FireChan Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 I think he was talking about branch, though hogan is pretty athletic if you pull his measurables--- Was reading a bit about the Houston rockets gm that brought his version of analytics to the NBA and how he struggled with scouts, and even himself being guilty of comparing guys based on race and once he banned comparing guys to someone of the same race it fixed some of their issues even as professional evaluators - they looked at guys more objectively instead of, in this case, hogan being just a hard worker with a lunch pail. That's very interesting and surely applicable to the NFL. Lots group think and tradition in the NFL. I'm sure there's a pro working for a team who think that Watson and Taylor have very similar games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted January 23, 2017 Share Posted January 23, 2017 That's very interesting and surely applicable to the NFL. Lots group think and tradition in the NFL. I'm sure there's a pro working for a team who think that Watson and Taylor have very similar games. It was a very interesting piece about how they continuously improve their models but still struggle with the human element and trusting their numbers over their preconceived notions even subconsciously Another similar anecdote was that they banned nicknames after passing on the guy at the top of their list because they couldn't get over drafting a guy they called man boobs during the process... they drafted a bust and man boobs is an all star. The psych of some of this stuff on the evaluations is always pretty cool when they are willing to pull back the curtain and talk candidly even about failures. So much of the "gut reactions" can be based on really silly things Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 To be fair, no one called Rodney Harrison lunch pail, but he was always regarded as an extremely intelligent player (which he was - it's part of how he turned 5th round athleticism into a near-HOF-worthy career). Harrison was also an established star when he came to NE. The lunch pail guys that people usually highlight from whom BB gets production are Woodhead, Welker, Edelman, Amendola and now Hogan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Do you think he misses us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Do you think he misses us? As much as Levitre does? They both can reminisce during the warm-ups in Houston about the good old days when they could end their season sooner and hit the beach somewhere in the Caribbean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 As much as Levitre does? They both can reminisce during the warm-ups in Houston about the good old days when they could end their season sooner and hit the beach somewhere in the Caribbean. I live in Atlanta and honestly didn't realize Levitre landed here until recently. Goes to show coach, scheme, etc. goes a long way to determining success. (I bet Hogan agrees, but he's got a certain QB as well!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnC Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 (edited) I live in Atlanta and honestly didn't realize Levitre landed here until recently. Goes to show coach, scheme, etc. goes a long way to determining success. (I bet Hogan agrees, but he's got a certain QB as well!) The GM for Atlanta (former Patriot staffer) did a good job in fortifying the OL. The Mack pickup was a terrific addition. I thought Levitre retired after he left Tennessee. Goes to show you that smart low profile pickups can solidify a roster and make a difference. I'm happy for the both of them. As I said in another post I'm sad that a player and person such as Kyle Williams hasn't had the opportunity to play in a playoff game. He deserves it. Edited January 24, 2017 by JohnC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
What a Tuel Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 (edited) As you shouldnt. I too lamented him not being retained. For others trying to reconcile away his performance on the Pats**, the question is NOT whether he would have put similar numbers with the Bills. The question is if the Bills passing O would have benefited from his presence on the team. It would be real tough for anyone to argue that it would not. Does he come with defenses not covering him? I mean come on, the guy was literally standing in areas where defenders just ignored him. The guy has Woods like stats on a team that threw 120 more times this season. Would he have helped once Watkins was out? Maybe. But when Hogan left, we had Watkins, Woods and Goodwin. The upgrade from Goodwin to Hogan just isn't worth the $4 million. Edited January 24, 2017 by What a Tuel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augie Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 The GM for Atlanta (former Patriot staffer) did a good job in fortifying the OL. The Mack pickup was a terrific addition. I thought Levitre retired after he left Tennessee. Goes to show you that smart low profile pickups can solidify a roster and make a difference. I'm happy for the both of them. As I said in another post I'm sad that a player and person such as Kyle Williams hasn't had the opportunity to play in a playoff game. He deserves it. Hang in there Kyle, next year, I swear! ONE MORE YEAR! (And then maybe another?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BADOLBILZ Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Oh, when he's good he's good - no doubt. But in a post about high character intelligent dudes being the key- he was an odd inclusion I think Belichick thinks he has a profile of troubled players that he thinks he can turn into system guys.........and to most of us it makes no sense but he takes chances on guys like Ochocinco and Haynesworth and misses on those and hits on others........Parcells always used to bring in some odd characters as well and turn them into producers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punching Bag Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Not by one of the three stooges. http://buffalonews.com/2017/01/23/bills-found-way-keep-chris-hogan/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 (edited) Who equtes Hogan with Julio Jones??? That be like equating Clay with Gronkowski at TE. Someone did earlier in this thread so I pointed it out. I don't remember who, go back a few pages and find it. I disagree with your view comparing Goodwin with Hogan if he was with the Pats. A receiver in the Pats system and playing with Brady has to run precise routes and be able to adjust his routes in their system. That certainly isn't Goodwin's forte. It's not Goodwins forte at all ( disclaimer : I am not a fan of Goodwin ) . It's not difficult to imagine that the Pats offensive staff could find a way to incorporate what he does with his speed; namely run fly routes , go routes and an occasional post route into their Offense. He is capable of taking the top off a defense, and running the deeper routes he could put up yardage numbers in the area code of Hogan's this season. Edited January 24, 2017 by Boatdrinks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadianFan Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Does he come with defenses not covering him? I mean come on, the guy was literally standing in areas where defenders just ignored him. The guy has Woods like stats on a team that threw 120 more times this season. Would he have helped once Watkins was out? Maybe. But when Hogan left, we had Watkins, Woods and Goodwin. The upgrade from Goodwin to Hogan just isn't worth the $4 million. I agree. Hogan had a huge game because A) Steelers DBs just made dumb mistakes (mental errors due to lack of sleep, anyone? ANYONE?) and B) had a QB who can get the ball to whomever is open. In the Bills 31st ranked passing system he wouldn't have had as many touches. Even going to a pass-first team Hogan got ONLY 36 receptions this year. about equal to what he did with Bills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 I agree. Hogan had a huge game because A) Steelers DBs just made dumb mistakes (mental errors due to lack of sleep, anyone? ANYONE?) and B) had a QB who can get the ball to whomever is open. In the Bills 31st ranked passing system he wouldn't have had as many touches. Even going to a pass-first team Hogan got ONLY 36 receptions this year. about equal to what he did with Bills. True. But Hogan is now on a team that wins games and gets publicity. This can only mean that the Bills would surely be winning if only they had kept Chris Hogan on the roster. In others news, the Bills actually have some talented players that can produce in the league. The team doesn't win because they havent had a good quarterback in 20+ years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#34fan Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 (edited) True. But Hogan is now on a team that wins games and gets publicity. This can only mean that the Bills would surely be winning if only they had kept Chris Hogan on the roster. In others news, the Bills actually have some talented players that can produce in the league. The team doesn't win because they havent had a good quarterback in 20+ years. But could that be because they haven't had a good GM, or HC in 20+ years.. Edited January 24, 2017 by #34fan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 But could that be because they haven't had a good GM, or HC in 20+ years.. Yes , that would be the primary reason that they don't have one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thurman#1 Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 (edited) Harrison was also an established star when he came to NE. The lunch pail guys that people usually highlight from whom BB gets production are Woodhead, Welker, Edelman, Amendola and now Hogan. Depends what you mean by lunch pail. Does it mean hard worker? Then they're all lunch pail guys. Does it mean unathletic, slow, not quick? If it does, anyone calling Welker or Edelman that ... just ... doesn't ... get it. Those two are terrific athletes, guys who almost can't be covered. Welker could have started on any team in the league in his prime. Same as Edelman now. Hogan isn't as athletic as them, but he's more than just a guy. He's an athlete. True. But Hogan is now on a team that wins games and gets publicity. This can only mean that the Bills would surely be winning if only they had kept Chris Hogan on the roster. In others news, the Bills actually have some talented players that can produce in the league. The team doesn't win because they havent had a good quarterback in 20+ years. No, you're right, Hogan's not the difference between winning and losing. But basically no one player is. Hell, the Pats won the year Brady was injured, though they weren't the same team. He'd have upgraded our WR group and been worth the money at the higher tender. Letting him go without replacing him was absolutely a mistake. A huge mistake? No, but a mistake, clearly. Could've kept him at the second tender level, $2.553 mill a year. With the lack of WR depth, Whaley should've kept him. Edited January 24, 2017 by Thurman#1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatdrinks Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Yes, as I've stated before it was a mistake to let him walk for no compensation. But how big of one? He may very well have not been offered a deal by another team if they had to surrender a second rounder for his services. However, for a little more money he was worth that and is better than Goodwin. Bad timing with others FAs they had to be more concerned about than a reserve WR. In Doug Whaleys long and well documented list of transgressions , this one is very minor. It had little to no impact on the Bills W- L record. It really doesn't matter much that CH can play in the league and be a role player on another team. Not many teams would have been willing to offer draft compensation, and he would still be here putting up about the same numbers on a run first team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 He'd have upgraded our WR group and been worth the money at the higher tender. Letting him go without replacing him was absolutely a mistake. A huge mistake? No, but a mistake, clearly. Could've kept him at the second tender level, $2.553 mill a year. With the lack of WR depth, Whaley should've kept him. Exactly... This really is not that hard to figure out, and I'm shocked there is much debate about it...The Bills blew it on the tender...They were not a deep team at WR , Hogan was a valued contributor, and honestly worth the higher tender pay anyway... Hindsight makes it easier...No question...But after what the Bills went through in 2016 at WR, plus what Hogan ends up doing for our biggest nemesis...Well...Pretty clear Whaley blew this one...Not to mention they would likely have a decent chance and retaining Hogan this off-season to soften the blow when Woods leaves... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChasBB Posted January 24, 2017 Share Posted January 24, 2017 Hated to see Hogan go. I was never on-board with letting him walk. It's not like they were stacked at WR. Good for the Patriots for making the smart move. He could have been that player here in Buffalo if we had a QB who could spot open receivers. Can't believe I'm going to say this, but Go Pats - for Hogan's sake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts