Trump and Russia

[row_33]

 

I agree that Flynn is a chump, and it just exemplifies how bad a decision Trump made in selecting him as NSA. And if not for the public disclosure of his lying to Pence which embarrassed Trump into firing him, Flynn would still be the compromised NSA.

 

When nobody from your party supports you, they all want to continue collecting a Gravy Train cheque doing nothing, then you are kinda limited in your choice for immediate heavy appointments.

 

Do Americans feel that the rest of the world sees them as leaders with integrity and uncompromised intelligence services? Honestly??

[Deranged Rhino]

Key Democratic Officials Now Warning Base Not to Expect Evidence of Trump/Russia Collusion

https://theintercept.com/2017/03/16/key-democratic-officials-now-warning-base-not-to-expect-evidence-of-trumprussia-collusion/

[B-Man]

Key Democratic Officials Now Warning Base Not to Expect Evidence of Trump/Russia Collusion

https://theintercept.com/2017/03/16/key-democratic-officials-now-warning-base-not-to-expect-evidence-of-trumprussia-collusion/

 

 

FTA:

 

The principal problem for Democrats is that so many media figures and online charlatans are personally benefiting from feeding the base increasingly unhinged, fact-free conspiracies — just as right-wing media polemicists did after both Bill Clinton and Obama were elected — that there are now millions of partisan soldiers absolutely convinced of a Trump/Russia conspiracy for which, at least as of now, there is no evidence.

 

And they are all waiting for the day, which they regard as inevitable and imminent, when this theory will be proven and Trump will be removed.

[4merper4mer]

 

FTA:

 

The principal problem for Democrats is that so many media figures and online charlatans are personally benefiting from feeding the base increasingly unhinged, fact-free conspiracies — just as right-wing media polemicists did after both Bill Clinton and Obama were elected — that there are now millions of partisan soldiers absolutely convinced of a Trump/Russia conspiracy for which, at least as of now, there is no evidence.

 

And they are all waiting for the day, which they regard as inevitable and imminent, when this theory will be proven and Trump will be removed.

 

 

Just ween them off of Russia to UFO crap. That has decades of staying power .

[Joe Miner]

 

FTA:

 

The principal problem for Democrats is that so many media figures and online charlatans are personally benefiting from feeding the base increasingly unhinged, fact-free conspiracies just as right-wing media polemicists did after both Bill Clinton and Obama were elected that there are now millions of partisan soldiers absolutely convinced of a Trump/Russia conspiracy for which, at least as of now, there is no evidence.

 

And they are all waiting for the day, which they regard as inevitable and imminent, when this theory will be proven and Trump will be removed.

Like an inverse rapture?

[Logic]

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/adam-schiff-trump-twitter-wiretapping-russia-ties-236249

 

FBI Director James Comey confirmed Monday the FBI is investigating Russia’s meddling in the presidential election, including possible links between the Trump campaign and Moscow.

Comey told the House Intelligence Committee at a hearing that the bureau normally does not comment on the existence of counterintelligence investigations, but that he was authorized to do so in this case because of the extraordinary public interest.

And from Adam Schiff:

“Mr. President, the Russians hacked our election and interfered. No one disputes this now, but you. This is what is called 'fact,'” Schiff wrote in a series of tweets denouncing Trump's claim that his predecessor wiretapped Trump Tower. “The intelligence community concluded the Russians will interfere again. This is why full investigation is important to country. Please stop.”

 

 

 

While this obviously does not mean that there WAS collusion, since no guilt has yet been proven, it shows that the topic is at least serious enough and likely enough that there is an active investigation underway. While I and many others had zero doubt that such an investigation existed, many here laughed off even the notion that it COULD happen.

I suppose it's just more Deep State persecution, eh?

[row_33]

Canada has been doing fine somewhere between obeying what England, the US and the USSR has commanded.

