justified), but I did not see that playing well for our blue collar variety of football or fans, I thought he was sharp, threw a good ball, but I saw times when he held the ball too long and did not sense the pressure in the pocket which could lead to bad things/injuries. Darnold - I thought he was probably the best of the bunch as for being NFL ready, feeling the rush and creating time in the pocket, hitting most of the throws you would ask him to, and threading passes into tight places. Allen - I thought he would translate best in terms of locker room, attitude, and the Western NY market. I thought folks would not mind getting behind a kid who did not get offers from D1 schools - clawed his way up from JUCO - finally got a shot with tiny Wyoming to being drafted in the 1st round for the NFL. I never watched a single Wyoming game and going by the surface reports I felt it was a huge risk to take him because early reports from those that make a living evaluating college players had me thinking this guy was a cannon with a bent barrel. Jackson - Intriguing prospect, felt he was the best of the bunch as far as using his legs to extend plays. Did not think he had very good mechanics as far as standing in a pocket and delivering strikes, but from other clips I watched he seemed more than accurate enough and comfortable throwing on the move. I felt we could have some success with him behind center and that we would need a mobile QB because I was pretty sure our o-line was going to be pretty bad this year. Rudolph and the other guys whose names I really did not note, I figured would go later so I did not focus on them at all. The gist of this is that I am not trying to justify some pre-draft idea that I supported or hated Allen, he was an unknown commodity with plenty of documented risks. Now he is a Buffalo Bill and I will root for him to succeed because he has shown me flashes that he could be the QB this team has been looking for, when given time he has been surprisingly accurate, seems to be coachable as anyone watching his games week by week can see (if they are open to seeing progress), displays incredible leadership from the position that I would not expect from a rookie, is passionate about football - his team - and winning, and as long as I see him leaving it all on the field and progressing he's the right QB for the Bills. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffalo Bills Fan Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 8 hours ago, Mountain Man said: Any QB in the league would look bad in that team. Rosen has zero chance to succeed in that situation. Let's wait and see before we pass judgement I clearly said this year and worst of bunch right now means this year. Read that. Year 2 or 3 well see how it goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing Bong Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said: said...but in other news while we're on the topic of letting negative things go, when is your current avatar title going to die a natural (or unnatural for that matter) death? I've been trying to come up with something all day.. any suggestions? Cogs might stay my Avatar pick to maintain the PT5P brand. I'm thinking some variant of PT5P. BarkleyIsARealBackupPT5P BarkleyDoesn'tThrowPicks eh? Eh? 2 hours ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said: Well said...but in other news while we're on the topic of letting negative things go, when is your current avatar title going to die a natural (or unnatural for that matter) death? Who wants to be continually reminded about that game almost 2 seasons ago now, and IIRC, you were thinking of doing that anyway if the Bills beat the Vikes earlier this year! But do your thing man, I aint hating or anything, lol Meet Barkley's biggest fan. Edited December 17, 2018 by PetermanThrew5Picks 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoHuddleKelly12 Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 2 minutes ago, PetermanThrew5Picks said: I've been trying to come up with something all day.. any suggestions? Cogs might stay my Avatar pick to maintain the PT5P brand. I'm thinking some variant of PT5P. BarkleyIsARealBackupPT5P BarkleyDoesn'tThrowPicks eh? Eh? Make it a poll and let democracy run rampant! How about “RightJoshChosenPT5P,” or BarkleyBowlesOverJetsPT5P, or McDStarted4QBsThisYearPT5P... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bing Bong Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 (edited) 4 minutes ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said: Make it a poll and let democracy run rampant! How about “RightJoshChosenPT5P,” or BarkleyBowlesOverJetsPT5P, or McDStarted4QBsThisYearPT5P... I'm BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P NoHuddleKelly. Should have more lasting power if I am correct on this. Democracy would be mean: "How about PT5PSUCKS!" Oof I like BarkleyBowlesOverJets. But should probably stray away from referencing single games. BFGB Edited December 17, 2018 by BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoHuddleKelly12 Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 10 minutes ago, BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P said: I'm BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P NoHuddleKelly. Should have more lasting power if I am correct on this. Democracy would be mean: "How about PT5PSUCKS!" Oof I like BarkleyBowlesOverJets. But should probably stray away from referencing single games. BFGB Good calls all around BFGBPT5P! I’m a fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WideNine Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 3 minutes ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said: Good calls all around BFGBPT5P! I’m a fan OurBackupsCanBeatYours... ok, I suck at this. