BuffaloRush Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 (edited) In my opinion, one of the most interesting tenures in Bills history is that of Doug Whaley's brief run as GM. Bills fans have two reactions to him - they either love him or hate him. It's been like this way for quite some time. I remember walking out the stadium toward the end of last season after the Miami loss and we were grumbling about how Rex Ryan needed to be fired. I said Whaley should be fired too and it really spawned a heated debate. So in your estimation was Doug Whaley a good general manager. Yes he's fired but there's many who still feel he got a raw deal. Here's a few things to consider: Positives: - Very good at signing "bargain basement" free agents in offseason who contributed to the team (Zack Brown, Jordan Mills, Chris Hogan) - Good at signing street free agents - Able to re-sign several players to long term deals to stay in Buffalo (Hughes, Cordy, Marcel) - Found players to fit in coaches scheme - Wanted to win NOW Negatives - A very questionable draft record (especially in Rounds 1 and 2) - Over spending for Sammy Watkins/doubling down on EJ Manual - Drafting "damaged good" high in the draft (Lawson, Kuoundjio etc) - Reckless with salary cap - Neglected QB position for years - Seemingly had problems with coaches (Rex and Marrone) - Took chances on guys with "character issues" My take - I think that Doug did try very hard to build a winning football the best way that he could. In the end though, I feel that he was a bad General Manager and was happy to see the Bills move on from him. Overall, I feel that his strength is with Pro Personnel and not as a GM. We all have our thoughts - what's your take on DW? Edited December 2, 2017 by BuffaloRush Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangarang Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 No, he wasn’t. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsherd Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 He was good Scout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aceman_16 Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 GM = no. Scout = yes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 As is often the case, the truth is somewhere in the middle. No hate, no blind love here. He was a good scout in many ways, making some nice trades and picking up some FA jewels. But he failed to “build a team”. No clear plan was evident. I have to wonder what would have happened had he been able to pick his own HC and how much input the HC’s had in our drafts. That could impact his legacy significantly. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob's House Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 I didn't love or hate him. He seemed like a likeable guy who made some exciting moves, but never quite put it together. He was ok. Not great, not bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fadingpain Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 Lousy GM. Lacked raw intelligence to perform job well and had no vision for how to build a cohesive team with proactive moves. Typical moves were passive, reactive, after the fact, fixes made on a temporary basis with no long term vision on display. His handling of the QB position alone was grounds for dismissal. He's lucky he survived as long as he did. The move up in the draft to get Watkins was another colossal failure. He was also bad enough at his job that he was often forced to choose between what was good for him and his personal career vs. what was good for the team. An example: EJ got way more of a shot than he ever should have, b/c Whaley's hide was on the line and admitting that EJ was a failure was synonymous with admitting Whaley was a failure; so EJ was promoted long after it was obvious he sucked. You can't have a top executive in any organization watching his own back at the expense of the organization and expect good things to flow from that dynamic. He will never work as a GM in the NFL again. Other than these observations, I loved him! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Call_Of_Ktulu Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 52 minutes ago, BuffaloRush said: In my opinion, one of the most interesting tenures in Bills history is that of Doug Whaley's brief run as GM. Bills fans have two reactions to him - they either love him or hate him. It's been like this way for quite some time. I remember walking out the stadium toward the end of last season after the Miami loss and we were grumbling about how Rex Ryan needed to be fired. I said Whaley should be fired too and it really spawned a heated debate. So in your estimation was Doug Whaley a good general manager. Yes he's fired but there's many who still feel he got a raw deal. Here's a few things to consider: Positives: - Very good at signing "bargain basement" free agents in offseason who contributed to the team (Zack Brown, Jordan Mills, Chris Hogan) - Good at signing street free agents - Able to re-sign several players to long term deals to stay in Buffalo (Hughes, Cordy, Marcel) - Found players to fit in coaches scheme - Wanted to win NOW Negatives - A very questionable draft record (especially in Rounds 1 and 2) - Over spending for Sammy Watkins/doubling down on EJ Manual - Drafting "damaged good" high in the draft (Lawson, Kuoundjio etc) - Reckless with salary cap - Neglected QB position for years - Seemingly had problems with coaches (Rex and Marrone) - Took chances on guys with "character issues" My take - I think that Doug did try very hard to build a winning football the best way that he could. In the end though, I feel that he was a bad General Manager and was happy to see the Bills move on from him. Overall, I feel that his strength is with Pro Personnel and not as a GM. We all have our thoughts - what's your take on DW? If he was even average as a GM another would've made him a offer. I wanted him fired after his 2nd season as GM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. K Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 Yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 I think in general Whaley was a good GM who was hamstrung by coaches who were not his choice, as well as meddling new owners. Had he been able to choose his own coach, that he could work with, I think he would still be here and we very well may have broken the playoff drought by now. As others said, Whaley excelled at finding some diamond in the rough FAs. The Watkins pick will go down as a huge mistake, but this is known in retrospect. I do applaud his aggressiveness in bringing in the best talent he could, as well as making some shrewd trades. I do think Whaley's downfall was the QB position, which he passed on several in the draft following 2013 when he picked EJ Manuel. I don't count EJ as his miss, necessarily, since his back was against the wall in 2013 thanks to Buddy Nix. Cardale Jones was puzzling. A 5th round flier on a QB with an incomplete college career was probably a little early. Whaley was the best GM we had in many years when you look at the likes of Tom Donahoe, Marv Levy, Russ Brandon, and Buddy Nix. In the end, I think Whaley can be credited with starting the process of bringing the Bills back to relevancy. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddy Hix Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 42 minutes ago, Fadingpain said: Lousy GM. Lacked raw intelligence to perform job well and had no vision for how to build a cohesive team with proactive moves. Typical moves were passive, reactive, after the fact, fixes made on a temporary basis with no long term vision on display. His handling of the QB position alone was grounds for dismissal. He's lucky he survived as long as he did. The move up in the draft to get Watkins was another colossal failure. He was also bad enough at his job that he was often forced to choose between what was good for him and his personal career vs. what was good for the team. An example: EJ got way more of a shot than he ever should have, b/c Whaley's hide was on the line and admitting that EJ was a failure was synonymous with admitting Whaley was a failure; so EJ was promoted long after it was obvious he sucked. You can't have a top executive in any organization watching his own back at the expense of the organization and expect good things to flow from that dynamic. He will never work as a GM in the NFL again. Other than these observations, I loved him! My initial reaction was the same...Whaley just isn't intelligent enough to develop a strategy or hire competent people beneath him to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CDogg20 Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 Sticking to my guns, yes he was a good gm, the EJ Manuel pick really gave him a bad reputation and ik a lot of people loved getting Sammy initially but hated the move when they saw the wr’s we could of had were producing more than Sammy. He wanted to win now and tried his damndest, he signed a good coach in Marrone. I wonder how much input he had in the Rex signing though. Overall I think he was a good gm and will flourish if ever given another opportunity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoBills808 Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 51 minutes ago, Rob's House said: I didn't love or hate him. He seemed like a likeable guy who made some exciting moves, but never quite put it together. He was ok. Not great, not bad. This. I'm very meh on the whole Whaley debate. I thought he had a great feel for LBs and a troubling fondness for EJ Manuel. I'd call him an above average drafter outside a few high profile blunders which very much color his time as GM, a good eye for talent in FA, but overall suffered like others have said from not being able to put all the pieces together. Whether his hands were tied as far as HC choices is spilt milk...you still gotta make it happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sig1Hunter Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 