[Deranged Rhino]

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/adam-schiff-trump-twitter-wiretapping-russia-ties-236249

 

 

FBI Director James Comey confirmed Monday the FBI is investigating Russia’s meddling in the presidential election, including possible links between the Trump campaign and Moscow.

Comey told the House Intelligence Committee at a hearing that the bureau normally does not comment on the existence of counterintelligence investigations, but that he was authorized to do so in this case because of the extraordinary public interest.

 

And from Adam Schiff:

 

“Mr. President, the Russians hacked our election and interfered. No one disputes this now, but you. This is what is called 'fact,'” Schiff wrote in a series of tweets denouncing Trump's claim that his predecessor wiretapped Trump Tower. “The intelligence community concluded the Russians will interfere again. This is why full investigation is important to country. Please stop.”

 

 

 

While this obviously does not mean that there WAS collusion, since no guilt has yet been proven, it shows that the topic is at least serious enough and likely enough that there is an active investigation underway. While I and many others had zero doubt that such an investigation existed, many here laughed off even the notion that it COULD happen.

 

I suppose it's just more Deep State persecution, eh?

 

We've learned nothing new. Everyone knew an investigation was ongoing, no evidence was offered (and I'm open to any and all evidence that is more than just speculative) and so far Comey has barely answered any questions.

 

There is still a glaring lack of evidence outside of partisan talking points from the likes of Schiff (who's an embarrassment), this entire hearing is for the optics. Nothing substantive has been offered in way of advancing this theory. Combine that with the likes of Clapper and Brenner saying there is no evidence of collusion and I imagine the ones still clinging to this narrative are starting to get nervous -- so they make a big show of Comey coming to the Hill and hope no one pays attention to what the man actually said... which has been nothing.

[meazza]

 

We've learned nothing new. Everyone knew an investigation was ongoing, no evidence was offered (and I'm open to any and all evidence that is more than just speculative) and so far Comey has barely answered any questions.

 

There is still a glaring lack of evidence outside of partisan talking points from the likes of Schiff (who's an embarrassment), this entire hearing is for the optics. Nothing substantive has been offered in way of advancing this theory. Combine that with the likes of Clapper and Brenner saying there is no evidence of collusion and I imagine the ones still clinging to this narrative are starting to get nervous -- so they make a big show of Comey coming to the Hill and hope no one pays attention to what the man actually said... which has been nothing.

 

I'll just answer for Logic:

 

"Because Russia"

 

/Logic

 

the end

[Tiberius]

 

We've learned nothing new. Everyone knew an investigation was ongoing, no evidence was offered (and I'm open to any and all evidence that is more than just speculative) and so far Comey has barely answered any questions.

 

There is still a glaring lack of evidence outside of partisan talking points from the likes of Schiff (who's an embarrassment), this entire hearing is for the optics. Nothing substantive has been offered in way of advancing this theory. Combine that with the likes of Clapper and Brenner saying there is no evidence of collusion and I imagine the ones still clinging to this narrative are starting to get nervous -- so they make a big show of Comey coming to the Hill and hope no one pays attention to what the man actually said... which has been nothing.

Why is Schiff an embarrassment? Because he wants to follow through on this and find out about all these things that look really strange. There IS circumstantial evidence of collusion, so I disagree with you. The evidence is pretty right out in the open. What isn't is the technological finding of who did what, which will be hard to present to a jury, for sure

[Deranged Rhino]

Why is Schiff an embarrassment? Because he wants to follow through on this and find out about all these things that look really strange. There IS circumstantial evidence of collusion, so I disagree with you. The evidence is pretty right out in the open. What isn't is the technological finding of who did what, which will be hard to present to a jury, for sure

 

I've interviewed Schiff several times and spent time with the man off camera. He's driven entirely by partisanship, which has been on display with how he's handled this ongoing story over the past several months and is indeed an embarrassment to any American who cares about truth.