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dakrider Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 Swap Allen and Rosen and the Bills are 3-11 while Cards are 5-9. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoTier Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 21 hours ago, Azucho98 said: To all the draft analysts out there that said the Bills made a mistake - eat crow. We picked the right Josh. Famous last words. Rookie QBs tend to be all over the place, and some of those who don't look very good as rookies (like Goff) go on to develop into excellent NFL QBs when some of those who look like great early on never develop into real franchise QBs. Mark Sanchez and Blake Bortles are good examples of guys who never developed after some early success. It's simply too early to say much about the 2018 rookie QBs except to say that Mayfield looks like the real deal, Allen and Jackson have played much better than just about anybody expected them to play, and that both Darnold and Rosen seem to have been underwhelming compared to the expectations for them. That may be the result of the situation they're in. Goff and Trubisky looked pretty mediocre as rookies but blossomed under new and better coaches. Of course, how a rookie QB plays doesn't matter much if he develops into a bonafide NFL QB (as both Goff and Trubisky have) -- or doesn't. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 6 minutes ago, SoTier said: Famous last words. Rookie QBs tend to be all over the place, and some of those who don't look very good as rookies (like Goff) go on to develop into excellent NFL QBs when some of those who look like great early on never develop into real franchise QBs. Mark Sanchez and Blake Bortles are good examples of guys who never developed after some early success. It's simply too early to say much about the 2018 rookie QBs except to say that Mayfield looks like the real deal, Allen and Jackson have played much better than just about anybody expected them to play, and that both Darnold and Rosen seem to have been underwhelming compared to the expectations for them. That may be the result of the situation they're in. Goff and Trubisky looked pretty mediocre as rookies but blossomed under new and better coaches. Of course, how a rookie QB plays doesn't matter much if he develops into a bonafide NFL QB (as both Goff and Trubisky have) -- or doesn't. With Allen its all about upside and worth ethic....of which there are a ton. Put a better team around him and I think the difference will be sigificant. Rosen? Put a better OL in front of him and I think he looks better......as I have said since the beginning I think there are as many as 4 legit starters that come out of this draft...which was supposed to be a QB draft....which is why so many went so high. I know this....our QB is a gamer who plays with crap and tries to put the team on his shoulders and win.....that is what I can live with for this year. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 (edited) 13 minutes ago, SoTier said: Famous last words. Rookie QBs tend to be all over the place, and some of those who don't look very good as rookies (like Goff) go on to develop into excellent NFL QBs when some of those who look like great early on never develop into real franchise QBs. Mark Sanchez and Blake Bortles are good examples of guys who never developed after some early success. It's simply too early to say much about the 2018 rookie QBs except to say that Mayfield looks like the real deal, Allen and Jackson have played much better than just about anybody expected them to play, and that both Darnold and Rosen seem to have been underwhelming compared to the expectations for them. That may be the result of the situation they're in. Goff and Trubisky looked pretty mediocre as rookies but blossomed under new and better coaches. Of course, how a rookie QB plays doesn't matter much if he develops into a bonafide NFL QB (as both Goff and Trubisky have) -- or doesn't. Very level headed and quality post. I had my QB's going into the draft as Mayfield, Allen, Darnold, Lamar, Rosen. I live in LA, and I hated thought of us trading up for Rosen. I would have been fine if we didn't trade up and he was the guy that fell to us, but he was the last guy I wanted to risk more assets on. He is just not likable, and fans tend to over look just how significant that is for a QB in a locker room. Its what plagued Cutler for years, Jeff George, etc. Add in questions about how much he really loved the game and his injury history, and just wasn't someone I wanted to risk more