I have to ask. Is the OP serious with this thread? Or, is this a troll job? This question has been debated ad nauseam, with no definitive answer. Some liked him, some didn't, and some were indifferent. He is no longer the GM of the Buffalo Bills. End of story. He is available for a lunch date, however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted December 2, 2017 Author Share Posted December 2, 2017 8 minutes ago, Sig1Hunter said: I have to ask. Is the OP serious with this thread? Or, is this a troll job? This question has been debated ad nauseam, with no definitive answer. Some liked him, some didn't, and some were indifferent. He is no longer the GM of the Buffalo Bills. End of story. He is available for a lunch date, however. 100% serious. If you read the initial post, that's why I'm asking the question. The second Doug's name is brought up on posts, people have a very strong reaction one way or another. There's people associated with the Bills that we unanimously love or despise. But Doug has to be one of the most polarizing personalities in Bills history Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 He was a very good GM who was instrumental in building a top 3 defense that was DESTROYED when our meddling new owners decided to cherry pick Rex Ryan as their new, shiny toy. His death knell was sticking with EJ Manuel too long. MOST GMs make bad QB picks. The good ones know when to admit they !@#$ed up, then move on. He didn't do that and that's what will define him. But I think he is one of the best GMs the Bills have ever had. Second to Donahoe. And no ... I'm not forgetting Polian. !@#$ his lucky ass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloRush Posted December 2, 2017 Author Share Posted December 2, 2017 2 minutes ago, Gugny said: He was a very good GM who was instrumental in building a top 3 defense that was DESTROYED when our meddling new owners decided to cherry pick Rex Ryan as their new, shiny toy. His death knell was sticking with EJ Manuel too long. MOST GMs make bad QB picks. The good ones know when to admit they !@#$ed up, then move on. He didn't do that and that's what will define him. But I think he is one of the best GMs the Bills have ever had. Second to Donahoe. And no ... I'm not forgetting Polian. !@#$ his lucky ass. I think you are glossing over Doug's draft record - it leaves a lot to be desired Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 Just now, BuffaloRush said: I think you are glossing over Doug's draft record - it leaves a lot to be desired No. It doesn't. His draft picks fit the coaching staff that he helped hire. What happened to that coaching staff - and what they were replaced with - was not on Doug Whaley. It was on the 3/4 dead previous owner and the !@#$ new owners who undermined him and hired the Ryan Circus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
westerndecline Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 He failed to get Dalton, Wilson, cousins, Carr .... He failed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ganesh Posted December 2, 2017 Share Posted December 2, 2017 1 hour ago, BuffaloRush said: In my opinion, one of the most interesting tenures in Bills history is that of Doug Whaley's brief run as GM. Bills fans have two reactions to him - they either love him or hate him. It's been like this way for quite some time. I remember walking out the stadium toward the end of last season after the Miami loss and we were grumbling about how Rex Ryan needed to be fired. I said Whaley should be fired too and it really spawned a heated debate. So in your estimation was Doug Whaley a good general manager. Yes he's fired but there's many who still feel he got a raw deal. Here's a few things to consider: Positives: - Very good at signing "bargain basement" free agents in offseason who contributed to the team (Zack Brown, Jordan Mills, Chris Hogan) - Good at signing street free agents - Able to re-sign several players to long term deals to stay in Buffalo (Hughes, Cordy, Marcel) - Found players to fit in coaches scheme - Wanted to win NOW Negatives - A very questionable draft record (especially in Rounds 1 and 2) - Over spending for Sammy Watkins/doubling down on EJ Manual - Drafting "damaged good" high in the draft (Lawson, Kuoundjio etc) - Reckless with salary cap - Neglected QB position for years - Seemingly had problems with coaches (Rex and Marrone) - Took chances on guys with "character issues" My take - I think that Doug did try very hard to build a winning football the best way that he could. In the end though, I feel that he was a bad General Manager and was happy to see the Bills move on from him. Overall, I feel that his strength is with Pro Personnel and not as a GM. We all have our thoughts - what's your take on DW? Very Un-Pittsburghian way of building a team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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