 

There is some circumstantial evidence -- all of which is very weak and largely based on unnamed sources citing unnamed methods of collecting that evidence. That's not compelling... unless it's fitting your confirmation bias. Then it probably feels much more substantive.

[4merper4mer]

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/adam-schiff-trump-twitter-wiretapping-russia-ties-236249

 

 

FBI Director James Comey confirmed Monday the FBI is investigating Russia’s meddling in the presidential election, including possible links between the Trump campaign and Moscow.

Comey told the House Intelligence Committee at a hearing that the bureau normally does not comment on the existence of counterintelligence investigations, but that he was authorized to do so in this case because of the extraordinary public interest.

 

And from Adam Schiff:

 

“Mr. President, the Russians hacked our election and interfered. No one disputes this now, but you. This is what is called 'fact,'” Schiff wrote in a series of tweets denouncing Trump's claim that his predecessor wiretapped Trump Tower. “The intelligence community concluded the Russians will interfere again. This is why full investigation is important to country. Please stop.”

 

 

 

While this obviously does not mean that there WAS collusion, since no guilt has yet been proven, it shows that the topic is at least serious enough and likely enough that there is an active investigation underway. While I and many others had zero doubt that such an investigation existed, many here laughed off even the notion that it COULD happen.

 

I suppose it's just more Deep State persecution, eh?

 

 

No one disputes that Russia "hacked" the election?

 

Define "hacked the election". If your definition includes getting access to John Podesta's email because John Podesta is a stupid old man, please explain how that is "the election". Look, i have as much or more respect for old people than anyone, but let's face it, they fall for phishing stuff all the time.

 

Did the Russians do anything to alter even one actual vote that was cast? Has that even been posited? Because that would be hacking the election if they did it electronically. If they did it by allowing dead people to vote it would be criminal, but not hacking.

[B-Man]

 

 

No one disputes that Russia "hacked" the election?

 

Define "hacked the election". If your definition includes getting access to John Podesta's email because John Podesta is a stupid old man, please explain how that is "the election". Look, i have as much or more respect for old people than anyone, but let's face it, they fall for phishing stuff all the time.

 

Did the Russians do anything to alter even one actual vote that was cast? (NOPE) Has that even been posited? Because that would be hacking the election if they did it electronically. If they did it by allowing dead people to vote it would be criminal, but not hacking.

 

 

This post x 100

[IDBillzFan]

“Mr. President, the Russians hacked our election ...

 

No. They didn't. I really wish you leftists would stop lying about this. It's embarrassing.

[Tiberius]

 

I've interviewed Schiff several times and spent time with the man off camera. He's driven entirely by partisanship, which has been on display with how he's handled this ongoing story over the past several months and is indeed an embarrassment to any American who cares about truth.

 

There is some circumstantial evidence -- all of which is very weak and largely based on unnamed sources citing unnamed methods of collecting that evidence. That's not compelling... unless it's fitting your confirmation bias. Then it probably feels much more substantive.

I really don't agree. Trump's actions speak for themselves, imo. As do the financial connections and his associates. Could all be coincidences but well worth looking into

[Deranged Rhino]

I really don't agree. Trump's actions speak for themselves, imo. As do the financial connections and his associates. Could all be coincidences but well worth looking into

 

No one, at least not me, is arguing they're not worth looking into.

 

What's being debated is what conclusions can be drawn from this information. There is a rush to judgment on the left that has existed since election night... and so far none of the evidence, even the circumstantial stuff you reference, makes that case.

 

Yet people like Schiff are acting like it's already a proven case when it's anything but.

[B-Man]

This what was said

 

 

FBI Confirms It’s Investigating Possible Links Between Trump Campaign and Russia - This Is Good News
by David French

Minutes ago, FBI Director James Comey made this announcement:

I have been authorized by the Department of Justice to confirm that the FBI, as part of our counter-intelligence mission, is investigating the Russian government’s efforts to interfere in the 2016 presidential election. And that includes investigating the nature of any links between individuals associated with the Trump campaign and the Russian government and whether there was any coordination between the campaign and Russia’s efforts. As with any counter-intelligence investigation, this will also include an assessment of whether any crimes were committed. Because it is an open, ongoing, investigation, and is classified, I cannot say more about what we are doing and whose conduct we are examining.

 

This is good news on at least three counts.

First, by making this announcement, the FBI has ended months of sometimes-irresponsible speculation about its activities.

Second, the FBI is informing America that it is doing its job. Of course we should want the FBI to comprehensively investigate a foreign power’s efforts to interfere with an American presidential election. Of course that would include following the evidence wherever it leads, including (if applicable) to one or both of the rival campaigns.

Third, since the Trump administration’s DOJ authorized this announcement, it is a sign to all Americans that its system is still working as intended. This announcement is not helpful to the administration, but the DOJ authorized it anyway. None of this means the election outcome is illegitimate.

None of this means that anyone affiliated with the Trump campaign broke the law. None of this means that illegal leaks are somehow proper simply because an investigation exists. At all times the Constitution protects the rights of each investigated American. It could very well be that a thorough investigation exonerates the Trump campaign. We simply don’t know yet.

Comey also said he had “no information” to support Trump’s “wiretapping” tweets, and that same assertion applied to the DOJ and all its components. As Comey noted, the president simply doesn’t have the legal authority to order a wiretap on an American citizen.

Bipartisan congressional investigation of all aspects of the Russian intervention in our election is still important, but public trust in Congress is low. Adding a comprehensive FBI investigation to the mix increases the chances that Americans will not only learn the full extent of Russian efforts to undermine our democracy but to do so in a manner that bolsters public confidence in those findings. Comey and the DOJ made the right call. America needed to know that federal law enforcement is on the case.

Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/445917/fbi-confirms-its-investigating-potential-links-between-trump-campaign-and-russian

Edited March 20, 2017 by B-Man

[/dev/null]

Remember when the FBI investigating stuff like this was a sexist political witch Hunt?

 

How about letting the investigation take it's course before convicting|acquiting Trump.

[Tiberius]

 

No one, at least not me, is arguing they're not worth looking into.

 

What's being debated is what conclusions can be drawn from this information. There is a rush to judgment on the left that has existed since election night... and so far none of the evidence, even the circumstantial stuff you reference, makes that case.

 

Yet people like Schiff are acting like it's already a proven case when it's anything but.

It's what good prosecutors do. He, in my opinion, is fighting for our democracy. If he has to be a prick to get this investigation going into full gear, so be it

[Deranged Rhino]

It's what good prosecutors do. He, in my opinion, is fighting for our democracy. If he has to be a prick to get this investigation going into full gear, so be it

 

Fighting for our democracy by claiming it was undermined by a foreign power without any evidence??

 

That's the opposite of fighting for our democracy. That's undercutting it to score political points because to a hack like Schiff, party trumps country.

[Tiberius]

 

Fighting for our democracy by claiming it was undermined by a foreign power without any evidence??

 

That's the opposite of fighting for our democracy. That's undercutting it to score political points because to a hack like Schiff, party trumps country.

There is evidence on multiple levels and if the electronic evidence the CIA and others is real, then this case has merit

[Deranged Rhino]

There is evidence on multiple levels and if the electronic evidence the CIA and others is real, then this case has merit

 

There has been zero concrete evidence proffered by anyone, including Schiff thus far. There has been talk of classified briefings disclosing more concrete evidence -- but even those reports are disputed by the other party. The only evidence that has been offered is speculative in nature and none of it has proven (in any way) that the Russians tipped the election outcome one way or the other OR that Trump or any of his administration colluded with Russia to accomplish that.

 

But Schiff has been making the public case since November, that there's not only smoke but a huge, raging fire under all that smoke.

 

And every piece of electronic evidence offered by IC is now under suspicion due to CIA's own Umbridge program's capabilities.