than I had to in order to draft him. However, when the offseason first started, Allen was bottom of my list. But this kid just kept wowing me and changing my mind. I had Mayfield as top QB the whole football season, even when people kept arguing with me saying he is a 2nd or 3rd round prospect when I said I think the Bills would draft him in the first. Obviously Mayfield played his way out of our reach by going #1 overall. But it was the guys after Mayfield that switched for me when Allen made it to number 2 on my list. I had Rosen and Darnold alternating earlier in the year as the 2nd and 3rd guys, but mostly had Darnold there. But I watched all Darnolds games and I just saw so many bone head plays that it really just took some of the shine off for me. I still liked the kid, but decision making ability for me was a big question mark. I would have been fine moving up for him though because the kid was tough, a gamer and obviously tons of talent. But like I said, Allen though is the guy who worked his way up for me and just really made me go wow. I felt pretty strongly that Mayfield and Allen were the 2 best, even though the other 3 were still quality QB prospects themselves. The reason I say that is because, clearly Mayfield and Allen (at least in my eyes) are shining the most. Lamar story is great, but his style is very questionable for sustainability. But even with the two guys I felt the strongest about playing well, I still know that this means nothing. There is a long list of guys who started strong and then just never progressed much more or regressed even...and there is also long lists of guys who struggled early then came on strong. So anyone claiming that guys like Mayfield or Allen will be best long run are really jumping the gun, just like saying Rosen will be a bust is jumping the gun. For the record, I still firmly believe both Allen and Mayfield will be top 10 and maybe both top 5 starting QB's through their careers. Edited December 17, 2018 by Alphadawg7 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nedboy7 Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 2 hours ago, teef said: having an above average qb doesn't mean the playoffs every year, but without one the chances of going are next to none. i think all of us as bills fans should realize this. i like tyrod too, but anyone could see that an improvement was needed at the qb position, hence josh allen. You are correct. But I did not agree with the way it was done. Going into the season with 2 rookies basically was almost career ending for these guys. And the result is this crap season. For me it’s not about one player. So watching Allen develop was not close to enough to be peleased with this season. Especially after having success last year. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoodHands15 Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 16 hours ago, formerlyofCtown said: They might have 2 people on their board if they start losing. One of them being a Bills troll XD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ddaryl Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 I feel a heluva a lot better about the bills future than I did in October Josh is developing and the last few weeks it has been on display 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John from Riverside Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 1 hour ago, nedboy7 said: You are correct. But I did not agree with the way it was done. Going into the season with 2 rookies basically was almost career ending for these guys. And the result is this crap season. For me it’s not about one player. So watching Allen develop was not close to enough to be peleased with this season. Especially after having success last year. "career ending?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teef Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 1 hour ago, nedboy7 said: You are correct. But I did not agree with the way it was done. Going into the season with 2 rookies basically was almost career ending for these guys. And the result is this crap season. For me it’s not about one player. So watching Allen develop was not close to enough to be peleased with this season. Especially after having success last year. i'm not sure what you mean by career ending, but my "goal" for this year was to get allen some playing time, see some progression, and see what we have in the young players, (while also solving some cap issues). not for a second did i think this was a playoff year, so these to me were the biggest wants. i think the bills did just that. it wasn't a good season in terms of wins, but i'm much more optimistic about the qb position going forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 46 minutes ago, ddaryl said: I feel a heluva a lot better about the bills future than I did in October Josh is developing and the last few weeks it has been on display o ho HO! orly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
papazoid Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 but did they pick the right Patrick ? (laffin) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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