 

So... again, not saying don't investigate, but men like Schiff are putting the cart before the horse INTENTIONALLY because it serves their political agenda, which is NOT in the nation's best interest.

[grinreaper]

There is evidence on multiple levels and if the electronic evidence the CIA and others is real, then this case has merit

Please list the evidence. Be specific.

[Tiberius]

 

There has been zero concrete evidence proffered by anyone, including Schiff thus far. There has been talk of classified briefings disclosing more concrete evidence -- but even those reports are disputed by the other party. The only evidence that has been offered is speculative in nature and none of it has proven (in any way) that the Russians tipped the election outcome one way or the other OR that Trump or any of his administration colluded with Russia to accomplish that.

 

But Schiff has been making the public case since November, that there's not only smoke but a huge, raging fire under all that smoke.

 

And every piece of electronic evidence offered by IC is now under suspicion due to CIA's own Umbridge program's capabilities.

 

So... again, not saying don't investigate, but men like Schiff are putting the cart before the horse INTENTIONALLY because it serves their political agenda, which is NOT in the nation's best interest.

Like I said it is circumstantial but that's enough to investigate. Trump's actions were very suspicious when related to the hacking and all. I listened to a radio program about the CIA evidence and they seemed to think that our spying could identify where much of the hacking came from. It was technical, so it can be easy to dismiss. That being said, if the IC believes it is real, they have to go after this.

Please list the evidence. Be specific.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/adam-schiff-trump-twitter-wiretapping-russia-ties-236249

http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/16/politics/trump-russia-timeline/

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2017/02/15/michael-flynn-russia-timeline/97946470/

 

Start here

[DC Tom]

Like I said it is circumstantial but that's enough to investigate. Trump's actions were very suspicious when related to the hacking and all. I listened to a radio program about the CIA evidence and they seemed to think that our spying could identify where much of the hacking came from. It was technical, so it can be easy to dismiss. That being said, if the IC believes it is real, they have to go after this.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/03/adam-schiff-trump-twitter-wiretapping-russia-ties-236249

http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/16/politics/trump-russia-timeline/

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/onpolitics/2017/02/15/michael-flynn-russia-timeline/97946470/

 

Start here

 

That matryoshka doll graphic from CNN is the most compelling evidence yet.

 

You are so soft-headed. You are more susceptible to marketing than my wife, and that's really saying something.

[Deranged Rhino]

I listened to a radio program about the CIA evidence and they seemed to think that our spying could identify where much of the hacking came from. It was technical, so it can be easy to dismiss.

 

And CIA's own Umbrage program, as evidenced by Wikileaks dump, proves the CIA can and has used it's cyber-weapon programs to frame other nation states for their cyber activities. The same leak also details how CIA stole the codes and methods used FSB/GRU use in their operations in order to replicate those attacks while hiding their origin.

 

In other words, the strongest evidence to date proffered by anyone has been the digital footprint left by the various disinformation sites roped into this investigation. This was never strong evidence to begin with, which just shows how weak this case actually is, but the Day Zero leaks immediately undermines any and all digital evidence proffered by CIA in this regard.

Edited March 20, 2017 by Deranged Rhino

[Tiberius]

 

And CIA's own Umbrage program, as evidenced by Wikileaks dump, proves the CIA can and has used it's cyber-weapon programs to frame other nation states for their cyber activities. The same leak also details how CIA stole the codes and methods used FSB/GRU use in their operations in order to replicate those attacks while hiding their origin.

 

In other words, the strongest evidence to date proffered by anyone has been the digital footprint left by the various disinformation sites roped into this investigation. This was never strong evidence to begin with, which just shows how weak this case actually is, but the Day Zero leaks immediately undermines any and all digital evidence proffered by CIA in this regard.

I wouldn't say that is the strongest evidence, I say Trump's own words and deeds are. He tried hiding almost nothing, it seems. But if the electronic evidence is also there, then that's damning, or just a false flag for you. I'm sure if there was something done, they will pressure some rat into talking. The investigation has barely started

[Tiberius]

Democrats have pointed to a number of publicly-reported connections between several Trump campaign associates and Russian interests.

Roger Stone, a former advisor to Trump, has admitted to a “back channel” connection to WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange. The radical transparency site published the emails stolen by Russian hackers from the Democratic National Committee (DNC) and former Clinton campaign chairman John Podesta.

Stone has also made public conversations with Guccifer 2.0, the hacker persona believed to be run by Russian intelligence that was also used to disseminate some of the stolen emails.

Foreign policy adviser Carter Page’s reported dealings with Russian energy firm Gazprom and former campaign chairman Paul Manafort’s ties to a pro-Russian official in Ukraine have also come under scrutiny.

 

http://thehill.com/policy/national-security/324754-comey-fbi-investigating-possible-collusion-between-trump-team-moscow

[Nanker]

 

No. They didn't. I really wish you leftists would stop lying about this. It's embarrassing.

It's probably going to come out that it's just another Harry Reid lie. They have no trouble making unjustified and outrageous accusations just to set off a bomb of political controversy for their opponents. Trump's got that gene too.

 

That matryoshka doll graphic from CNN is the most compelling evidence yet.

 

You are so soft-headed. You are more susceptible to marketing than my wife, and that's really saying something.

[Deranged Rhino]

I wouldn't say that is the strongest evidence, I say Trump's own words and deeds are. He tried hiding almost nothing, it seems. But if the electronic evidence is also there, then that's damning, or just a false flag for you. I'm sure if there was something done, they will pressure some rat into talking. The investigation has barely started

 

It's been going on since before October per Comey's own words...

[Logic]

 

No. They didn't. I really wish you leftists would stop lying about this. It's embarrassing.

Just curious, are you a Trump supporter?

[FreddieJizzle22]

Just curious, are you a Trump supporter?

 

He is.

[Logic]

 

He is.

Cool. So a TRUMP SUPPORTER thinks it's "embarrassing" that leftists keep lying.

 

How's old honest Donny coming along with his not-at-all-embarrassing wiretapping allegations against Obama, by the way?

 

If lies embarrass you, my friend, I think you're supporting the wrong man.

[gatorbait]

None of us know for sure, so let's not get ahead of ourselves. Two things we know after Comey's hearing today: there's a criminal investigation going on by the FBI, and Trump lied about the wire tapping.

 

Drip drip drip

[grinreaper]

 

He is.

You have no clue.

[Deranged Rhino]

 

He is.

 

He actually isn't.

[meazza]

Just curious, are you a Trump supporter?

 

Why don't you use the search function or is that illogical you stupid !@#$ing noob.

[Doc Brown]

Here's my opinions and predictions:

 

-Will they come up with enough evidence to prove Russia and Trump colluded? No. I'm guessing it all will be circumstantial.

-Should Trump apologize about baseless accusations of Obama wiretapping Trump tower? Yes. Will he? No.

-Should the intelligent agencies get to the bottom of who leaked classified information? Yes. Will they? No.

-Was their communication between Trump Operatives and Assange about what and when to release hacked DNC emails? Yes. Roger Stone admitted to it and it's why he left campaign early on.

-Did released wikileaks DNC e-mails of Podesta cost Hillary the election? NO. Hillary's reputation was already tarnished enough and rightfully so.

-Do I find it funny the FBI got involved with finding Brady's Superbowl Jerseys? Yes.

[Logic]

 

He actually isn't.

I knew I shouldn't have trusted the word of a man with "jizzle" in his name.

 

Why don't you use the search function or is that illogical you stupid !@#$ing noob.

No need for hostility and name-calling, now.

[meazza]

I knew I shouldn't have trusted the word of a man with "jizzle" in his name.

No need for hostility and name-calling, now.

 

There is when you are a stupid !@#$ing noob who doesn't know how to use the search function.